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Posted: 5/7/2004 9:04:06 AM EST
Yes, I listen to Rush and I don't care if you don't!

He said "Robert Bird is now speaking..Remember, there were more hoods at his 40th birthday party than you saw at the prison in Iraq"
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:09:09 AM EST
I heard that
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:10:16 AM EST

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Yes, I listen to Rush and I don't care if you don't!

He said "Robert Bird is now speaking..Remember, there were more hoods at his 40th birthday party than you saw at the prison in Iraq"



Isn't that the truth!!!
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:15:32 AM EST
OH SHIT! He just said "Kennedy is calling for the Red Cross to investigate...Why didn't he call for the Red Cross at Chapaquidick(sp)"
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:22:00 AM EST
Ya and rush said that the rape and forced sodomy going on in that prison were soldiers just "blowing off steam". Give me a break.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:33:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By Imbroglio:
Ya and rush said that the rape and forced sodomy going on in that prison were soldiers just "blowing off steam". Give me a break.

No, that was a liberal paraphrase of what he said.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:44:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 10:12:24 AM EST by dtomfrank]

Originally Posted By Carbine_Man:

Originally Posted By Imbroglio:
Ya and rush said that the rape and forced sodomy going on in that prison were soldiers just "blowing off steam". Give me a break.

No, that was a liberal paraphrase of what he said.



No, I was listening....I have it on tape.....He said that they were just "blowing off steam" and he called it a faternity prank "just like they do at Skull & Bones" which he also said didn't exsist two months ago.

I would also add that I am at this moment reading the 'Article 15-6 Investigation of the 800th Military Police Brigade' by Maj Gen Antonio M. Taguba. In it, among the charges of abuse, is rape of male and female prisoners. This is not simple 'beating information out of prisoners', this is the behaviour of rabid animals who are a disgrace to the uniform. It is not an idictment of the entire military in any way. It is a statement of fact about evil that was done in our name and paid for by us. This is exactly what we accused Saddam of and exactly what we demonized (with good reason) the Nazi SS for.

It is time to admit that there is right and wrong, and if we are to continue acting like we wear the white hat in this whole thing then we need to start facing up to the evil that went on here; rather than laugh along with a lapdog, yes man, junky radio host.


Link Posted: 5/7/2004 9:46:12 AM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:00:40 AM EST
Why is it that there is so much more anger, outrage, and even a congressional investigation on Iragi prison abuse that at worst is described by the Red Cross as bordering on torture than there was anger and outrage when the Americans were killed and mutilated in Fallujah? Why so much media coverage and political outcry for justice on this when these same people hung an American body off a bridge and the media quit covering that in about a week? It's not we lined them up and killed them.

I'm I such a hardass or I'm I missing something here?
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:06:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By cjl32:
Why is it that there is so much more anger, outrage, and even a congressional investigation on Iragi prison abuse that at worst is described by the Red Cross as bordering on torture than there was anger and outrage when the Americans were killed and mutilated in Fallujah? Why so much media coverage and political outcry for justice on this when these same people hung an American body off a bridge and the media quit covering that in about a week? It's not we lined them up and killed them.

I'm I such a hardass or I'm I missing something here?

You're not missing anything. The biggest attrocities of this war are being commited by the media.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:25:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 10:28:40 AM EST by dtomfrank]

Originally Posted By cjl32:
Why is it that there is so much more anger, outrage, and even a congressional investigation on Iragi prison abuse that at worst is described by the Red Cross as bordering on torture than there was anger and outrage when the Americans were killed and mutilated in Fallujah? Why so much media coverage and political outcry for justice on this when these same people hung an American body off a bridge and the media quit covering that in about a week? It's not we lined them up and killed them.

I'm I such a hardass or I'm I missing something here?



Read the Army report.

We're supposed to be the good guys.

The bodies on the bridge were already dead - they were not tortured. I do not agree with it, and it made me sick, as well. But I will not justify torture and rape just because "they did it first." We are not on a grade school playground here.

The Red Coats did all manner of ruthless things to the colonists during the Revolutionary war, but General Washington's men at no time, even when they were starving and frozen, treated British prisoners in no way but honorable. Why? Because it was the right thing to do.

We have standards - we believe that ALL MEN are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights. If we do not start behaving that way, we as a nation are doomed.

Think about how sick a man has to be to be able to get a hard-on and rape a female prisoner. Someone who is helpless - done while others looked on and laughed. Shame on you for making excuses.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:28:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By Carbine_Man:
[You're not missing anything. The biggest attrocities of this war are being commited by the media.



AMEN!
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:35:25 AM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:36:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 10:36:27 AM EST by cyanide]

It is time to admit that there is right and wrong, and if we are to continue acting like we wear the white hat in this whole thing then we need to start facing up to the evil that went on here; rather than laugh along with a lapdog, yes man, junky radio host.


No one wears a white hat in war, do not kid yourself.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:39:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Rush Just Said....



he is a big, fat idiot !



Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:44:15 AM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:47:44 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 10:48:54 AM EST by wetidlerjr]

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Rush Just Said....



he is a big, fat idiot !





Ahhhh, the Al Franken Is My Sweet Babboo contingent here at ARFCOM rears its ugly head!

Liberal drivel, even when repeated here by a Member, is still liberal drivel!

How is Al's radio show doing?

Did the checks clear, yet? Is it still on the air?

Heh-heh-heh!

Eric The(BowledOverWithLaughter)Hun



I beg your very confused pardon ! My head (and rear!) is , in no way, ugly !


I did, however, send a nice check to Al in your name !
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:49:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Rush Just Said....



he is a big, fat idiot !





Ahhhh, the Al Franken Is My Sweet Babboo contingent here at ARFCOM rears its ugly head!

Liberal drivel, even when repeated here by a Member, is still liberal drivel!

How is Al's radio show doing?

Did the checks clear, yet? Is it still on the air?

Heh-heh-heh!

Eric The(BowledOverWithLaughter)Hun



I beg your very confused pardon ! My head (and rear!) is , in no way, ugly !



So your not gay.................................. right.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:49:55 AM EST
Who in the heck wants to listen to Al Franken?

Get me Zell Miller.

Now there's a Democrat I can listen to.

And no I am not a Republican. Registered Independent.

CRC
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:22:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:

Originally Posted By cjl32:
Why is it that there is so much more anger, outrage, and even a congressional investigation on Iragi prison abuse that at worst is described by the Red Cross as bordering on torture than there was anger and outrage when the Americans were killed and mutilated in Fallujah? Why so much media coverage and political outcry for justice on this when these same people hung an American body off a bridge and the media quit covering that in about a week? It's not we lined them up and killed them.

I'm I such a hardass or I'm I missing something here?



Read the Army report.

We're supposed to be the good guys.

The bodies on the bridge were already dead - they were not tortured. I do not agree with it, and it made me sick, as well. But I will not justify torture and rape just because "they did it first." We are not on a grade school playground here.

The Red Coats did all manner of ruthless things to the colonists during the Revolutionary war, but General Washington's men at no time, even when they were starving and frozen, treated British prisoners in no way but honorable. Why? Because it was the right thing to do.

We have standards - we believe that ALL MEN are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights. If we do not start behaving that way, we as a nation are doomed.

Think about how sick a man has to be to be able to get a hard-on and rape a female prisoner. Someone who is helpless - done while others looked on and laughed. Shame on you for making excuses.




You missed the entire meaning of my rant. In no way do I agree with what happened to the prisoners and I'm also perfectly aware that two wrongs do not make a right. I never said anything about "they did it first" to justify what happened. My point was that the attention and coverage this is getting is exponentially greater than that of what these same Iragis have done to our boys. In my mind, the exposure is inversely proportional to the crimes committed. It boils down to this for me: Why so much more outcry over some trailer trash girl pointing at a naked man's dick than outcry over a dead American hanging from a bridge. I guess it was because the American was just dead, not tortured as you described.



Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:25:25 AM EST



So, fret not, little fellow, we share your views of how US military personnel should act.

But I, for one, refuse to be consumed by this little shiitefest, and the Media is counting on most folks to forget that this prison was the scene of AUTHORIZED rape and murder under the previous regime!

Eric The(KeepingHisEyesOnThePrize)Hun hr


It sure was, carried out by people who were trained at the School of America's at US taxpayer expense, done under the fully aware eye's of our own CIA (just like in Iran during the Shah's rule) in order to keep rival factions at bay so the oil would flow. And that's what the "Media" is hoping we forget. Saddam was a bayguy...but he was OUR badguy.

I agree that this "torture" issue is a media manipulation. However, it is to make us out the badguy's so the UN Peacekeeper's can come in and take control. That was telegraphed at the start of this debacle when that oh-so-loving organization was given the oil profit rights to Iraq at the beginning of the "war" [I thought only Congress could declare those?]

There is nothing going on here on any level, on either side, that is based in any kind of truth. And it's the soldier, as usual, that is stuck in the middle and pays for the sins of others.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:29:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 11:30:50 AM EST by wetidlerjr]

Originally Posted By cyanide:
So your not gay.................................. right.






You should not be ashamed of being gay. Your friends will understand.There are organizations that will help you with your problems. Maybe they will stop your mommy from beating your ass so often.
(or maybe not)

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:29:59 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 11:31:52 AM EST by dtomfrank]

Originally Posted By cjl32:

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:

Originally Posted By cjl32:
Why is it that there is so much more anger, outrage, and even a congressional investigation on Iragi prison abuse that at worst is described by the Red Cross as bordering on torture than there was anger and outrage when the Americans were killed and mutilated in Fallujah? Why so much media coverage and political outcry for justice on this when these same people hung an American body off a bridge and the media quit covering that in about a week? It's not we lined them up and killed them.

I'm I such a hardass or I'm I missing something here?



Read the Army report.

We're supposed to be the good guys.

The bodies on the bridge were already dead - they were not tortured. I do not agree with it, and it made me sick, as well. But I will not justify torture and rape just because "they did it first." We are not on a grade school playground here.

The Red Coats did all manner of ruthless things to the colonists during the Revolutionary war, but General Washington's men at no time, even when they were starving and frozen, treated British prisoners in no way but honorable. Why? Because it was the right thing to do.

We have standards - we believe that ALL MEN are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights. If we do not start behaving that way, we as a nation are doomed.

Think about how sick a man has to be to be able to get a hard-on and rape a female prisoner. Someone who is helpless - done while others looked on and laughed. Shame on you for making excuses.




You missed the entire meaning of my rant. In no way do I agree with what happened to the prisoners and I'm also perfectly aware that two wrongs do not make a right. I never said anything about "they did it first" to justify what happened. My point was that the attention and coverage this is getting is exponentially greater than that of what these same Iragis have done to our boys. In my mind, the exposure is inversely proportional to the crimes committed. It boils down to this for me: Why so much more outcry over some trailer trash girl pointing at a naked man's dick than outcry over a dead American hanging from a bridge. I guess it was because the American was just dead, not tortured as you described.






I more than agree that it is getting "overplayed" - now ask yourself why? Why now, when it's been known about for over a year. Why is this getting play but the commander of Guantanamo quiting because he refused to go along with torturing "goat herders" (his words, not mine) got zero coverage? Perhaps we're being played?
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:32:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By cjl32:
My point was that the attention and coverage this is getting is exponentially greater than that of what these same Iragis have done to our boys. In my mind, the exposure is inversely proportional to the crimes committed. It boils down to this for me: Why so much more outcry over some trailer trash girl pointing at a naked man's dick than outcry over a dead American hanging from a bridge. I guess it was because the American was just dead, not tortured as you described.






I guess you have a very short attention span and don't remember most if not all of you supported the U.S. govt clamp down on media coverage of U.S. casualties in iraq when the war started. Now you want full coverage. Make up your damned minds.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:40:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:
I more than agree that it is getting "overplayed" - now ask yourself why? Why now, when it's been known about for over a year. Why is this getting play but the commander of Guantanamo quiting because he refused to go along with torturing "goat herders" (his words, not mine) got zero coverage? Perhaps we're being played?



I am beginning to believe that it is a good cop (UN)/bad cop (U.S.) game being played to condition people to accept the UN as a savior. As you mentioned hardly any play came about when the commander resigned from gitmo over torture, but isn't it convienent how all of this iraqi prison stuff is coming out a few months before the U.S. to UN transition? This whole mess started over violations of UN sactions and will end up back in UN hands.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:47:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By Imbroglio:

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:
I more than agree that it is getting "overplayed" - now ask yourself why? Why now, when it's been known about for over a year. Why is this getting play but the commander of Guantanamo quiting because he refused to go along with torturing "goat herders" (his words, not mine) got zero coverage? Perhaps we're being played?



I am beginning to believe that it is a good cop (UN)/bad cop (U.S.) game being played to condition people to accept the UN as a savior. As you mentioned hardly any play came about when the commander resigned from gitmo over torture, but isn't it convienent how all of this iraqi prison stuff is coming out a few months before the U.S. to UN transition? This whole mess started over violations of UN sactions and will end up back in UN hands.



Bingo!
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:49:06 AM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:50:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By cyanide:

It is time to admit that there is right and wrong, and if we are to continue acting like we wear the white hat in this whole thing then we need to start facing up to the evil that went on here; rather than laugh along with a lapdog, yes man, junky radio host.


No one wears a white hat in war, do not kid yourself.



That's why I said "acting."
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 11:56:20 AM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:18:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By Imbroglio:
Ya and rush said that the rape and forced sodomy going on in that prison were soldiers just "blowing off steam". Give me a break.



Which leg? (Actually you're misrepresenting what he said, but that's nothing new for you.)
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:19:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By Imbroglio:

I am beginning to believe that it is a good cop (UN)/bad cop (U.S.) game being played to condition people to accept the UN as a savior.



Which, I guess, establishes that you'll believe ANYTHING...except the truth.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:25:50 PM EST

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:
Post from dtomfrankm-

It sure was, carried out by people who were trained at the School of America's at US taxpayer expense, done under the fully aware eye's of our own CIA (just like in Iran during the Shah's rule) in order to keep rival factions at bay so the oil would flow. And that's what the "Media" is hoping we forget. Saddam was a bayguy...but he was OUR badguy.

Oh no!

You are one of 'them'!

That is so disheartening! You subscribe to the conspiracy theories of the Ultra Far Left! And the Ultra Far Right! That this war was for nothing but oil!

Get real, if we were so used to dealing with Saddam, then we would have asked our 'badguy' to simply lower the price on his crude oil.

BTW, before the War, Iraqi crude was selling cheaper than any other OPEC nation's oil!

Why?

And if it was, then why did we want him out?

Surely Halliburton could deal with Saddam a whole lot easier than they can deal with Islamo-facists that may likely replace him?

The problem with all conspiracy geeks is that they assume they know more than anyone.

When in truth they often know less that everyone!

That phrase that closed this segment of your post was taken from FDR, by the way. Is he one of your heroes, or not?

I agree that this "torture" issue is a media manipulation. However, it is to make us out the badguy's so the UN Peacekeeper's can come in and take control. That was telegraphed at the start of this debacle when that oh-so-loving organization was given the oil profit rights to Iraq at the beginning of the "war" [I thought only Congress could declare those?]

Oh, I now see where you're coming from with this paragraph!

Congress approved this 'war'. my friend! Do you need to go check that out the Congressional Record, or can you simply grasp that bit of knowledge from the fact that NO opponent of the War in Congress is still urging that lame excuse?

There is nothing going on here on any level, on either side, that is based in any kind of truth. And it's the soldier, as usual, that is stuck in the middle and pays for the sins of others.

That my friend is sheer BULLSHIITE, plain and simple!

I love the way y'all conspiracy geeks explain to us, the gawking hoi polloi, that YOU know the TRUTH on every LEVEL and that YOU favor neither SIDE!

You and Art Bell, Baby! You and Art Bell!

Y'all know the Truth!

Eric The(Savant)Hun



Never listened to Art Bell in my life, just making my assesment from what I've read in the Wall Street Journal.

FDR was a Commie/Sociallist who I have zero use for.

I love the way "You People" can only ever come up with TWO sides to any issue when there are generally multiple layers.

Congress "approving" and Congress "declaring" are two completely different things.

Halliburton was only awarded ALL of the rebuilding contracts without bidding.

And it really isn't a matter of theory at this point. If you go to the PNAC(Project For The New American Century) website, you can read a policy paper writen by Cheney before Bush was elected where he states that Saddam will be used as a pretext for invading Iraq.

No consperacy...just what he said.

Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:33:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:
Congress "approving" and Congress "declaring" are two completely different things.



No, sorry, they are not.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:34:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:
Bingo!





BINGO



Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:35:59 PM EST
"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."

- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:37:02 PM EST
"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."

- Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:37:29 PM EST
"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."

- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:38:10 PM EST
"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has invigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a illicit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and
>> our allies."

- Letter to President Bush, Signed by Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL,) and others, December 5, 2001
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:38:43 PM EST
"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."

- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:39:10 PM EST
"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."

- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:39:46 PM EST
"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."

- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:42:55 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 12:43:28 PM EST by Paul]
"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

This was clearly brought on by socialist liberals hell bent on destroying the peaceful and legitimate government of Iraq ... and the illegitimate one of the Republik of Amerika.


Link Posted: 5/7/2004 12:43:48 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 1:22:38 PM EST
Anybody remember when this thread was about Rush???
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 3:51:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:
We're supposed to be the good guys.


Bingo!!

Maybe that’s already been said in prior threads - regardless, it’s worth repeating!!
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 4:22:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By mcgrubbs:
Anybody remember when this thread was about Rush???



Oh yeah....the drug addicted felon who's been given a pass by his loyalists.
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 5:11:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By dtomfrank:

Originally Posted By mcgrubbs:
Anybody remember when this thread was about Rush???



Oh yeah....the drug addicted felon who's been given a pass by his loyalists.



He was convicted....that's news to me!

If he's so horrible, why do you waste your time posting about him?!?!?
Link Posted: 5/8/2004 3:34:42 AM EST
He admitted what he did....

Atta wasn't "convicted", either, but I'm sure you have no problem refering to him as a scum-bag terrorist.

And...I really haven't been posting about him, that seemed to be the complaint I was responding to.

Link Posted: 5/8/2004 3:59:29 AM EST
Another liberal troll arrives. Wonderful!

Link Posted: 5/8/2004 4:06:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:
Post from wetidlerjr -

I beg your very confused pardon ! My head (and rear!) is , in no way, ugly !


Yes, I am certain that the next time you and Al Franken get together it will be to discuss the relative attractiveness of your respective heads!
But leave us out of the discussion, if you don't mind!

I did, however, send a nice check to Al in your name !

That's great!
Maybe some of his show's creditors can get paid now!
Just watch when you get that check back with your monthly statement and see that he took yourcheck straight to your bank to cash it!
I think that's called 'hammering a check'!
I can assure you that he's been doing a lot of that lately!
Eric The(FormerBankAttorney)Hun



Al said to say hello to you and ask that when you call again to let him know what time to pick you up at the airport. He says he knows the family reunion will be fun.



Link Posted: 5/8/2004 4:18:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By skipperJ:
Another liberal troll arrives. Wonderful!

fishhook1.homestead.com/files/troll.gif


At least we don't tattle on them to get them banned as happens to "DISRUPTERS" over on his home site.

We still believe in the Constitution and we remain comfortable with our differences. We like a robust, rowdy debate...in his idyllic world, there is NO debate, only the party line.

Doubt me anyone? Take a trip on the wild side and emulate this in reverse. Travel over to the DU and enter into a "conversation". The nanosecond that you disagree, your outta there! Ya know what? It's a pretty weak mind and character that simply refuses to hear alternatives...and it is right out of the Book of Lenin too.

Stick around Troll...you're amusing!
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