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Posted: 6/16/2010 1:07:05 PM EDT
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Anyone remember the "scary" Black Talon bullets from the early 90's? Well, I think I've figured out Remington's (correction Winchester's) Lubalox coating, (a proprietary oxide process) and have began making my own "Black Talon" bullets to reload. Whether they will perform any better, who knows...... but they sure look cool.
Ooooh ........scary bullets 
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Anyone remember the "scary" Black Talon bullets from the early 90's? Well, I think I've figured out Remington's Lubalox coating, (a proprietary oxide process) and have began making my own "Black Talon" bullets to reload. Whether they will perform any better, who knows...... but they sure look cool. Ooooh ........scary bullets
http://i585.photobucket.com/albums/ss291/uncleboomboom/BlackTalon.jpg That's quite the miracle, since it was Winchester that produced the Black Talon with Lubalox coating. 
But if you're happy, I'm happy. 
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I try to make bullets shiny Link, you make them black.
Now we have both. 
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How'd you do that? 
Seriously though, The real thing was DARK BLACK and felt like some sort of dip coating. Yours are brown and look like they've been colored with a sharpie! I imagine you've oxidized them with some sort of electrolisis process from 8th grade science! In either case, If your happy that's what matters! -Masta |
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How'd you do that? Seriously though, The real thing was DARK BLACK and felt like some sort of dip coating. Yours are brown and look like they've been colored with a sharpie! I imagine you've oxidized them with some sort of electrolisis process from 8th grade science! In either case, If your happy that's what matters! -Masta These are actually a nice dark black, it's just a crappy picture taken with a crappy camera. I assure you that these were not colored by a Sharpie. I have some of the original Black Talons to compare and I'm pretty sure that the process (that I learned in 8th grade science  ) is the same one that Winchester likely used.
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Quoted: Quoted: How'd you do that? http://taylorshocks.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/sharpiemarker.jpg Seriously though, The real thing was DARK BLACK and felt like some sort of dip coating. Yours are brown and look like they've been colored with a sharpie! I imagine you've oxidized them with some sort of electrolisis process from 8th grade science! In either case, If your happy that's what matters! -Masta Nah, I have a few boxes of Black Talons, and quite a few of Fail Safes....and the color is pretty spot on. |
Looks like moly coating: http://www.intlmidway.com/intl/eproductpage.exe/ShowProduct?saleitemid=183655
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Looks like moly coating: http://www.intlmidway.com/intl/eproductpage.exe/ShowProduct?saleitemid=183655 http://www.gswagner.com/bigreloading/components/bullets.jpg Nope, not Moly. From the Winchester web site: Lubalox Coating: * Black oxide * First used in early 1990 * Does not increase diameter of bullet * Used on Accubond CT®, Ballistic Silvertip®, E-tip and XP3® product lines * Does not harm barrel * Reduces barrel fouling * Does not require barrel "seasoning" Moly Coating: * Molybdenum Disulfide * First used in late 1990 * Increases diameter of bullet * Was used on part or all of Power-Point® Plus, Partition Gold® Rifle, and one Hornet SKU * Did not harm barrel * For optimum performance barrel "seasoning" was required * Could cause accuracy problems in some guns |
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I sold what was left of my early 90s vintage Black Talons about 3 years ago at about $30/box of 20. I have 2 boxes left in 10mm. The Precision Bullets moly coated lead stuff always reminds me of BT's. http://www.precisionbullets.com/ |
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It's great you figured out the coating process, but how'd you get the pills? I'd love to get my hands on some of the pills loaded into top defensive rounds, but so far the only suppliers that sell them loose are Speer and Remington... Hornady sells their XTP bullets as components which are in their TAP handgun cartridges. I believe some of the fancy magnum handgun 'hunting' bullets are also available. And frankly, I don't think you'd be at a disadvantage with Speer Gold Dots loaded up. |
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It's great you figured out the coating process, but how'd you get the pills? I'd love to get my hands on some of the pills loaded into top defensive rounds, but so far the only suppliers that sell them loose are Speer and Remington... Hornady sells their XTP bullets as components which are in their TAP handgun cartridges. I believe some of the fancy magnum handgun 'hunting' bullets are also available. And frankly, I don't think you'd be at a disadvantage with Speer Gold Dots loaded up. I love the fact that Gold Dots are sold loose and they're what I carry, but wish I could get a hold of Federal HSTs or Ranger Ts so I could at least try them out without spending an arm and a leg.. |
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Quoted: It's great you figured out the coating process, but how'd you get the pills? I'd love to get my hands on some of the pills loaded into top defensive rounds, but so far the only suppliers that sell them loose are Speer and Remington... Speer Gold Dots, Hornady XTPs, Winchester SilverTips, Remington Golden Sabers are all sold sans cartridge. |
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Winchester Ranger SXTs are the Same eXact Thing as Black Talons. But you knew that, right?  This. Also, the black lube is no longer needed due to Winchesters updated technology, otherwise it's the same stuff. I carry the Ranger 127gr +P+ 9mm for everyday. |
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Black oxide for copper, sometimes known by the trade name Ebonol C, converts the copper surface to cupric oxide. For the process to work the surface has to have at least 65% copper; for copper surfaces that have less than 90% copper it must first be pretreated with an activating treatment. The finished coating is chemically stable and very adherent. It is stable up to 400 °F (204 °C); above this temperature the coating degrades due to oxidation of the base copper. To increase corrosion resistance the surface may be oiled, lacquered, or waxed. It is also used as a pre-treatment for painting or enamelling. The surface finish is usually satin, but it can be turned glossy by coating in a clear high gloss enamel.[7]
On a microscopic scale dendrites form on the surface finish, which trap light and increase absorptivity. Because of this property the coating is used in aerospace applications for light rejection.[7] An applicable U.S. military specification is MIL-F-495E. 
http://www.heatbath.com/heatbath/products/black_oxide_finishing/black_oxide_for_non-ferrous_metals http://www.jacksonplating.co.uk/ebonol-c.php http://www.everyspec.com/MIL-SPECS/MIL+SPECS+(MIL-C)/download.php?spec=MIL-C-14550B(AMENDMENT3).007637.PDF |
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Alright, you've wormed it out of me. I am using a conversion process that involves chemical baths but no electrolysis (electroplating). I start off by degreasing the copper jacketed bullets. Then they are immersed in a 10% aqueous solution of HNO3 (pickling). They are then rinsed with water and dipped into a 140 degree aqueous solution of K2S, KSH, K2S2O3, and H2KS+ where they turn black within 30 seconds to a minute. They are then removed from this solution, rinsed once, and left to dry. Once dry, the smut (excess CuO) is wiped off and they're ready to load.
For those of you who claimed "Sharpie" and "BS"....you can kiss my chemistry set! 
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