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11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 9/26/2004 5:57:22 AM EST
HERE'S MY ORIGINAL POST

I figured I'd also come to the source for all opinions M1A.

Thanks in advance,

Hep
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 11:12:04 AM EST
I'm stunned an amazed....not a single opinion? C'mon fellas, help a brother out!
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 1:10:16 PM EST
Leupold 3.5-10 Mark 4 M3.
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 3:23:34 PM EST
Is money an object?

Regards,
Gary
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 10:10:31 PM EST
I like the Leather Wood 3-9x and SpringField 3rd Gen...
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 1:57:47 AM EST
Also, how are you defining "tactical'..?
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 4:21:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
Also, how are you defining "tactical'..?



Geez, I know that "Tactical" is a very over used word (Example: "Tactical Beverage Holder") but I used it in this instance because I'm looking for an optic that is battle sighted, like an ACOG, to get rounds on target at 2-400 yards. Not under a 1/4 MOA at long ranges. However, I want better eye relief and more economy than an ACOG.

I'm thinking a solid medium range scope, possibly short to medium ranges. That's why I'm looking at the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT I like the idea of having an illuminated CQB scope (1.1x) or a little more power (4x) to reach out and touch someone. I know this is heresy to the ACOG crowd, but I love my Leupold CQ/T. I just think it would sit too high on my M1A.

So are their any Leupolds that are similar to the IOR 1.1-4x26 but in a 30mm tube, maybe with more power, and an illuminated reticule? Like the next step up in performance of the IOR.

As far as money, I'd like to stay in the $500ish ballpark, but you never know. Good glass is worth every penny, so I want to know more about the Leupolds that have the features I'm looking for and what the prices are to help me make a better call on how to proceed. That's another reason the IOR's are attractive, they seem to have the performance but at good prices.

Link Posted: 9/28/2004 4:44:35 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 4:48:18 PM EST by LastDefender]
I was going to suggest the new Nightforce but that is out of your price range.



Regards,
Gary

Link Posted: 9/28/2004 7:12:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
I was going to suggest the new Nightforce but that is out of your price range.

img51.exs.cx/img51/42/5263.jpg

Regards,
Gary




Yeah, I've thought about those. I know even less about them. Any info, feedback, range report on the posted scopes Gary? I'd be obliged to you.

BTW - I said $500...but I could be persuaded by the right scope.

Thanks to everyone who has posted so far! Feel free to chime in more....
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 7:25:36 PM EST

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
I was going to suggest the new Nightforce but that is out of your price range.

img51.exs.cx/img51/42/5263.jpg

Regards,
Gary




Hey Gary, what do you think of the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT ???
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:16:00 PM EST
The Leupold or Nightforce are great suggestions. Then again 2- 400 yards ain't that far...... many would say stick to irons for that.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:08:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By BKinzey:
The Leupold or Nightforce are great suggestions. Then again 2- 400 yards ain't that far...... many would say stick to irons for that.



I do.

But glass wouldn't hurt.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:19:06 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:34:42 AM EST


Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm Illuminated Reticle. Dealer cost is right around $480. You could probably find one for a good deal if you shop around. It is available with the cirlce dot just like the CQ/T, has a 30 mm tube, and just the right amount of magnifacation.


Product Specifications
Actual Magnification: 1.5(1.5x) 4.5(5x)
Length (in): 9.3
Eyepiece Length (in): 3.2
Objective Length (in): -------
Objective Diameter (in): 1.0
Eyepiece Diameter (in): 1.6
Tube Diameter: 30mm
Weight: 14.0 oz. / 397 grams
Eye Relief (in): 4.4(1.5x) 3.6(5x)
Eye Relief (mm): 113(1.5x) 93(5x)
Obj. Lens Diameter: 0.8in / 20mm
Max. Adjustment @ 100 yds (in): 65
Max. Adjustment @ 100 m (cm): 181
FOV @ 100 yds (ft): 65.7(1.5x) 23.7(5x)
FOV @ 100 m (m): 21.9(1.5x) 7.9(5x)
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:40:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By QuinlanV:


Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm Illuminated Reticle. Dealer cost is right around $480. You could probably find one for a good deal if you shop around. It is available with the cirlce dot just like the CQ/T, has a 30 mm tube, and just the right amount of magnifacation.
www.leupold.com/products/images/Reticle_Illum_Circle_Dot.gif

Product Specifications
Actual Magnification: 1.5(1.5x) 4.5(5x)
Length (in): 9.3
Eyepiece Length (in): 3.2
Objective Length (in): -------
Objective Diameter (in): 1.0
Eyepiece Diameter (in): 1.6
Tube Diameter: 30mm
Weight: 14.0 oz. / 397 grams
Eye Relief (in): 4.4(1.5x) 3.6(5x)
Eye Relief (mm): 113(1.5x) 93(5x)
Obj. Lens Diameter: 0.8in / 20mm
Max. Adjustment @ 100 yds (in): 65
Max. Adjustment @ 100 m (cm): 181
FOV @ 100 yds (ft): 65.7(1.5x) 23.7(5x)
FOV @ 100 m (m): 21.9(1.5x) 7.9(5x)




Very nice!

Opinions?

Does it come with any other reticles?

I'm looking into this bad boy.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:45:04 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 5:53:44 AM EST

Originally Posted By SHIVAN:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:
Very nice!

Opinions?

Does it come with any other reticles?

I'm looking into this bad boy.



I have a 0-4 power Pentax Lightseeker X/V on my 458 SOCOM. It is good for my intended use, deer hunting, where the FOV is not very critical when the game is 40yds away.

FOV, even though listed at 65', is going to be limited with the smaller objective lensed scopes, it's the trade-off for lightweight and smaller profile.

You can get other reticles. Premier Reticles should have the full gambit...




I do like the CQ/T like reticle. Very clean.

Anyone use the IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT with the 4A dot or circle reticles? The CQB reticle seems messy.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 6:49:35 AM EST

Originally Posted By hepcat85:

Does it come with any other reticles?

I'm looking into this bad boy.






Very nice looking optic. I have thinking of getting one for my M1A. The German reticle is my personal favorite, but the circle dot is very slick as well. Though I don't have any experience with this exact model, I have owned many Leupold products. They have all been top-notch.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 6:53:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By hepcat85:

Originally Posted By QuinlanV:
www.leupold.com/products/magnified/images/VX-III/VX-III_1_5-5x20_IR_XL.gif

Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm Illuminated Reticle. Dealer cost is right around $480. You could probably find one for a good deal if you shop around. It is available with the cirlce dot just like the CQ/T, has a 30 mm tube, and just the right amount of magnifacation.
www.leupold.com/products/images/Reticle_Illum_Circle_Dot.gif

Product Specifications
Actual Magnification: 1.5(1.5x) 4.5(5x)
Length (in): 9.3
Eyepiece Length (in): 3.2
Objective Length (in): -------
Objective Diameter (in): 1.0
Eyepiece Diameter (in): 1.6
Tube Diameter: 30mm
Weight: 14.0 oz. / 397 grams
Eye Relief (in): 4.4(1.5x) 3.6(5x)
Eye Relief (mm): 113(1.5x) 93(5x)
Obj. Lens Diameter: 0.8in / 20mm
Max. Adjustment @ 100 yds (in): 65
Max. Adjustment @ 100 m (cm): 181
FOV @ 100 yds (ft): 65.7(1.5x) 23.7(5x)
FOV @ 100 m (m): 21.9(1.5x) 7.9(5x)




Very nice!

Opinions?

Does it come with any other reticles?

I'm looking into this bad boy.



I've got this one on my M1 with the Sage EBR stock. I'm getting great groups at 100, but then again I get the same groups with irons. With my setup I can use both. The illumination is great for my older eyes in low light though, and it's really fast.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 7:25:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By az_larry:

Originally Posted By hepcat85:

Originally Posted By QuinlanV:
www.leupold.com/products/magnified/images/VX-III/VX-III_1_5-5x20_IR_XL.gif

Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm Illuminated Reticle. Dealer cost is right around $480. You could probably find one for a good deal if you shop around. It is available with the cirlce dot just like the CQ/T, has a 30 mm tube, and just the right amount of magnifacation.
www.leupold.com/products/images/Reticle_Illum_Circle_Dot.gif

Product Specifications
Actual Magnification: 1.5(1.5x) 4.5(5x)
Length (in): 9.3
Eyepiece Length (in): 3.2
Objective Length (in): -------
Objective Diameter (in): 1.0
Eyepiece Diameter (in): 1.6
Tube Diameter: 30mm
Weight: 14.0 oz. / 397 grams
Eye Relief (in): 4.4(1.5x) 3.6(5x)
Eye Relief (mm): 113(1.5x) 93(5x)
Obj. Lens Diameter: 0.8in / 20mm
Max. Adjustment @ 100 yds (in): 65
Max. Adjustment @ 100 m (cm): 181
FOV @ 100 yds (ft): 65.7(1.5x) 23.7(5x)
FOV @ 100 m (m): 21.9(1.5x) 7.9(5x)




Very nice!

Opinions?

Does it come with any other reticles?

I'm looking into this bad boy.



I've got this one on my M1 with the Sage EBR stock. I'm getting great groups at 100, but then again I get the same groups with irons. With my setup I can use both. The illumination is great for my older eyes in low light though, and it's really fast.




This seems like the same features as the comparible IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT, but better price since the IOR runs about $6-650. I like the German reticle as well. One question...does the lowest setting of 1.5x prevent "both eyes open" CQB range shooting? Or is that the point, you wouldn't use a 1.5x with both eyes. I'm guessing the IOR at 1.1x would allow both eyes open.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 4:58:34 PM EST
Hepcat,

I am in the process of aquiring the 2.5 x 10 x 24 for my SPR and stumbled upon the 1-4. I believe Wes at MSTN is either currently carring it or will be carring it. Since everyone seems to be raving about the 2.5 x 10, it would stand to reason that the 1-4 is worth a look.

Good luck and happy scope hunting.

Regards,
Gary

PS...With regards to the IOR, I have their M2 model for another AR. The scope is very clear and seems well built. I have no firsthand knowledge of the product you are considering.
Link Posted: 9/30/2004 4:55:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2004 4:57:26 AM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
Hepcat,

I am in the process of aquiring the 2.5 x 10 x 24 for my SPR and stumbled upon the 1-4. I believe Wes at MSTN is either currently carring it or will be carring it. Since everyone seems to be raving about the 2.5 x 10, it would stand to reason that the 1-4 is worth a look.
Good luck and happy scope hunting.

Regards,
Gary

PS...With regards to the IOR, I have their M2 model for another AR. The scope is very clear and seems well built. I have no firsthand knowledge of the product you are considering.



Thanks Gary. Your knowledge is appreciated.

Clarification, when you said the "1-4 is worth a look", were you refering to the Leupold 1.5-5x ??? You later mentioned the IOR seperately, so I'm not 100% on which you meant wehn discussing the 1-4. Thanks in advance...

*************

Seperate question from earlier:

"This (Leupold 1.5-5x) seems like the same features as the comparible IOR 1.1-4x26 CRT, but better price since the IOR runs about $6-650. I like the German reticle as well. One question...does the lowest setting of 1.5x prevent "both eyes open" CQB range shooting? Or is that the point, you wouldn't use a 1.5x with both eyes. I'm guessing the IOR at 1.1x would allow both eyes open."

Anyone?
Link Posted: 9/30/2004 5:00:57 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2004 5:01:32 AM EST by hepcat85]
I just want to take a minute and thank all the members who have taken the time to help educate a brother member. This is why I love this place! Great guys looking to stick together and help out.

Cheers to you all!
Link Posted: 9/30/2004 11:37:03 AM EST
Hepcat,

The 1-4 I was refering to was the Nightforce.

Regards,
Gary
Link Posted: 9/30/2004 3:03:32 PM EST
Hey, what are the thoughts on the Trijicon Accu-points?
Link Posted: 9/30/2004 3:04:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 6:09:39 AM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
Hepcat,

The 1-4 I was refering to was the Nightforce.

Regards,
Gary



Thanks Gary.

I think Nightforce is out of my self imposed price range. I'm trying to be reasonable......
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:01:54 AM EST
i cant vouch for the Leupold mentioned above because i have never used it but i can vouch for them as a company and will therefore encourage you to purchse Leupold optics. I have their products on damb near every rifle i own - only other personal favorite is Zeiss. But hes not so inexpensive.

Have to agree on the Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm IR

And ofcourse, i have to suggest the Mark 4 CQ/T - although i remember them being slightly more expensive that $500, i also was shopping right after they came out.

Zeiss - i would consider the Varipoint 1.5-6x42 T VM/V

my .02
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:54:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By phrkshw:
i cant vouch for the Leupold mentioned above because i have never used it but i can vouch for them as a company and will therefore encourage you to purchse Leupold optics. I have their products on damb near every rifle i own - only other personal favorite is Zeiss. But hes not so inexpensive.

Have to agree on the Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm IR

And ofcourse, i have to suggest the Mark 4 CQ/T - although i remember them being slightly more expensive that $500, i also was shopping right after they came out.

Zeiss - i would consider the Varipoint 1.5-6x42 T VM/V

my .02




Thanks for your .02 phrkshw

I currently have a CQ/T on my Fulton Rifle. I found NIB for $500. Right place at the right time.

Does Leupold make any other illuminated optics that can be dialed down to 0 for close range?

I'll look into the Zeiss, thanks.

How abut the Trijicon Accupoint series?

Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:25:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/1/2004 1:25:57 PM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By hepcat85:


Thanks for your .02 phrkshw

I currently have a CQ/T on my Fulton Rifle. I found NIB for $500. Right place at the right time.

Does Leupold make any other illuminated optics that can be dialed down to 0 for close range?




Anyone?
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:31:46 PM EST
i do not have any experience with trijicon but have heard complaints about the fiberoptics being good during the day but lacking at night. i dont remember exactly. I would have to do some research and ask around to those more knowledgable than i.

about leupold - there VX-III line has three options with IR. 3.5-10, 4.5-14, and the 1.5-5. In their tactical line every magnification has an optional IR EXCEPT the "Precision Rifle" scopes. From the CQ/T to the long range/tacticals. Check the website, its all there.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 5:25:59 PM EST
I'm not familiar with the IOR variable that you have talked about. Mine is an IOR 4x24, Dragunov reticle, IOR throwlever rings on a two point ARMS mount. It works fine for me. Eye relief is an issue, the scope sits forward on the mount and you have to crowd it in most positions as you would crowd a peep sight. Height of scope is not much of an issue as I think you can learn a good jaw weld just as you can learn a good cheek weld. At any rate if using a GI stock with this system I would not go chasing comb height with the use of cheek pads, because your jaw is going to be set forward of where these pads are going to be.

No complaints with the M2 Valdada. Windage adjustments are on the coarse side. Elevation is with a manual BDC from 100 to 1000 meters, with hold-off chevrons on the reticle to 1300m if you
re that optimistic. The super M2 (6x30 with a big but straight tube) may give better eye relief since it is longer. I've seen that some people are mounting the 4x24 with only one large ring. Don't know what to think about that idea, but believe that it would not work with a two-point ARMS mount, it may work to some extent with an ARMS which is one piece with more mounting locations.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 6:14:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By PrairieFire:
I'm not familiar with the IOR variable that you have talked about. Mine is an IOR 4x24, Dragunov reticle, IOR throwlever rings on a two point ARMS mount. It works fine for me. Eye relief is an issue, the scope sits forward on the mount and you have to crowd it in most positions as you would crowd a peep sight. Height of scope is not much of an issue as I think you can learn a good jaw weld just as you can learn a good cheek weld. At any rate if using a GI stock with this system I would not go chasing comb height with the use of cheek pads, because your jaw is going to be set forward of where these pads are going to be.

No complaints with the M2 Valdada. Windage adjustments are on the coarse side. Elevation is with a manual BDC from 100 to 1000 meters, with hold-off chevrons on the reticle to 1300m if you
re that optimistic. The super M2 (6x30 with a big but straight tube) may give better eye relief since it is longer. I've seen that some people are mounting the 4x24 with only one large ring. Don't know what to think about that idea, but believe that it would not work with a two-point ARMS mount, it may work to some extent with an ARMS which is one piece with more mounting locations.



Fantastic info! Thanks very much.

I'm looking at one in .308, dragonuv reticle. Great prices. I sort of have my heart set on a varible magnification scope w/ illuminated ret, but this may be a good way to go for now.


Further opinions/range reports?
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 6:26:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/4/2004 10:13:30 AM EST by hepcat85]
Who has the best deal on the Leupold VX-III (1.5-5x20mm) Illuminated Scope???


Edited to add - Who has the best scope deals PERIOD???
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 10:13:37 AM EST
btt
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 10:53:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By SHIVAN:

FOV, even though listed at 65', is going to be limited with the smaller objective lensed scopes, it's the trade-off for lightweight and smaller profile.





I don't understand. Will it be less than 65' or is something else at play?


And here is my choice for a scope ( I want one but have to wait). It does not have a 65' FOV, but it still has much more than most of the scopes on the market, even a bit more than an ACOG (it is over the price range too):

Nikon Tactical 2.5-10x44
www.riflescopes.com/products/6694/nikon_tactical_2.5-10x44.htm

Link Posted: 10/4/2004 11:10:41 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/4/2004 11:54:03 AM EST by hepcat85]
The Nightforce scopes look great.....but I'd have trouble pushing myself to pick one up at retail prices. Any good dealers out there with good prices???
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 4:19:52 PM EST
btt
Link Posted: 10/6/2004 7:21:43 PM EST
From what I've seen there are not too many deals on new Nightforce product. You may be able to find a used one on the cheap. It is a great product but not for the faint of heart financially.

Regards,
Gary
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 9:27:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By LastDefender:
From what I've seen there are not too many deals on new Nightforce product. You may be able to find a used one on the cheap. It is a great product but not for the faint of heart financially.

Regards,
Gary




Amen brother.

I think I'm going for Leupold.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 5:48:40 PM EST
Have to chip in. I mounted an IOR M2 on an M1a and there is no way to get it to work well. Very nice scope though. Awesome on an AR, but look elsewhere for the M1A. However, they have other models that don't suffer from the short eye relief of the M2.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 3:25:20 PM EST
Have you thought about an Aimpoint (2x)
Link Posted: 10/19/2004 3:52:02 PM EST
Have you considered an EoTech? I have shot targets out to 300 yards with it with no problems.



Link Posted: 10/19/2004 4:47:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/19/2004 4:48:19 PM EST by hepcat85]

Originally Posted By TennVol:
Have you considered an EoTech? I have shot targets out to 300 yards with it with no problems.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v366/TennVol/c4fe2840.jpg




Yes I have............

I currently have a 512 rev F mounted. I'm looking for more range....and general purpose.

I'm moving to a NForce 2.5-10x w/ the FC-2 illuminated reticle.

Link Posted: 10/20/2004 8:41:27 PM EST
hepcat85

I have an older Leupold 1.5X5 power scope with out illuminated reticle and on 1.5 I can use it for CQB/both eyes open shooting with no problem. I had it on an AR10 carbine and with two Armalite mounts I could swap with a 3.5x10 Leuy for longer range. you could do the same with two sets of quick release mounts for your M1A platform. Now that the Illuminated reticle is available, I just might have to pick one up too.
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