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Posted: 11/30/2002 12:58:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2002 12:00:26 AM EDT by Master_Blaster]
Does a laser sight work better for CQB applications? Red dots seem to be preferred optics, but lasers aren't becoming past tense, either.

I'm considering a SF L-80 green laser sight module, but I wonder if it would provide me w/ noticiable performance over my Comp M2.

Edited to add: I've got an Aimpoint Comp M2. It's simply the gearhead in me raising its voice once again. I suppose if I ignore it, it'll go away...or not.
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 1:09:39 AM EDT
Laser gives away your position. But you can use it to blind someone. I have red dot site and I'm able to point my gun quickly than going through iron sights.
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 1:09:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/30/2002 1:12:06 AM EDT by LotBoy]
How about the OTAL from [url=http://laserdevices.com/]Laser Devices Inc[/url]?
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 8:07:56 AM EDT
The L-80 green laser from Sureifre isnt out yet. I dont know when it will be released. And when it is, expect to pay some MAJOR cash for it. The L-72 red laser retails for about $600, and the L-80 will be considerably more money than that. Generally speaking, a red dot sight is the best choice for overall use. Lasers have their place, but for the most part, there isnt anything a laser can do that a quality red dot cant. Think about an Aimpoint.
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 11:00:51 AM EDT
Never been in a fire fight and hope never to be. With that said, I have shot a pistol with a laser. There's something to be said about looking at a target (not the sights or red dot), seeing the laser dot, and seeing a hole there the next moment. It gives a sense of confidence which can mean a lot when the SHTF.
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 10:11:44 AM EDT
I don't like lasers (they aren't visible in daylight) and they can be blocked by brush they are confusing to pick up while panning with the weapon. Dirt/Dust could difract the beam. Also they give away your position. Get the red Dot E-O tech or Aimpoint it's always there and te light won't give you away.
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 10:28:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/10/2002 10:28:46 AM EDT by boggl]
HAKKO's are a great little sight. Multi-recticle/brightness. Fairly inexpensive $220. I wouldn't take it into battle but it sure is fun at the sandpit! [^]
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 10:34:02 AM EDT
I've got lots of experience with lasers on pistols and several days of trigger time on rifles with lasers. So I speak from some, but not a ton of experience. We have an AR with a red laser Surefire here. Very nice unit. The main advantage of a laser on a rifle is that it allows heads-up sighting and total target focus. For real CQB and entry, this is a huge advantage. As using a laser increases your field of vision over a red-dot, because you don't have to be right behind it. You can shoot more "heads-up", see more of the situation and still aim accurately. Situations like this, the whole "give away position" thing doesn't really matter. Another interesting feature I have found of lasers is that I have found the light they emit is about perfect for navigating dark environments. Navigation without losing night vision. Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 5:41:50 PM EDT
I'm assuming that you're using the rifle in self defense within your house. The longest range available in my house is about 40 feet shooting from my bedroom's balcony area across my "great room". At ranges like this I can hit the center of mass without sights at all. If I'm shooting the length of my property - about 150 feet I would like a pair of sights. Irons work and a red dot of death is great. I use a .357 magnum revolver for my house defense weapon. The ability to use the other hand to open doors, hold a cell phone, or a flashlight is great. It wears a pair of Crimson Trace grips and they're very good for indoor use. They allow me to keep a steady hold on a target without my "full" attention. I live in a single family home with nice thick walls, double pain windows, nice locks, ample lighting, high fences and in a neighborhood full of retired cops and corrections officers and large noisy dogs. I don't think I'm going to need an M-60 to fend off the hoards of swarming armed gang members. My M-4 with a Comp ML is a wicked tool of death. The dot is so fast and accurate that I have full confidence in my abilities to put hot fast lead on any target at any reasonable distance. The rifle is the tool, the sight just an aid ... it's the man behind that tool that does the "work". It's a zen thing for me. Part of my Buddhist training - we practice the most deadly martial art - and becoming one with the weapon comes with time and practice.
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 9:05:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/10/2002 9:08:03 PM EDT by kwb377]
With the limited experience I've had with lasers, I found it more distracting trying to find the dot on the target than just lining up the iron sights and firing. I beleive that you wind up chasing the laser dot around, and also the further the target the smaller the dot. I've had a good bit of experience with red dot sights (mostly EoTech) and find it much easier to hit with. The dot is a constant size regardless of target distance. The dot is superimposed over the target instead of projected directly onto the target as with a laser. (my opinion, your mileage may vary)
Link Posted: 12/10/2002 9:15:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kwb377: With the limited experience I've had with lasers, I found it more distracting trying to find the dot on the target than just lining up the iron sights and firing. I beleive that you wind up chasing the laser dot around, and also the further the target the smaller the dot. I've had a good bit of experience with red dot sights (mostly EoTech) and find it much easier to hit with. The dot is a constant size regardless of target distance. The dot is superimposed over the target instead of projected directly onto the target as with a laser. (my opinion, your mileage may vary)
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Actually the further the distance, the LARGER the dot is. It does however become dimmer.
Link Posted: 12/11/2002 3:09:48 AM EDT
Well I have one of each on my favorite long arm, an ACOG TA-31F and a SF L72. With regards to the Red dot, I did not want a simple 1x magnification, because I wanted the ability to reach out at greater distances. However, in doing so, I felt I was sacrificing my CQB abilities in that 0-50 yard range. I believe the L72 fills that void nicely and believe me, there is no issue with “searching for the dot” when operating indoors as some have suggested. It even gives me greater confidence in transitioning to my weak side for turning those right side corners. Try doing that smoothly with a red dot.
Link Posted: 12/11/2002 6:58:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/11/2002 7:01:13 PM EDT by kwb377]
Originally Posted By DevL: Actually the further the distance, the LARGER the dot is. It does however become dimmer.
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My mistake. That's what I get for operating a keyboard with no sleep and hopped up on cold medicine.[:)]
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