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Posted: 1/29/2002 9:24:16 AM EDT


I want to use a birdcage flash suppressor on my post ban gun.
I can get a thumbhole stock from brownells.
If I cut the bayonnett lug off the upper will my gun be legal?
What do you think about using a dremmel tool to do the cutting?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 9:30:58 AM EDT
i could be wrong, but i dont think the thumbhole stock frees up the pistol grip "evil feature slot". in short, not legal.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 9:40:43 AM EDT
I don't know what Brownells is selling now, but at least one thumbhole that they used to sell was nixed by ATF as eliminating the pistol grip. If you just want to get the flash hider look, there are non-functional units on the market. Also, you cannot have usable threads on the barrel. Whatever unit you use has to be permanently attached over the threads.

Yes, a Dremel is fine for removing the bayo lug. Put the barrel in a vise and use both hands on the Dremel. Don't let it dance around on you.

Don
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 9:41:25 AM EDT
Besides that, what does a bayolug do on a postban barrel. Aren't these supposed to be just crowned and don't have a bayolug at all.

Anyway you might want to consider Kurt's Kustom for a fake A2 compensator. It is my understanding that these look like the A2 birdcage flashhider but are classified as compensator.

Even though military manuals refer to the birdcage hider as "compensator" BATF does not for it's supposed riflegrenade firing ability.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 9:58:49 AM EDT
I actually want to suppress the muzzle flash.
Was the nixed stock plastic or wood?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 10:02:30 AM EDT
Your best bet is a Kurt's A2 Tac Brake. Then Wilson's Brake is also good but not as cool. You could fix the mag so that tools are required to remove it, but that's the least cool. Or... you can just call it a gov issue A2 a compensator just like our own military does and leave it the way that it is. Just don't rob any banks with it and it shouldn't be an issue. Do the one that you feel is right for you.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 10:09:13 AM EDT
What the hell is a rifle fired grenade anyway?!?! I thought those were last used early in Vietnam? Isn't the M203 the only thing used now?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 10:10:21 AM EDT
The nixed stock was really an A2 setup with a rod running from in front of the sling swivel to the bottom of the piston grip. Sort of a poor man's Dragunov. IIRC, the manufacturer was billing them as the solution to the protruding pistol grip being the one allowable feature.

There are other thumbhole designs around, but I have never heard of any of them being accepted by ATF. ATF really wants to hold on to the protruding pistol grip thing.

Don
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 10:12:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By 308wood:
I actually want to suppress the muzzle flash.
Was the nixed stock plastic or wood?



You want a flash suppressor?
Buy a pre-ban.

Some problems in life are so simple.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 10:18:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By KCBoomer:
What the hell is a rifle fired grenade anyway?!?! I thought those were last used early in Vietnam? Isn't the M203 the only thing used now?



Well, there's the Brunswick RAW which packs a bit more punch than a 203 (2.7 lbs of explosive), though I don't know if its ever gained much acceptance.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 1:56:09 PM EDT
308wood,

Any money you save going this route will likely be eaten by legal fees. Why don't you just buy a preban or wait for the AWB sunset?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 2:05:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By marvl:
308wood,

Any money you save going this route will likely be eaten by legal fees. Why don't you just buy a preban or wait for the AWB sunset?



You mean postban right?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 2:12:39 PM EDT
I think you can. Remember you are only allowed one evil feature on a post ban gun. Most opt for the pistol grip, meaning no flash suppressor or bayo lug. But you can go for the other ones. For example the M-1A can still have the flash suppressor because there is no pistol grip, and no bayo lug. If you have a fixed magazine you can have all three, pistol grip, bayo lug, and flash hider. I'm pretty sure all these laws pertain to rifles with detachable magazines. But check it out just to make sure, don't take any advice from us as the gospel, because your rights are riding on it being correct, you don't want to risk a mistake.


ROCK ON!
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 3:01:38 PM EDT
I think as long as you permanently attach the birdcage and remove the bayonet lug, you should be OK.
Like 7_62Gunner said, Post ban M1A's have a flash suppressor, but no pistol grip.

www.brownells.com is an excellent place to shop.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 3:59:41 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 4:01:13 PM EDT
What is NOT clear, however, is if can one get away with a thumbhole stock and a flashhider. Better check it out.

Schapman43, I meant preban. It's a moot point with a preban since the flashhider would be perfectly legal.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 4:02:22 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 6:02:50 PM EDT
Why would the birdcage need to be permanantly attached? If you lose the pistol grip, you have no 'evil' features, so you can add one back. A "flash supressor or threaded barrel capable of receiving a flash supressor" counts as one feature. Why not just have a threaded barrel? Then you could attach a flash supressor, compensator, sound supressor, or whatever you want. The reason that postbans with muzzle brakes must have them permanantly attached is to remove the possibility of a flash supressor. (Because you know how many people have been slaughtered by flash supressors over the years )

This is taken from the '94 Krime Bill. Is there some other legislation I'm forgetting that would make a threaded barrel verboten?
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 6:16:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:23:14 PM EDT

My previous posting about "permanent attachment" wasn't too clear. I meant to say that a fake flash hider or a muzzle brake, when mounted on a threaded muzzle for post-ban use must be permanently affixed.

An interesting question - if you chose to fire your AR with no handgrip, leaving it off and removing any means of attachment for a handgrip, does anyone out there think ATF would buy it?
Link Posted: 1/30/2002 12:35:56 AM EDT
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