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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:07:07 PM EDT
[#1]
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Lol I was just asking myself the exact same question. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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overhead enclosure diving is incredibly dangerous. At 194 ft as well? Fuck that. RIP Cavern diving is extremely dangerous....you need certification...tons of experience...and triple redundant safety along with backup divers ready to rescue....with a well practiced plan in place. Sounds like a place where permanent safety cables leading in an out are not in place? http://www.tamug.edu/cavebiology/Bahamas/caves/images/GuardianMap.jpg Whole lotta NOPE in that picture. Gotta love all those squeeze points... And the question marks are just so comforting. How the hell does that giant section support itself with no bottom and basically no top connection. Am I looking at it wrong? Lol I was just asking myself the exact same question. Not the same Blue Hole. The Guardian Blue Hole is in the Bahamas. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:18:41 PM EDT
[#2]
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You are quite correct. He's a dumbass for considering thrill seeking to be more important than his family. That's okay, his family can have a garage sale and sell off all his cave diving junk. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Wonder if he got that sinking feeling at some point Obviously, you are not a diver. You obviously are not funny either. Your butthurt and avatart are very funny. You seem bends out of shape. Really. This isn't some dumb ass who brought his kid with him or deserves a Darwin award or was committing a crime. It's a 43 year old explorer with a family. That guilt that you must have somewhere deep down at piling on and posting something you can't possibly think is funny... I'd listen to it. You are quite correct. He's a dumbass for considering thrill seeking to be more important than his family. That's okay, his family can have a garage sale and sell off all his cave diving junk. agree 100%, do stupid shit when you are young, single and with no one depending on you..doing stupid shit with a family is fucking retarded. And I would also put MC in this category, I rode, I loved it..I also realized that being alive, able to provide and be there for your family instead of dead or a vegetable and being a drain to them is more important |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:22:18 PM EDT
[#3]
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So, do you think making jokes about someone's death is good sport or appropriate? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Wonder if he got that sinking feeling at some point Obviously, you are not a diver. You obviously are not funny either. Your butthurt and avatart are very funny. You seem bends out of shape. So, do you think making jokes about someone's death is good sport or appropriate? was it an accident or a choice to go into a confined space 200 feet below the water line? |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:27:36 PM EDT
[#4]
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was it an accident or a choice to go into a confined space 200 feet below the water line? And just because some people are scared of their own mangina farts doesn't mean everyone is. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:28:24 PM EDT
[#5]
There ain't a rock in the fucking universe that's so pretty that I want to die staring at it in a water-filled hole.
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:49:45 PM EDT
[#6]
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There ain't a rock in the fucking universe that's so pretty that I want to die staring at it in a water-filled hole. Had a patient die yesterday moving a coffee table. Shit happens. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:51:10 PM EDT
[#7]
Of all the things that I want to do in life. Cave diving is not one of them.
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Posted: 4/3/2016 5:56:25 PM EDT
[#8]
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Of all the things that I want to do in life. Cave diving is not one of them. Wreck diving is much better |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:02:39 PM EDT
[#9]
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it was quite plainly an accident. To question that is beyond retarded. And just because some people are scared of their own mangina farts doesn't mean everyone is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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was it an accident or a choice to go into a confined space 200 feet below the water line? And just because some people are scared of their own mangina farts doesn't mean everyone is. no he chose to put himself in that situation, no one else. Wild idea-don't go into caves and you won't drown in a cave ETA: lol, fear and stupidity are pretty much mutually exclusive in this situation, I did plenty of non mangina fart fearing stuff...when I was ..young..single, with no one else depending upon me...grow the fuck up or take no responsibility |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:11:59 PM EDT
[#10]
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Been posted here before, but an interesting read about another experienced cave diver. http://www.outsideonline.com/1922711/raising-dead Quote HistoryQuoted:
Been posted here before, but an interesting read about another experienced cave diver. http://www.outsideonline.com/1922711/raising-dead Ten minutes into his dive, Dave Shaw started to look for the bottom. Utter blackness pressed in on him from all sides, and he directed his high-intensity light downward, hoping for a flash of rock or mud. Shaw, a 50-year-old Aussie, was in an alien world, more than 800 feet below the surface pool that marks the entrance to Bushman's Hole, a remote sinkhole in the Northern Cape province of South Africa and the third-deepest freshwater cave known to man. Man what a read... I lost my dad to a scuba diving accident when I was 20. Off the coast of California. That story was a tough read, but I'm glad I did. Thanks for posting it. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:22:38 PM EDT
[#11]
I've been SCUBA diving for over 15 years.
Cave diving scares the shit out of me. I have zero interest in it. Even with tons of training, shitloads of experience, excellent equipment, etc. - exploring unmapped caves (especially at considerable depth) is a ridiculously dangerous activity. People who do it have huge balls - but it's more predictable than tragic when they die. Sort of like aggressive base jumpers or free divers. They are pushing the limits, and sometimes the limit pushed back hard. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:29:59 PM EDT
[#12]
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Caves are not a no, they are a HELL NO. I feel bad for the family, glad they at least recovered the body quickly. In the other thread there was a video of a guy who went down to recover another divers body quite some time after the first diver died. The second diver died while trying to recover the body. On video Several days later they both floated up to depths where they were much easier to recover |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:31:11 PM EDT
[#13]
So what happens when your tank runs out. of oxygen. I assume you try to breath but its like someone has their hand over your mouth. Is that correct?
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:32:12 PM EDT
[#14]
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I've been SCUBA diving for over 15 years. Cave diving scares the shit out of me. I have zero interest in it. Even with tons of training, shitloads of experience, excellent equipment, etc. - exploring unmapped caves (especially at considerable depth) is a ridiculously dangerous activity. People who do it have huge balls - but it's more predictable than tragic when they die. Sort of like aggressive base jumpers or free divers. They are pushing the limits, and sometimes the limit pushed back hard. Exploring mapped cave systems with a main line isn't that big of a deal. There is a world of difference between Peacock and where this guy died. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:33:56 PM EDT
[#15]
Man Sticks Hand in Bear Trap; Trap Closes on Wrist
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:34:37 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In the other thread there was a video of a guy who went down to recover another divers body quite some time after the first diver died. The second diver died while trying to recover the body. On video Several days later they both floated up to depths where they were much easier to recover Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Caves are not a no, they are a HELL NO. I feel bad for the family, glad they at least recovered the body quickly. In the other thread there was a video of a guy who went down to recover another divers body quite some time after the first diver died. The second diver died while trying to recover the body. On video Several days later they both floated up to depths where they were much easier to recover Was the link I posted a few pages back. I watched a little of the video, it is out there. Pretty damn hard to watch. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:34:55 PM EDT
[#17]
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The #1 nope tied with being on-fire. I'd take death by fire and be happy about it 
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:36:17 PM EDT
[#18]
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Expense. It adds a lot of complexity and requires more proficiency than tanks. Tanks are simple and reliable. Consider that most divers don't dive all that often, like myself. If I cleaned my stuff before I put it away a few months ago there is an excellent chance my gauges and Scuba Pro Mk25/600 is going to work just fine. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Why do people still use air tanks? Don't they have rebreathers and things now that take the oxygen from the water? Expense. It adds a lot of complexity and requires more proficiency than tanks. Tanks are simple and reliable. Consider that most divers don't dive all that often, like myself. If I cleaned my stuff before I put it away a few months ago there is an excellent chance my gauges and Scuba Pro Mk25/600 is going to work just fine. Don't they also need certain mixes at depth? M not sure but how would a breather work in those situations? |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:37:31 PM EDT
[#19]
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That picture is a cross-section. Think of it like a skywalk between two buildings. So much nope in cave diving. Just thinking about it in the safety of my own home here is raising my blood pressure. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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How the hell does that giant section support itself with no bottom and basically no top connection. Am I looking at it wrong? That picture is a cross-section. Think of it like a skywalk between two buildings. So much nope in cave diving. Just thinking about it in the safety of my own home here is raising my blood pressure. Gotcha |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:39:24 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't they also need certain mixes at depth? M not sure but how would a breather work in those situations? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Why do people still use air tanks? Don't they have rebreathers and things now that take the oxygen from the water? Expense. It adds a lot of complexity and requires more proficiency than tanks. Tanks are simple and reliable. Consider that most divers don't dive all that often, like myself. If I cleaned my stuff before I put it away a few months ago there is an excellent chance my gauges and Scuba Pro Mk25/600 is going to work just fine. Don't they also need certain mixes at depth? M not sure but how would a breather work in those situations? Yeah, I cannot really comment on how the rebreather handles it. Anything below about 300 and you have to get into some real exotic mixes and they change as your depth changes. Too much 02 deep is deadly. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:42:34 PM EDT
[#21]
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The #1 nope tied with being on-fire. A friend is a cave diving instructor. He's insane. NFW I would do it. I'll take the fire, Toledo. TC |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:44:27 PM EDT
[#22]
If anyone is interested in some really NOPE diving, check out "Descent into Darkness" by Edward Raymer.
http://www.amazon.com/Descent-into-Darkness-Harbor-Divers/dp/1591147247 Dude was on the Navy Dive Recovery teams at Pearl Harbor. Talks about the work they did on the ships trying to get them righted for salvage. You can imagine how tough it would be diving around a pitch black ship, upside down, in oil filed water. With dead bodies floating all around you. Absolutely riveting book |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 6:45:55 PM EDT
[#23]
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Yeah that guy that died upside down in a cave whole spelunking, fuck that. I believe water started to collect in the hole his head was stuck in as well, drowning him upside down. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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By the time Young finally found Thompson, he was already dead. Not sure how your partner has air, finds him, and dude is already dead. Panic Eta: this thread reminds me of the one awhile back about caving and cave diving. Gives me the creeps just thinking about it. Yeah that guy that died upside down in a cave whole spelunking, fuck that. I believe water started to collect in the hole his head was stuck in as well, drowning him upside down. IIRC he didn't drown. He was just upside down too long. They initially had a line attached to him and had him pulled up to the edge but the anchor pulled and he dropped and wedged in even worse. Absolutely horrible, gives me chills. If I was somehow forced to go into tight caves like that I would want one of those secret agent cyanide pills. What a terrible way to die, drowning is horrible but fairly quick. That poor guy essentially took 24+ hours to die, upside down, not able to move and in the pitch black 
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:07:32 PM EDT
[#24]
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IIRC he didn't drown. He was just upside down too long. They initially had a line attached to him and had him pulled up to the edge but the anchor pulled and he dropped and wedged in even worse. Absolutely horrible, gives me chills. If I was somehow forced to go into tight caves like that I would want one of those secret agent cyanide pills. What a terrible way to die, drowning is horrible but fairly quick. That poor guy essentially took 24+ hours to die, upside down, not able to move and in the pitch black Quote HistoryQuoted:
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By the time Young finally found Thompson, he was already dead. Not sure how your partner has air, finds him, and dude is already dead. Panic Eta: this thread reminds me of the one awhile back about caving and cave diving. Gives me the creeps just thinking about it. Yeah that guy that died upside down in a cave whole spelunking, fuck that. I believe water started to collect in the hole his head was stuck in as well, drowning him upside down. IIRC he didn't drown. He was just upside down too long. They initially had a line attached to him and had him pulled up to the edge but the anchor pulled and he dropped and wedged in even worse. Absolutely horrible, gives me chills. If I was somehow forced to go into tight caves like that I would want one of those secret agent cyanide pills. What a terrible way to die, drowning is horrible but fairly quick. That poor guy essentially took 24+ hours to die, upside down, not able to move and in the pitch black I'll take dying moving the coffee table any day. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:14:39 PM EDT
[#25]
sad
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:17:22 PM EDT
[#26]
i love caving and i want to learn to dive but i don't want to ever do both at the same time lol.
you want to feel alone turn off the lights in a cave. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:20:10 PM EDT
[#27]
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Wreck diving is much better Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Of all the things that I want to do in life. Cave diving is not one of them. Wreck diving is much better I would love to dive on a U-boat. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:21:58 PM EDT
[#28]
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A man has got to know his limitations. Tragic but there is a reason it is considered dangerous. https://jupiterdivecenter.com/wp-content/uploads/Cave-Diving.jpg >Nothing worth dying for >Loot of over 300 people, some of them high level I'm getting mixed messages here. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:29:16 PM EDT
[#29]
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I've been through Santa Rosa, total shithole. Nothing against the diver. It used to be a regular stop on my runs to visit relatives in Texas. Thought it was an interesting town, albeit a bit run down. The "Blue Hole" itself is in a nice little park just about down-town, near some fishing ponds. Lots of water there considering the location. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:29:52 PM EDT
[#30]
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If anyone is interested in some really NOPE diving, check out "Descent into Darkness" by Edward Raymer. http://www.amazon.com/Descent-into-Darkness-Harbor-Divers/dp/1591147247 Dude was on the Navy Dive Recovery teams at Pearl Harbor. Talks about the work they did on the ships trying to get them righted for salvage. You can imagine how tough it would be diving around a pitch black ship, upside down, in oil filed water. With dead bodies floating all around you. Absolutely riveting book Here you go again, Arfcom, costing me more dang money! 
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:33:37 PM EDT
[#31]
a man must know his limitations
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:34:24 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He died doing what he loved. dying aint much of a living |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:41:25 PM EDT
[#33]
What a terrible way to go.
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:42:30 PM EDT
[#34]
tragedy. overhead diving is ridiculously dangerous. I feel bad for his family.
However, sealing the caves is stupid. Some morons here in utah did that to Nutty Putty caves after one dude screwed up and died in there. A cave system utilized by tens of thousands of scouts, for generations, sealed up cause one guy fumbled the ball. Dumb. They should map those caves with a UAV, and special permit divers who want to dive them. People like doing dangerous shit, don't wall off a natural wonder cause someone made a mistake. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:49:30 PM EDT
[#35]
I think the key to what went wrong is somewhere in this statement: "The two divers entered a narrow chamber about 194 feet deep in waters with no visibility due to the silt."
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Posted: 4/3/2016 7:56:41 PM EDT
[#36]
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I would love to dive on a U-boat. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Wreck diving is much better I would love to dive on a U-boat. It's on my bucket list, but getting farther away. I took a GUE Primer, was told my kicks were up to at least a Fundies rec pass, and started getting gear. Doubles setup with manifold/wing/LP95s/used can light/etc. for local quarry practice, AOW, and more advanced training. My ambition has been stymied before even hitting AOW. I live in a landlocked high desert with a nondiving spouse and coworkers who are tropical-only divers, kids too young to dive, and insufficient time & funds to travel myself to remain proficient. Nobody wants to go sit in a local silty pond practicing drills. The guy who was my Primer instructor was solid and willing to mentor me, but it's a 5 hour drive just to get to his location, and he's no longer appearing on the GUE instructor list. The nearest GUE or UTD instructors are now much farther away. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:02:10 PM EDT
[#37]
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Interesting to read that Young NOW wants the caves sealed off for being too dangerous even though HE got permission after they had been off limits. While tragic, that is total BS and my respect for him dropped like a rock. Yeah, picked up on that too. Feel the same way. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:07:13 PM EDT
[#38]
I've heard of skygods, are there watergods as well?
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:11:34 PM EDT
[#39]
http://www.navimate.com/
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:16:40 PM EDT
[#40]
It happens, that sucks. Exploring caves that are not well mapped out is hazardous. My guess is a 'brown out' occurred from the silt being kicked up, the procedure at that point is both divers should have stopped and waited a few for the waters to clear, if it didn't they should have turned back together but damn that sucks.
Never have been in that cave but honestly, I've lost my interest in caves partially for this reason. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:18:41 PM EDT
[#41]
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breathing water? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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He died doing what he loved. breathing water? Ok, I didn't want to, but I snorted. Which feels, somehow, appropriate. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:20:07 PM EDT
[#42]
I've been diving on and off since the eighties and I've done a little caving. Even before I started having some issues with claustrophobia* I never had the desire to try cave diving. I seriously don't think that you could pay me enough to try it now.
* No idea why since I wasn't when I was younger, I started noticing it back in the late nineties during a confined space rescue refresher. At this point I'm not sure that I could complete a real confined space rescue class where you have to wiggled through a pipe.. 
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:24:16 PM EDT
[#43]
I have surfed 20' waves,ridden motorbikes way too fast and have been passenger in a professionally driven rally car,been in a plane with gear failure...The only time I have ever 100% lost my composure and freaked was caving,above ground. NFW am I doing that underwater. I'm not sure I even respect it,more like place it with free handling venomous snakes.
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:26:37 PM EDT
[#44]
Dumb.
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:27:31 PM EDT
[#45]
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Here you go again, Arfcom, costing me more dang money! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If anyone is interested in some really NOPE diving, check out "Descent into Darkness" by Edward Raymer. http://www.amazon.com/Descent-into-Darkness-Harbor-Divers/dp/1591147247 Dude was on the Navy Dive Recovery teams at Pearl Harbor. Talks about the work they did on the ships trying to get them righted for salvage. You can imagine how tough it would be diving around a pitch black ship, upside down, in oil filed water. With dead bodies floating all around you. Absolutely riveting book Here you go again, Arfcom, costing me more dang money! Well worth it. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:29:52 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's on my bucket list, but getting farther away. I took a GUE Primer, was told my kicks were up to at least a Fundies rec pass, and started getting gear. Doubles setup with manifold/wing/LP95s/used can light/etc. for local quarry practice, AOW, and more advanced training. My ambition has been stymied before even hitting AOW. I live in a landlocked high desert with a nondiving spouse and coworkers who are tropical-only divers, kids too young to dive, and insufficient time & funds to travel myself to remain proficient. Nobody wants to go sit in a local silty pond practicing drills. The guy who was my Primer instructor was solid and willing to mentor me, but it's a 5 hour drive just to get to his location, and he's no longer appearing on the GUE instructor list. The nearest GUE or UTD instructors are now much farther away. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Wreck diving is much better I would love to dive on a U-boat. It's on my bucket list, but getting farther away. I took a GUE Primer, was told my kicks were up to at least a Fundies rec pass, and started getting gear. Doubles setup with manifold/wing/LP95s/used can light/etc. for local quarry practice, AOW, and more advanced training. My ambition has been stymied before even hitting AOW. I live in a landlocked high desert with a nondiving spouse and coworkers who are tropical-only divers, kids too young to dive, and insufficient time & funds to travel myself to remain proficient. Nobody wants to go sit in a local silty pond practicing drills. The guy who was my Primer instructor was solid and willing to mentor me, but it's a 5 hour drive just to get to his location, and he's no longer appearing on the GUE instructor list. The nearest GUE or UTD instructors are now much farther away. Just curious, have you dove any of the stuff in Oregon? I am looking at a possible relocation to ID and shocked how pretty some of the places were up there. I actually live across the street from the back and GoM, but most of it is undivable unless you go offshore. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:33:06 PM EDT
[#47]
From what I can discern so far it sounds like it was simply a case of panic. I didn't know Shane, I'm not sure that he'd had a lot of experience pushing tight, low visibility caves. It's a different type of cave diving, and if he hadn't done much, that deep is not really the place to learn.
It's not (usually, there are some exceptions) actively any more or less dangerous assuming you're prepared, it's simply not forgiving of any screw ups. Panic is never a constructive behavior, and in that kind of situation it becomes distinctly self destructive. Usually it's a cascade of events, one thing goes wrong, which leads to another, and so on. This is exactly why you have to be able to stop yourself, prioritize what problem to address and try and fix it one at a time. Why he followed into the restriction we will likely never know. He may have misinterpreted Mike's signals, or just decided to take a look. For whatever reason, it doesn't sound as though he handled the ensuing situation very well. As far as to what contributed to his death that quickly, I don't know. He could have lost the DSV and flooded the loop. Or just spit it out. It's not been that unusual to find OC divers with gas still in their tanks. It's sad that he passed. But it was very nearly a dual fatality. |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:33:38 PM EDT
[#48]
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no he chose to put himself in that situation, no one else. Wild idea-don't go into caves and you won't drown in a cave ETA: lol, fear and stupidity are pretty much mutually exclusive in this situation, I did plenty of non mangina fart fearing stuff...when I was ..young..single, with no one else depending upon me...grow the fuck up or take no responsibility Quote HistoryQuoted:
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was it an accident or a choice to go into a confined space 200 feet below the water line? And just because some people are scared of their own mangina farts doesn't mean everyone is. no he chose to put himself in that situation, no one else. Wild idea-don't go into caves and you won't drown in a cave ETA: lol, fear and stupidity are pretty much mutually exclusive in this situation, I did plenty of non mangina fart fearing stuff...when I was ..young..single, with no one else depending upon me...grow the fuck up or take no responsibility |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:34:33 PM EDT
[#49]
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So what happens when your tank runs out. of oxygen. I assume you try to breath but its like someone has their hand over your mouth. Is that correct? Pretty much |
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Posted: 4/3/2016 8:35:18 PM EDT
[#50]
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Don't they also need certain mixes at depth? M not sure but how would a breather work in those situations? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Why do people still use air tanks? Don't they have rebreathers and things now that take the oxygen from the water? Expense. It adds a lot of complexity and requires more proficiency than tanks. Tanks are simple and reliable. Consider that most divers don't dive all that often, like myself. If I cleaned my stuff before I put it away a few months ago there is an excellent chance my gauges and Scuba Pro Mk25/600 is going to work just fine. Don't they also need certain mixes at depth? M not sure but how would a breather work in those situations? They adjust for depth |
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