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Posted: 8/14/2006 11:46:51 AM EDT
[#1]
As long as the Chicoms buy our .gov paper. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 11:46:52 AM EDT
[#2]
Along those lines I heard that Hezbola has declared a sweeping victory in this cease fire. It seems in order to have them actually lose you have to kill anyone who could speak and declare victory after the war. I envision a lone gunman with an arm missing "monty python" style and a bandanna over his face wading through piles of his dead (all dead but him) comrades and declaring a decisive victory over whoever. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 11:48:52 AM EDT
[#3]
And you were the one claiming you "told me so", implying that I had disagreed with you. Jeeeez! You're in turbo-red-herring mode today. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 11:51:17 AM EDT
[#4]
Well said. It would certainly be no nation in which I would wish to live. I find myself agreeing more and more with you tc556guy - what is going on here? |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 11:52:47 AM EDT
[#5]
You are both nuts? |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 12:38:53 PM EDT
[#6]
Ahhh name calling again. "I told you so" does NOT mean I disagreed with you. It means we covered this ground before. I never said we "disagreed", hell I never even said you were wrong. I simply REMINDED you that we had in fact covered this ground before. You seemed to not know what I was talking about so I posted the link so you would know. Then you commenced to name calling...but you've done that before too. The problem would appear to be the fact that you are determined to see me as "the enemy." I was critical of Israel, so being of a racists mindset (all Jews are the same and if you criticize Israel you are anti semetic) you deemed me a racist. As a result of that adopted mindset you see ANY comment I make as contradictory and attempt to apply an adversarial connotation to it. In short you are always looking for a fight. As a result of that racist mindset, like any other racist, your assumptions are clouding your ability to see when a person actually agrees with you. And this is why you persist with name calling like Pali Boy, Red Herring Boy, etc. Perhaps if you painted a swastika on my business and broke my windows you would feel better. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 12:40:14 PM EDT
[#7]
Well it seems he doesn't think we are much different than terrorists. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=490222&page=7 |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 12:53:59 PM EDT
[#8]
In my language (the English language), person A usually says the phrase "I told you so" when they want to remind person B that person B was wrong about something, and to remind person B that they were offered advice by person A which was not taken by person B. Of course, redefining the English language is a common tactic that you use in debates, and therefor is not surprising in the least. You are so predicable. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 12:55:40 PM EDT
[#9]
+1 Everyone is chicken little. Enjoy life, damn. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 1:03:43 PM EDT
[#10]
Only to address the situation 5 or 10 years later when it's a lot worse? Allow an enemy that has sworn to destroy our way of life to strengthen while we worry about illegals only? Ignoring it will only make it a lot worse eventually. This is the denial attitude that weakens the war on terror in my opinion. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 1:05:50 PM EDT
[#11]
I tend to believe they're the bad guys and the u.s. is right, I don't care what they think. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 1:17:17 PM EDT
[#12]
Exactly, now wheres the oil, and dont forget to be afraid, the terror level is orange today!! BOO! |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 1:47:46 PM EDT
[#13]
We had no hitman squad composed of Sunnis that could have taken him out with our blessing and help of a dozen of 155mm shells...and taken all the blame for it. Sad. 
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Posted: 8/14/2006 2:09:59 PM EDT
[#14]
You can't win a war against an abstract concept. You'll never win the "War On Terror", "War on Drugs" or "War on Poverty". It's impossible. What we can win at is war on nations or organizations. "Terror" does not have a locality or uniform and can never be defeated.
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Posted: 8/14/2006 2:35:45 PM EDT
[#15]
In its essence? No. But tell me what true military officers we have in office, as ALL their politicians were required in those days? And where can we point to their future-telling that states would be as divided as they are now? Or that political influence, party influence, demographic separation, world trading, and the ease of corruption we face today? You have to remember context. Why do I think they made that decision? Easy. Because at that time, any true leader was proven in battle - willing to proudly die, if necessary, in the belief of the nation he was charged with from the front lines. The more honor the man had, the more he was likely to lead this nation, which, at that time, was led by its military. Look at the 2nd we so often tout here in the name of personal freedom: weren't we ALL the militia back then? Certainly a militia needed a tried and true combat leader to direct their actions and decisions. And back then, dissention of the government's wishes would have been incredibly minimal. Why? Becuse we had this value we call trust. <shrug> Tell me one politician you have 100% trust in that would die for this country leading troops to protect our doctrines. They don't exist anymore, but they did at one time. And at that time, they had earned the right to be called our commander in chief. Now they just buy their way into the slot under the guise of the interests of the country. While the politicians of today prosecute the military standing our watch, like Col. North. Hey, someone has to be the scapegoat for the corruption and lies, yes? |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 2:49:47 PM EDT
[#16]
Why don't you relate what I said correctly. The comment that I was replying to was that the "terrorists" are outside the mainstream thinking. I said the same could be said of many here, which is true. I did not say that people here are terrorists. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 2:52:25 PM EDT
[#17]
Shooting at people who are shooting at us IS a rule, and one I could live with. Going in and , for instance, lining up a villages inhabitants and shooting all of them in order to get the one combatant hiding against them ( as a for instance) would be wrong. Yet some here would say "thats fine, mow them all down, they'll just have more kids to replace the people who are dead". |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 2:57:09 PM EDT
[#18]
Another person who has managed to dehumanize an entire group for the actions of a per centage of that population. If someone in particular has commited criminal acts then yes, what they have done might very well be barbaric and inhumane. They should be made to answer for what they did...individually. That does not make them any less human. You do not dehumanize the adversary in some attempt to make yourself better able to kill members of his/ her population. Haven't we learned from the mistakes of our past when we did that to previous enemies? As much as some of you claim to think with open minds nad make your own decisions, you seem awfully ready to cluster into some hive/mob mentality when its convenient for you to do so. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:20:43 PM EDT
[#19]
There you go again. "I told you so" is about the same as "I told you this would happen." It does NOT mean I disagreed with you. Example: You say "Those fuckers blew somebody up." I reply "They'll do it again." Fast forward 2 weeks. You say "Jesus those fuckers blew somebody up." I reply "I told you so." In the EXACT usage of my post on the original topic "I TOLD YOU" that Bush would sandbag Israel and you would be here posting about it. You agreed. You are now here posting about it and "I told you so." But please continue calling me names and stating that I am "redefining the English language." |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:25:20 PM EDT
[#20]
That is a pretty little speech. But meaningless when the missiles are in the air. The only thing waiting will do is give them time to build nuclear warheads. Getting all warm and fuzzy about people who may have to die is not good discipline. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:26:02 PM EDT
[#21]
We havent lost, until were all dead.
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:30:47 PM EDT
[#22]
Its not surprising that the two terrorist apologists are agreeing. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:31:59 PM EDT
[#23]
Do you want to be "Different" ? Or do you want to win? |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 3:42:18 PM EDT
[#24]
Have you blown your load tonight thinking about killing Muslim children, or is this foreplay for you? 
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Posted: 8/14/2006 4:02:50 PM EDT
[#25]
I want to win! The time has come for us to recognize that our current "nice guy" strategy against our Islamofacist enemies is not working. We are not taking this Islamofacist threat seriously enough. I don't see any planning by our leaders that will give any degree of certainty that the way of life America has come to know, will be secure for the next 25 years, much less for the next 1000 years. I see more importance placed on our moral integrity as a nation, than on keeping our nation safe. We are not dealing with people that are reasonable or willing to compromise to gain peace. Given that fact, we need to take extreme measures to defeat them. We can always return to our moral values after it's over, just as we did after WWII. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 4:22:14 PM EDT
[#26]
A HUGE SAD +1  I live about an Hour and a half from NYC( UPSTATE) some of you have never been to NY and seen the WTC's... People that were weeping and Gnashing their teeth a couple of years ago are walking past those holes without a second glance now....
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Posted: 8/14/2006 4:25:47 PM EDT
[#27]
You need to start caring what "they" think. You don't just win by beating an adversary into the ground, you win by winning over the hearts and minds of those who oppose you. Not caring what is in the heads of the opponent, or of their view of you, only assures that there will be fresh enemy personnel to oppose you. Of course you think you are right, just as they think they are right to oppose what they see as centuries of Western encroachment. It is not being an apologist to try to see the adversary without the lens of propoganda that so many of you choose to view them through. As for TheDoctors comment about agreeing with me, I wonder why I hear the same question everytime someone admits they agree with me on something. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 4:31:58 PM EDT
[#28]
How are we different? We don't want a fight, we want to live and let live. We would be more than happy to leave them to their own devices, just as long as they wouldn't threaten us or our interests... But they want war - they attacked us - so I say we give them everything we've got. To HELL with "proportionality" and "measured responses". If they hide among the civilian population and we're forced to bomb them, it would a damn shame, but the blood would be on their hands, not ours.
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Posted: 8/14/2006 6:06:51 PM EDT
[#29]
We tried to win the hearts and minds in Iraq and look what it got us. Iraq is about to explode into civil war and we are going to have to either bring in a few hundred thousand troops to contain the situation, or we are going to have to abandon the cause and call it quits. We are dealing with savages that are living in the 7th century. The only thing they understand is a fooking club upside the head. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 6:42:23 PM EDT
[#30]
You are completely wrong, dhimmi. Did we care about winning the "hearts and minds" of the Japanese in WW2? How about the Italians and the Germans? No! We inflicted horrific destruction on the germans and Japanese. We demanded unconditional surrender. This was a righteous and moral course of action by the United States. The enemy capitulated and rolled over on his back. We moved in and imposed our will. We wrote their new constitution, gave it to them, and said, "here is how you'll live, now." ONLY THEN did we start to rebuild them and by doing so "win their hearts and minds." You, my little equivocating, hand-wringing apologist, don't understand what it will take to win this. fortunately other, more serious men do. Hopefully those men will get their chance. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 6:48:27 PM EDT
[#31]
With the Western Mindset ( Germans Japanese WWII ) it was about akin to Pain Compliance, when they had had enough they finally accepted defeat
( I realize small elements of Germans and Japanese continued the fight, but as a Nation they ceased hostilities ) With AL Q, Hezbollah and other Terror Cells only destroying them will work |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 7:03:51 PM EDT
[#32]
tc556guy and thedoctors308 have not come to realise that it is impossible to reason with the unreasonable.
Those savages have only one thing on their hearts and minds - The absolute destruction of Western Culture, and if need be, their own self immolation to achieve that goal. They will not stop until they succeed or die trying. Soon, those unreasonable savages will have nuclear weapons. I have no doubt they WILL use nuclear weapons against Isreal and the US as soon as they are able. I pray our leaders have the courage required to do what MUST be done before we lose one or two cities and several million Americans to islamic nuclear attacks. This game is for ALL of the marbels. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:04:03 PM EDT
[#33]
Tell you what, you go win the hearts and minds of the islamic fanatics for us then. I'm certain this jihad religous thing they claim is propaganda and they really just want someone to listen to them. You'll be that person. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:06:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Of course, because obviously the Israelis couldn't possibly have fucked this one up on their own, so we must 'blame America'.  What a useless crock of shit you are peddling. Look to Israel for why Israel lost its little battle with Hezbollah. Blaming America is nothing but idiotic escapism. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:13:40 PM EDT
[#35]
I already KNOW what they think. That is why I no longer care. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:28:40 PM EDT
[#36]
They think that if you don't convert to islam, you are either to be made a slave or to be killed. The amount of profound left wing dribble your thinking is consumed with makes me wonder if you need help tieing your shoes. Did we give a shit about what the Nazi's thought? Did we give a shit about what the Soviet Communists thought? Did we seek to have a cozy lunch with Goebbels so we could feel his pain about how he thought all the world's evil came from the Jews? See, you come from a land where they don't believe in Good and Evil, where all world views are equally valid. In that bullshit place, everyone is a victim and calling evil people evil is mean spirited and may make someone cry. When you get nut kicked in a street fight and the thug is pulling out his blade to finish you off, its too late to cry about not how you were playing by the rules and he wasn't. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:47:05 PM EDT
[#37]
Your approach is simply WRONG. Let's crunch some numbers...... 6,534,724,949 (6.5billion) people in the world www.census.gov/main/www/popclock.html 64.77 years life expectancy 64 years, 281 days..... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy#Variations_in_life_expectancy_in_the_world_today Using that math 23,657 days of life expectancy worldwide Divide people by days of life expectancy...... Approx: 276,228 people die every single day.....(obviously this is an estimate) What does that tell you? It's not about reducing them to non-people (your words). It's about realizing that people are worthless as a whole and we are all going to die. From my agnostic view point, exterminating EVERY Muslim (note not Arab- being Muslim is a choice) on the planet would probably save far more lives in the long run then not...........Many would call it a sick viewpoint but sometimes the truth hurts.........Am I saying killing every Muslim would be the best plan? Nope and I'm sure with a little thought a better one could be thought up............I'm just stating what I see......... Here's another ball-buster, there's 299million people in the U.S. from that same link......... with a life expectancy of 77 years 329 days.....28,124 www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lifexpec.htm people divided by days: 10,631 people dieing every day.......I guess the only difference with September 11th was their families received over a million dollars that none of ours will get unless we provided it ourselves........ |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:52:33 PM EDT
[#38]
No offense but how many people in our country can name 3 people that died in the attack? I'm going to guess it's far less then 1%.........Could you name 3 without surfing for the info right now? If not is it possible you don't care as much as you pretend on an internet forum? I'm not saying that I can name 3- I can't name 1.......... This country was built off the backs of millions of great people and all we've done is insult them with the way we've run the country they handed us........ |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 8:55:31 PM EDT
[#39]
You will never win the hearts and minds of anyone unless you treat them as equals. That would entitle giving them our standard of living. Something that is not only impossible but a ridiculous assertion that it should be our responsibility. Do you truly feel that they will be thankful when you increase their wages from $1 a day to $2 a day when they see what we have? Greed and wanting what other's have is human nature.........I think the war in Iraq has already proven how ridiculous the 'hearts and mind' strategy is. |
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Posted: 8/14/2006 9:20:29 PM EDT
[#40]
another +1 basiclly what i was going to type I do think somewhere sometime they ROPers will push too far and maybe finally awake the sleeping giant again you would think 3000 people would be enough but unfortuneatly i think it will take the loss of a entire city |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 4:05:58 AM EDT
[#41]
Typical red-herring debate tactics from you. I never said "Israel lost it's little battle w/ Hezbullah". Point to my quote where I said Israel was beaten by Hezbollah. There is a much bigger issue here that you can't seem to grasp. The victory I spoke of for the terrorists is not about the Israeli vs. Hezbulloh war, it's about the fact that terrorists were allowed to live, exist & rearm, when they should have been exterminated. World opinion, US pressure and the UN forced Israel to withdraw before the job was finished. This was a victory for the global terrorism. Here's one example of the US meddling and pressure placed on Israel. But since you are in constant contact with GWB and Condi, maybe you can let us in on what you know. US pressure prompts delay of offensive |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 8:56:08 AM EDT
[#42]
I think we know how to fight it with honor, as we ALWAYS have. The real problem is how do you prevent the victory that was won by the military from being stolen by the media? I read the other thread and agree completely. no matter how well we win the war, the media turns the public perception to a loss and that's what history records, not how well we were doing, but that in the end we pulled and ran because we were "losing"... |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 9:36:49 AM EDT
[#43]
While agree with you mostly, I have to argue a couple points: No, we had already turned the tide and nuked Hiroshima and Nagasaki to finish the war immediately and decisively instead of letting it drag out another two or three years it would have taken to finish them off in a conventional manner. regardless if you believe it to be right or wrong morally, that was the call that was made... It's real easy for most of us here at ARFCOM to understand, unfortunately most of America and the rest of the world doesn't care enough to get the truth, they watch CNN and believe the B.S. they see there... Just like in Vietnam, when they turn enough of the poopulation(was going to correct the typo but decided I liked the typo better...) against the war then the politicians in charge of the millitary buckle and do a cut and run away from a near total victory... And finally, I completely and totally agree with this!!! |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 1:02:12 PM EDT
[#44]
My reply is my .sig line.
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Posted: 8/15/2006 1:42:25 PM EDT
[#45]
You just can't bring yourself to admit that Israel botched this one from the start, can you? America! The UN! The opinion of people in Belgium! ANYTHING but piss-poor leadership from Olmert and subpar performance from the IDF. Well, hopelly the Israelis and the IDF learn some lessons from all this; I know you won't.
Gosh, so the evil Americans stepped in and told Israel not to botch the ceasefire agreement that the Israelis said they wanted? Golly, if only Israel didn't fuck around with border-raids and airstrikes for 30 days... 'Blame America' truly is the battle-cry of idiots around the world, and right here at Arfcom. |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 1:54:28 PM EDT
[#46]
And I canot agree with someone who holds your views, no matter which side of the dispute you are on. |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 2:42:22 PM EDT
[#47]
It is clear a large portion of the Middle East is brainwashed. Their children are like our children, until they get fed into the Saudi funded schools called madrases, get taught to hate, and come the other side wanting to engage in jihad and kill the infidels. The grown up ones are probably beyond hope, since you can't really reason with brainwashed folks - folks who strap bombs on themselves and get on schoolbusses cannot be reasoned with - only a complete fool would think it worth the time and effort. Destroying the schools will be the only way to solve the problem. It is complete bullshit to believe sitting down and trying to understand these brainwashed MF'ers will do one bit of good. This same goofball philosophy has resulted in more deaths than it has ever saved. It is not, I repeat not important to understand their thinking. We know what they think. There is NO MIDDLE GROUND between our civilization and theirs - they want to take us over, just as the Nazi's did. Damn, some folks have a severe case of their head up their butt. |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 2:44:52 PM EDT
[#48]
The very wording indicates you believe there is some validity to Hezbollah's views. You are beyond hope. Sometimes a group of people may actually be what is known as "wrong" or "evil", words that seem to be absent from your vocabulary. |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 3:51:30 PM EDT
[#49]
If you're going to quote me.....at least include the whole quote and don't take parts out of context. THANKS!...........My views are the realistic view of an informed individual-yours are those of brainwashed sheep so of course we won't agree....... |
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Posted: 8/15/2006 3:52:37 PM EDT
[#50]
+1 Death of a non combatant is UNFORNUNATE and SAD,not immoral. It would be immoral in the case of going in a known room of innocents and mowing them down as discussed but sadly to win a war and protect our very existance innocents dying in Iraq or whereever is inevitable. The firebombing and the two Nukes in WW2 was necessary to win,less you would speaking german right now. |
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