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Posted: 5/21/2002 3:41:06 PM EDT
Now that everybody predicts, terrorist attacks will happen and that the terrorist will adquire nuclear weapons, what are we to do, what are the things we need to have on hand to defend our families? This whole idea sucks, but we need to be ready.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 3:49:09 PM EDT
Do a search on the topic "SHTF" or "TEOTWAWKI" there are things you can do, and may have been covered in detail in the past. [8D]
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 3:50:40 PM EDT
Beer and lots of it.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 3:50:40 PM EDT
1) Take that big pile of stuff, formerly labelled "SHTF", then labelled "Y2K Stuff," then relabelled "SHTF." 2) Peel off those labels. 3) Put on a label that says "In case of Terrorist Nuke Use." 4) Proceed as normal.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 3:52:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/21/2002 3:54:32 PM EDT by Johnny_Reno]
As far as nukes go - There are two basic designs of nukes. The one that requires the least in technical knowledge and ability would max-out its yield at about 20 kilotons. The main disadvantage is in its size. You aren't going to put it in a suitcase or even a car trunk for that matter. So moving it around or through a border checkpoint would be a difficult proposition at best. However, that wouldn't prevent a terrorist organization from putting one in a shipping container, sailing it into a US port and then setting it off. My first line of defense against nuclear terror is to not live in a large city (read: good newsworthy target) that has deep water port facilities. I'm afraid that New York remains a very good target.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 3:54:11 PM EDT
IN CASE OF NUKE: [flame]
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 4:12:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 4:21:41 PM EDT
Fun and games... [url]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/bomb/sfeature/mapablast.html[/url]
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 4:32:04 PM EDT
I believe potassium iodate (sp) can help with radiation poisoning. Tatjana would know better than I. A friend of mine emailed this link to me. I have not had a chance to go through it, but it may prove useful to you. http://www.asod.org/ ARH
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 5:13:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno: ...... that wouldn't prevent a terrorist organization from putting one in a shipping container, sailing it into a US port and then setting it off.
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Or assembling a bomb here.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 5:13:51 PM EDT
bend over kiss ass goodbye have a nice day or as imbroglio would probly say dial 911 and wait for help
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 6:32:17 PM EDT
Think what you want, but I wouldn't worry to much about terrorists using nukes. It is not an impossibility, but I don't think they are willing to risk the consequences.
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What consequences? Limited military response accompanied by simultaneous food drops!!! HAHA!! Perhaps send a crack batalion of Berkley hippies over to "chant" them to death!! The Islamic world KNOWS that the US, much less the rest of the world, DOES NOT have the intestinal fortitude to deal with this situation in a decisive manner.
Link Posted: 5/21/2002 6:51:02 PM EDT
[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=57927[/url] [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=60759[/url] I posted on this board multiple times that I had potassium iodate (KIO3) as cheap as you could possibly get it unless you spent almost $2,000 on a big quantity of it. There were ***three*** replies from this board. Nobody on this board loves their kids enough to spend $14 on them???? Sheesh! I'll posted the same info about a week ago. No responses. The point is that even though Rumsfeld came out TODAY and said it's only a matter of time [url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,53350,00.html[/url] everybody STILL seems to have their heads in the sand. Nah... ain't never gonna happen in this here country....(spits tobacco juice).....
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 6:40:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 6:40:41 AM EDT by Johnny_Reno]
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno: ...... that wouldn't prevent a terrorist organization from putting one in a shipping container, sailing it into a US port and then setting it off.
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Or assembling a bomb here.
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Assembling a bomb within the US would be very difficult as well. Quite a bit of weapons grade uranium would need to be either acquired or smuggled in through our borders. Impossible - No. But, if I was UBL, I would assemble it offshore and then just float it in to the target area. That would be the least risky and offer me a much higher chance of success.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 11:40:23 AM EDT
I am curious. I notice in response to Tate's original post that Kharn explains how the chemical works on the thyroid gland. What if you have no thyroid gland, e.g. - thyroidectomy?
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 1:58:16 PM EDT
From the 50's nuclear blast survival for the public: Duck and cover! The 21st century verison: Oh Sh!t! We are going to die.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 2:05:24 PM EDT
Untill then live life as usual and when it happens, put on our shades and watch the fireworks 'cause it truly will be TEOTWAWKI! If you manage to survive then dig out the Y2K+2 survival kit and hope for the best. Jake
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 2:05:31 PM EDT
To start with I say we just ship out EVERY SINGLE non-American!!! If we dont, we might as well shoot ourselves in the foot!
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 2:11:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno: ...... that wouldn't prevent a terrorist organization from putting one in a shipping container, sailing it into a US port and then setting it off.
View Quote
Or assembling a bomb here.
View Quote
Assembling a bomb within the US would be very difficult as well. Quite a bit of weapons grade uranium would need to be either acquired or smuggled in through our borders. Impossible - No. But, if I was UBL, I would assemble it offshore and then just float it in to the target area. That would be the least risky and offer me a much higher chance of success.
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BWHAAHAAHAA! Maybe they could just hide the fissionable material inside a bale of marijuana and drop it in the Everglades. That seems to be a pretty safe way to put stuff into the US. Our borders aren't a wall, they are a butterfly net. One with big holes. I would put a nuke into the keel of a 12 meter yacht and let the 30,000 lbs of lead down there sheild it from any scanners and then sail it into any harbor I liked, to include Chicago, Cleveland, etc. Or put it on a Cessna.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 2:21:48 PM EDT
If we have another terrorist attacks I think all people who look a little middle eastern are going to be in Hell.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 2:27:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 2:28:50 PM EDT by cgwahl]
Put a lawn chair in your front yard. Sit in the chair. Open up a beer. Sip said beer. Relax...and hope you're nowhere near the light show you're currently watching...
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:10:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By poikilotrm:
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By Johnny_Reno: ...... that wouldn't prevent a terrorist organization from putting one in a shipping container, sailing it into a US port and then setting it off.
View Quote
Or assembling a bomb here.
View Quote
Assembling a bomb within the US would be very difficult as well. Quite a bit of weapons grade uranium would need to be either acquired or smuggled in through our borders. Impossible - No. But, if I was UBL, I would assemble it offshore and then just float it in to the target area. That would be the least risky and offer me a much higher chance of success.
View Quote
BWHAAHAAHAA! Maybe they could just hide the fissionable material inside a bale of marijuana and drop it in the Everglades. That seems to be a pretty safe way to put stuff into the US. Our borders aren't a wall, they are a butterfly net. One with big holes. I would put a nuke into the keel of a 12 meter yacht and let the 30,000 lbs of lead down there sheild it from any scanners and then sail it into any harbor I liked, to include Chicago, Cleveland, etc. Or put it on a Cessna.
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How about a mine/bomb on a LPG tanker sitting in a major harbor, simple and effective.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:37:27 PM EDT
... Nuclear weapons are way over rated, you guys worry too much. ... A nuclear detonation is survivable
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:37:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By JIMBEAM: [ How about a mine/bomb on a LPG tanker sitting in a major harbor, simple and effective.
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I thought liquid anything won't explode. Wouldn't you have to aerosolize it first to get it to work thus leading to unwanted predetonation dispersal and a poor yield?
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:40:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Fox: I am curious. I notice in response to Tate's original post that Kharn explains how the chemical works on the thyroid gland. What if you have no thyroid gland, e.g. - thyroidectomy?
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Then you are going to die because after the US has its economy shut down, no more thyroxine for folks with thyroid problems. On the other hand, type 2 diabetes will rapidly become a rare thing because obesity will suddenly no longer be a national concern.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:08:22 PM EDT
I can hardly wait! I won't have to keep looking for a job and will be able to barter some potassium iodate pills for a nice womenz. I would treat her right and give her stuff like candlelit MRE dinners.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:11:44 PM EDT
[peep]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:21:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 1GUNRUNNER: Beer and lots of it.
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Believe it or not, years ago we used to recommend just that for confirmed assimilations of Tritium. [:D]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:37:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Tate: [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=57927[/url] [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=60759[/url] I posted on this board multiple times that I had potassium iodate (KIO3) as cheap as you could possibly get it unless you spent almost $2,000 on a big quantity of it. There were ***three*** replies from this board. Nobody on this board loves their kids enough to spend $14 on them???? Sheesh! I'll posted the same info about a week ago. No responses. The point is that even though Rumsfeld came out TODAY and said it's only a matter of time [url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,53350,00.html[/url] everybody STILL seems to have their heads in the sand. Nah... ain't never gonna happen in this here country....(spits tobacco juice).....
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I really don't appreciate your "marketing strategy". In case of Nuclear war, the least of your worries would be an I-131 assimilation.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:11:57 PM EDT
Hey Winston W, there are alot of Japanese that would like to argue that point with you (1945 era) I think FirearmTom1 has the right idea.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 6:02:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2002 2:20:51 AM EDT by Tate]
Originally Posted By HMC:
Originally Posted By Tate:
Think what you want, but I wouldn't worry to much about terrorists using nukes. It is not an impossibility, but I don't think they are willing to risk the consequences.
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What consequences? Limited military response accompanied by simultaneous food drops!!! HAHA!! Perhaps send a crack batalion of Berkley hippies over to "chant" them to death!! The Islamic world KNOWS that the US, much less the rest of the world, DOES NOT have the intestinal fortitude to deal with this situation in a decisive manner.
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Everyone has an opinion, regardless of how stupid it is.
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So, HMC, it's your opinion that we are dealing with this in a decisive manner? HA!! Occupying all of Japan, Italy, and Germany is decisive, HMC. NOT deploying Marine MEU's, pulling them out, then deploying 10th MD and 101st along with some SF assets. NO, that's not decisive. Giving an ultimatum to the militant muslim world with forces in place to carry out our threats (read B52's in holding patterns over Palestinian "camps", Mecca, Riyadh, Tehran, Baghdad, ect. with air and seaborne ground forces ready to occupy/complete the total control of these areas) would be one example of DECISIVE action. In WWII we would not have put up with "suicide bombers" we would have found out where they were operating from, and leveled the area with arty and air, then occupied with ground forces - period - we would have been DECISIVE. Our pc bullshit society sheeplethink will not allow us to do that now. How do you think my opinion is stupid??? It is fact. Winston_Wolf wrote:
A nuclear detonation is survivable
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Exactly!
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 6:28:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/29/2002 5:59:58 AM EDT by Tate]
Rabbit9 wrote:
I really don't appreciate your "marketing strategy". In case of Nuclear war, the least of your worries would be an I-131 assimilation.
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????????? And what will be the greatest? Blast? Heat? Alpha, beta, gamma rays? Duh. But unless you can carry on your life in a lead lined bunker, you can't do much about them if your in a contaminated area, can you? Rabbit9 - you control what you can. Your argument reminds me of the antis comments on CCW. "It's not going to help anyway". "The bad guy will kill you before you can fire". So your solution is not to prepare? My comment wasn't aimed at you - sorry you didn't appreciate my "marketing strategy" - ha! If you would, please explain - sorry my post rubbed you wrong, but I have no idea why it did.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 8:06:01 PM EDT
Folks have been emailing asking for more info re: KIO3. Here's an informative link: [url]http://www.ki4u.com/[/url] Or do a search for "potassium iodate" or "potassium iodide".
Hey Winston W, there are alot of Japanese that would like to argue that point with you (1945 era)
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BWAHAHA!!! [:D]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 10:24:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bear3351: Now that everybody predicts, terrorist attacks will happen and that the terrorist will adquire nuclear weapons, what are we to do, what are the things we need to have on hand to defend our families? This whole idea sucks, but we need to be ready.
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Lets think this through: IF a terrorist organization manages to acquire a Nuke it will most likely only be ONE Nuke. Then they have to transport it to this country.. and IF they are able to do that..then they would have to choose their target.. Sooo...if you were a leader of a Terrorist Organization and all you had was ONE Nuke AND you managed to smuggle it into the United States..naturally you would want to pick a target that would have Maximum Impact. Since Terrorism is all about Symbolism...the target would naturally be Washington D.C.: the CAPITAL of the World's Most Powerful Superpower. Or in eyes of one of these wacked out Arab Extremists: the Heart and Mind of the "Great Satan". Now..I ask you..would you REALLY miss Washington D.C. ? I would certainly miss the monuments and the historic sites (not to mention the Library of Congress and the Smithsonian Museum) but the politicians ? Naw... But let us suppose the Terrorists have MORE than ONE Nuke..maybe: 100 Nukes: each hidden in Vans or Trucks parked in some major city..set to go off at a specific time. Unless you are living in rather close proximity: within about 20 miles. If a Nuke went off: all you would need to do is to calmly walk into your FALLOUT Shelter. And that is basically all you need: a FALLOUT Shelter with some Air Filters, and enough Food and Water (not to mention Sanitary Devices) that will last you for between 1 - 6 months depending upon the levels of radioactivity. (Of course a Gieger Counter would be handy too..since you will need to know when it is safe to come out of your FALLOUT Shelter.) Most deaths from a Nuclear Attack would be from: Radioactive Fallout.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 2:35:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2002 2:41:03 AM EDT by Tate]
Understood, HMC, but what our nation's military would or would not do wasn't really the topic of this thread - thread got off track. the topic was:
Now that everybody predicts, terrorist attacks will happen and that the terrorist will adquire nuclear weapons, what are we to do, what are the things we need to have on hand to defend our families? This whole idea sucks, but we need to be ready.
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What can I do for **my family** in case something happens. As far as I'm concerned, all bets are off as far as predicting how far these militant muslim mother f*ckers will go. As for your job - keep it up!!! Did I attack your job????? Don't read between lines that aren't there - ask anyone on this board who knows me - I am a HAWK - not a dove. [:D] USS Enterprise / VA-94 NORPAC 87 WESTPAC 88
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 2:55:03 AM EDT
Tate's a good guy HMC.He ain't the enemy
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 3:05:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2002 3:06:00 AM EDT by M4Real]
Go here! I like the foil-sealed for freshness. [url]www.nukepills.com/[/url]
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 3:18:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf: ... Nuclear weapons are way over rated, you guys worry too much. ... A nuclear detonation is survivable
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I agree...the real danger comes from the masses of stupid people afterwards. In World War 2, Hiroshima we killed roughly 80,000 people without including subsequent radiation injuries. Nagasaki we killed roughly 60,000. These figures are almost identical to the deaths caused in major fire bombing raids, during which we laid waste to a number of Japanese cities. Even though it was a small bomb, the amount of nuclear material was substantial yet did not cause major contamination. Hiroshima is perfectly clean. Matter of fact I was just there this past weekend.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 3:23:24 AM EDT
Did you see the "shadows" of the people burned into the sides of bridges and buildings while you were in Hiroshima?VERY graphic and creepy.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 6:12:56 AM EDT
Yes I have, but with the exception of what they have chosen to preserve, there are no signs that the city was ever nuked.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 7:15:24 AM EDT
History shows that once a weapon is invented it remains ready for use in the arsenals of some nations and in time will be used.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 2:58:46 PM EDT
Do me a favor and give TATE a few stars, he is the man when it comes to supplying solid information even when you don't buy from him, and shipping is fast, furious and reliable! A+
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 3:53:55 PM EDT
When I was in the Army in (74 - 78) nuclear blast (air burst) fatalities were: Blast 50% Heat 35% Radiation: 15% Has this changed?
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 4:04:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2002 4:05:53 PM EDT by MAC-DADDY]
Originally Posted By ChuckT: When I was in the Army in (74 - 78) nuclear blast (air burst) fatalities were: Blast 50% Heat 35% Radiation: 15% Has this changed?
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I'm no rocket scientist but your statistics add up to 100% fatalities.Wheres the suvivability in that?
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 4:40:07 PM EDT
MAC-Daddy, that is the breakdown of all fatalities, not of all who go through the event. BTW, food for thought about radiation: Most statistics that were predicted for the spread of radioactive dust are based on airbursted nukes. A terrorist nuke would very likely be a ground level bomb=less blast damage, and more radioactive dust distributed into the atmosphere.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 4:56:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2002 4:59:11 PM EDT by Johnny_Reno]
Originally Posted By Poodleshooter: MAC-Daddy, that is the breakdown of all fatalities, not of all who go through the event. BTW, food for thought about radiation: Most statistics that were predicted for the spread of radioactive dust are based on airbursted nukes. A terrorist nuke would very likely be a ground level bomb=less blast damage, and more radioactive dust distributed into the atmosphere.
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Then again, if your target is New York or Washington DC, the fallout is going to move westerly and drop in the Atlantic. Fewer worries in that scenario. Also, keep in mind that there were many above ground nuclear tests in Nevada in the 50s. We didn't see huge casualties as a result....well, except for Godzilla.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 9:44:11 PM EDT
That is some scary chit.
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 10:16:51 PM EDT
I would certainly miss the monuments and the historic sites (not to mention the Library of Congress and the Smithsonian Museum) but the politicians ? Naw...
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Hey, wait a minute! Ron Paul spends part of his time up there!
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 11:06:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By STRIKER_316: Hey Winston W, there are alot of Japanese that would like to argue that point with you (1945 era) I think FirearmTom1 has the right idea.
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... Yes, and your point is what?
Link Posted: 5/23/2002 11:22:27 PM EDT
Just my .02: As a kid of the 70's I remember "duck and cover" drills. Today's society is generally completely unprepared for a nuclear attack. Is smuggling in a warhead feasible? Watch the movie "True Lies" and then answer that question. As to what you can do: 1) Now is the time to replenish all of your Y2K stuff that you've either consumed gradually since Y2K didn't happen, or haven't touched, with fresh supplies. 2) Buy at least 1 more box (or in the case of some of our friends in the cyclic community, 1 more CASE) of ammunition than you normally would for recreational purposes. Not enough to break your wallet, but enough to put you in a good position once the ugliness starts afterward. 3) The nukepill pack sure LOOKS like cheap insurance. I've grabbed that website for future reference come tomorrow when payday rolls around. 5) Anybody know about the effectiveness of certain gas mask/filter combinations that might assist a person trying to escape a fallout zone? If so, I'm all ears. This seems an appropriate place to post. 6) Get to know your neighbors...not so much let them know you're prepared, or that you might be one of those "survivalist wackos", but in a disaster, it will be good to know who belongs where when the shooting starts. It is also absolutely indispensable intelligence to know which of your neighbors you can at least count on to HAVE a gun when the shooting starts. Going it alone is rough. Having trusted allies can go a long way to a healthier, longer life, provided you choose wisely. Best to select those allies well in advance of any serious action. 7) This one's gonna sound stupid and obvious, but you'd be surprised at how many people are caught flat-footed when it comes time to evacuate...HAVE A VEHICLE THAT IS FULL OF GAS...I know gas prices are high...and I'm sure as heck NOT RICH...but our "designated evac vehicle" gets topped off every three days without fail. Spare gasoline might be a consideration, too...with proper fuel stabilizer. All I'm saying is that: ATTITUDE-WISE, prepare to survive, not to die. It's easy to prepare to die. Just stand there. To survive you need to THINK! Do I think there will be a nuclear attack? Unfortunately, yes, I do. Do I hope I am wrong? Damn skippy. Have I been wrong before? Yup. Was I prepared, even though I might have been wrong? Yup. What happened to all my gear? The MRE's got eaten on picnics and camping trips, the ammo got used up at the range with friends and lots of happy memories. The gas I'd stored got me through the first part of the higher gas prices (bought it at 1.07, used it when gas hit 1.43...who said I don't invest in commodities??), and the rest of my gear has seen good use since I assembled it for Y2K. And now, in keeping with my own advice, I'm bringing it all out for revaluation and replenishment. And yes, I'm packing a jump bag I hope that again, I will not need. God help us all. In the meantime, business as usual to make the money I need to buy the gear, of course...gee, I get to go shopping for more stuff....twist MY arm! Panz [bounce]
Link Posted: 5/24/2002 2:18:31 AM EDT
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