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Posted: 2/27/2002 11:57:47 AM EDT
You can go back in time for 24 hrs with a long gun, sidearm and 1000 rounds for each. Where would you go? _______________________ I was never here!
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:05:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:09:45 PM EDT
Serpent, HELL. ill take a SAW and cut down a tree.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:13:38 PM EDT
Don't need but 15 minutes, a handgun and 100 rounds of .45. It'll sound cliche, but I'd go to post WWI Germany, to one A. Hitler's pad, and give him a good stern talking to.[kill] A whole lotta pain, death and destruction could've been averted by the erasure of that miserable mans existence. I'm sure a lot of you guys will be more creative than me with this...
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:21:06 PM EDT
Just think, [b]Gunbert[/b], with that one change, none of us would likely be alive! My father was at Texas A&M when Pearl Harbor was attacked. He was set to graduate as Class of '45. As it was he went off to the Pacific, fought a while, and came back in time to graduate in 1949! He met my mother at an Aggie Bonfire in 1947! Which means no war, no marriage, no Hun! Gadzooks! The discombobulation of the time-web continuum would be catastrophic! Eric The(LayDownThatPistol!HeSneered)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:27:02 PM EDT
I'd go to back to Sept 11 and hang out at the airport. I'd only need a handgun and 19rds though.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:47:37 PM EDT
Lets see. . . I'd drop it off in 1990 in the middle of nowhere, then start in 2001 and go back every day, taking the guns and the ammo, then I would return to the future with 1000s of guns and countless rounds of ammo, at which point I would sell them and retire.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:53:09 PM EDT
Actually, Eric is correct. If time travel is what you want to do, you must resign yourself that you can not change the past. If you change even one small thing in the past, it could have DIRE consequences to your future. I think that if your were to change something, you could change something to happen in your near future. Such as going back to the Great Depression and buying stock in International Business Machines (IBM), or going back to 1981 and buying $10,000 worth of stock in Microsoft. After making these purchases, you could then will them to yourself in several days in your near future (March 5, 2002 for example) That way, you are not changing the past, but your near future. I don't see this interrupting the Space-Time Continuum, like a much larger change would have. (Saving Kennedy or Lincoln, or killing Hitler or Hirohito)
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:55:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/27/2002 1:11:16 PM EDT by Gunbert]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Just think, [b]Gunbert[/b], with that one change, none of us would likely be alive! My father was at Texas A&M when Pearl Harbor was attacked. He was set to graduate as Class of '45. As it was he went off to the Pacific, fought a while, and came back in time to graduate in 1949! He met my mother at an Aggie Bonfire in 1947! Which means no war, no marriage, no Hun! Gadzooks! The discombobulation of the time-web continuum would be catastrophic! Eric The(LayDownThatPistol!HeSneered)Hun[>]:)]
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Yah, I thought of the "I might just disappear" possibility... but what can you do? Greatest good for the greatest number, in this case. It's kinda greedy for any of us to think that all of those people suffered and died just to establish our existance, [i]now[/i]. Self preservation instincts notwithstanding, you'd just POOF!, and be replaced by the new and improved world that your action created. Kind of a cosmic Catch-22, if you think about it. And, C'mon, who wouldn't want to be alone in a room with just you, Hitler and a softball bat? And I already know what some of you smartasses would say, so don't![;D]
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 12:56:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:00:08 PM EDT
Actually i would be more likely to kill the person who made it, destroy all the papers, then kill myself for the greater good of mankind. (Who wants to defend themselves against the past?)
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:07:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gunbert: Don't need but 15 minutes, a handgun and 100 rounds of .45. It'll sound cliche, but I'd go to post WWI Germany, to one A. Hitler's pad, and give him a good stern talking to.[kill] A whole lotta pain, death and destruction could've been averted by the erasure of that miserable mans existence. I'm sure a lot of you guys will be more creative than me with this...
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dont forget to stop by joe stalin's on the way home...
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:14:15 PM EDT
only rpbo would be paradox but i like that stock idea :)
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:18:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:25:48 PM EDT
The poet (whose name escapes me for the moment) said it best: 'Thou canst not touch a flower, Lest thou trouble a star.' So all of our lives are so intertwined that those who would have lived should not envy those of us who did. Eric The(Poetic)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:27:40 PM EDT
Changing the past too significantly would likely lead to unintended consequences. I would probably go back about 15 years to see myself. I would tell myself to invest all my money in Microsoft stock and use the profit to buy guns. I would also tell myself about a couple of women I would probably meet and to do things a bit differently.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:32:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 1:46:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By brouhaha: Future time travel, OTOH, could be a possibilty. That's what I'd do. The past is already done. Why not go into the future and find out how things can be made for the better? Will there be another Hitler? Will we find out where Osama has been hiding? This way, you could change our future timeline for a better one.
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Your logic is faulty--if one could not travel back in time, but COULD travel forward, it would be impossible to return to "the present" (this would require travelling backward in time...) For myself, I wouldn't need the weapons--as others have pointed out, changing the past would likely mean that you could have never gona back in time to begin with--ergo, travelling back in time with the intent to change the past is futile. Changing the FUTURE on the other hand, is a different story. Buying $10,000 worth of Microsoft and locking the certificates in a safe deposit box for a few decades would be nice. Since the year mentioned was 1981, I'd probably register a few dozen DIAS, M16 receivers, and various other MGs as well (all for the greater good, of course. :) Hell, that might be a better investment than microsoft! OTOH, if one could go forward, I figure just twenty years would be enough--stopping by the library to pick up the last twenty years of the WSJ on microfiche (or CDROM, whatever) and maybe raiding the patent database for the specs of "the next big thing." If I was feeling particularly altruistic, I'd choose the early 1790s, and bring to the attention of Madison and Jefferson that certain of their successors won't read the constitution the same way they did... and maybe if they moved a comma or two, things might work out a little better.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 2:04:29 PM EDT
Many have suggested going to the future to see what needed to be fixed in our present to avoid a future outcome. Wouldn't doing this have dire consequences for those living in the future? I mean if you don't want to change anything in the past because it may affect you or your existance what would give you the right to do it to someone else? Point is that space and time are relative to the point of observation. We see light from distant galaxies in our present. Essentially that is looking back in time. To us it is current but to someone from a distant galaxy it could be 300 million year old news. Some day trans warp drives will not be simple fodder of science fiction but will actually exist. There is no doubt that space and time can be warped by a significant enough source of gravity. Scientists have observed this at the edges of black holes. Just a matter of time (ironic) before we harness this power and can travel somewhere and arrive before we left.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 2:15:33 PM EDT
OK, guys, I think we're getting away from the spirit of the topic... Just give in, throw logic and science out the window and [b]go back in time for 24 hrs with a long gun, sidearm and 1000 rounds for each.[/b] What would you do?
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 3:27:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 4:19:04 PM EDT
If you really want to make your brain work, consider this: We'd like to think of avoiding big, horrible things like WWII, 9/11, the gradual stripping of our rights by making one small change some time in the past. But would a small change like shooting Hitler or Osama, or changing the wording of the 2nd really have an effect? Hitler was able to start WWII not just because he was a sick, crazy f*ck, but because the German people liked his ideas. Germany took a real beating in WWI, and had harsh sanctions imposed on it. Then this guy comes along and says "Hey, we're the perfect race here! It's just those damm Jews that are keeping us down! Let's kill them and take over Europe!" In any other time, he would have been ignored, just as Neo-Nazis are mostly ignored today. But he succeded because he gave the german people what they wanted at the time. If you kill him, would someone else come foreward and do basically the same thing? Same idea with 9/11. You can kill Osama or the hijackers pretty easily, but you cannot erase the Islamic hatred of America that fueled these events so easily. Same thing again with the gradual stripping of our rights. The forces at work trying to encroach on our rights have already ignored all sane rules of grammer when interpereting the second amendment. Would moving a few words or commas around really stop them? Of course, I'd like to see what they would do with this: "The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. Ever. By anyone. This means you. Any government employee who acts to limit the people's access to weapons or ammunition shall be banned forever from government service and imprisoned for a time not less then 10 years" Not bad for something I just made up.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 4:51:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mace: "The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. Ever. By anyone. This means you. Any government employee who acts to limit the people's access to weapons or ammunition shall be banned forever from government service and imprisoned for a time not less then 10 years" Not bad for something I just made up.
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I love it! I would've made our case a bit easier to defend against interpretive lawyers and feel-good legislators.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 6:13:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gunbert: OK, guys, I think we're getting away from the spirit of the topic... Just give in, throw logic and science out the window and [b]go back in time for 24 hrs with a long gun, sidearm and 1000 rounds for each.[/b] What would you do?
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Ok, I'll play... I would go back and have some good one on one fun with the (I use the term loosely) man that molested my daughter. I just don't know if 2000 rounds is enough! :)
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 6:30:08 PM EDT
I'd go back 10 minutes, because 10 minutes ago I didn't have the sidearm of my dreams and a $hitload of ammo.[bounce]
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 7:00:53 PM EDT
Regarding the scientific time travel questions...a lot of physicists think that if time travel were possible that if you changed something, the timeline from which you came would continue on undisturbed, but you would split off a second timeline with your changes. So if you kill your grandfather, you'll still exist, but the new timeline you created won't have the you in it that it would otherwise have had.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 7:57:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/27/2002 7:58:54 PM EDT by The_Macallan]
Originally Posted By RikWriter: Regarding the scientific time travel questions...a lot of physicists think that if time travel were possible that if you changed something, the timeline from which you came would continue on undisturbed, but you would split off a second timeline with your changes. So if you kill your grandfather, you'll still exist, but the new timeline you created won't have the you in it that it would otherwise have had.
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Absolutely [b]RikWriter[/b] and well said. There would be no contradiction - just another alternative future you've created from that point forward. Regarding buying Microsoft in 1981, that's not possible. It didn't go public until March 13, 1986. The IPO price was [b]$21[/b] per share. You really want to cry? [b]If you bought just ONE share of Microsoft for $21/share back when it was first offered in '86, today it would be worth...[red]$10,080[/red]. (that's a gain of 47,900% over 16years!).[/b] Okay... go ahead... [>(]
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 8:10:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RikWriter: Regarding the scientific time travel questions...a lot of physicists think that if time travel were possible that if you changed something, the timeline from which you came would continue on undisturbed, but you would split off a second timeline with your changes. So if you kill your grandfather, you'll still exist, but the new timeline you created won't have the you in it that it would otherwise have had.
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Wait, is this something like the idea that everysingle possibility/outcome for something has happened in another plane of existance? As Star Trek's 'Capt. Janeway' said: "This is giving me a head ache."
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 8:14:34 PM EDT
I'd go back before the CA AW ban and buy a winning lotto ticket. Cash it in, buy all the weapons I can't have now and register them so I can have them. Then I would move out of this fricken state! And then buy more toys.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 8:54:05 PM EDT
I would try to figure out exactly where the dinosaur quary near Vernal Utah was at the time all of those dinosaur bones were deposited. I would add a few more bones to the pile and would leave the rifle and ammo scattered in the area. They would be altered quite a bit, but I'm sure they would be identifiable. Wouldn't that be interesting?
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 9:36:39 PM EDT
In all seriousness, I would search historical documents and find the one day in the mid-late 1800's in which Karl Marx, Friedrich Engles and Vladimir Lenin were in close enough proximity to each other to wipe them all out in a single 24hr period. After that, if I had time, I think I'd also try to head out to Austria and look in on a young lad named Adolph. Now THAT'S a day well spent!
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 9:47:32 PM EDT
Go back to the 80's, pop Hinkley before he shot Regan/Brady, hence no Brady Bill.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 10:08:51 PM EDT
One Long Gun and a Sidearm and 1000 rounds each. 24 hours??? Long Gun? M16/M203 yes the 20"er Sidearm? HK .45Acp Tactical 24 hours/ when and where. OH about 3 Days before Jesus was put on the Cross. "COMMON Jesus Were gettin outa here!" Of course he wouldn't go, but you can always try. Benjamin
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 10:24:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By brouhaha: Think about it this way...you go back to the time of the Dinosaurs and step on a measly bug. But wait! That bug was supposed to be a major part of evolution! Or a lizard that was evolving needed that single bug to stay alive! You just changed millions of years worth of events...possibly even the existance of mammals!
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That reminds me of the Simpson's Halloween Special when Homer "fixed" the toaster into a time machine. I love that episode.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 10:38:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By brouhaha: Think about it this way...you go back to the time of the Dinosaurs and step on a measly bug. But wait! That bug was supposed to be a major part of evolution! Or a lizard that was evolving needed that single bug to stay alive! You just changed millions of years worth of events...possibly even the existance of mammals!
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Actually that sounds like Ray Bradbury's classic tale "A Sound of Thunder".
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 11:43:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Schnert: I'd go back 10 minutes, because 10 minutes ago I didn't have the sidearm of my dreams and a $hitload of ammo.[bounce]
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Now this guy is thinking. I could have a new rifle and pistol! They'd probably be VERY rare and be worth millions of dollars each. Oh yea, the only future I'd like to change is the one that starts now.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 12:06:17 AM EDT
Why would you have to go back at all? Just walk into the Vatican and demonstrate it to the Cardinals, tell them that your going to go back to Cavalry with a video camera, and record what realy happened in the final days of the life of Christ. The pope quick as a wink writes you a check for millions, So he can take your machine out back and have Bishops beat it into junk with sledge hammers. Them you head strait to Salt Lake City to repeat this stunt with the Mormans. This scam has endless posibilities.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 8:25:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Fearandloathing37: Why would you have to go back at all? Just walk into the Vatican and demonstrate it to the Cardinals, tell them that your going to go back to Cavalry with a video camera, and record what realy happened in the final days of the life of Christ. The pope quick as a wink writes you a check for millions, So he can take your machine out back and have Bishops beat it into junk with sledge hammers. Them you head strait to Salt Lake City to repeat this stunt with the Mormans. This scam has endless posibilities.
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A unique answer.....
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 9:03:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/28/2002 9:06:07 AM EDT by The_Macallan]
Originally Posted By Fearandloathing37: Why would you have to go back at all? Just walk into the Vatican and demonstrate it to the Cardinals, tell them that your going to go back to Cavalry with a video camera, and record what realy happened in the final days of the life of Christ.
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The pope quick as a wink gives you his blessing and waits for you to go "see Jesus's crucifixion and resurrection for yourself". Then, wiping the cold sweat from your face you begin to realize that puny little you were about to witness the singular event that changed all of human history, the event that was witnessed by hundreds of people and told about for millinnia, the event that formed the foundation of Modern Western Civilization. The death of Jesus Christ. YOU - THERE - IN PERSON. The knot in your stomach begins to twist as you contemplate the magnitude of what you, up till then had so frivolously and casually dismissed as fairytales, were about to witness. No room for doubts. You'd come face to face with the MAN himself as HE is nailed to the cross for YOUR sin of denying Him. When it's over, you'd know for sure. Slowly breathing, eyes bugging out, hands trembling, sweat dripping like blood from your forehead, you step into the time machine knowing you're headed straight into the [u]cross[/u]road of all human history. Take a deep breath. Wave bye-bye to the Pope as he gives you a very slight but content smile knowing you'll soon learn what he's known for 80 years. Cuts both ways buddyboy.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 9:20:45 AM EDT
Thank you, The_Macallen, for your thoughts on such a unimaginable scene as you described! When we view the Sun from earth, I am informed by those who should know, that we are actually viewing the Sun as it looked 7 minutes ago! Meaning that it takes approximately 7 minutes for the light from the Sun to arrive at earth. So that if the Sun suddenly blew up, it would be 7 minutes before we would see it, since light travels at the approximate speed of 186,000 miles per second! Does that mean, someone help me here, that if you were on the surface of an object 2,000 light years from earth, [u]and[/u] you had a telescope of such magnitude that you could actually focus on the earth, and such telescope was sufficiently able to focus on a hill outside of the City of Jerusalem, would you then be able to see the actual crucifixon of the Lord? In the 'present', so to speak? Hello? Scientists? Wait a minute! Is this a Kilgore Trout kind of question? Maybe I should be asking Kurt Vonnegut? Eric The(ElliotRosewaterOfAR15.com)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 9:24:51 AM EDT
Steyr SSG in .308 go back and wax this dude named Mohammad. (Not Ali..)
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 11:00:03 AM EDT
in theory, if you could travel faster than light, (much faster) and get PAST the light traveling through space-assuming it was strong enough to be visible in you mega super delux telescope, you COULD see it, yes. but the other factors make it impossible. Remember the stars you see every night (granted its not cloudy) you are seeing the light they produced thousands/millions of years ago(depending on distance) that is just reaching us now.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 2:48:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gunbert: OK, guys, I think we're getting away from the spirit of the topic... Just give in, throw logic and science out the window and [b]go back in time for 24 hrs with a long gun, sidearm and 1000 rounds for each.[/b] What would you do?
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I'd probably forget to bring a @%^#^$& cleaning kit and my ^*!#@% AR15 would get dirty and jam, leaving me to fight off the angry hordes of whoever with only my pistol! [:D] Now, WRT the time paradox problem, my thoughts on the matter are that in order for time travel to work, "thinking outside the box" will be required. In other words, if the time paradox is preventing time travel from becoming a reality, then we'll have to change the rules so there's no time paradox. I'll use the fictional Star Trek "warp drive" or Star Wars "hyperdrive" as examples. Our laws of physics say no object can travel at or faster than the speed of light, so what some genius does is create a field that, not being an "object," CAN travel faster than light. The field is generated by the starship and therefore, when viewed from the starships' frame of reference is travelling at the starship's subluminal velocity. But, when viewed from an outside frame of reference, the field is travelling at hyperrelativistic velocities. Anyway, I just think that what's going to have to happen is someone will change the rules to fit the problem, if the problem can't be solved within the rules.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 2:58:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gunbert: Don't need but 15 minutes, a handgun and 100 rounds of .45. It'll sound cliche, but I'd go to post WWI Germany, to one A. Hitler's pad, and give him a good stern talking to.[kill] A whole lotta pain, death and destruction could've been averted by the erasure of that miserable mans existence. I'm sure a lot of you guys will be more creative than me with this...
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How do you know that World War II didn't prevent total nuclear anhilation? Killing Hitler might doom the planet.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 3:00:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Does that mean, someone help me here, that if you were on the surface of an object 2,000 light years from earth, [u]and[/u] you had a telescope of such magnitude that you could actually focus on the earth, and such telescope was sufficiently able to focus on a hill outside of the City of Jerusalem, would you then be able to see the actual crucifixon of the Lord? In the 'present', so to speak? Hello? Scientists? Wait a minute! Is this a Kilgore Trout kind of question? Maybe I should be asking Kurt Vonnegut? Eric The(ElliotRosewaterOfAR15.com)Hun[>]:)]
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Arthur C Clarke had a similar short story in one of his collections. A future insterstellar expedition is exploring a planet that had been occupied by an intelligent civilization several thousand years in the past and was destroyed by its primary going supernova. One scientist (maybe he was a priest, it's been 10-15 years since I read it) calculated exactly when the supernova occurred and lamented the fact that the sign that announced Christ's birth also destroyed this civilization.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 3:03:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gunbert: Don't need but 15 minutes, a handgun and 100 rounds of .45. It'll sound cliche, but I'd go to post WWI Germany, to one A. Hitler's pad, and give him a good stern talking to.[kill] A whole lotta pain, death and destruction could've been averted by the erasure of that miserable mans existence. I'm sure a lot of you guys will be more creative than me with this...
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NO CHANCE IN HELL! Hitler as well as every historical figure needs to live in order for us to exist as we do. Imagine a world where the US never recovered from the depression? Where the USSR developed the bomb first and told us not to? Where Germany had a leader who wasn't stupid enough to open up the second front, and actually used Russia to conquer the world. If I could go back in time with a gun, I'd take the M16, bring it back into the 40's and sell it to the gov, with all future TM's and $$ to be vested to the unborn ME!!!
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 3:13:14 PM EDT
I would zap back a couple of thousand years and take out a certain carpentry student.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 4:45:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Stormbringer: I would zap back a couple of thousand years and take out a certain carpentry student.
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Gee, and you hardly knew the guy!
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 4:51:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Stormbringer: I would zap back a couple of thousand years and take out a certain carpentry student.
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On second thought... So you'd take the side of Pontius Pilate and Judas? Let's see, would you rather be the one who drove the nails into his hands, or would you stick your sword into his nearly dead body for the coup de gras? You're certainly one hell of wise sage there [b]Stormbringer[/b]. [devil]
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 5:38:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 6:04:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Macallan:
Originally Posted By Stormbringer: I would zap back a couple of thousand years and take out a certain carpentry student.
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On second thought... So you'd take the side of Pontius Pilate and Judas? Let's see, would you rather be the one who drove the nails into his hands, or would you stick your sword into his nearly dead body for the coup de gras? You're certainly one hell of wise sage there [b]Stormbringer[/b]. [devil]
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No silly if you recall I get to use a firearm!!! Hmmmmm I would use my Springfield 1911!
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