AK Sponsor
Posted: 1/21/2014 3:57:53 PM EDT
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have gotten the bug for some more AKs lately.
I first got foreign weapons fam training on them in the military in "86, and got my first personal one, in the early 90s Interstate Arms imported thumbhole MAK-90 Sporter. (Stamped, straight cut) I added a SAR-2 in 5.45, and a couple of other 7.62x39 examples but had not bought a new one in close to ten years. While not 80s and early 90s prices, a synthetic stocked NPAP for under 500$ out the door at my LGS caught my eye and followed me home. It has eaten Norinco gray box, S&B green box, WPA, black/red Wolf, and Tula through spine Euorpean mags, Tapco mags, and Chinese no-spine mags like a champ without a single hiccup. I liked it so much I ordered the underfolder version from Classic to go with it. Well, I was checking my other little LGS just because I like to stop in. There was on O-PAP sitting there looking all lonely in a gun shop with like one other AK and a wall of ARs. The box says made in 11/13, and the SN is just a hair over 8000. I have nothing against regular stamped AKs, am not really a seeker of milled receiver AKs, but for whatever reason I am a sucker for extra thick stamped receiver AKs. I should have passed, but I was dumb enough to pick it up and think I would be able to pass after that. The combination of the receiver and the Yugo wood on steroid stocks, and it just felt right. It had that old heft and feel of an early, old school battle rifle like a Garand or FN49. I love ARs and other AKs, but this one really called to me. Plus, everyone seems to be looking for an O-PAP now. At the range, I could see the first round hit about 8 inches low and 6 inches left at 25m. That is as far off out of the box an AK I have ever handled. And the bolt either did not come all the way back, or it got stuck on its way forward. As far as the range of bolt carrier hitting the hammer goes, most of my AKs did far less, but I have felt plenty of others that did it this much. I went through several magazines known to function well, and the same stash and variety of ammo that the N-PAP had no issues with. I did get 8 rounds in a row off once. On a handful of times, I got a few shots in the row off, but most of the time by far it was a single shot. Brass was ejected just a foot or so away when it did fire. I had stove pipes left and right. In fact, I had more malfunctions with this AK trying to get through the 120 rounds I took with me than in ALL AKs I have ever owned or shot in my life put together. Anyways, I have never had an AK that needed to be broken in or had issues. I can take them apart and clean them blindfolded, but have never built one and never had one not work so have never learned how to mess with one- every other one I had was as easy as a fat, ugly, drunk chick at the prom. Should I just send it to Century now, or is there a logical proven way to sort it out on my own? Thank you. |
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Well,
pulling the bolt back with hammer cocked feels rougher and to take more force than on my other AKs, in fact bolt wants to stay to the rear unless charged fast and hard. But, pulling the bolt back on an AK with the hammer fired takes more force to pull back, so I don't see how a little hammer / bolt carrier rub while it breaks in could be causing it. Sometimes I think it is short stroking because the bolt is partway back, and I have a stovepipe. I don't know on an AK how I check for under gassing or something causing a short stroke. At other times, it seems like the bolt did make it all the way to the rear, but did not come all the way forward, but I can't see exactly what would have held it up. Part of me just wants to say, hell, some edges, etc. must be rough just shoot some more an break it in. But the back of my mind says- WTF! You have never had to break in an AK before. |
| Aside from your accuracy issues, my npap experienced the same issues. The action was plain nasty out of the box. Bolt would want to stay to the rear. Took the advice of other members here and polished the hammer face and underside of the bolt. Made a huge difference but was still not butter smooth. So I lubed it up with motor oil and ran about 200 more rounds through it as hard and fast as I could. Now my action is crazy slick. No more bolt sticking to the rear. I can't even make it stick if I'm trying. I'm no AK expert so I couldn't tell you the difference between opap and npap but this worked for me. Hope it helps. |
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Quoted:
Century guns where the magwell is opened up to accept hi cap mags need a thorough cleaning BEFORE the 1st round is fired. I assume you did this. GARY Well, I never did it on any other AKs, but when I was checking this one out, there were a ton of metal shavings in there. I mean enough where it was like a salt shaker for a second or two. I was able to air hose the rest out, hit it with hopes, CLP before firing. So yep, it got more than the usual out of the box AK treatment before firing. I knew something was up with the cleanliness of them by the fact you could see rust forming at the edges under the side scope mount and all the shavings. It looks like it has the Tapco FCG, piston, brake, and CAI grip for 6 US parts. I believe my NPAP has the same, but was told it also had barrel and receiver, which seems odd as that would make 8 us parts. |
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Quoted:
Well, I never did it on any other AKs, but when I was checking this one out, there were a ton of metal shavings in there. I mean enough where it was like a salt shaker for a second or two. I was able to air hose the rest out, hit it with hopes, CLP before firing. So yep, it got more than the usual out of the box AK treatment before firing. I knew something was up with the cleanliness of them by the fact you could see rust forming at the edges under the side scope mount and all the shavings. It looks like it has the Tapco FCG, piston, brake, and CAI grip for 6 US parts. I believe my NPAP has the same, but was told it also had barrel and receiver, which seems odd as that would make 8 us parts. Quoted:
Quoted:
Century guns where the magwell is opened up to accept hi cap mags need a thorough cleaning BEFORE the 1st round is fired. I assume you did this. GARY Well, I never did it on any other AKs, but when I was checking this one out, there were a ton of metal shavings in there. I mean enough where it was like a salt shaker for a second or two. I was able to air hose the rest out, hit it with hopes, CLP before firing. So yep, it got more than the usual out of the box AK treatment before firing. I knew something was up with the cleanliness of them by the fact you could see rust forming at the edges under the side scope mount and all the shavings. It looks like it has the Tapco FCG, piston, brake, and CAI grip for 6 US parts. I believe my NPAP has the same, but was told it also had barrel and receiver, which seems odd as that would make 8 us parts. Do you see those shavings before or after you bought it? Did you see them before or after you fired it? |
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I suspect gasport problems. I'm thinking that either the gas port isn't lined up with the GB, the hole wasn't drilled correctly. Chuck up a long 1/8" drill bit and try running it down the gas hole. Put a dowel or something down the barrel to help keep you from going to far. Use lots of lube and keep the RPMs up at a decent rate. You do NOT want to break off the drill bit (had a bad experience with an RPK build). Headspace is another thing that can cause goofy symptoms. If you know anyone that has 7.62x39 HS gauges, its worth a shot. |
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Start eliminating things. Take out the hammer and slide the BCG back and forth in and out of battery to see where it's hanging up. Check to
See if the piston goes into the rear sight block correctly. See if it's rubbing on the guide rails. If that's all smooth round off the profile of the hammer with a file and sand paper until it's smooth. I do that no matter what anyway to mine. |
| Sold a Century AK to a guy a few years ago. When he said he was going to shoot it right away on our range, I told him to clean out the shavings FIRST. Did he, no. 10 minutes later he's complaining that the gun is jamming. I grabbed the gun, sprayed in brake cleaner to get rid of the shavings, followed by CLP for lube, & the gun was perfect. I told the customer "Why do I waste my breath to help you with your gun, & if you cleaned your gun like I said, it would not have jammed". He replied "I shouldn't have to clean a new gun". I replied "My experience selling guns where the magwell is hogged out says it does need cleaning. How did not cleaning the gun work out for you? GARY |
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Quoted:
Sold a Century AK to a guy a few years ago. When he said he was going to shoot it right away on our range, I told him to clean out the shavings FIRST. Did he, no. 10 minutes later he's complaining that the gun is jamming. I grabbed the gun, sprayed in brake cleaner to get rid of the shavings, followed by CLP for lube, & the gun was perfect. I told the customer "Why do I waste my breath to help you with your gun, & if you cleaned your gun like I said, it would not have jammed". He replied "I shouldn't have to clean a new gun". I replied "My experience selling guns where the magwell is hogged out says it does need cleaning. How did not cleaning the gun work out for you? GARY I am not sure how that applies to me, I thought I made it clear my initial look at the gun to lube it had shavings and stuff And it was cleaned before shooting. These malfunctions were occuring after a clean and lube, as opposed to any other ak i have had run like a top with a lube out of the box, none of which looked nasty enough for a cleaning. |
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Is the Tapco G2 FCG complete - in that it has the sleeve over the trigger pin through the trigger and disconnector?
Is their spring tension on the disconnector? Hammer spring correct on the hammer (not in backwards)? Sheppard hook installed? Never know, maybe Century missed a step when they put the US parts in it. Try a exchanging bolt carriers (NOT BOLTS) between this rifle and your other AKs. I don't own a wide receiver AK so not sure if those are interchangeable or not but still worth a try. How does the bolt carrier ride on the rails (without the bolt) - any burs on the receiver rails? |
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Quoted:
I am not sure how that applies to me, I thought I made it clear my initial look at the gun to lube it had shavings and stuff And it was cleaned before shooting. These malfunctions were occuring after a clean and lube, as opposed to any other ak i have had run like a top with a lube out of the box, none of which looked nasty enough for a cleaning. Quoted:
Quoted:
Sold a Century AK to a guy a few years ago. When he said he was going to shoot it right away on our range, I told him to clean out the shavings FIRST. Did he, no. 10 minutes later he's complaining that the gun is jamming. I grabbed the gun, sprayed in brake cleaner to get rid of the shavings, followed by CLP for lube, & the gun was perfect. I told the customer "Why do I waste my breath to help you with your gun, & if you cleaned your gun like I said, it would not have jammed". He replied "I shouldn't have to clean a new gun". I replied "My experience selling guns where the magwell is hogged out says it does need cleaning. How did not cleaning the gun work out for you? GARY I am not sure how that applies to me, I thought I made it clear my initial look at the gun to lube it had shavings and stuff And it was cleaned before shooting. These malfunctions were occuring after a clean and lube, as opposed to any other ak i have had run like a top with a lube out of the box, none of which looked nasty enough for a cleaning. |
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Quoted:
Those shavings were there right after taking it out of the box before cleaning it or taking it to the range. My assumption was that they were from the grinding of the magwell. Your assumption is correct. The shavings are from when Century hogged out the magwell to accept a double stack mag. Your problem is one that other folks have had with their O-PAP. The Tapco G2 hammer is sitting up high and slowing the Bolt Carrier. Another problem with some O-PAPs is the mag catch was filed on too much and the mag sits low causing feeding problems. |
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Quoted:
Is the Tapco G2 FCG complete - in that it has the sleeve over the trigger pin through the trigger and disconnector? Is their spring tension on the disconnector? Hammer spring correct on the hammer (not in backwards)? Sheppard hook installed? Never know, maybe Century missed a step when they put the US parts in it. Try a exchanging bolt carriers (NOT BOLTS) between this rifle and your other AKs. I don't own a wide receiver AK so not sure if those are interchangeable or not but still worth a try. How does the bolt carrier ride on the rails (without the bolt) - any burs on the receiver rails? Yugo parts are not interchangeable with other AKM rifles. |
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Quoted:
Is the Tapco G2 FCG complete - in that it has the sleeve over the trigger pin through the trigger and disconnector? Is their spring tension on the disconnector? Hammer spring correct on the hammer (not in backwards)? Sheppard hook installed? Never know, maybe Century missed a step when they put the US parts in it. Try a exchanging bolt carriers (NOT BOLTS) between this rifle and your other AKs. I don't own a wide receiver AK so not sure if those are interchangeable or not but still worth a try. How does the bolt carrier ride on the rails (without the bolt) - any burs on the receiver rails? FCGs are looking good. The carriers I have ride slick as butter on the rails, minimal normal hammer bump. With the bolt in, is when it gets rough. it is in the white and I am having trouble telling where |
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Quoted:
Yugo parts are not interchangeable with other AKM rifles. Quoted:
Quoted:
Is the Tapco G2 FCG complete - in that it has the sleeve over the trigger pin through the trigger and disconnector? Is their spring tension on the disconnector? Hammer spring correct on the hammer (not in backwards)? Sheppard hook installed? Never know, maybe Century missed a step when they put the US parts in it. Try a exchanging bolt carriers (NOT BOLTS) between this rifle and your other AKs. I don't own a wide receiver AK so not sure if those are interchangeable or not but still worth a try. How does the bolt carrier ride on the rails (without the bolt) - any burs on the receiver rails? Yugo parts are not interchangeable with other AKM rifles. Did you read the opening post?? He mentions he has 2 other Yugo AKM's. 
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Is the gas port clear?
I'd send it back it ought to work from the factory. Let them dick with it. I have feeling the mag is probably too high. The fix is to file on the spacer between the mag release and the receiver. Personally I'd let Century screw with that. |
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This POS is officially going back to Century.
No a ding on O-PAPS, but I got a lemon. So, the action has been lovingly cleaned and lubed and worked by hand a couple of hundred times and we are back at the range ready to go It is sunny and no rain or snow and I have the range to myself. I throw in a mag, reach over and charge one in the chamber, then go to pull it into safe while I decide which target order to go, etc. The safety is really hard stuck in fire. I pull up harder. The safety comes up past safe and comes out. Ok, I have seen a safety lever go to far and come out, clear weapon and go to address. The trigger pin has come out also. I, to be honest, have swapped a few FCGs in my day and everytime I do it swear I will never do it again unless I get the updated plate or something instead of the springs. It is no fun at home with all my stuff. Plus in the past year I got a little closer to 50 than I am to 40 and have not adjusted to needing and always having reading glasses with me and I don't. At 34 degrees, with basic range tools, it sucks. I get her together, and it is one of the safeties that don't clear the disc. even when you pull the trigger, etc. What the monkey f..k, it just came out. Anyways, I pull out a Mak90 that has not been shot in like five years, gets an oil down every year. It shoots great and my range day is not wasted. I get home and get the safety and spring in with the trigger spring only partially in so I can forward it, then get everything all tucked in again. If this had been my first AK, I would never get another. The experience has been that bad. I still don't know why the safety decided to need some extra umph to pull up into safe. Whoever built my shit must have been a former Yugo car factory worker and not an AK dude. And the damn rifle was so sweet and sexy when I picked it up, and it has burned me so bad. This must be how those guys on liberty feel when they score some awesome hot chick, then wake up groggy with a sore ass and start to remember the hot chick's hands may have been a little big and she had a scarf around her neck. |
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Quoted:
Send it back to Century, no AK should have those types of problems out of the box. No need on wasting more ammo or anything on it. This. Interesting to me, people have been dogging on WASRs and recommending PAPs lately and all the WASRs I've seen lately run 100% and are straight (FSB/GB) and well put together, yet the only AK to go down in an AK class I just attended was a PAP (can't remember if it was O or N, but it was recent production) and now reading this makes me glad I never got one, even after they swapped the single-stack lug for the double stack lug. Send it back, OP. ETA: didn't read both pages  . Keep the faith, once it's fixed it should be good to go. don't be a stranger w/ Century, seems like they need some prodding to light a fire under their ass.
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OK, at the 7 week mark UPS has dropped off the gun.
Both magazines came back. It looks like they polished the top of the hammer/bottom of the bolt, and polished the chamber, and ground some off the face of the barrel. I received no communication and not details in the paperwork. There are some standard lines on the print out, X's are next to: Within Headspace Gas System Function Check Mag Catch Fit Check Polish Chamber Ejector Function Check Bolt and Carrier Fit / Function Test Fire 30 rounds Clean Firearm Fire Control Group If it had come sooner, I could have taken it to the range. (I was shooting my old SAR2 some today to test out the Promag 40 rounders) I work a string of days coming up, may have to wait a week or so until I can tell you how it works. I do wish even a sentence or two came back saying what was jacked up. |
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Ok, made it to the range today.
I threw in a ribless Chinese mag full of my last 30 rounds of the old steel core I got around 1990. Probably the last time I will ever shoot sub-10 cents a round AK ammo and it ran fine. I threw in a 40 round European ribbed steel mag with my last two boxes of gray box Norinco. It ran fine and may be the last time I ever shoot sub-20c a round 7.62x39. I put in some old Wolf black and red box in a Tapco and it ran fine. I put in some new Wolf black and red box 24 cents a round delivered stuff in a new PMAG and it ran fine. I threw in some Tula in some of those used, surplus steel European mags and it ran fine. I will put the finger groove grip on an NPAP underfolder to replace the non finger grip it came with, and order a M76 scale down wood grip for this. I'm good with Blondes, Gingers, and Brunettes, so not sure which finish I will pick. |
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Congrats on the new and improved pap-o-matic. My "Woody." Just kidding. My first AK, MAK90 over 20 years ago had that horrible wood thumbhole club. Options were not what they are now when I 922d, it- it is in Tapco dress now. I also wanted a folder on my SAR-2, and railed the front end. That was actually some nice wood I may go back to. My Draco is also in polymer and pending its stamp for a VZ58 folder. My NPAP fixed stock is polymer, and the underfolder too. I think I am going to keep this full wood. |
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Contact Century, they'll fix it. I had a great experience with their CS. My original PAP had issues after they tried fixing it so they upgraded me to an OPAP 11 months after the purchase. I haven't had a single problem with the OPAP but I have only put a few hundred rounds through it.
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