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Posted: 7/22/2013 10:56:33 AM EST


I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:02:00 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 11:03:01 AM EST by HardShell]
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:30:31 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 12:02:15 PM EST by die-tryin]
I still prefer CC even if we had OC here.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:38:39 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.
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Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:48:22 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 12:03:58 PM EST by die-tryin]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Grin:




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.
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Originally Posted By Grin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.


Ok.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:49:57 AM EST
Buying a pack of smokes and a Snickers wasn't an act of war, last I checked.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:51:06 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Grin:
Buying a pack of smokes and a Snickers wasn't an act of war, last I checked.
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Try purple drank and some Skittles.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:53:17 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TrojanMan:


Try purple drank and some Skittles.
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Originally Posted By TrojanMan:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Buying a pack of smokes and a Snickers wasn't an act of war, last I checked.


Try purple drank and some Skittles.

I was going to say Skittles and Iced Tea but I didn't want to get in trouble
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:53:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 11:54:07 AM EST by Merlin]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars
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Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars


If anyone is "speculating" it's you.

Read and educate yourself:

"Surprise:

Probably the most common condemnation of open carry comes from the armchair tacticians who believe it’s better to have the element of surprise in a criminal encounter. Although this was touched on in the previous paragraph about deterrence, I’ll expand on it specifically here because there are some important truths you need to consider before you lean too heavily on this false support. Surprise as a defensive tactic is often based on unrealistic or ill-thought out scenarios, and seems to exist only in the minds of concealed carry firearms proponents. The circumstance where several street toughs surround and taunt you for a while before robbing you, like in some Charles Bronson movie, is not realistic; the mugger wants to get in and out as fast as possible. In most cases you will have only seconds to realize what’s happening, make a decision, and react. Imagine you’re walking along the sidewalk when two gangsta looking teenagers suddenly appear at the corner coming in the opposite direction. You have only seconds to react if their intent was to victimize you. Do you draw your concealed firearm now or wait until there’s an actual visible threat? If they are just on their way to church and you pull a gun on them, you are the criminal and you will likely forever lose your firearms rights for such a foolish action. If you don’t draw and they pull a knife or pistol when they’re just a couple steps away, your only options are draw (if you think you can) or comply. Imagine staring at the shiny blade of a knife being held by a very nervous and violent mugger, three inches from your or your wife’s throat and having to decide whether or not you have time to draw from concealment. The element of surprise may not do you any good; in fact the only surprising thing that might happen is that your concealed carry pistol gets taken along with your wallet. The thug will later get a good chuckle with his buddies about how you brought a gun to a knife fight. The simple truth is that while surprise is a monumentally superior tactical maneuver, it is exclusively an offensive action, not a defensive one. What many internet commandos call ‘defensive surprise’ is nothing more than damage control, a last ditch effort to fight your way back out of a dangerous situation. I am not aware of any army that teaches using surprise as a defense against attack. No squad of soldiers goes on patrol with their weapons hidden so that they can ‘surprise’ the enemy should they walk into an ambush."

Source: The Open Carry Argument

The author is a member here IRC.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:54:41 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars
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Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars

It's not speculation that bad guys have a tendency to go after weaker targets.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:55:53 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars
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Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars



And nuclear deterrents havent prevented them from happening in the first place?

Non OCer who supports OC, here.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 11:57:42 AM EST
I've seen plenty of open carriers in WA. Of course, many of them were federal agents "under cover".
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:01:42 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Merlin:


If anyone is "speculating" it's you.

Read and educate yourself:

"Surprise:

Probably the most common condemnation of open carry comes from the armchair tacticians who believe it’s better to have the element of surprise in a criminal encounter. Although this was touched on in the previous paragraph about deterrence, I’ll expand on it specifically here because there are some important truths you need to consider before you lean too heavily on this false support. Surprise as a defensive tactic is often based on unrealistic or ill-thought out scenarios, and seems to exist only in the minds of concealed carry firearms proponents. The circumstance where several street toughs surround and taunt you for a while before robbing you, like in some Charles Bronson movie, is not realistic; the mugger wants to get in and out as fast as possible. In most cases you will have only seconds to realize what’s happening, make a decision, and react. Imagine you’re walking along the sidewalk when two gangsta looking teenagers suddenly appear at the corner coming in the opposite direction. You have only seconds to react if their intent was to victimize you. Do you draw your concealed firearm now or wait until there’s an actual visible threat? If they are just on their way to church and you pull a gun on them, you are the criminal and you will likely forever lose your firearms rights for such a foolish action. If you don’t draw and they pull a knife or pistol when they’re just a couple steps away, your only options are draw (if you think you can) or comply. Imagine staring at the shiny blade of a knife being held by a very nervous and violent mugger, three inches from your or your wife’s throat and having to decide whether or not you have time to draw from concealment. The element of surprise may not do you any good; in fact the only surprising thing that might happen is that your concealed carry pistol gets taken along with your wallet. The thug will later get a good chuckle with his buddies about how you brought a gun to a knife fight. The simple truth is that while surprise is a monumentally superior tactical maneuver, it is exclusively an offensive action, not a defensive one. What many internet commandos call ‘defensive surprise’ is nothing more than damage control, a last ditch effort to fight your way back out of a dangerous situation. I am not aware of any army that teaches using surprise as a defense against attack. No squad of soldiers goes on patrol with their weapons hidden so that they can ‘surprise’ the enemy should they walk into an ambush."

Source: The Open Carry Argument

The author is a member here IRC.
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Originally Posted By Merlin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Originally Posted By LuckyDucky:
http://i44.tinypic.com/vpda51.png

I still have yet to see another person open carrying in OK.


Those people are just a tad smarter. While Open carry is "cool" and allows for better clothing options, giving up the element of surprise is a big deal. I wouldnt open carry even if I had the option.




Your so-called element of surprise is one-upped by the actual deterrent value.


Pure speculation on your part, element of surprise will always be just that and has won many a wars


If anyone is "speculating" it's you.

Read and educate yourself:

"Surprise:

Probably the most common condemnation of open carry comes from the armchair tacticians who believe it’s better to have the element of surprise in a criminal encounter. Although this was touched on in the previous paragraph about deterrence, I’ll expand on it specifically here because there are some important truths you need to consider before you lean too heavily on this false support. Surprise as a defensive tactic is often based on unrealistic or ill-thought out scenarios, and seems to exist only in the minds of concealed carry firearms proponents. The circumstance where several street toughs surround and taunt you for a while before robbing you, like in some Charles Bronson movie, is not realistic; the mugger wants to get in and out as fast as possible. In most cases you will have only seconds to realize what’s happening, make a decision, and react. Imagine you’re walking along the sidewalk when two gangsta looking teenagers suddenly appear at the corner coming in the opposite direction. You have only seconds to react if their intent was to victimize you. Do you draw your concealed firearm now or wait until there’s an actual visible threat? If they are just on their way to church and you pull a gun on them, you are the criminal and you will likely forever lose your firearms rights for such a foolish action. If you don’t draw and they pull a knife or pistol when they’re just a couple steps away, your only options are draw (if you think you can) or comply. Imagine staring at the shiny blade of a knife being held by a very nervous and violent mugger, three inches from your or your wife’s throat and having to decide whether or not you have time to draw from concealment. The element of surprise may not do you any good; in fact the only surprising thing that might happen is that your concealed carry pistol gets taken along with your wallet. The thug will later get a good chuckle with his buddies about how you brought a gun to a knife fight. The simple truth is that while surprise is a monumentally superior tactical maneuver, it is exclusively an offensive action, not a defensive one. What many internet commandos call ‘defensive surprise’ is nothing more than damage control, a last ditch effort to fight your way back out of a dangerous situation. I am not aware of any army that teaches using surprise as a defense against attack. No squad of soldiers goes on patrol with their weapons hidden so that they can ‘surprise’ the enemy should they walk into an ambush."

Source: The Open Carry Argument

The author is a member here IRC.


Ah, nice read. makes sense, still not going to OC though.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:06:08 PM EST
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:07:18 PM EST
I usually OC'd because it was a job requirent. CC is preferred around here.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:12:38 PM EST
I'll go all in for OC but me personally I don't think it's for me, I don't like drawing attention to myself and I also don't get this element of surprise aspect, I mean, I'm not out to stop crime, just to save my own skin as a last resort.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:20:15 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif
View Quote


i don't doubt your training, but posting hollywood bs to backup a claim is.... idk.... dubious at best?
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:20:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
I still prefer CC even if we had OC here.
View Quote

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:25:51 PM EST
i'm pretty sure that there has never been a study on the effects of OC's deterrent effect vs CCW. (John Lott wru?) . I'd like to see some science on this. SC only allows CCW so that's how i roll.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:26:42 PM EST
I see it occasionally in AZ (much more often in gun stores, of course). I'm all for it for those who want to, but I prefer not to attract attention.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:28:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 1:07:12 PM EST by beardog30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Grin:
Buying a pack of smokes and a Snickers wasn't an act of war, last I checked.
View Quote

On your blood sugar and lungs it is
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:29:33 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif
View Quote



Says the guy using a fictional gunfight to support his claim.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:29:50 PM EST
I don't believe anyone here even knows that the OC law passed.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:32:14 PM EST
i hope the local LEO's got the memo.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:36:09 PM EST
I saw someone not too long ago filling up with gas at QT OCing.

Other than that, I guess most want it concealed, like myself.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 12:44:51 PM EST
Very few people in my AO give a rat's ass about it, so OC vs CC is mostly a fashion/comfort thing for me. My clothing (especially in the warmer months) is not conducive to CC. So as long as I'm staying in my area, my decision goes like this:

Is my outfit conducive to OC, I.e. am I wearing a sturdy belt? If yes, OC. If no, it goes in my CC pocketbook.

That's all there is to it. If leaving my local area, obviously other factors come into play.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:21:18 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
...

Ah, nice read. makes sense, still not going to OC though.
View Quote


Why?
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:25:26 PM EST
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:26:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 5:34:00 PM EST by HogJaws]
I saw a guy today OC'ing at Subway. Looked kinda meatheady, a Yeager type but whateva. Food was good too.

ETA: Dude above me hates America.

ETA2: Dude below me loves America.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:31:33 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote


You sound like you might be a busy-body asshole that likes to make other people business your own.

Which is worse?
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:37:18 PM EST


Real enough for you?

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By hushpuppy:



Says the guy using a fictional gunfight to support his claim.
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Originally Posted By hushpuppy:
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif



Says the guy using a fictional gunfight to support his claim.

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:38:12 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:

I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote

That's called "projection." You has it.


Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:40:17 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote
So, you're not against it, you just want to tell the "assholes" who do it to stop.

Gotcha.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:45:58 PM EST
I see it a lot in VA, but I never see the drama that some in GD associate with it.

No extra attention... sometimes someone might spot it, but usually not. Occasionally a conversation... "Is that a Glock?" "I'm thinking of buying a gun..."

Seems like 80%+ are Glocks in Serpas. 1911s are popular, as are thumb-break leather holsters.

Seems like most of the opinions in GD about it are based in ignorance... people who have never done it proclaiming absolutes about it and projecting their own insecurities or boorish tendencies onto someone else.

Personally, I'm glad when people responsibly carry for defense of themselves and their family, whether it's concealed or open.



Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:48:56 PM EST
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Originally Posted By DanTSX:


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Originally Posted By DanTSX:
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.




I can see this being my new "thing"
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:53:19 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote



Don't look now but you look like an attention seeking asshole right now.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 5:55:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2013 6:05:44 PM EST by Scott_R]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KaiK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGMdbEgJ-xk

Real enough for you?


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Originally Posted By KaiK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGMdbEgJ-xk

Real enough for you?

Originally Posted By hushpuppy:
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif



Says the guy using a fictional gunfight to support his claim.



Shooter didn't even lose his place in LINE!

Georgia.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:04:52 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
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Isn't utopia a communist ideal? Just askin'...
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:23:55 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By yakmon:


i don't doubt your training, but posting hollywood bs to backup a claim is.... idk.... dubious at best?
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Originally Posted By yakmon:
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif


i don't doubt your training, but posting hollywood bs to backup a claim is.... idk.... dubious at best?


Very.

Anyone want to take bets on what 'ol Tom thinks about the peon carrying?

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:26:33 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote


So what stopped you?

The world needs more people up in everyone's business. Really.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:26:56 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Renegade13B:


You sound like you might be a busy-body asshole that likes to make other people business your own.

Which is worse?
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Originally Posted By Renegade13B:
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.


You sound like you might be a busy-body asshole that likes to make other people business your own.

Which is worse?


He's going to guess wrong.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:29:06 PM EST


I've seen it twice here in Tulsa. Both times at the same white trash Walmart.


One time it was an attention whore: giant cowboy had, loud shirt, exotic boots.

The other time it was a tactical tommy: black cargo pants tucked into his black boots, held up by his black belt, with his black Tee shirt tucked in. Trusty black Walmart holster with his black pistol at his side...


Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:33:16 PM EST
I occasionally see OC in Arizona. Yes, it stands out. It doesn't bother me, though. To non-gun people, it probably makes them feel uncomfortable.

Concealed is probably a better way to carry, imo. Although, I have seen some guys printing really badly. Once again, non-gun people probably don't notice.

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:34:11 PM EST
Way to completely use that meme wrong. Congrats.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:40:09 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By W_E_G:
open-shmopen, concealed-conschmeeled.

Its all in how you train as to whether you are any good with it.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/animated/TomCruisebriefcase.gif
View Quote
Yo holmes, could I get that briefcase?
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:41:31 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Utopia:
I saw my first open carry tonight. I just wanted to walk up to the guy and ask if he was a cop. When he said no I wanted to say "then cover that shit up". I am not against open carry I think it just makes you look like an attention seeking asshole.
View Quote

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:42:19 PM EST
Go to Walmart. I see it all the time in Walmart.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:47:15 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TrojanMan:


Try purple drank and some Skittles.
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View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By TrojanMan:
Originally Posted By Grin:
Buying a pack of smokes and a Snickers wasn't an act of war, last I checked.


Try purple drank and some Skittles.

*sigh* you use the skittles and juice to MAKE the purple drank....you don't go to the store and just buy purple drank off the shelf.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:48:17 PM EST
I see OC all the time here in Alabama and I have never seen anyone act uncomfortable around them.
Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:51:34 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mustangduckk:
...
The other time it was a tactical tommy: black cargo pants tucked into his black boots, held up by his black belt, with his black Tee shirt tucked in. Trusty black Walmart holster with his black pistol at his side...
View Quote


During my last open carry outing, I was wearing a vertx coldblack polo, vertx pants, black nylon 5.11 tactical belt, serpa holster, beretta 92FS, and running shoes.



The time before that I had the same clothes but a G19 in a OWB fobus

Link Posted: 7/22/2013 6:52:08 PM EST
I won't do it, conceal carry is for me.
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