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Posted: 10/28/2002 4:40:56 AM EDT
[#1]
[b]BS[/b]. Though I can't speak for the truth of the church itself, or what it's founders intended, I don't understand how anyone can say that Mormons are not Christian. Because.....when a religion puts more stock in what comes out of their presidents (Gordon B. Hinckley) mouth than they do the bible...then they are not Christian...... |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 4:56:52 AM EDT
[#2]
This is kind of ironic b/c I have been harassed by the different religions this week also (may have something to do with Halloween?).
What pisses me off is that they invade my space...if I am interested in whatever particular religion then I will go to that church. Last Saturday I was visited by LDS at 9am then JW at 1pm then at 3pm I was visited by The New Jerusalem church of the Holy Christ Missionary New Life Baptist church or something like that. Then I had this one dude preaching to me at Burger King while I was waiting in line the night before last. I just want to be left alone to live my life the way I choose |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 5:14:52 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: [b]BS[/b]. Though I can't speak for the truth of the church itself, or what it's founders intended, I don't understand how anyone can say that Mormons are not Christian. Because.....when a religion puts more stock in what comes out of their presidents (Gordon B. Hinckley) mouth than they do the bible...then they are not Christian...... So you're saying that you wouldn't be able to accept the idea that God would continue to talk to us through a chosen prophet? You're saying you believe in God, but that he just ran out of things to say a long time ago? That's fine if you do... But that difference does not change the "Christian" argument one way or the other. Please people, these are generally some pretty minor differences here. [b]I don't care if you believe that these things are true or not.[/b] But you can't say that just because a religion differs from yours in several ways, that it's not Christian. All that's needed for Christianity is Christ. "Oh, those Catholics, always listening to the dang POPE! That's just not Christian at all!" [rolleyes] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 5:24:41 AM EDT
[#4]
I live about an 45 minutes away from where Joseph Smith was killed. Their temple was burned down and consequently they moved out to Utah. They just spent millions of dollars to rebuild it this past year. they opened it up to tours for the public, but you had to wear special things over your shoes and you couldnt touch anything. Then after they closed the tour, they proceeded to strip out all of the carpeting and replaced it because it had been walked on by "unholy" people. I was talking to some locals who had a long family history in the area, and they said it is no coincidence that their leader was in jail, shot in jail, and their temple burned. They said at this period of time they were basically worse than a modern day gang. I don't believe the got run out of their original settlement in Ohio, and then Nauvoo,IL because they were nice people. They were just smart enough to know that there were no rules out in Utah and they could do whatever they want. Now granted the LDS church has changed their image tremendously but this is some of their history. The only problem I have with them, is that their commericials on TV are very convincing to the average person who is struggling with religion. They appear to be very christianlike on the outside, and I think it is very easy to get sucked into it if you are searching for answers.
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Posted: 10/28/2002 5:36:24 AM EDT
[#5]
Mormanism and the LDS is a farce... they should drop the "S" and just be LD. I worked for these folks, and it is nothing more than a cult.
BTW, What other religion "owns" a bank? (Zion Savings)[puke] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 5:56:59 AM EDT
[#6]
Yeah, FU** them. Their religion sucks. They should be just like me and so should everyone else. Yeah, because I'm a goddamn American and we have freedom of religion and shit. They are free to be just like me. If they don't want to we should just kill their sorry asses. Yeah, knocking on my door every 5 minutes for weeks on end. I caught a couple trying to sneak in my window and I just whipped out my cock and pissed on his head. How do you like that, meet elder Johnson.
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Posted: 10/28/2002 6:03:06 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted: Yeah, FU** them. Their religion sucks. They should be just like me and so should everyone else. Yeah, because I'm a goddamn American and we have freedom of religion and shit. They are free to be just like me. If they don't want to we should just kill their sorry asses. Yeah, knocking on my door every 5 minutes for weeks on end. I caught a couple trying to sneak in my window and I just whipped out my cock and pissed on his head. How do you like that, meet elder Johnson. Damn dude... TheBeekeeper is gonna [b]own[/b] your ass now!! [:D] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 6:06:08 AM EDT
[#8]
BTW, What other religion "owns" a bank? (Zion Savings)[puke] I can't answer that but I know of very damn few that aren't happy to handle a deposit for you. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 6:07:49 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: Yeah, FU** them. Their religion sucks. They should be just like me and so should everyone else. Yeah, because I'm a goddamn American and we have freedom of religion and shit. They are free to be just like me. If they don't want to we should just kill their sorry asses. Yeah, knocking on my door every 5 minutes for weeks on end. I caught a couple trying to sneak in my window and I just whipped out my cock and pissed on his head. How do you like that, meet elder Johnson. [img]www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/thumb.gif[/img] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 6:45:38 AM EDT
[#10]
It is truly amazing to see all these folks spewing utter hatred and intolerance while proclaiming what true Christians they are. "My religion is better than your religion." If all of you are so fucking good at being Christians, or whatever, then why do you feel compelled to prove it by tearing down everyone else's beliefs? If your God is as you claim then he knows what kind of people you are. In my opinion, it doesn't make a shit of difference as long as you are a decent person. The kind of crap flying here definitely doesn't meet the standard. Give me, give us all, a break.
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Posted: 10/28/2002 7:01:08 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Why does it matter? It matters because you speak against one faith while proclaiming that you are a "true Christian". I am just curious what faith you are which leads you to say this. Niether you or flash66 have answered my simple questions, which actually, by not answering, that answers my questions. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 7:01:57 AM EDT
[#12]
I am no religion, so I don't really care which one of you wins the great holly war, jihad, rahowa, or whatever you want to call it. I find it completely ridiculous that in this day and age people are divided by religion. I find most people that subscribe to one acknowledged faith or another to be hypocrites on one level or another. Look at how defensive Glock shooters get when 1911'ers bash their weapon of choice (and vice-versa). Of course people are going to get offended when you bash their religion. I say believe what you want, and leave others to their beliefs. No one has put forth the argument that Mormons are in any way harming anyone else, so what do you care what/who/how they worship? I admit to having certain pre-conceived notions of Mormons, based on living across the street from two Mormon families when I was a kid. Did I find some of their habit odd? Sure did, but did these habits affect my quality of life? Sure didn't. For that reason I figure they are entitled to believe what they want. Ironically, most Mormons I have met come closer to strictly following their faith than any of the mainstream religions have in centuries.
With that said, on the topic of Mormons, I'd be interested to hear the explanation of Solomon Spaulding's 1812 novel, "Manuscript Story". I'm surprised that no one else has brought this up yet. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 7:35:18 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: Quoted: Hmmm, Mormons are (mostly) pro second amendment, are there other religions that are officially so? Sure, [b]Church of Christ[/b] folks are ardently pro RKBA, as are most Southern Baptists I know! Eric The(Cambellite)Hun[>]:)] And you can put the United Methodist Church in the solidly anti-gun list (anti capitalism, freedom, and America as well) |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:03:41 AM EDT
[#14]
I am not a religous person. I was raised Catholic, but never could quite convince myself it was real. I simply live my life by a few basic principles, I treat people like I would want to be treated, keep my nose out of other people business, and help people who need it when I am able. If teher is a God, and my living my life like that is not enough for him, oh well.
That said, it amazes me the energy some people will put into fighting over religion. I have no problem with religion unless it gets to the point where it is activly trying to force me to join or disrupt my way of life (such as Islam, or even the socialist anti-gun activities of the Methodist church). Every Mormon I have ever dealt with was a stand up person who I wouldn't hesitate in a second to share a foxhole with or trust with a valuable posession. I can't say the same for some others. As far as I am concerned, if being a Mormon encourages people to become the types of individuals that I have dealt with, more power to them. Personally, I am much more concerend about the anti-gun anti-capitalism pro-socialism and wealth redistribution stance and actvities of the Methodist Church than I am about anything the LDS church is doing. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:26:44 AM EDT
[#15]
Allah (not GOD by the way) is well pleased in your attacks on the LDS religion. He loves it when Christians are persecuited, especially by other Christians.
Keep up the good work. Lebrew |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:34:21 AM EDT
[#16]
There are two types of people in the "gun culture":
(1) Those who love freedom and want everyone to be able run their own lives as they see fit; (2) Those who are weak and fearful at heart, who are attracted to weapons as another way to to dominate and control others who are not exactly like them. Thank you for identifying yourselves. Like my new sig line? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:42:32 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted: Allah (not GOD by the way) is well pleased in your attacks on the LDS religion. He loves it when Christians are persecuited, especially by other Christians. Keep up the good work. Lebrew well, there are *many* christians, jews, and muslims who will assert that the jewish, christian, and muslim God are one and the same. But you're saying they're not. Their view is exactly like that of a Mormon's, though: Same base text, with a particular addition. Christians have the NT, Mormons the BOM, Mulsims the Koran. They're all based on the OT, so they must be the same God, right? If the muslim God is different than the Christian and Jewish God, then what's to say the Mormon Jesus isn't different from the mainstream Christian Jesus? edited to clarify some of my sentences and grammar. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:43:26 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: There are two types of people in the "gun culture": (1) Those who love freedom and want everyone to be able run their own lives as they see fit; (2) Those who are weak and fearful at heart, who are attracted to weapons as another way to to dominate and control others who are not exactly like them. Thank you for identifying yourselves. Like my new sig line? I don't know that you covered all possible bases but I do think you are on to something. The fun now will be watching all the "really smart" people rationalize both aspects, their interest in firearms and their religious devotion. This is getting better and better. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:50:09 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: Quoted: ... ROFLAMO I SECOND THAT! ROFLAMO! |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 8:58:31 AM EDT
[#20]
Quoted: Quoted: Allah (not GOD by the way) is well pleased in your attacks on the LDS religion. He loves it when Christians are persecuited, especially by other Christians. Keep up the good work. Lebrew well, there are *many* christians, jews, and muslims who will assert that the jewish, christian, and muslim God are one and the same. But you're saying they're not. Their view is exactly like that of a Mormon's, though: Same base text, with a particular addition. Christians have the NT, Mormons the BOM, Mulsims the Koran. They're all based on the OT, so they must be the same God, right? If the muslim God is different than the Christian and Jewish God, then what's to say the Mormon Jesus isn't different from the mainstream Christian Jesus? edited to clarify some of my sentences and grammar. The only flaw in the logic here is that Mormons believe in the Old Testament [i]and[/i] the new testament [i]and[/i] the Book of Mormon. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:01:31 AM EDT
[#21]
As soon as you realize that you'll all one day be brought back to the one and only true Christian faith, Catholicism, the better off you will all be. [:D]
On a serious note, there was a girl in high school, Becky Smith IIRC who was hotter than a bottle of tabasco in August in Mexico. Nicest girl I ever met too. Some lucky Mormon guy got a piece o' that! Personally, I have no problems with the LDS'ers. I tell them that I'm Catholic and that usually ends the conversation. I like their pro-family, pro-2nd amendment, pro-self reliance stand. Why must we always try to alienate our friends and allies here? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:05:52 AM EDT
[#22]
Child Rapers ...
That is all... |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:13:44 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted: Child Rapers ... That is all... wow, how profound, Your wisdom enlightens us all. [rolleyes] BTW, hope you can make the next shoot, I would love to meet you. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:23:18 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted: Quoted: Child Rapers ... That is all... wow, how profound, Your wisdom enlightens us all. [rolleyes] BTW, hope you can make the next shoot, I would love to meet you. I think his comment was directed at me. And it goes to reinforce the last sentence of my last post on this thread. Sigh. If we could ever be unified and use all this useless energy against something important..... |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:38:22 AM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:The only flaw in the logic here is that Mormons believe in the Old Testament [i]and[/i] the new testament [i]and[/i] the Book of Mormon. Ditto. Christianity = You believe, Jesus the Son of God, died on the cross for your sins. You ask God to forgive you of your sins, and that is all that is needed for you to go to heaven. If you believe you need to do anything in addition to this to be "saved", then that doesn't fall in line with Christian teaching. Therefore, I still don't see how the Mormons in this thread can say they are Christian and Mormons.Again I'm basing this on what I've heard about the Mormon beliefs on this thread. The same goes for any other religion, it was said in earlier post that Catholic's are the one true Christianity, I don't know squat about Catholics or what they believe, but it would seem to me that if they believed what Christian s believe then they would be called Christians instead of Catholics. Maybe I can make my point of view clearer for any who don't understand my logic. If you say your for guns and pro 2nd Ammendment and then say your also for reasonable restrictions on guns, you are not pro gun. Does this make sense ? Maybe I didn't get enough sleep last night. 007 ________________________________________________ I don't have a liscense to kill, but I got a learners permit. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:51:07 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: Christianity = You believe, Jesus the Son of God, died on the cross for your sins. You ask God to forgive you of your sins, and that is all that is needed for you to go to heaven. If you believe you need to do anything in addition to this to be "saved", then that doesn't fall in line with Christian teaching. Therefore, I still don't see how the Mormons in this thread can say they are Christian and Mormons.Again I'm basing this on what I've heard about the Mormon beliefs on this thread. So, what you're saying is that being "Christian" or not hinges on one's definition of repentance. Mormons believe that Jesus died on the cross to give us the ability to repent. But you still have to actually [b]do[/b] it. It's not just asking. And Mormons are not the only Christians who believe this. Confession, anyone? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:58:01 AM EDT
[#27]
Quoted: The same goes for any other religion, it was said in earlier post that Catholic's are the one true Christianity, I knew I shouldn't have said that. I was trying to make a joke. I don't know squat about Catholics or what they believe, but it would seem to me that if they believed what Christian s believe then they would be called Christians instead of Catholics. Catholics are Christian, just as Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, Lutherans, etc are also Christians. Catholic is a Christian 'denomination' Maybe I can make my point of view clearer for any who don't understand my logic. If you say your for guns and pro 2nd Ammendment and then say your also for reasonable restrictions on guns, you are not pro gun. good point. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 9:58:56 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted: I was talking to some locals who had a long family history in the area, and they said it is no coincidence that their leader was in jail, shot in jail, and their temple burned. They said at this period of time they were basically worse than a modern day gang. I don't believe the got run out of their original settlement in Ohio, and then Nauvoo,IL because they were nice people. Good point GO_ARMY. Those Jews had it coming too, ask anyone in Hamburg. And the World Trade Center? Totally justified, just ask anyone in Cairo. Sound Thinking GO_ARMY. I live about an 45 minutes away from where Joseph Smith was killed. Their temple was burned down and consequently they moved out to Utah. They just spent millions of dollars to rebuild it this past year. they opened it up to tours for the public, but you had to wear special things over your shoes and you couldnt touch anything. Then after they closed the tour, they proceeded to strip out all of the carpeting and replaced it because it had been walked on by "unholy" people. I hate rich people and people who have nicer guns too. The only problem I have with them, is that their commericials on TV are very convincing . . . [Note: this post contains sarcasm] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:07:28 AM EDT
[#29]
Gods word is consistant in the Old Testament, the New Testament and the Book of Mormon(the other Testament of Jesus Christ). Where is the
messiah in the Koran? Lebrew |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:13:58 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: Quoted: So are Mormons not welcome here ? Are they welcome at our shoots ? No they are not. While we are at it here is a list of undesirables not allowed at any shoots or events organized here: 1. ALL Muslims. 2. ALL Mormons. 3. ALL Buddhists. 4. Those of Middle Eastern descent (excluding Israelis) 5. Those of Japanese descent 6. Those of African descent 7. Libertarians 8. Democrats 9. Non-heterosexuals There are more and will be added soon. 7. Libertarians I thought libertarians were cool. I thought the Liberians were the ones we didn't invite. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:19:40 AM EDT
[#31]
Quoted: Quoted: Christianity = You believe, Jesus the Son of God, died on the cross for your sins. You ask God to forgive you of your sins, and that is all that is needed for you to go to heaven. So, what you're saying is that being "Christian" or not hinges on one's definition of repentance. Mormons believe that Jesus died on the cross to give us the ability to repent. But you still have to actually [b]do[/b] it. It's not just asking. And Mormons are not the only Christians who believe this. Confession, anyone? I'm not making this up as I see fit, every person I have ever met who refers to themselves as a Christian believes this. They believe it because that's what it says in the New Testament part of the Bible. I don't know where, maybe some of the more educated on this board would be able to point you to a passage that says this. They did not, as YOU say, interpret the Word of God to mean something else by adding THEIR own definition of what repentance is. They don't need to, they have the Word of God plainly in front of them. You say; Mormons believe that Jesus died on the cross to give us the ability to repent.But you still have to actually DO it.It's not just asking. By DO it, I'm guessing that you mean, ( since you said it's not just asking and gave no definition of DO ) Do = good works to earn your way to heaven; this would not fall in line with what the Bible teaches and therefor would not fall in line with what "Christians" believe. 007 |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:31:20 AM EDT
[#32]
Quoted: And you can put the United Methodist Church in the solidly anti-gun list (anti capitalism, freedom, and America as well) There is another religion (the reader will have to figure which one for himself) that has MANY leaders who are hardcore anti-gun and their organizations appear prominently on the membership lists of HCI/BC. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:44:32 AM EDT
[#33]
Hey fellas! I've got a [size=3][b]GREAT[/b][/size=3] idea! Judy's got a barn, and we've all got lots of guns & ammo,
[center][size=3][b]Let's put on a Holy War![/b][/size=3][/center] We can sell tickets in the neighborhood, and divide up the neat stuff of the participants that don't survive! Waddaya say? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:46:44 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: There are two types of people in the "gun culture": (1) Those who love freedom and want everyone to be able run their own lives as they see fit; (2) Those who are weak and fearful at heart, who are attracted to weapons as another way to to dominate and control others who are not exactly like them. Thank you for identifying yourselves. I've said it before and I'll say it again. There are a lot of people and ideas represented here that I fear more than the antis'. At least armed though I know they may spout but will not chance 'doing anything about it' for fear of an armed responce, no matter how tough they talk. These days organized religion brings out the worst in people. I didnt join my faith to act out 'savage Darwinism', kill or be killed. I will fight in the name of my faith only in the face of aggression, and I will never deny someone's right to believe or worship so long as it does not restrict my right to the same. Its all about control. Toujours fidèle, mon ami Aqil. Toujours Fidèle. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:57:24 AM EDT
[#35]
Considering your post count you are very opinionated. Obviously, you are not interested in endearing yourself to the membership.
Quoted: I dont post often but I read almost daily and always fight the good fight against gun control and our freedoms. No, you don't post at all. Almost all of the members I know NEVER slander other religions or other beliefs, we just dont believe they are true. I don't see a lot of slandering going on here. Please people the reason those young men and women are out there is because they have found something in their lives the believe in passionately and just want to share with you not because they have nothing better to do. So, there is no way the mission is one of those "works" required to make points with God? You see, when you have something based on works, as opposed to grace, it's easy for people to accuse you of doing things solely to make points with God. Call me a cynic. Why on earth would you want disown, disassosiate, and disband us from your ranks, because a few guys were trying to share something with you that changed their lives while you were downloading porn while your family was gone is beyond me. What the hell are you talking about? "Disown, disassociate, and disband?" Who the hell said that? As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people who practive monogamy for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] It reaffirms my belief that the gun culture, those who believe in firearms for our preservation of freedoms and because we just love guns, shooting and hearing things go BOOM are held back, ridiculed by the media, and are made to look bad by the few such as yourself. We're more likely to look bad if you bring 13 wives to the next shoot than for anything said here. I'm barely 24, a big time gun freak, firm in my beliefs of God and Country, don't think I'm even close to perfect or even that us Mormons are perfect (far from it, like over there far from it) but I think we pretty dang good neighboors. No disagreement here. Believe what ya want, discuss religion on another site, but dont start picking a fight with your own side when the leads flying, not a good policy. So, now you have the right to dictate what gets discussed here? Talk about ego. I can't believe it. One post and talking smack like some DUer. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 10:58:46 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: I'm not making this up as I see fit, every person I have ever met who refers to themselves as a Christian believes this. They believe it because that's what it says in the New Testament part of the Bible. I don't know where, maybe some of the more educated on this board would be able to point you to a passage that says this. They did not, as YOU say, interpret the Word of God to mean something else by adding THEIR own definition of what repentance is. They don't need to, they have the Word of God plainly in front of them. You say; Mormons believe that Jesus died on the cross to give us the ability to repent.But you still have to actually DO it.It's not just asking. By DO it, I'm guessing that you mean, ( since you said it's not just asking and gave no definition of DO ) Do = good works to earn your way to heaven; this would not fall in line with what the Bible teaches and therefor would not fall in line with what "Christians" believe. 007 *ahem* How about this one. Book of James, Chapter 2. 14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17 [b]Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.[/b] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:16:49 AM EDT
[#37]
You seem to be implying that I said somewhere that Christians don't believe they need to be good people. They in fact do believe they need to be good people; just not to get to heaven. In fact most of the ones I have met who openly refer to themselves as "Christians" think they they are better people than most other people. That's why I think alot of people are put off by the "Christian" belief. As was stated earlier, alot (not all) of churches that base their faith on the Bible are very cult like in the sense that they feel superior to everyone, and are constantly judging people according to their standards....the Bible says "Judge not, less ye be judged first" 007 |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:20:05 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted: *ahem* How about this one. Book of James, Chapter 2. 14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17 [b]Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.[/b] Or this one: Ephesians, Chapter 1 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. Therefore, it is by grace, not works that you are saved. You are called to do good works, and doing otherwise is disobedience. But those good works are not what bring about your salvation. Being disobedient CAN cause you to be rejected, however, with this exception: "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land (2Chr7:14)." |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:26:50 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted: As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people with monogamous relationships for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] ROFLMAO!! |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:30:56 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted: Therefore, it is by grace, not works that you are saved. You are called to do good works, and doing otherwise is disobedience. But those good works are not what bring about your salvation. Being disobedient CAN cause you to be rejected, however, with this exception: "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land (2Chr7:14)." I don't see where the disagreement is here. You're saying that both are required, because God has commanded it. That's what I've been saying this whole time. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:32:49 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: Quoted: I don't know squat about Catholics or what they believe, but it would seem to me that if they believed what Christian s believe then they would be called Christians instead of Catholics. Catholics are Christian, just as Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, Lutherans, etc are also Christians. Catholic is a Christian 'denomination' Thanks for taking the time to clear that up for me. But now I'm confused about 'denomination', do they just put their own spin on things or what ? 007 |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:34:27 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: Quoted: As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people with monogamous relationships for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] ROFLMAO!! soooo, is his statement funny because it's a lie and you're laughing at his stupidity or are you laughing because you're stupid and don't know any better ?? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:36:39 AM EDT
[#43]
"Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only" (James 2: 24)
"And behold, one came to Him and said, "Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?" And He said to him, "Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments." Matthew, 19, 16-17. On the other hand: "nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we may be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified." Galatians 2:16 "because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin...For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law." Romans 3:20,28. "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, that no one should boast."Ephesians, 2:8-9. Gee, there seems to be a contradiction in the text. Before we continue this dicussion, can someone please get clarification from the author(s)? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:40:14 AM EDT
[#44]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people with monogamous relationships for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] ROFLMAO!! soooo, is his statement funny because it's a lie and you're laughing at his stupidity or are you laughing because you're stupid and don't know any better ?? I was laughing at the first sentence mainly but found the whole to be amusing.But hey feel free to call me names. 007 |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:46:37 AM EDT
[#45]
In SPECTRE's mind, truth = stupidity. [whacko]
Are you saying the Mormon church does not allow polygamy? Are you forgetting the reason why they were kicked out of the East in the first place? Could it be because polygamy was, and is still today, considered a sin and is illegal in every state? Hmm...??? |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:47:21 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people with monogamous relationships for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] ROFLMAO!! soooo, is his statement funny because it's a lie and you're laughing at his stupidity or are you laughing because you're stupid and don't know any better ?? I was laughing at the first sentence mainly but found the whole to be amusing.But hey feel free to call me names. 007 Someone posts a lie and you find it "amusing" ?? how intelligent. [rolleyes] |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 11:53:09 AM EDT
[#47]
Quoted: In SPECTRE's mind, truth = stupidity. [whacko] [red]Are you saying the Mormon church does not allow polygamy? [/red] Are you forgetting the reason why they were kicked out of the East in the first place? Could it be because polygamy was, and is still today, considered a sin and is illegal in every state? Hmm...??? In mattja's mind truth is found in ignorance. Yes, I am saying that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints does not allow polygamy. Maybe you should do some research before you shoot yourself in the foot. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 12:11:09 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted: Quoted: As to your latter point, hey, if I could have 12 wives I wouldn't be downloading porn either! You guys have all the sexual variety you want, sanctioned by your church noless, and then condemn people with monogamous relationships for downloading pictures of nekkid hotties? Hypocrite! [:)] ROFLMAO!! I realize that was mostly in jest, but you've got me in debate mode, and I like dispelling myths. From [url]http://www.mormon.org/question/faq/category/answer/0,9777,1601-1-114-3,00.html[/url]: Question: What is the Church’s position on polygamy? Answer: In 1998, President Gordon B. Hinckley made the following statement about the Church's position on plural marriage: "This Church has nothing whatever to do with those practicing polygamy. They are not members of this Church. . . . If any of our members are found to be practicing plural marriage, they are excommunicated, the most serious penalty the Church can impose. Not only are those so involved in direct violation of the civil law, they are in violation of the law of this Church." At various times, the Lord has commanded His people to practice plural marriage. For example, He gave this command to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, David, and Solomon (Doctrine and Covenants 132:1). In this dispensation, the Lord commanded some of the early Saints to practice plural marriage. The Prophet Joseph Smith and those closest to him, including Brigham Young and Heber C. Kimball, were challenged by this command, but they obeyed it. Church leaders regulated the practice. Those entering into it had to be authorized to do so, and the marriages had to be performed through the sealing power of the priesthood. In 1890, President Wilford Woodruff received a revelation that the leaders of the Church should cease teaching the practice of plural marriage (Official Declaration 1). You people have me talking like I'm still an active member, which is rather interesting. Again I will point out, that I'm not. I do lots of things that conflict with the LDS church, which I won't go into here. However, I have this nasty habit of trying to make things right that I think are wrong. Misstating a religion's beliefs is one of those things. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 12:34:21 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I don't know squat about Catholics or what they believe, but it would seem to me that if they believed what Christian s believe then they would be called Christians instead of Catholics. Catholics are Christian, just as Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, Lutherans, etc are also Christians. Catholic is a Christian 'denomination' Thanks for taking the time to clear that up for me. But now I'm confused about 'denomination', do they just put their own spin on things or what ? 007 I don't think "spin" is the correct word to use. Each denomination may have a different understanding on what the Bible instructs us to do. IMO, all Christians seek to reach the top of the mountain (relationship with Christ and an eternal life within him) but we are all walking different paths. Actually, if you overlook some of the little differences, we are all remarkably similar. I have a lot of respect and love for my Christian bretheren of other denominations. They still are my brothers. |
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Posted: 10/28/2002 12:41:29 PM EDT
[#50]
Quoted: I realize that was mostly in jest, but you've got me in debate mode, and I like dispelling myths. You must not be Mormon, because you got the joke. [:)] Nonetheless, it's fun to torment SPECTRE. [}:D] |
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