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Posted: 6/27/2008 8:24:26 AM EST
One thing that has REALLY been bothering me is how little respect people show for women. I was raised to hold the door, say "ma'am" when talking to women who I don't know, etc. Now people look at me like I am nuts when I hold the door for them. I understand that it isn't common, but it has gotten ridiculous. I held the door for a girl once and she was so shocked, she asked me out.

I was at Home Depot today and three employees were sitting around talking while a woman was struggling with a bag of charcoal. Occasionally the employees would glance at her, but they kept talking. What is wrong with them?

That, and a guy and girl making out in the middle of the street. She tried to push him away and was yelling at him to stop, but he wouldn't let go and was laughing the whole time. Eventually th two walked away holding hands. How is she still his girlfriend? Why doesn't she dump him and find someone who treats her like a human being, and not like a piece of property?

Just wanted to get that off my chest.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:29:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By LoganSackett:

Now people look at me like I am nuts when I hold the door for them. I understand that it isn't common, but it has gotten ridiculous. I held the door for a girl once and she was so shocked, she asked me out.


LOL!!! So you're a dinosaur too?!?!?

Almost the exact same thing happened to me several times in succession when I was in Australia! Opened a door for a lady and she knew right away I was a "yank" and proceeded to strike up conversation and eventually led to a night out/dinner and the weird part is that I was never able to pay for anything! Things like that happened to me fairly often over there...totally blew me away.

Don't dare try to to such a thing around here (Seattle area) while attending college though...practically got my head chopped-off by college girls and lady instructors. Learned to mind my own damned business, keep my eyes down and my mouth shut.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:35:08 AM EST
Didn't use to be like that around there. I grew up out there, but then maybe I'm a dinosaur.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:37:42 AM EST
Very noticable...

On the female side, the feminazis get pissed if you do anything 'nice' for them - and I'm not talking about 'be nice, maybe I can screw you later', I'm talking about opening doors, etc....

On the male side, a certain cultural phenomenon (Which, IMHO is full of CRAP) has lead to guys going even further to treat/talk about women like shit... I'm sorry, maybe I'm old fashioned, but referring to women-in-general as 'bitches' or 'whores' (when you have seen no evidence that they are either) -> FAIL...

Of course, the end result of the aobve is that it's become more 'acceptable' for young women to 'rise to the occasion' and fill that stereotype...

And so we go, off on another liberal-induced, amoral downward spiral...

Thanks Feminazis... Maybe someday you'll wake up & realize that the 'old' way of treating women like ladies until they prove themselves not to be such... Was better...
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:39:37 AM EST
Dunno...here in liberal land, men are still polite, and the women are appreciative. At least those that I know and run into in my daily pitiful life.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:44:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Very noticable...

On the female side, the feminazis get pissed if you do anything 'nice' for them - and I'm not talking about 'be nice, maybe I can screw you later', I'm talking about opening doors, etc....

On the male side, a certain cultural phenomenon (Which, IMHO is full of CRAP) has lead to guys going even further to treat/talk about women like shit... I'm sorry, maybe I'm old fashioned, but referring to women-in-general as 'bitches' or 'whores' (when you have seen no evidence that they are either) -> FAIL...

Of course, the end result of the aobve is that it's become more 'acceptable' for young women to 'rise to the occasion' and fill that stereotype...

And so we go, off on another liberal-induced, amoral downward spiral...

Thanks Feminazis... Maybe someday you'll wake up & realize that the 'old' way of treating women like ladies until they prove themselves not to be such... Was better...


Guess I'm glad I haven't been home in a few years.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 10:52:09 AM EST
I'm old fashioned too..

but the womenz these days are ungrateful (too much self entitlement, I guess)

IMHO and YMMV
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:02:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By RED_5:
I'm old fashioned too..

but the womenz these days are ungrateful (too much self entitlement, I guess)

IMHO and YMMV


Not all women. And not everywhere.

Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:09:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Originally Posted By RED_5:
I'm old fashioned too..

but the womenz these days are ungrateful (too much self entitlement, I guess)

IMHO and YMMV


Not all women. And not everywhere.



hence my 'disclaimer'
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:10:10 AM EST
It was a pretty tough for me back in 2005...

I remember I was going to school part-time, working full-time.

I was also going through a course of chemotherapy at the time so I didn't look so hot...my color looked terrible and my hair was pretty thinned-out because it had been falling out for a while.

Anyway...I was at the registration office at my local community college and I had my 3 kids with me.

I was carrying my 3 year old (at the time) son and one of the ladies at the registrar's desk mentioned what a,"cute little proto-rapist" he was...right to my face...in front of my older son and my daughter.

Good times for middle-aged white single dads attending college these days...
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:16:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/27/2008 11:17:32 AM EST by daisywench]

Originally Posted By RED_5:

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Originally Posted By RED_5:
I'm old fashioned too..

but the womenz these days are ungrateful (too much self entitlement, I guess)

IMHO and YMMV


Not all women. And not everywhere.



hence my 'disclaimer'


Your "disclaimer" indicates that it's your opinion, and my opinion may vary. I find it hard to believe that you have never met ONE appreciative woman in your life.

not even one? Even though you're from hippynik Colorado? Surely you jest.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:18:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Very noticable...

On the female side, the feminazis get pissed if you do anything 'nice' for them - and I'm not talking about 'be nice, maybe I can screw you later', I'm talking about opening doors, etc....

On the male side, a certain cultural phenomenon (Which, IMHO is full of CRAP) has lead to guys going even further to treat/talk about women like shit... I'm sorry, maybe I'm old fashioned, but referring to women-in-general as 'bitches' or 'whores' (when you have seen no evidence that they are either) -> FAIL...
Of course, the end result of the aobve is that it's become more 'acceptable' for young women to 'rise to the occasion' and fill that stereotype...

And so we go, off on another liberal-induced, amoral downward spiral...

Thanks Feminazis... Maybe someday you'll wake up & realize that the 'old' way of treating women like ladies until they prove themselves not to be such... Was better...


Sounds alot like ARFCOM GD. And we're supposed to be the superior, knowledgable Conservatives, huh.

Makes you wonder.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:22:07 AM EST
when i hold open doors and call women ma'am, i get the death look.

whats a proto-rapist?
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:30:42 AM EST
the problem I see here is that most of you are from the NORTH . Down south it is normal to do what you are talking about and men do it for each other too. Holding a door and being nice to one another is normal to me.

SLug-O
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:32:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Originally Posted By RED_5:

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Originally Posted By RED_5:
I'm old fashioned too..

but the womenz these days are ungrateful (too much self entitlement, I guess)

IMHO and YMMV


Not all women. And not everywhere.



hence my 'disclaimer'


Your "disclaimer" indicates that it's your opinion, and my opinion may vary. I find it hard to believe that you have never met ONE appreciative woman in your life.

not even one? Even though you're from hippynik Colorado? Surely you jest.



oh I have, but they're few and far between.. Don't get me wrong, I still say please, thank you, yes/no ma'am, hold the door and all that other good upbringin'. but the past year, this 'entitlement' thing or not even a 'thank you' or' excuse me' is offered, is getting out of control. Just because a guy has was raised right, doesn't mean he's wanting to fuck right on the spot or expecting a BJ in return.

and to further clarify, it's mostly from the single ones (or giving the appearance thereof). Married/gf women with their spouse/bf are way more friendly.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:33:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Sounds alot like ARFCOM GD. And we're supposed to be the superior, knowledgable Conservatives, huh.

Makes you wonder.


I do, sometimes...

Then again, I'm not one of the GD hound dogs, asking for pics of every female discussed...

The engagement/marriage threads are particularly ....

But then again, my morality & manners are a bit old fashioned for some...
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:39:47 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/27/2008 11:40:49 AM EST by Dave_A]
.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:40:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/29/2008 12:28:33 PM EST by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By rockstar4960:
whats a proto-rapist?


A young boy...

Some of the more militant feminazis consider all male-initiated sex rape... By their standards, all men are rapists (since men generally are the ones to initiate sex)....

Which IMHO is *VERY* ironic, since the feminist types are supposed to be the 'strong' ones... Yeah, you're so 'strong', but you can't be 'strong' enough to tell him 'NO' - and thus feel victimized because you were 'pressured' into having sex? ?

Once again, the 'old way' seems to give the women the majority of the power - Yeah, men initiate... But if she says 'NO', you're done... As opposed to this compensatory 'have sex with everything, blame the men for 'pressuring' you into it, take no responsibility, be a VICTIM & proud of it!!!' crap that it seems has been developed to rationalize otherwise conflicting philosophies....
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:44:24 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/27/2008 11:45:02 AM EST by PlaymoreMinds]

Originally Posted By rockstar4960:
when i hold open doors and call women ma'am, i get the death look.

whats a proto-rapist?


First time I was called, Ma'am, I wanted to cry....just makes us ladies who are no longer 20-something feel older than our years. It's respectful...but it's still a tough passage to walk (that of aging!) so don't take it personally. Switch to "Miss."
There's a receipt checker at BJ's (warehouse shopping) who ALWAYS says, "Have a nice day, MISS."
Makes me

Other than that, please do hold the door for me...as I WILL say thank you. Like Daisy, I find more folks with manners than without up here. It's all how you're raised.

My son (the 6 year old) scampered ahead of me one day to open the door for an elderly lady the other day and she just LIT up! "My, what a little gentleman you are!" she said, smiling at me. And I replied, "Gentlemen aren't born, they're made. "

And yeah...WTH is a proto-rapist?

ETA: Dave_A Answered...thanks...and what utter BS
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 11:54:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By Slug-O:
the problem I see here is that most of you are from the NORTH . Down south it is normal to do what you are talking about and men do it for each other too. Holding a door and being nice to one another is normal to me.

SLug-O


I don't think it has anything to do with North/South. I've always lived in the north, but have traveled extensively in the South. Most folks are polite up here. Perhaps not the 20-something college girls, but I think you find that everywhere.

The rudest people I've ever encountered are late teenagers and early 20's.

Regardless of where they live.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:06:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By daisywench:

Originally Posted By Slug-O:
the problem I see here is that most of you are from the NORTH . Down south it is normal to do what you are talking about and men do it for each other too. Holding a door and being nice to one another is normal to me.

SLug-O


I don't think it has anything to do with North/South. I've always lived in the north, but have traveled extensively in the South. Most folks are polite up here. Perhaps not the 20-something college girls, but I think you find that everywhere.

The rudest people I've ever encountered are late teenagers and early 20's.

Regardless of where they live.


That's mainly who I'm talking about. My generation makes me sick sometimes.

Most people are polite and say "Thanks you" and stuff like that. But holding a door for a lady shouldn't be the foreign concept among younger men that it is.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:06:42 PM EST
the last time i used ma'am, it was in the form of "yes, ma'am". the person was younger than me.
i guess i use it as an attempt to give respect, force of habit from the service industry i think.
i even call my 5 year old niece ma'am.

i think ill give "miss" more use in the future. thanks for the tip

and the whole proto-rapist thing...

my rule pertaining to that is this:
if she grabs my junk, its on. if not, then no play tonight.
does that make me a "sub."?
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:08:47 PM EST

Originally Posted By rockstar4960:

i think ill give "miss" more use in the future. thanks for the tip



Me too, thanks.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:18:37 PM EST
I offered a light to a woman in Sweden a few years ago. She looked at me funny once her cigarette was lit and said that in Sweden, offering to light a womans cigarette is a sure sign the guy is hitting on you.

I told her that no, where I came from it's just being polite.

Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:20:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By VACaver:
I offered a light to a woman in Sweden a few years ago. She looked at me funny once her cigarette was lit and said that in Sweden, offering to light a womans cigarette is a sure sign the guy is hitting on you.

I told her that no, where I came from it's just being polite.



well...sometimes he could be hitting on you.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:21:16 PM EST
I think what's funny is when I hold open a door for a man. they don't know what to say or do! They get all flustered.

Usually they just look down at the ground and mumble.

Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:22:12 PM EST
I show respect to those who've earned it. With that said, I give all people the benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise. I'd just as soon hold the door for a man as I would for a woman.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:23:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By Bob1984:
I show respect to those who've earned it. With that said, I give all people the benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise. I'd just as soon hold the door for a man as I would for a woman.


Me too. They look at me funny too. I guess they just don't expect it from a dumb teenager.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 12:52:07 PM EST

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Very noticable...

On the female side, the feminazis get pissed if you do anything 'nice' for them - and I'm not talking about 'be nice, maybe I can screw you later', I'm talking about opening doors, etc....

On the male side, a certain cultural phenomenon (Which, IMHO is full of CRAP) has lead to guys going even further to treat/talk about women like shit... I'm sorry, maybe I'm old fashioned, but referring to women-in-general as 'bitches' or 'whores' (when you have seen no evidence that they are either) -> FAIL...

Of course, the end result of the aobve is that it's become more 'acceptable' for young women to 'rise to the occasion' and fill that stereotype...

And so we go, off on another liberal-induced, amoral downward spiral...

Thanks Feminazis... Maybe someday you'll wake up & realize that the 'old' way of treating women like ladies until they prove themselves not to be such... Was better...


I'm only 23 but from what I recall of history class, a radical feminist wanted today's stereotype of women.

Guess I'm a radical feminist by today's standards. I'd LOVE to stay at home and take care of the house and kids and have a good dinner on the table when the Mr. gets home from a long day of work. But I guess that's why I'm married to an old fashioned guy

It does make me when guys don't hold open the door, help carry heavy stuff, etc.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 3:42:34 PM EST
Ya just hold the door open for whomever because you know it's the right thing to do and don't give a hooey about what other people think.

That probably applies to most things in life.

Link Posted: 6/27/2008 5:11:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By Persephone:

Ya just hold the door open for whomever because you know it's the right thing to do and don't give a hooey about what other people think.

That probably applies to most things in life.


I totally agree with you...and I pretty much do just that.

But it seems that people (women) in the schools around this area tend to be really hypersensitive.

I learned not to open doors for women or do anything nice (like helping pick up spilled books or something) on campus or at work after having my nice gesture rewarded with insults hurled in my face (especially by women in groups).

When I arrived here from Germany I was raised by my grandfather who taught me the meaning of chivalry and the value of treating women with kindness and respect...

Though I still behave that way, seems like it is becoming more of an outmoded behavior these days...that's why the reference to being a dinosaur in my earlier post.
Link Posted: 6/27/2008 5:20:19 PM EST
I was very pleasantly surprised when a 16ish y/o looking young man held the door open for me a week or so ago. I made sure I made eye contact when I thanked him too.... just so he doesn't think that we ladies are ungrateful for these little gentlemanly acts.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 2:05:33 AM EST
I am torn. As a dinosaur I hold the door open, I carry heavy stuff I hold the chair out. I call my friends parents Mr. and Missus even if I am freaking 40 years old and try not to get bent when somebody older calls me boy or son. As an opinionated flaming butthead who believes in Karma I feel hey, you want equal rights etc ya gotta take the bad with the good so pick up that there 50# bag o'charcoal yourself. I don't do or say it but I do occassionally think it.

As far as a lady opening the door for me I smile say thank you and if there is another door I hold it for her.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 5:00:00 AM EST
I agree gentlemen and ladies are made not born! I am doing my part in the North!

My SO, Missilecop, is a great influence on my son and daughter! He is the perfect gentleman.

I was very appreciative when I was recently at Home Depot and bought potting soil in the
very larger bags that a gentelmen saw me getting ready to try to load them into the back of my jeep and he offered his assistance which I gladly accepted and thanked him.

I believe we all should do our part to be kind and make the world a better place to live in.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 5:09:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/28/2008 5:14:24 AM EST by packingXDs]
.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 5:37:32 AM EST
I try to be polite and courteous to everyone until the give a reason otherwise ,
regardless of their chromosomal pairing . Although in my experience . Men
tend to acknowledge such actions more so then women . Women tend to fall
into three categories pretty equally . A third will say thank you , the next third
will act as if it's expected and ignore you completely , and the last third will react
as offended
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 1:57:47 PM EST

Originally Posted By Arctangent:
It was a pretty tough for me back in 2005...

I remember I was going to school part-time, working full-time.

I was also going through a course of chemotherapy at the time so I didn't look so hot...my color looked terrible and my hair was pretty thinned-out because it had been falling out for a while.

Anyway...I was at the registration office at my local community college and I had my 3 kids with me.

I was carrying my 3 year old (at the time) son and one of the ladies at the registrar's desk mentioned what a,"cute little proto-rapist" he was...right to my face...in front of my older son and my daughter.

Good times for middle-aged white single dads attending college these days...


I've never heard that term before. Are you sure you didn't mishear or misunderstand what she said?
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 2:48:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/28/2008 2:55:20 PM EST by Barbara]
I'm pretty "militant feminazi" and I could care less if someone holds the door for me. In fact, I think they're assholes if they don't..not because I'm a chick, but because its rude. I always try to hold the door for people, instead of slamming it in their face. And I always thank someone who holds it for me.

But all in all, the original posters question boils down to courtesy. Helping someone with a package, or holding a door or yielding the right of way or not calling adults by their first name unless invited are polite and gender really doesn't have anything to do with it.

Link Posted: 6/28/2008 2:55:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By Molon-Labe:

I've never heard that term before. Are you sure you didn't mishear or misunderstand what she said?


Both my older kids and I heard it plainly. I simply refused to dignify the insult with any response whatsoever.

I had just finished registering for Fall quarter at the time. After I had paid my tuition at the cashiers' office and we were making our way to the Tahoe...both my daughter and older son asked questions as to what she meant.

At the time I thought that my kids were too young to know about the straight versus gay/lesbian thing. I explained it away in such a manner as there are lots of people in the world who enjoy,"dumping salt in other peoples' ice-cream" and she was one of them.

I learned long ago that I can't control other peoples' behavior...I can only control my own behavior in how I react. If I let people like that "get" to me then they have won the moment...and I refuse to give them the satisfaction.

I simply look forward to the end of the day when I escape the rat-race/urban-sprawl and drive to my beautiful home on rural view-acreage on a high ridge at the foot of the Cascade Mountains; happy and content in the fact that living well truly is the best revenge...
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 3:05:27 PM EST
I've carried heavy stuff for guys... I hold the door open for whoever too. I think it is rude to get it slammed in my face but I don't expect guys to get things off a shelf if I can't reach it (other day in a Bodega I used something to get paper towels stacked to high for me to reach). I am to independent I guess to have a man help. But as for women putting up with Ahole men, most like to be treated like shit.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 3:09:52 PM EST
You're nicer than I am, then. I'd have told my kids she was a kook.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 3:13:31 PM EST
Most people in my area are pretty polite to women.

The unfortunate thing is that most girls don't know what to do with polite. Old school manners are lost on alot of society and is deemed awkward and weird.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 3:24:17 PM EST
You really want to tick me off, though, try loading my rifle for me (no kidding..had a guy at a Garand match try to load my M1 for me during a timed string. Yikes!) That isn't polite, that's obnoxious.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 4:51:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By daisywench:
I think what's funny is when I hold open a door for a man. they don't know what to say or do! They get all flustered.

Usually they just look down at the ground and mumble.



I have had the same reaction at times...isn't it cute!
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 4:54:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By Barbara:

You really want to tick me off, though, try loading my rifle for me (no kidding..had a guy at a Garand match try to load my M1 for me during a timed string. Yikes!) That isn't polite, that's obnoxious.


That's hilarious...never heard of that before!

I would be upset if that happened to me as well...

I guess it will suffice to say that I try to be as much of a gentleman as possible "out in the world"...but due to prior experience, I tend to "turn it off" and be a little guarded when in environments such as work and school.
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 5:07:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By Persephone:
Ya just hold the door open for whomever because you know it's the right thing to do and don't give a hooey about what other people think.

That probably applies to most things in life.



More like that does or SHOULD apply to most things in life...think how much kinder life would be if we all acted in a polite and caring way.
Don't let a few idiot little girls change how you act toward others, continue to be polite, kind and caring...some day they will figure it out. If they don't, they will they will be the losers, not you!!
and yes, I agree with PMM...MISS is so much nicer, especially when you are actually old enough for the ma'am...hehehe
Link Posted: 6/28/2008 5:29:30 PM EST
I saw that post...thought it was pretty cool idea.

The connotations surrounding "miss" and "ma'am" never occurred to me.

I'm picking up all kinds of good tips from you ladies...
Link Posted: 6/29/2008 7:01:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By Persephone:
Ya just hold the door open for whomever because you know it's the right thing to do and don't give a hooey about what other people think.

That probably applies to most things in life.



Of course I'll keep doing it regardless of whether they thank me or not.

It just annoys me that the practice of being respectful is getting lost among my generation.
Link Posted: 6/29/2008 4:45:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/29/2008 4:53:04 PM EST by MEDIKEIGHTED]

Originally Posted By rockstar4960:
the last time i used ma'am, it was in the form of "yes, ma'am". the person was younger than me.
i guess i use it as an attempt to give respect,


I do the same thing. Any female I don't know who looks over the age of 12 is addressed as ma'am.


Originally posted by Daisywench:
I think what's funny is when I hold open a door for a man. they don't know what to say or do! They get all flustered.

Usually they just look down at the ground and mumble.


I'm sure they have all kinds of reasons to be flustered when you're the one holding the door, Daisy.

If I'm carrying something heavy or have my hands full I thank a woman (or anybody else) for holding the door. If I'm empty handed it's "After you, ma'am." Don't know whether it's chivalrous or chauvenistic, guess it depends on who's holding the door.

Link Posted: 6/30/2008 7:12:25 AM EST
lol I guess living in Utah has its perks. These Mormon guys are always opening doors, carrying groceries, and smiling around here. I'd say it's eerie, but I enjoy it too much.
Link Posted: 7/1/2008 3:51:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By XCRmonger:
lol I guess living in Utah has its perks. These Mormon guys are always opening doors, carrying groceries, and smiling around here. I'd say it's eerie, but I enjoy it too much.


[leghumping on]
Judging from the pic thread, I don't think Joseph Smith or Brigham Young had much to do with it. I'm sure you cause plenty of smiles and door holding all by yourself. [/leghumping off]
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