User Panel
Posted: 8/4/2005 7:56:22 AM EDT
Please add your personal experience with Federal .223 ammunition to this thread. When you do, please give information about:
1) Ammunition used 2) Firearm used in 3) Approximate number of rounds fired. Archived thread results: 174 votes 155 positive 7 mixed 12 bad In this thread, I would like to limit discussion to all .223 loadings (XM193 is covered in another thread), including the "American Eagle" brand. I know this is kind of a broad area, but I don't want to create a zillion posts for every variant. For more information about this ammunition, please visit the Federal website I am trying to solicit only information about your PERSONAL experience with this ammunition. If you haven't used it, then please don't clutter up the thread. Information about proper functioning (or lack thereof) is obviously the most important, but factors such as the accuracy or other peculiarities you've noticed are informative also. If you have had problems with this ammo which were severe enough to cause you to stop using this ammo, then please describe them. |
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Chuck
At least 2000 rounds of Americal Eagle thru several AR15 & M16 Rifles. The only difference between this and M193 is a lighter powder change which results on slightly slower muzzle velocity. And it's not laquer sealed. -- Chuck txalan Fired about 300 rounds of AE through my AR and one FTF which matches the XM193 failure rate. It's cheap, good plinking ammo and SOOOO shiny. The Federal XM193 is great. My only problems with Federal were not with this caliber. Troy Federal American Eagle .223 Positives: This ammo is nice and clean like most commercial ammo, is generally very consistant, and usually runs very well in nearly any gun of this caliber. The bullets have a cannalure and are crimped to prevent bullet set-back. Fed AE is widely available. The 50gr HP version is quite accurate for bargain-line ammo. Negatives: Like all commercial .223, Fed AE is loaded about 200 fps slower than M193 specs, and therefore is a poor choice for defensive use. Like most commercial ammo, the bullets aren't sealed (primers are), and the primers aren't crimped. But the biggest problem is the brass. Federal's .223 brass is unlike any other .223 brass I've run across. The case walls are thicker, but the case head is MUCH thinner than normal, being 30-50% the thickness of other brass. This means that the case head won't be supported in most guns, and that the case head will expand significantly when the round is fired. One nasty result of the case-head expansion is that the primer pocket will no longer hold the primer, and on an AR15, the primer will often end up either in the barrel extension or under the fire control parts, locking the gun up in either case. Reloading these cases should be avoided! The mild factory loadings probably pose little danger, but the reduced case capacity and unsupported case head will quickly lead to case-head separations or much worse, and many pieces of brass won't even hold a primer after their first firing. IMO, if Federal is going to make such non-standard brass, they should make it Berdan-primed to prevent attempts to reload it. But they REALLY should just manufacture the cases correctly in the first place. NOTE: None of the above applies to XM-193, which uses Lake City brass, not commercial Federal brass. -Troy dpmmn I have used Thousands of the 55 grain and the 62 grain American Eagle rounds in all of my AR's and my Winchester Model 70 stealth. Not 1 problem ever. Buy American Made Ammunition -Absolut- Only about 150 rounds of AE used, but no probs JoeInCT I have gone through several thousands of rounds of American Eagle in various calibers: .22LR for my 22 rifle .223 for my AR-15 .30 Carbine for my M-1 Carbine 30-30 for my Marlin 336C 30-06 for my M-1 Garand plus XM-193 for my AR-15, and never a problem. Good, consistent quality. It has become the standard by which I compare all other brands. And Made in the USA! Charging_Handle I have used somewhere in the neighborhood of 350-400 rounds of the Federal American Eagle 50 gr JHP and 55 gr FMJ with no problems. It seems like reliable, clean ammo. I would rate it a good practice load but as Troy points out, I would not want it for reloading. In addition, I have used about 200 rounds of the Federal Premium 55 gr BTHP with good results. It is accurate, has low muzzle flash and seems very reliable. This is my standard load of choice for varmints in the coyote size on down. I have no problems to report with these either. I've also fired off a few 20 round boxes of the Federal Gold Medal 69 gr SMK's, but not enough in my opinion to be a good test. However it seemed plenty accurate and I saw no problems with the few rounds I shot. -CH NCCop Our agency issued AE .223 55FMJ ammunition for several years. We used approximately 6-7K rounds through several department-issue Bushmasters, a variety of personally-owned rifles (ArmaLites, Colts, Olympics, Ruger Mini-14s) with absolutely no problems whatsoever which could be attributed to the ammunition. Since I had a choice on state purchase ammunition this year, we now issue Federal XM193, for the additional velocity & the fact that it has sealed primers & case necks. But I would have no hesitation in choosing AE for defensive loads over most of the other non-milspec ammo on the market. With the exception of Winchester USA, the AE is, IMHO, the best of the available choices. obershutze916 Have used lots of 90's production American Eagle with no problem. Have seen a lot of it laying around lately with the bullet pushed in though. Have used large amounts of "Classic" 63 gr. FMJ with only one failure. MTNmyMag 16" RRA upper, Bushy Lower American Eagle 55 grn FMJ 120 rounds had some really really hot rounds huge muzzle flash cracked case mouth, bulged primers and cases (head space is correct) another_shooter No problems either with 55 g AE or 69-75 g GM. I've probably shot over 500 rounds of each. The AE was primarily through a Steyr USR and GM was through a Colt CAR-A3. Some cratering around the firing pin was noted when the GMs were shot through an H-S Precision bolt action, so I stopped after two rounds. I've noticed the brass tends to be long, above the maximum trim length after resizing. I've not had any problems with reloading, but I use relatively light loads. Paul 8900 rounds fired (in one morning and afternoon) Colt M-16's (x40) Military issue M-193 1 failure to fire - good looking primer strike DistCPO The 55gr AE seems to shoot OK out of the several ARs I have (2 kit 1:9 A2s, a RRA 1:8" CMP rifle, a 1:6.5" WOP CMP upper, a 1:8" space gun). THe 77gr ammo from CMP blew primers out into my RRA at a match at Parris Island in Oct 02. Wouldn't have been so bad except it happened to several people's rifles of various makes. THe Marines had to shut the match down because of the unsafe ammo (everyone had to use the supplied ammo, no reloads allowed). They made the right call. Federal, when contacted made a firm stance that their ammo was loaded safely. THey refused to refund the ammo and weren't interested in examining the fired cases. THe CMP very quickly refunded the ammo and after discussion with Federal, opted out of selling any more of the Federal 77gr ammo. Good service from CMP, very poor from Federal. DistCPO On another interesting note, while active duty, we were training with the MK46, a shorter, lighter version of the M249 SAW. The MK46 would shoot the M855/M856 linked ammo without a hitch. Ran over (20) 200rd packs thru 4 MGs with no problems. When we ran the M193/M196 ammo (linked for use in Stoners) thru the MK46, it wouldn't shoot more than 4 or 5 bursts without a stoppage. I would guess it requires the increased impulse of the 62gr rounds to reliably function. phoenix27 Shot of few hundred rounds of the Fed .223 through my Colt and Bushy ARs, plus a few from a mini14 and zero problems. It doesn't seem as hot as the 5.56MM XM-193 stuff, but accuracy is fine. Phoenix27 Leisure_Shoot RRA 20" chrome-moly HBAR Approximately 200 rounds fired. No problems of any kind. I was plinking, so no accuracy info. ikor Thousands of rounds of both American Eagle as well as 55gr. JSP...a very little 52gr. HP. Not a single ammo problem that I recall through probably 25-30 different ARs...mostly Colts...three Steyer AUGs, about 8-10 HK 93s and G33s, one FN FNC, several Mini 14s, an HK 53 and five or six Ruger AC 556Ks...probably some other weapons I can't recall right now as well. FA on the select fire guns was mostly with the FMJ but I have shot a fair amount of the JSP through the AUGs in FA...no problems at all over mayne ten years worth of shooting. TheKnack 55 and 62 grain with never a FTF or FTE with all rounds through a RRA Varmint AR15. Great ammo at a great price. Some may disagree but I have a lot for SHTF. I really do not plan on being underwater so the lacquer sealed bullet and primer I can do without. I have many rounds of .300 Winchester I reloaded over ten years ago and all are sure fire and still accurate without the lacquer. Semper Fi, Jerry ALAN308 A.E. 55gr. fmjbt. Bushmaster 16" postban w/ Armalite brake, Colt 20" MT pre ban 5k down range. Very clean and reliable. Cost effective plinking and local action matches. Not as accurate as xm193 lots 4/10. Skydiverman 400+ rds through bushmaster 16" mod. carbine. Zero failures of any kind. Good groups and consistency. better accuracy than xm193, but not nearly as hot. I just ordered another K. rockymtnhi RRA 16" & 20" 1K rds in one day with no problems. perfect for the range. Q3131A I have shot many thousands of rounds of Federal American Eagle. I have never had troubles with it in any of my guns. It is good ammo, although there were reports of the brass having troubles for reloads. I use Q3131A most of the time now. Mantis_51 Used 80rds of 55gr FMJBT American Eagle by Federal in a 20" Bushmaster. This ammo was great and very inexpensive, great plinking round, but with good accuracy and clean. I will definatly be purchasing more of this ammo. MOIGR AE 55GR. Bushy 20" HBAR --short cycle-FTF. Works fine in Mini 14 ar15_finatik 500 rnd case just arrived and noticed something different from what I'm reading here... These cartridges are the AE 55gr, but the brass seems pretty thick. In comparison to the PMP (gazelle box) 55gr rounds the case head thickness seems very close. The stamping on these are LC 03 and has the NATO symbol (cross in circle). The box states 3240fps / 1280 fpe...this doesn't seem far off from the LC XM193's at 3250fps / 1289 fpe. Does this seem normal? I'm anxious to shoot & chrono this stuff now...I'll post my results this weekend. M4Kid I love this ammo. Fires perfect every time. Zip06 Member Joined :: September 2001 Post Number :: 24 OR, USA 400 rounds of AE223, 55gr FMJ Boat Tail. Ranges out to 150 meters. All rounds shot out of 20 round magazines in a 20" Colt HBAR. All rounds shot within 4 hours. No malfunctions or ammo related problems what so ever. Accuracy was about par. Good, clean-burning ammo. Ratters I just bought a five hundred round case today and it is all lake city stamped brass. Does anyone have any confirmation on the velocity labled on the back? Says 3240 from the muzzle. Seems awfully close to lake city velocities. This ammo is way to pretty to be lake city though. M199 Finally chronoed some strings of New production AE with Lc brass. _____________ 14.5" ________20" New AE ______ 2785fps _____3041fps Old AE _______2843fps _____3066fps LC 2002 ______ 3000fps_____3229fps The New AE is actually lower in velocity abit and this could be to the larger case volume of the LC brass as compared to the old AE Federal brass. I haven't done a case vol. comparision but I think it's the case. The end result for the time being is better components which is a + in my view. The cheapest quality ammo available. Matt_B I just received a few cases of AE 55gr .223 and every round I've looked at (480 so far) have the LC 01 and NATO cross headstamp. BTW, just to clarify something that some of us already know, the muzzle velocity listed on the box (3240 FPS) is from a 24" bbl. They don't state the test bbl length on the box but they do list on the Federal website. But, this doesn't really matter to me since this is just practice ammo. The XM193 I have is for a "rainy day". target435 New AE223 is packed in a smaller 500 rd case. The 20 rd boxes are the same size at XM193 boxes.Still shiny brass but with fc 223 rem headstamps. so far have not seen any LC headstamps Ammo was purchased the end of 2004 Zmeja I purchased 500 rounds from Sportsman's Warehouse this past January, and have shot all but 200 rounds of it. 1) 55gr FMJ 2) Used in numerous AR15s, including: A1 upper (mixed pedigree) 1:12 A1 upper (Colt) 1:12 A3 Cav Arms Midlength 1:9 A2 DPMS 20" 1:7 A3 Armalite 20" 1:9 All uppers fired and cycled fine. The 1:12 twist barrels liked it more than the 1:9 or 1:7. Noticeably softer report and recoil than XM193 or Q3131A. None of the brass was Lake City marked. dep4532 Have shot literally thousands of rounds of the AE223. I have never had a problem (that could be directly linked to the ammo). Usually 55gr AE is my practice ammo (along with PMP). Have fired it through at least five different Bushmaster rifles over the past several years. 100 rds of the 55gr AE is currently loaded in my Beta. Quien I've fired thousands of rounds of AE through several Bushmasters of mine, 14.5" M4A3 type, 16" Modular carbine, and 16" Patrolman's carbine with zero issues. Can't speak to accuracy outside of "Minute of Man," did not shoot off the bench for accuracy, but always hit the target. ETA: All fired rounds were: 55grain AE AnthonyL Shot 240 rounds of Federal American Eagle yesterday with zero issues. Some of the cases were XM193 brass with LC 04 stamps. The rest were Fed 223 brass. All of it was very clean and shinny, went bang every time! |
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Works all the time... every time.
Over 20,000 rounds last year In a Colt lightweight and a DPMS light weight. Mainly AE223, but some variants |
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Have shot approx 3K rds in the last 12 months of FAE 55gr FMJBT. Not one issue. That includes 1k of the new "M193 package" stuff, which seems to be using powder that smells different than the product in the older packaging.
Probably have about 12K of rds thru my DPMS in just under 3 years, easily the majority-plus of it has been FAE 55, and have never had any issues with any of it. |
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shot about 2k of the american eagle in 55gr.
works great! not a single problem in a few of my rifles and its accurate too. used it in a varmint rig ss1x8 and some of my others that are cl 1x9 |
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I was with someone who fired 60 rounds of 55 gr. FMJ - American Eagle this weekend.
I was surprised the brass is marked LC 04, has cross, primer sealed and lacked the visual annealing color at the neck like XM-193 (prolly polished off). Had 1 round get messed up during feeding. I just pulled it down. Powder: 27.5 grains of spherical propellant (looks similar to H-335 type). Bullet: 55.6 grain FMJ (wonder if this is a M193 bullet). No sealant on bullet/neck. ETA: Case: 93.7 grains for the 2004 case. 94.0 grains for a LC - 1985 case I had laying around. I need to chrono this in the 35p first chance I get. I think I'll be buying some of this ammo for range use, the LC brass is a Big + for the Handloader! Danny |
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Well i`ve gone through a case (1000 rds.) of the 55gr. FMG with out one hiccup. My rifles are a bushy lower w/ a cmmg 1/7 16" upper and a DPMS lower w/ a cmmg 1/7 16" upper. Will gladly buy again if I find a deal on it.-Todd
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After experiencing some problems with Radway Green mil-surp ammo I put 60 rounds of American Eagle 223 through my new 20" Bushy. Even with a very dirty rifle this ammo functioned without incident...no complaints here.
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Over the past 2 months I have gone through 1,200 roundsof Federal AE through my AR with no problems. Accuracy isn't "great" but it is Minute of Dirtbag at 100 yards and it is good reliable ammo. I have yet to have a any malfuction at all.
BBl is a 16" Bushmaster HBAR Upper is CMT Lower is an Armalite. |
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I've shot 400 rounds of 55 gn fmj american eagle, the majority in my HBAR Colt. No jams average 2 3/4 inches at 100 yards. Also tried the same in a Rem 700 adl w/ nikon 4-12 for kicks one day. It was still 2 1/2 inches.
Also tried the 50 gn hp version. Accuracy in the HBAR was 3 inches. (two boxes) Accuracy in the bolt gun was 2 1/2 inches (one box) My overall opinion, it measures up as good plinking ammo. No more, no less. |
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I've shot around 5-6k of 55g AE. Not a single problem in all those rounds. Rilfes used were a factory Bushmaster and a mutt gun I built.
I would buy it again if it wasn't so high right now..... |
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750 rounds of AE 55 gr. through a variety of rifles (20", 16", mid, full, carbine, M17, SAR-3) no failures to fire or eject.
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I voted bad experence,never use again however let me explain that.I have found that federal manufactured cases do not last as long if you reload,ie the primer pocket will strech out in just a few loadings with starting loads with .223 cases,and with pistol cases,primarily .38spl and .357mag you get split case mouths quick with starting loads.If reloading is not your bag,cant really comment on just factory loaded ammo,however in about 15k rnds of .223 reloaded,I can say IMHO that federal brass is not as durable as rem,win or pmc.
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I have shot about 500 rounds of the Federal / American Eagle 62 grain out of my Rock River 16" Varmiter without any problems (that weren't caused by my few cheap magazines - doh).
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Fired 100 rounds 55gr and 40 rounds 62gr with SL8-5.
55gr is more accurate (about 1,5"-2" at 100m), 62gr about 2.5"-3" at same range out of my rifle. Functions consistently and flawlessly, cartridges are clean and shiney. Packages are a bit large for my taste . I think the ammo is absolutely OK if you dont expect match accuracy. |
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I typically purchase Federal American Eagle for my 16" M4's, in both 62gr and 55gr FMJ. I've never had a problem in probably 2,000 rounds among 3 different rifles. I love the stuff. It is reasonably accurate, the 55gr is sometimes 1" groups @75yds which I consider super-accurate. I've had 2" to 3" groups with 62gr both of these results are out of 1x7, 1x8 and 1x9 twist rifles. It is reasonably priced and I've never had a misfire, FTFed, FTEx, jam, or anything.
The only problem ammo I've ever encountered was wolf several years back. Had some FTF but that is it. - rem |
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Explain this one. How do thinner heads result in lack of casehead support? I'll grant you that the pockets tend to expand, but it's not due to any less support over a LC or Win case, it's just that in all cases there is a lack of support. Those with sufficient material and hardness handle the pressure better, but Federals being thinner, don't. You can relaod Federals, I've done it many times. But I sort those out and drop the charge down accordingly. I'll also retire the case quicker. But you are right, when seating a primer in a Federal case, there's much leass resistance than say a LC once fired case whose crimp has reamed away. Those pockets do hold up better, both to higher pressure and a couple more reloads. I wish some mfg could come out with a tool to resize the pocket back to original dimensions. I suspect though if one were possible, it would be very costly and a conventional press probably wouldn't have enough leverage to squeeze the head enough. |
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Weapon used: RRA 16" mid-length A2 upper with 2 stage NM lower and 6 pos stock.
Ammo: Obviously Fed 55gr .223 FMJBT Rounds fired: 240 0 misfeeds due to weapon 0 misfeeds due to ammo 0 misfires 0 hang fires 0 problems overall Ammo shot very good groups at 150 yards. Ill shoot it again if price is right. |
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I shot 1000 rounds of Red Box through my 20" RRA 1 in 9 twist with 0 problems.
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No problems here. I've shot probably between 150 to 200 rounds of this stuff, mostly for barrel break-in, initial sighting in, and some offhand practice. Flawless functioning. Rifle is a RRA NM A2, first with a RRA/Wilson 1-8 SS HBAR (no FS) and now with a WOA/Wilson 1-7 SS HBAR with FS.
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AE223 55GR.FMJ BOAT-TAIL.I shot a ship-load out of Mini-14s and am going to try it in my new Bushmaster.It shoots clean and never had a problem of any kind with it.tom.
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Shoots clean, no problems. New Bushy 11.5 barrel with a 5.5 supressor.
C.M. >;p |
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I have shot over 2K of these rounds through a Bushy. Absolutely no problems at all. For the price it is great plinking ammo. Looking to get more when I have the cash.
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So, does have enough velocity to fragment? Is this particular bullet designed to fragment?
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Have put 200 rounds of my 1000 round case through my new RRA A4. Shoots great so far, not a failure of any kind. Brass is nice and clean and no damaged cases. Hard to beat for $189/1k.
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I've instructed 2 Patrol Rifle classes over the last few weeks and students fired 60,000+ rounds of red box AE with headstamps "FC 05".
Rifles used were Colt, Bushy, DPMS, Armalite, RR, and a Mini 14 thrown in for good measure. Not a single malfunction attributed to ammunition, and we were watching closely as the Department just switched to using this ammo for practice. It is said (by our permanent range staff) to chrony a little slower than our duty loads, but accuracy is excellent. We qualify out to 200yds and when the rifleman does his/her part, this ammo performs. Two thumbs up, this is outstanding ammunition. |
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My Bushmaster lower with 16in. Model 1 Sales upper. choked on one FAE223 out of 40, and zero falirues shooting IMI855 & Q3131A on the same session. the round got hung up at the feed ramp/barrel extention. i wasn't shooting the gun when it happened so i do know if was anything diffrent/wrong the shooter did. I will quess that it's because of it's lower power than the others. i will use this ammo for practice.
kevin |
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Bushmaster 20" AR-15
Olympic OA-93 Fed. American Eagle 223 I have used a little over 500 rounds of this ammo without a single incident. I started using this instead of XM193 for random plinking use when the XM started getting more expensive/scarce. Very happy with this ammo. |
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I just bought 1500 AE 55gr FMJ rounds from Outdoor Marksman and it showed up today. I have shot several thousand rounds of this with 0 problems. This batch came in brass marked LC 04 with the NATO headstamp. The total price (including shipping) for 1500 rounds was $319.87. By the way for you smart shoppers this is still cheaper then XM193...
If I really wanted to complain I could say that Outdoor Marksman charged me an extra cent on 75 packages, but I won't because it goes against my buddistic beliefs of swimming against the stream. |
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500 rounds thru my bushy.. no problems, pretty good accuracy.
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Federal/AE 62gr FMJ
Colt 20'' HBAR (MT6601) 300-400 rounds fired without problem of any kind. good accuracy at 100 yards. |
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Expecting my third 1k round order any day now. I love this ammo. No problems with my bushmaster 20"
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I just shot 250 of the AE through my RRA. The headstamp was LC05. I had no failures, and will by more next chance I get.
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Ive used the 55fmj in my Mimni14`s and AR15`s
AE is outstanding |
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