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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:45:50 PM EDT
Have shipped 1000+ rifles in the last couple weeks
Now getting customer complaints of missing magazines

While I am sure a few are just customers trying to scam extra mags , my money is on little dealers swiping um

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:47:41 PM EDT
That sucks.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:48:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:


we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home

best practice, there
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:50:23 PM EDT
How low can they go
Don't people have any pride anymore ?
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:50:42 PM EDT
That's just sad.

Thieves need to be set on fire.

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:51:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:52:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
That happened to me in Tennessee around 2005, when I ordered a Glock 21 from a local gunstore (right outside Nashville).

When it arrived, they told me it came with 10-round magazines. I told them to double-check, because I was pretty sure Glock shipped them with 13-round mags. They assured me that no, this was the way that Glock shipped them from the factory, and never included 13-round mags. But they'd be happy to sell me some 13-round mags.

I told them to fuck off.

Were those your exact words?
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:55:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home


Good move.

I'd be tempted to include a card with the firearm that said something like "Magazines shipped directly to purchaser because of the high ratio of thieving douchebags conducting ffl transfers"
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 12:59:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:
Have shipped 1000+ rifles in the last couple weeks
Now getting customer complaints of missing magazines

While I am sure a few are just customers trying to scam extra mags , my money is on little dealers swiping um

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home

Keep track of which dealer correlate to missing magazine complaints.


Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:01:26 PM EDT
Bastards did it during the beginning of the last assault weapons ban too.
Only HK had a note enclosed, that explained they were only going to send one with the gun, rather than the customary two, as apparently they didn't have ten rounders available yet.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:04:06 PM EDT
We have an LGS well known for pulling that the during the AWB.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:05:02 PM EDT
Some Glock dealers did that when the Gen 4's came out. glock got wise and put their foot down
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:07:08 PM EDT
I bought a rifle from AIM (or was it SOG) and used the local old guy FFL. Dude was mad because the sun came up every day or something. Terrible personality - the only place he could have possibly made it would be in the gun business, so good for him for finding his niche.

When it came in, he tried to just give me the rifle. I asked him where the magazines and other accouterments were. He looked like he just got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and sheepishly said, "oh were those yours?"

I stopped using him.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:07:09 PM EDT
When I bought my STG-556 from MSAR, the box said:

Attention Dealers: This rifle shipped with 5 magazines and must be included with the rifle

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:07:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home


I'll be ordering from you. Thank you. I went though a similar issue a year ago with my wife's LC9. "blah blah case included (yes just a shitty ruger zip soft one which comes standard) two factory mags, yadda yadda. It came with the factory tape cut. I didn't realize it till we got it home. It had one mag, the "fingerplate" (pinky finger extension) wasn't in the box either. I know damn well it was swiped at the big box store that sold it. I let it go, and ended up coughing up another 40 bucks for another mag for her. Pisses me off to this day.

I now have everything sent to a small family gunshop in town. It costs a bit more. I offset it with the online savings, instead of backordering it through the big box chain that hires pimply faced 20 year olds to work the back.

It happens.

/endrant.

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:11:06 PM EDT


Hyatt Gun Shop pulled the mags (2 AR's) between me and the front door.

(They carry the gun to front door for you, package it up in back outta sight)

When I discovered such, I went back and confronted the owner, Hyatt.

He got defensive, mad and loud...wanted me to bring guns in and sell back to him.

What a jerk.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:13:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:


While I am sure a few are just customers trying to scam extra mags , my money is on little dealers swiping um





The shyster gun shop on Entrance Rd Leesville, LA right outside of Fort Polk was notorious for this in the 07/08 timeframe. Trying to sell pistols that per SKU came with 3 mags with only one or two mags. Conveniently they had out of the package mags to sell to people. Caught them at it with questions a couple of times.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:14:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2012 1:14:54 PM EDT by MikefromTX]
I've even heard of some dealers pulling Colt BCG's and substituting low-cost alternatives. Gotta watch those weasels. People are no damn good.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:14:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:15:09 PM EDT
Wow, it is hard to believe people would do stuff like this just for a few bucks. Do they think word won't get out?
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:15:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bubba_76:


Hyatt Gun Shop pulled the mags (2 AR's) between me and the front door.

(They carry the gun to front door for you, package it up in back outta sight)

When I discovered such, I went back and confronted the owner, Hyatt.

He got defensive, mad and loud...wanted me to bring guns in and sell back to him.

What a jerk.


When you falsely accuse someone, they get mad. When you accurately accuse someone, they get REAL mad.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:16:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:19:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2012 1:25:45 PM EDT by triburst1]
I had this happen to me during the ban in 2001. I bought an early GLOCK 19 that came with 2x15 round mags and had it transfered to a dealer where I was going to college. Went to pick up the gun and it had two 10 rounders in the box.

The dealer denied it at first and even tried to blame it on the shipping dealer. I threatened to call the police and report them for theft right then and there. At the time, pre-ban GLOCK 19 mags were going for $75-80 each. They finally admitted that "they must have mixed up" the mags and gave me my pre-bans. They ended up waiving the transfer fee.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:21:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:36:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MikefromTX:
I've even heard of some dealers pulling Colt BCG's and substituting low-cost alternatives. Gotta watch those weasels. People are no damn good.


Holy fuck!

I'd be livid!
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:38:03 PM EDT
I had someone remove the barrel of a 6920 that I bought, then re-install it backwards before shipping it. Shot myself in the shoulder. I was pissed man.

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:41:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Sig_Prude:
I had someone remove the barrel of a 6920 that I bought, then re-install it backwards before shipping it. Shot myself in the shoulder. I was pissed man.



For realz?
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:44:49 PM EDT
Isn't this, uh, theft, fraud, and selling stolen property?
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:44:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bubba_76:


Hyatt Gun Shop pulled the mags (2 AR's) between me and the front door.

(They carry the gun to front door for you, package it up in back outta sight)

When I discovered such, I went back and confronted the owner, Hyatt.

He got defensive, mad and loud...wanted me to bring guns in and sell back to him.

What a jerk.


Shooters express does the same thing, I bought a glock there, 4th gen and they went in the back to "package it up"

I asked the guy why the gun wasn't coming with 3 magazines of 15 rounds and he said "oh those don't come with the glock anymore"

I swear to god that Hyatts and Shooters are scam companies and need to go out of business.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:45:03 PM EDT
There is a dealer near here that always seems to lose mags, or sub out lower capacity mags. Even back straps for Glock Gen 4 seem to disappear. Pain in the ass.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:48:29 PM EDT
Used to happen with the Chinese AKS's back in the 80's. Dealers would pilfer 2 of the 3 magazines.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:50:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2012 1:51:48 PM EDT by SkiShooter]
In before the Thin Gunshop Line....
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:52:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:
Have shipped 1000+ rifles in the last couple weeks
Now getting customer complaints of missing magazines

While I am sure a few are just customers trying to scam extra mags , my money is on little dealers swiping um

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home

I've had dealers steal a t shirt with our company name on it we provide to the customers. I just started putting EVERYTHING on the invoice. It sucks but when your name is worth a .50 sticker or a $10 shirt you have to do something.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:58:16 PM EDT
Dealers swiping magazines is old news.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 1:58:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By wtturn:

Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:


we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home

best practice, there
Agree.. Sucks that it have to be that way, but good on OP for making the effort

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:03:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
That happened to me in Tennessee around 2005, when I ordered a Glock 21 from a local gunstore (right outside Nashville).

When it arrived, they told me it came with 10-round magazines. I told them to double-check, because I was pretty sure Glock shipped them with 13-round mags. They assured me that no, this was the way that Glock shipped them from the factory, and never included 13-round mags. But they'd be happy to sell me some 13-round mags.

I told them to fuck off.


I wouldnt have paid for it. I'd walk out.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:07:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
Originally Posted By wtturn:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
That happened to me in Tennessee around 2005, when I ordered a Glock 21 from a local gunstore (right outside Nashville).

When it arrived, they told me it came with 10-round magazines. I told them to double-check, because I was pretty sure Glock shipped them with 13-round mags. They assured me that no, this was the way that Glock shipped them from the factory, and never included 13-round mags. But they'd be happy to sell me some 13-round mags.

I told them to fuck off.

Were those your exact words?


I honestly cannot remember.

Normally, I am a very polite and laid-back guy, but I tend to get angry when I know people are fucking with me ... so it's very possible I used those very words.

Before that, I did ask them if they thought it was possible that they had gotten an OLD version (from the 94-04 AWB) that had perhaps been shipped with 10-round mags, and they assured me that it was a brand new gun that had been recently shipped from the Glock factory. Then, I called Glock and asked them if they ship G21s with 10-round mags, and they told me that the ONLY ship them like that to ban states, but certainly not to Tennessee.

So at that point, the only remaining explanation I could come up with was that they probably had lots of 10-rounders left from the AWB ban in stock that nobody wanted any longer, so they were swapping these out for the new ones that came with factory guns, and then trying to sell the correct "high-capacity" mags to the buyer as well.



Name of shop?

When we lived there I was starting to feel my way around the shops in Williamson, Davidson, Maury counties, and we still visit the area a lot and hope to live there again, so I'd like to know the name of the shop.

FWIW, I hope it wasn't Steve's in Columbia because they seem really cool.

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:08:05 PM EDT
Also don't forget here might be dishonest customers out there as well. I could see some jerk customer saying ohhh yeah he said there would be 3 mags in there, when infact it only came with one.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:13:56 PM EDT
Shipping dealer needs to use a marker that shows under UV - so when challenged you can pull out a light and say "read what's written on the mags you're trying to sell back to me".

"Stolen from Smith transfer"
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:15:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home

For years I've been requesting that sellers remove everything that can be easily removed and send it to me at my home. Send the gun to the FFL and the rest to my house. I will of course pay for any additional shipping and handling.

Not one has ever done it for me. I guess it's too much trouble.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:20:21 PM EDT
Holy shit, I had no idea this sort of thing took place.

How is that not considered straight up theft? I am shocked this is common practice....
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:22:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2012 2:22:35 PM EDT by www-glock19-com]

Originally Posted By DoubleARon:
Dealers swiping magazines is old news.

true

but it is not nearly as common anymore like during the ban
thought I'd give newbies and panic buyers a heads up
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:36:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2012 2:38:12 PM EDT by Hedonist]

Originally Posted By caskalefan:
Holy shit, I had no idea this sort of thing took place.

How is that not considered straight up theft? I am shocked this is common practice....

It starts with "I'm not sure if mags come with that" - to test your reaction. He then goes to some magic book that tells him that you're out of luck, "you want magazines with that?"

I remember Bushmasters (or was it the Colts?) having the accessory kits removed and offered back as "accessory kits". F-in' thieves.

Back during the ban, they'd steal your 30-round mags you got with your new rifle and try to sell them back or substitute lower capacity mags.

ETA - or your green follower mags were switched to the black follower mags.


Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:37:53 PM EDT
I had that happen to me when I got my XDm 9mm. At the time it was suppose to come with 3 19 round mags but when I got it, there were just the 2. after some arguing I left and went to another gun store and got it for a few $ more and 3 mags.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:40:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SkiShooter:
In before the Thin Gunshop Line....
As a dealer I do not do what has been purported to have gone on. However there is a difference between you buying a gun online and having the mags taken and buying a gun in stock. If the gun is the dealers possession he can sell it with out mags if he likes, it's his to so with as he pleases and you have the option not to buy from him. If you have him order a gun and it comes with 2 or 3 mags then that is how many you should get.

Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:41:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By King_Mud:
Wow, it is hard to believe people would do stuff like this just for a few bucks. Do they think word won't get out?

Some just love to cheat other people.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:45:41 PM EDT
I haven't used an FFL since WA started requiring them to collect tax on everything in shop, however the one I used to use wouldn't open the box until you came in. Took a few more minutes to do the paperwork and such, but you were the first one to inspect the package so no foul play could ever be called on their part.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:48:20 PM EDT
This is why whenever I sell a rifle that has some high dollar accessories I ship the accessories to the buyers house. I've heard too many stories of dealers helping themselves to things like mags and bayonets.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:48:56 PM EDT
Always good to remind folks.

I only had that happen to me once. Bought a pistol thinking it came with only one magazine, only to read the manual after purchasing to find out it was shipped with two. Went back to the dealer and they said the distributor shipped them that way, but on the shelf was a bin full of the factory mags that came with the pistols. Don't do business with that dealer anymore.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:51:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By www-glock19-com:
Have shipped 1000+ rifles in the last couple weeks
Now getting customer complaints of missing magazines

While I am sure a few are just customers trying to scam extra mags , my money is on little dealers swiping um

we are now going to remove mags and ship separate to the buyers home


AmmoBros in Cerritos tried that shit on me.
Lucky for me I picked up the rifle on a busy day, with a sale going on. Shop said 'No magazine in the case.' Had the owner email a pic of the rifle in the case as he packaged it. Made a BIG stink, then they brought out the mag to me.

Other than this, they have always done me well, but it pissed me off. This was the manager, not the guys working the counter.

Yes, I know it was the same mag; it was marked because it was a 10 round unit. Owner had sharpied the number 10 on the side, and it showed in the pic clearly.

I agree, ship mags separately to your house.
Link Posted: 12/28/2012 2:52:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By David_ESM:
I haven't used an FFL since WA started requiring them to collect tax on everything in shop, however the one I used to use wouldn't open the box until you came in. Took a few more minutes to do the paperwork and such, but you were the first one to inspect the package so no foul play could ever be called on their part.


I LIKE that! Give props where props are due.
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