Armory Sponsor
Posted: 7/5/2012 6:29:54 AM EDT
| For those with plate carriers and no plates what are you using whether to hold the shape or or for a weight substitute? |
|
I have real plates (BAE Level 4 stand-alones, Velocity System Level 3 ICWs, and a few sets of SAPI plates from work), so don't misread this.
I have a plate carrier set up that I use for PT. In it, I've got some titanium stand-alone plates. They're cheaper than real plates and they're damned near indestructible. However, I'd look at getting some of these, since they're way cheaper than titanium. I just ordered a set of those and they're going to replace the titanium ones in my PT kit. I'm also going to take my rear plate and soft armor out of my primary kit and put it in the front of another kit, and then put the two titanium plates in the back of both of these kits. Other than those, maybe check out the Team Wendy training plates. I would also advise you to put some PT pad foam behind the plate (just cut it to the shape of the plate for your own comfort). |
|
Quoted:
What are those Omega plates made of? MIL-DTL-46100 is basically just high hardness steel. It has been around since pre-Viet Nam. Interestingly, the site says "tested to NIJ level III" and the label on the plate clearly says "III-A". If you're not worried about having proven protection in the carrier, this would probably be a cheap solution. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
What are those Omega plates made of? MIL-DTL-46100 is basically just high hardness steel. It has been around since pre-Viet Nam. Interestingly, the site says "tested to NIJ level III" and the label on the plate clearly says "III-A". If you're not worried about having proven protection in the carrier, this would probably be a cheap solution. Hah, somehow I read the item's listing and totally missed that single bullet point. When I saw you clearly list the material, I thought you'd stumbled across info on another site, till I went back to the link. Thanks, though 
|
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
What are those Omega plates made of? MIL-DTL-46100 is basically just high hardness steel. It has been around since pre-Viet Nam. Interestingly, the site says "tested to NIJ level III" and the label on the plate clearly says "III-A". If you're not worried about having proven protection in the carrier, this would probably be a cheap solution. It actually looks like it says "Uncertified level IIIA Protection" on the label. When they come in, I'll verify it. |
|
Quoted:
I have real plates (BAE Level 4 stand-alones, Velocity System Level 3 ICWs, and a few sets of SAPI plates from work), so don't misread this. I have a plate carrier set up that I use for PT. In it, I've got some titanium stand-alone plates. They're cheaper than real plates and they're damned near indestructible. However, I'd look at getting some of these, since they're way cheaper than titanium. I just ordered a set of those and they're going to replace the titanium ones in my PT kit. I'm also going to take my rear plate and soft armor out of my primary kit and put it in the front of another kit, and then put the two titanium plates in the back of both of these kits. Other than those, maybe check out the Team Wendy training plates. I would also advise you to put some PT pad foam behind the plate (just cut it to the shape of the plate for your own comfort). Anyone have anymore info on these plates? Will they stop fast 5.56 like xm193 (which steel often doesnt) and ss109? I have been thinking about grabbing another set of steel plates as my XL ones are too heavy and they getting some kevlar or spectra to wrap them. |
|
Quoted:
Seriously though, there are ballistic NIJ rated HDPE plates.
I don't know how cheap they are over in the states, though. They can be as expensive as ceramic plates over here, sometimes more so.
Compressed UHMWPE plates usually pull a premium over ceramic hybrid plates in the States. They have the "light weight" marketing angle locked in. |
|
Quoted: Quoted: I have real plates (BAE Level 4 stand-alones, Velocity System Level 3 ICWs, and a few sets of SAPI plates from work), so don't misread this. I have a plate carrier set up that I use for PT. In it, I've got some titanium stand-alone plates. They're cheaper than real plates and they're damned near indestructible. However, I'd look at getting some of these, since they're way cheaper than titanium. I just ordered a set of those and they're going to replace the titanium ones in my PT kit. I'm also going to take my rear plate and soft armor out of my primary kit and put it in the front of another kit, and then put the two titanium plates in the back of both of these kits. Other than those, maybe check out the Team Wendy training plates. I would also advise you to put some PT pad foam behind the plate (just cut it to the shape of the plate for your own comfort). Anyone have anymore info on these plates? Will they stop fast 5.56 like xm193 (which steel often doesnt) and ss109? I have been thinking about grabbing another set of steel plates as my XL ones are too heavy and they getting some kevlar or spectra to wrap them. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1329478_de_spalling_the__79_ar500_armor__pics_of_final_test_in_the_OP_.html The last couple of pages address these plates. According to the manufacturer, he did go through the process of NIJ certification, which I guess cost him a dime or three. He's apparently sent bcauz3y a set to shoot at for evaluation, so we're waiting for results on that. There's also supposed to be a group buy in the works. I'll most likely be picking up a set, always contingent, of course, on bcauz3y's tests. |
|
Quoted:
I have real plates (BAE Level 4 stand-alones, Velocity System Level 3 ICWs, and a few sets of SAPI plates from work), so don't misread this. I have a plate carrier set up that I use for PT. In it, I've got some titanium stand-alone plates. They're cheaper than real plates and they're damned near indestructible. However, I'd look at getting some of these, since they're way cheaper than titanium. ^ Great suggestion. I have a similar setup based on some heavy-as-hell steel 8x8" plates in ~10-12" plate pockets. To stiffen the plate pockets, I use the top covers of appropriately-sized plastic storage bins. They aren't tacticool, but provide a nice subsitute for home training... And I wouldn't be caught dead outside the house in this getup - it's like fat girls and mopeds. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have real plates (BAE Level 4 stand-alones, Velocity System Level 3 ICWs, and a few sets of SAPI plates from work), so don't misread this. I have a plate carrier set up that I use for PT. In it, I've got some titanium stand-alone plates. They're cheaper than real plates and they're damned near indestructible. However, I'd look at getting some of these, since they're way cheaper than titanium. I just ordered a set of those and they're going to replace the titanium ones in my PT kit. I'm also going to take my rear plate and soft armor out of my primary kit and put it in the front of another kit, and then put the two titanium plates in the back of both of these kits. Other than those, maybe check out the Team Wendy training plates. I would also advise you to put some PT pad foam behind the plate (just cut it to the shape of the plate for your own comfort). Anyone have anymore info on these plates? Will they stop fast 5.56 like xm193 (which steel often doesnt) and ss109? I have been thinking about grabbing another set of steel plates as my XL ones are too heavy and they getting some kevlar or spectra to wrap them. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1329478_de_spalling_the__79_ar500_armor__pics_of_final_test_in_the_OP_.html The last couple of pages address these plates. According to the manufacturer, he did go through the process of NIJ certification, which I guess cost him a dime or three. He's apparently sent bcauz3y a set to shoot at for evaluation, so we're waiting for results on that. There's also supposed to be a group buy in the works. I'll most likely be picking up a set, always contingent, of course, on bcauz3y's tests. The way I read it: The plates are capable of passing the test, but in order to get the certification he would have had to pay either $6,500 for a Level 3A rating or $14,000 for a Level 3 rating. Being that the label on the plates says "uncertified" makes me think that he didn't pay for the NIJ certification. Totally understandable when you look at how affordable these plates are. Its sad just how many people out there are passing off their plates as being NIJ certified when they have never jumped through all of the hoops. To get the NIJ certificate is a big hurdle, NIJ IIIa costs about $6500 and NIJ III costs about $14,500 for the lab testing. the actual NIJ test id is free. ask me how i know ;)
Also, when you go to add the plates to your cart and proceed to checkout on the website, there is a warning that reminds you that these are not for use witn steel core ammunition (if I remember correctly). |
|
Yeah, steel core is AP ammo. That means Lvl IV, not 3. Funny, when I read it, it read like he was comparing his plates–– which he'd paid to put through the NIJ testing–– to the $89 set of flat plates that Were the original subject of the thread, and were just flat pieces of 1/2" AR500 cut to shape on a water table. ETA: If you've already ordered a set, let us know how they look/feel when they arrive. I'm all ready to pull the trigger on a set, but I'd like a few more reviews first. |
|
Quoted:
Yeah, steel core is AP ammo. That means Lvl IV, not 3. Funny, when I read it, it read like he was comparing his plates–– which he'd paid to put through the NIJ testing–– to the $89 set of flat plates that Were the original subject of the thread, and were just flat pieces of 1/2" AR500 cut to shape on a water table. ETA: If you've already ordered a set, let us know how they look/feel when they arrive. I'm all ready to pull the trigger on a set, but I'd like a few more reviews first.
I'd say get them. They're cheap and will serve great as a training aid (add weight to a vest without compromising the integrity of real plates when they get bounced around). I wouldn't trust these as a real plate, unless it was a SHTF scenario and you never got a chance to buy something proven. They have their place in the market, but I wouldn't put it in my go-bag. Also, I thought M855 was steel core (penetrator, not AP) and M855 is defeated by Level 3. Level 4 is .30cal AP, right? That would also explain why these plates say "uncertified level 3a" instead of "uncertified level 3" on them. They probably protect from Level 3a threats, but not against ALL level 3 threats (M855). |
|
Most Level III plates do not stop M855 or M193. They have to have a special threat rating that specifically states they stop those rounds as they are not in the Level III testing protocol.
Quoted:
Quoted:
Yeah, steel core is AP ammo. That means Lvl IV, not 3. Funny, when I read it, it read like he was comparing his plates–– which he'd paid to put through the NIJ testing–– to the $89 set of flat plates that Were the original subject of the thread, and were just flat pieces of 1/2" AR500 cut to shape on a water table. ETA: If you've already ordered a set, let us know how they look/feel when they arrive. I'm all ready to pull the trigger on a set, but I'd like a few more reviews first.
I'd say get them. They're cheap and will serve great as a training aid (add weight to a vest without compromising the integrity of real plates when they get bounced around). I wouldn't trust these as a real plate, unless it was a SHTF scenario and you never got a chance to buy something proven. They have their place in the market, but I wouldn't put it in my go-bag. Also, I thought M855 was steel core (penetrator, not AP) and M855 is defeated by Level 3. Level 4 is .30cal AP, right? That would also explain why these plates say "uncertified level 3a" instead of "uncertified level 3" on them. They probably protect from Level 3a threats, but not against ALL level 3 threats (M855). |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Seriously though, there are ballistic NIJ rated HDPE plates.
I don't know how cheap they are over in the states, though. They can be as expensive as ceramic plates over here, sometimes more so.
Compressed UHMWPE plates usually pull a premium over ceramic hybrid plates in the States. They have the "light weight" marketing angle locked in. I don't think it's a "lightweight marketing angle". The cost of raw materials for UHMWPE can be quite expensive. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
FYI, steel core does not automatically equal AP. Really? Is there a difference between a penetrator and just plain steel core? Perhaps I've been misled all these years–– it happens. Think of penetrator as a round with armor piercing properties, but without the correct velocity / mass to be able to penetrate armor. M855 penetrator (green tip) is steel core. It's not armor piercing. The 5.56 armor piercing round is M995 (black tip). An armor piercing round COULD be steel core (or tungsten, depleted uranium, or whatever). |
|
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: FYI, steel core does not automatically equal AP. Really? Is there a difference between a penetrator and just plain steel core? Perhaps I've been misled all these years–– it happens. Think of penetrator as a round with armor piercing properties, but without the correct velocity / mass to be able to penetrate armor. M855 penetrator (green tip) is steel core. It's not armor piercing. The 5.56 armor piercing round is M995 (black tip). An armor piercing round COULD be steel core (or tungsten, depleted uranium, or whatever). Gotcha. Thanks. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
For those with plate carriers and no plates what are you using whether to hold the shape or or for a weight substitute? Isn't that kind of pointless? Some people buy gear in increments. If you have to prioritize your purchases, I say do it this way: 1. guns / ammo 2. magazines / more ammo 3. first line belt / pouches / more ammo 4. plate carrier / more pouches / moar ammo 5. training plates / plates Regardless of how you do it, you should always end up purchasing plates. |
|
I have three plate carriers and one set of great plates. The point being sometimes you go to the range or class and you don't want/need to bring expensive plates. Other times you are just working on gear configurations and testing new stuff out and having a sub around would handy.
I've scene duct tape and hard bound children's books do a good and cheap job. Funny thing about the cutting board would probably rock if I could get the tri curves down. Once formed they would be waterproof, rigid, and cheap. |
|
Revisiting this.....
I got the Omega plates and was quite impressed. Cheap, nice cuts, nice curves. 
I didn't like the idea of the surface rust rubbing off inside of my plate carrier, so I coated them in rust inhibitor, then spray paint, and then wrapped them in rigger's tape. 
Their weight is going to be ideal for training. They seem to be a bit heavier than my titanium training plates. These Omega plates bring my PT plate carrier's total weight up to 25 lbs. 
|
Armory Sponsor