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Posted: 12/1/2007 10:50:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 10:59:40 AM EDT by Dave_A]
Illegal Immigration

vs

Islamic Fascisim

Oh, PICK ONE - 'both' is not an answer...

To be clear:

If you vote 'Jihadis', you are saying that worldwide Islamic extremism (in totality, not just Queda) is a greater threat to the US and it's interests than illegal immigration...

If you vote 'Illegals' than you are saying that illegal immigration is a greater threat to the US and it's worldwide interests than all Islamic terror/extremist groups combined...


Let's see where the chips fall...

P.S.

I vote Jihadis are a bigger threat....

We've dealt with illegal immigration in significant quantities as long as we've tried to regulate immigration... While we need to do a better job enforcing the law and cracking down on employers, the status quo isn't going to do massive damage to the US any time soon...

Now, Islamic terrorism OTOH has the potential to destabilize many economically critical regions of the world, to cause massive destruction (if they ever get their hands on CBRN weapons), and so on... Plus unlike the Illegal immigrants, the Jihadis actually have a hostile objective (the elimination of US operations overseas, IAT clear the way for them to take over the ME) and aim to kill as many Americans as they can IAT accomplish this....

No contest....
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:51:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 10:51:41 AM EDT by XDBACKUPGUN]
IBTP



Illegal Aliens
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:52:33 AM EDT
Definetly the Illegals
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:54:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Aarons419:
Definetly the Illegals


+1
In the short term the jihadists might be a threat but in the long run you should be more worried about the illegals.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:54:48 AM EDT
I picked jihadis, only because what they do has immediate, extreme results. Tough call though.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:55:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 10:56:28 AM EDT by Bob1984]
I voted illegals, because their presence has more of an effect on my immediate day to day life. Virtually every time I leave my house, I encounter illegals. I can't say that about Jihadists.

Edited for clarity.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:55:39 AM EDT
Illegal Immigration.

If there were no illegals, you know how much money there would be to fight the Jihadi's?

Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:56:21 AM EDT
I say illegals because we seem to be whupping the Jihadis.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:56:23 AM EDT
This thread should prove interesting. If it doesn't get locked within the first 10 posts.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:58:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
If you vote 'Jihadis', you are saying that worldwide Islamic extremism (in totality, not just Queda) is a greater threat to the US and it's interests than illegal immigration...

If you vote 'Illegals' than you are saying that illegal immigration is a greater threat to the US and it's worldwide interests than all Islamic terror/extremist groups combined...


Your question is leading, and you're comparing apples to orangutans.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:02:09 AM EDT
I would have to say that the boarder is THE problem for both illegal's and jihad's.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:02:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
If you vote 'Jihadis', you are saying that worldwide Islamic extremism (in totality, not just Queda) is a greater threat to the US and it's interests than illegal immigration...

If you vote 'Illegals' than you are saying that illegal immigration is a greater threat to the US and it's worldwide interests than all Islamic terror/extremist groups combined...


Your question is leading, and you're comparing apples to orangutans.


No...

It's comparing the 2 things that are most often cited as 'the big threat'...

ALL illegal immigration...

vs

ALL global jihadisim...

As a threat to the nation ant it's interests as a whole (instead of 'a threat to me and my backyard)....

Simple question, let's see where the chips fall...

I predict the isolationists will be more concerned about the illegals...

Interventionists more concerned about Jihad...
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:05:06 AM EDT
I say illegals, my brothers in arms are kicking the shit out of the jihadis in their own back yards currently and living in fear is not living at all, might as well take care of what we can now.

IBTAMTHL
(In Before The Anti Muslim Thread Hijack Lock)
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:05:33 AM EDT
Illegals. Easily. Disturbing.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:07:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 11:08:19 AM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By Mattl:
Illegals. Easily. Disturbing.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.


No rickrolls in this thread please...

It's moronic, and easy to spot when you post a youtube link in a fucking political thread....
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:09:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 11:09:27 AM EDT by TOL1488]

Originally Posted By Mattl:
Illegals.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.



Quoted for truth.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:09:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
If you vote 'Jihadis', you are saying that worldwide Islamic extremism (in totality, not just Queda) is a greater threat to the US and it's interests than illegal immigration...

If you vote 'Illegals' than you are saying that illegal immigration is a greater threat to the US and it's worldwide interests than all Islamic terror/extremist groups combined...


Your question is leading, and you're comparing apples to orangutans.


No...

It's comparing the 2 things that are most often cited as 'the big threat'...

ALL illegal immigration...

vs

ALL global jihadisim...

As a threat to the nation ant it's interests as a whole (instead of 'a threat to me and my backyard)....

Simple question, let's see where the chips fall...

I predict the isolationists will be more concerned about the illegals...

Interventionists more concerned about Jihad...


No, they aren't threats to the same thing.

Illegal immigrants aren't threats "to the US and it's worldwide interests," and I've never heard them declared such by anyone. They are purely a law enforcement problem.

This dog ain't gonna hunt.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:18:26 AM EDT
Jihadis. Illegals are only a problem because our socialist systems enable (and even encourage) them to be. If not for that, there would be less draw for them to come here, and those that did would end up like previous waves of immigrants - largely assimilated within a few generations.

The jihadis, on the other hand, want us dead. We're the Great Satan, after all. There's not much you can say to a viewpoint like that
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:22:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2007 11:26:59 AM EDT by foxherb53]

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By Mattl:
Illegals.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.


No rickrolls in this thread please...

It's moronic, and easy to spot when you post a youtube link in a fucking political thread....



That link is an eye opener on what is happening at the present level of immigration.


The first link is the guy with the charts on the present rate of immigration , but the second one is changed..
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:26:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By foxherb53:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By Mattl:
Illegals. Easily. Disturbing.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.


No rickrolls in this thread please...

It's moronic, and easy to spot when you post a youtube link in a fucking political thread....



That link is an eye opener on what is happening at the present level of immigration.


+1. I don't see a rick roll there.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:27:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By badfish274:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
If you vote 'Jihadis', you are saying that worldwide Islamic extremism (in totality, not just Queda) is a greater threat to the US and it's interests than illegal immigration...

If you vote 'Illegals' than you are saying that illegal immigration is a greater threat to the US and it's worldwide interests than all Islamic terror/extremist groups combined...


Your question is leading, and you're comparing apples to orangutans.


No...

It's comparing the 2 things that are most often cited as 'the big threat'...

ALL illegal immigration...

vs

ALL global jihadisim...

As a threat to the nation ant it's interests as a whole (instead of 'a threat to me and my backyard)....

Simple question, let's see where the chips fall...

I predict the isolationists will be more concerned about the illegals...

Interventionists more concerned about Jihad...


No, they aren't threats to the same thing.

Illegal immigrants aren't threats "to the US and it's worldwide interests," and I've never heard them declared such by anyone. They are purely a law enforcement problem.

This dog ain't gonna hunt.


Well then badfish, it would seem you'd be voting for the Jihadis then...

Remember: there are posters on this site who believe that illegals ARE such a threat... I just don't happen to be one of them, and apparently you aren't either...
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:33:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bob1984:

Originally Posted By foxherb53:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By Mattl:
Illegals. Easily. Disturbing.


Jihadism is an overblown threat used to expand government and scare voters.


No rickrolls in this thread please...

It's moronic, and easy to spot when you post a youtube link in a fucking political thread....



That link is an eye opener on what is happening at the present level of immigration.


+1. I don't see a rick roll there.



As someone already stated it is not a Rickroll, its yours, mine, and everyone elses money being syphoned to people who should not be here and the future outlook of it.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:35:54 AM EDT
Islamo facists by a long shot.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:36:28 AM EDT
Illegals by far.

Here in the South West, it's quickly becoming Mexico Norte.
America has 10 years tops in it's current size and form if things don't change big and fast.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:37:44 AM EDT
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:42:42 AM EDT
In all honesty we are probably bigger dangers to ourselves rather than the choices listed....
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:46:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By IamNOTted:
In all honesty we are probably bigger dangers to ourselves rather than the choices listed....


There's a scary amount of truth to this. We're a danger to ourselves because of what we are willing to tolerate.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:46:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:48:47 AM EDT
I'm going to go with Jihadis for a couple of reasons. Terrorist attacks can have an immediate and profound effect on the economy, and terrorism has resulted in the passage of laws that restrict our freedom and privacy. And there's the matter of thousands of American soldiers dieing to try to prevent more attacks.

Some of the same things could be said about illegals, but a lot of the negative effects of illegal immigration could be ameliorated if we had the political will to enforce immigration laws. I don't think there's anything we could do that we aren't already doing that would have nearly the same impact on terrorism.
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 11:56:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By absael:
a lot of the negative effects of illegal immigration could be ameliorated if we had the political will to enforce immigration laws. I don't think there's anything we could do that we aren't already doing that would have nearly the same impact on terrorism.


exactly. Illegals are only a problem because we allow it. If we put our foot down it wouldn't be that big of an issue. Terrorism on the other hand is a problem we cannot control as easily.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 2:31:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?


The Jihadis are up over 7,000 in the last 8...

I doubt that illegal immigrants come even close... Maybe if you count killing American gangbangers... But who misses them?
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 2:51:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2007 2:52:03 AM EDT by Master_of_Orion]
They are linked at the hip.

The Jihadis are the threat. Because of that threat we need to secure our borders. This cuts off the flow of illegals... killing... well wounding... two birds with one stone.

The extent that illegals are capable of getting in demonstrates how easily terrorists could and probably have gotten in.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:15:13 AM EDT
"Both" is an answer, as some of the jihadist highjackers on 9/11 were illegal aliens. Terrorists use the same means to violate our sovereignity as Salvadoran gangsters.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:19:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bob1984:
I voted illegals, because their presence has more of an effect on my immediate day to day life. Virtually every time I leave my house, I encounter illegals. I can't say that about Jihadists.

Edited for clarity.


That's true,but they don't usually try to kill you ,do they?
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:30:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?


The Jihadis are up over 7,000 in the last 8...

I doubt that illegal immigrants come even close... Maybe if you count killing American gangbangers... But who misses them?


According to this article by the John Birch society, illegals are responsible for the deaths of over 9,000 americans per year -- 36,000 deaths in the past 4 years.

Illegals are also a burden of several billion dollars on our infastructure and government services.

The illegals are definitely the larger, more immediate and long term threat.

Article
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:51:50 AM EDT
Um, any foreign terrorist commiting an attack on US soil is an illegal alien. Unless he listed "to wage jihad" on his visa application.


Illegals, even if you do not include the terrorists, have killed more Americans than Jihadists have killed.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:54:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kylaer_:
Jihadis. Illegals are only a problem because our socialist systems enable (and even encourage) them to be. If not for that, there would be less draw for them to come here, and those that did would end up like previous waves of immigrants - largely assimilated within a few generations.

The jihadis, on the other hand, want us dead. We're the Great Satan, after all. There's not much you can say to a viewpoint like that


Yet the border jumping illegals manage to kill more Americans than the jihadist do every year. So basically illegals are more dangerous without even trying to be.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:55:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings...


They did on 9/11.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 3:57:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?


The Jihadis are up over 7,000 in the last 8...

I doubt that illegal immigrants come even close... Maybe if you count killing American gangbangers... But who misses them?


Drug resistant TB, Staph, Hep...
DUI traffic collisions
Gang Violence
Generic murder/rape/robbery

Illegals kill many thousands every year.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 6:49:33 AM EDT
Beans was probably an unfortunate choice of words when titling a thread about illegal mexicans.

Link Posted: 12/2/2007 6:51:31 AM EDT
Illegals
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 6:51:55 AM EDT
Liberals.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:20:19 AM EDT
dave a i see you have an iraq sign under your avatar, thank you for your service. back to buisness, i see both as a threat, i live in a smaller southeastern community here in GA. where illegals are all over the place due to this being a farming community. there is alot of crime just in dui's ,assaults, etc.. just from the "migrant workers". in all honesty some of the migrant families are hard working and never cause trouble. but they are here illegally and are sucking up the social services and leaving them on the edge of collapse, i brought my wife to the emergency room almost a month ago because her pain from fibromyalgia( hope i spelled that right) and the hospital was overcrowded with people that can't speak english, over crowded to the point that there was literally 20 to 30 "immigrants" standing outside the emergency entrance and blocking it as well, the sheriffs dept had to come out and get things organized, it was a horrible experience for my wife that needs help. my wifes cousin is in iraq for the seventh time now with marine force recon and says we are winning but the media will never tell us that. i feel that islam will be a global thing due to the fact that the western countries don't have the stones to put islamo-asshats in check. there are many things that are causing America to come apart at the seems, we just don't have enough time to discuss it all
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:20:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?


The Jihadis are up over 7,000 in the last 8...

I doubt that illegal immigrants come even close... Maybe if you count killing American gangbangers... But who misses them?


Drug resistant TB, Staph, Hep...
DUI traffic collisions
Gang Violence
Generic murder/rape/robbery

Illegals kill many thousands every year.



Shhhh!!!!


[bull­horn] Fear the goatherder! [/bullhorn]
[con] Ignore the invasion it's really nothing to worry about. [/con]
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:23:51 AM EDT
Didn't I hear that Quaida was courting ms-13 for some co-ops?
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:29:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2007 7:31:17 AM EDT by Col_Panic]
Neither is much of a threat, but I'll say the Islamists are the greater. The Mexicans assimilate within two generations, just the same as every other wave of immigration. Islamists can't really do that much harm in the big scheme of things, but they are genuinely evil.

Now, I counter your leading question with one of my own:

Which is the greater threat to our liberty, purported anti-terrorism laws such as the PATRIOT act, or hypothetical anti-illegal laws of the "round 'em up" variety?
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:30:25 AM EDT
Illegals are the bigger threat. Now if we could just get them and the Jihadis to fight each other.....
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 7:33:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stumps:
Illegals are the bigger threat. Now if we could just get them and the Jihadis to fight each other.....

They will when they are finished with us.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 8:04:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By TOL1488:

Originally Posted By fosters:
Illegals have yet to crash planes into buildings ...the occasional car while drunk on the other hand

jihadis'....more determined to destroy our way of life



Who has killed more Americans in the last __ years?


The Jihadis are up over 7,000 in the last 8...

I doubt that illegal immigrants come even close... Maybe if you count killing American gangbangers... But who misses them?


Drug resistant TB, Staph, Hep...
DUI traffic collisions
Gang Violence
Generic murder/rape/robbery

Illegals kill many thousands every year.



Shhhh!!!!


[bull­horn] Fear the goatherder! [/bullhorn]
[con] Ignore the invasion it's really nothing to worry about. [/con]


Yup. Ignore the open border in a time of war.

Link Posted: 12/2/2007 8:10:01 AM EDT
This question is like saying "which do you want more, a sharp stick in the right eye or the left eye?"

I PERSONALLY think that illegal immigration edges out the jihadi threat by a slight margin. I think illegal immigrants will have a longer-term impact on the US than jihadists ultimately will.

It's a suck-vs-suck question though.
Link Posted: 12/2/2007 8:12:58 AM EDT
Read some of the replies after the video.
Scary!
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