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Your conditions and positioning have to be just right for you to see your own trace often and you have to manage your recoil well so you can stay on the target. It's much easier to see trace when setup as a spotter.
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
Now that's interesting. You probably need to be spotting for someone to see the bullet coming in. My shooting buddy had me spot for him when we were at Quantico and that's when I could see the trail. View Quote |
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Official Arfcom Nickname: 3 Gun
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Originally Posted By dHUTCH:
He may not have had enough humidity in WI to get a good vapor trail. Shooting in and around Houston we always had a solid vapor trail from my 6.5x47 Lapua. Shooting 300win mag in New Mexico was tough to pick up on one. View Quote |
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Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
Official Arfcom Nickname: 3 Gun
Whack-a-mole Champ |
Originally Posted By Defender3:
I was hoping to mount the Gen II on the bolt gun but alas, two-day shipping is once again not two-days. Oh well, I'll just mount the older Gen I HD for tomorrow's range day. First was to dig out a piece of pizza. The wife goes to pottery class on Wednesday night and always brings me a giant piece from Bennie's. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4863-216326.jpg I weighed a box of 50 of the Peterson .260 brass akin to how I did with the Lapua and Alpha last week. The Peterson weighed in a bit heavier and with a higher SD, but again, this is in grains so the deviation is miniscule, 0.121 ounces. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4869-216327.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/Brass-Weights-216325.jpg View Quote I wonder where it would be if: 1. You fire it one time, or not fire it and just do the below 2. Size it 3. Neck turn it and weigh it again. I dont have a scale yet so I cant do it. Maybe even try that with the Alpha and Lapua |
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I appreciate the flashlight/plumb-bob info. Very good.
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
I went downstairs and mounted the Gen II. First I laid out a plumb line since my bubble level is 35mm and the tube is 34mm so, I'm using an alternate method. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4872-216399.jpg I put out the parts and pieces and mounted this 0MOA optic on the 20MOA top mount. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4874-216400.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4875-216401.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4876-216402.jpg The Spuhr has a bubble level so once the scope is mounted and you think the reticle is close to level, you can shine a flashlight through the front of the scope to project the reticle onto a background where you have your plumb line. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4877-216403.jpg You then rotate the scope to align the reticle to the plumb line and absent a level, you should be very close. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4878-216404.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4880-216405.jpg Torque to 25 INCH pounds. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4881-216406.jpg The ladies are ready for the line tomorrow. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4882-216398.jpg View Quote |
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If you seek to do battle with me this day, you will receive the best that I am capable of giving. It may not be enough, but it will be everything I have to give, and it will be impressive.
-B.Terry |
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
I guess two-day was two-day. Shipping notice said UPS and the brown truck passed me by, but FedEx just showed up with the goods. Looks like it's off to the basement to mount the beast. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4873-216337.jpg View Quote Fr8dog |
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I'm heading to Utah tomorrow!
With my family, RV and rzr. I don't think I will have time to do any serious shooting but will take the 260 just in case. Heading up to enjoy the cool weather and relax with the family. Do not think I will make it over to the big range. But if I do I will take pics and you guys will be the first to know. |
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Give the laziest man the hardest job and he will find the easiest way to do it.
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Oh and D3, that rifle looks awesome!
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Give the laziest man the hardest job and he will find the easiest way to do it.
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Originally Posted By rugerdog:
I'm heading to Utah tomorrow! With my family, RV and rzr. I don't think I will have time to do any serious shooting but will take the 260 just in case. Heading up to enjoy the cool weather and relax with the family. Do not think I will make it over to the big range. But if I do I will take pics and you guys will be the first to know. View Quote I'm thinking quite a few .260 sparrels were delivered this week, so people will be out shooting at some point. They may also be posting their results in the FDE thread so watch that thread for reports too. Back to packing up for the range. |
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I had a chance to enjoy some 23 Pappy when I was in DC at the Inauguration! Seemed like a good reason to celebrate. Nice collection too. I've found some Four Roses Single Barrel Private Selection OESO and Knob Creek Small Batch to please my pallet as well.
Originally Posted By Freakinout:
So my bourbon colored pee is a bad sign? Should I drink more bourbon? Hoping those rounds aren't going to underperform based no the seating depth View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Freakinout:
Originally Posted By Defender3:
Todays update deals with the Gorilla ammo. When I looked at the round it seemed the bullet was loaded far back into the case. I took a couple of pictures to show just how far the Berger 130gr is set in the case, obviously so it can load reliably in a gasser. I'll try and pull a round to see what kind of charge they are running. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4778-209452.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4779-209453.jpg https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4781-209455.jpg Today's social update is a proud report that I am now a Marine Corps certified range OIC and RSO. I attempted to uphold the honor of the USAF (retired) but failed as I did answer one question incorrectly. I knew the answer but overthought the question. The classroom portion was at the Basic Course's Heywood Hall. It's a modern building with nice classrooms and there was a basic course of instruction occurring with probably 200 Lts, give or take a few. The fun fact of the course was that there are a lot of LaRue Targets being used on Quantico ranges, and I'm not talking the 100 pack paper grid targets. Don't forget to hydrate and you won't since there's a sign at every urinal. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-4783-209825.jpg Hoping those rounds aren't going to underperform based no the seating depth |
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So the gorilla was hitting the lands in the bolt or gas gun? That is weird because the ogive of that bullet is pretty sharp. I assume it is the gorilla with 130 AR hybrid?
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Originally Posted By mettee:
So the gorilla was hitting the lands in the bolt or gas gun? That is weird because the ogive of that bullet is pretty sharp. I assume it is the gorilla with 130 AR hybrid? View Quote |
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Nice write up!
For the FGMM 142's, do you happen to know the COAL and BTO measurements? Also, what velocity was that producing? 130 eld-m...... |
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Originally Posted By MikeinNC:
Range day update for a 18" .260 barrel We made it out to the range today to put some rounds through my new PredatAR FDE Heavy with 18" .260 barrel. Great day shooting, and I was able to out shoot the LT shootist... barely http://i732.photobucket.com/albums/ww322/michaelinnc/IMG_1636.jpg http://i732.photobucket.com/albums/ww322/michaelinnc/IMG_1635.jpg This group was shot with FGMM 142gr, but later in the day I tried a couple 130gr factory Match loads from Hornady and Gorilla that my shooting buddy had in his range bag. Both of the 130gr loads were definitely grouping well; MVs were ~2550fps with the 18" barrel. MVs for the FGMM were just under 2600fps; however, I was disappointed to see a MV spread of more than 70fps with the FGMM test group. As far as functioning, I ended up running the rifle without the suppressor in the suppressed setting on the PST, and it ran smooth with perfect ejection (H2 buffer and red spring). Suppressed; however, the rifle was slightly overpassed (1 o'clock ejection and felt hard recoil on the buffer). I need to reassess at the next range day before changing buffers/springs. Thanks again Mark and LT team for developing and offering the .260 option for us! View Quote |
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Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
Originally Posted By Defender3:
MVs for which rifle, the bolt or the gasser? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Originally Posted By Blaster7R:
I would like to know for the Gasser.. I have 200 rd of 142gr FGMM and just installed my 18in .260 barrel 10 min ago.. give me a good starting info for my Applied ballistics app.. I was just going to drop 100FPS off what you put out as the MV for the 22inch one.. but a spot on number would be better lol View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Blaster7R:
Originally Posted By Defender3:
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Nice write up! For the FGMM 142's, do you happen to know the COAL and BTO measurements? Also, what velocity was that producing? 130 eld-m...... |
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
MVs for which rifle, the bolt or the gasser? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Defender3:
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Nice write up! For the FGMM 142's, do you happen to know the COAL and BTO measurements? Also, what velocity was that producing? 130 eld-m...... MikeinNC.....any FGMM loaded rounds left to measure? |
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Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Both would be nice. MikeinNC.....any FGMM loaded rounds left to measure? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Originally Posted By Defender3:
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Nice write up! For the FGMM 142's, do you happen to know the COAL and BTO measurements? Also, what velocity was that producing? 130 eld-m...... MikeinNC.....any FGMM loaded rounds left to measure? |
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.... I tried a couple 130gr factory Match loads from Hornady and Gorilla that my shooting buddy had in his range bag. Both of the 130gr loads were definitely grouping well; MVs were ~2550fps with the 18" barrel. MVs for the FGMM were just under 2600fps; however, I was disappointed to see a MV spread of more than 70fps with the FGMM test group. View Quote The prime and Hornady ELD-M was above 28XX for D3. D3, any MV data from the Gorilla? |
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
I was finally able to have someone take a picture of me shooting. I mean, after all, I know posting a pic of me is the highlight of the thread for so many of you. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/52736/IMG-1634-217175.jpg View Quote |
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Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
Originally Posted By mettee:
For the 130 hybrid that MV seems pretty low. You said it was recoiling pretty hard against the buffer.... The prime and Hornady ELD-M was above 28XX for D3. D3, any MV data from the Gorilla? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By mettee:
.... I tried a couple 130gr factory Match loads from Hornady and Gorilla that my shooting buddy had in his range bag. Both of the 130gr loads were definitely grouping well; MVs were ~2550fps with the 18" barrel. MVs for the FGMM were just under 2600fps; however, I was disappointed to see a MV spread of more than 70fps with the FGMM test group. The prime and Hornady ELD-M was above 28XX for D3. D3, any MV data from the Gorilla? I had 2669FPS average in the |
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Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
Back the Blue
1,000,000 view! Certified LaRue Armorer NRA Benefactor, Team Ranstad, Tennessee Squire |
Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
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Originally Posted By Defender3:
That 18" .260 barrel hasn't sped up yet. The FGMM was averaging 2557, but the ES was 72FPS and SD was 36.6FPS. The Gorilla was 2665fps with an ES of 26FPS and SD of 10.4FPS. I had 2669FPS average in the bolt with the Gorilla, ES was 44 and SD was 17.5. View Quote |
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I wouldn't take any fps numbers seriously until after 100-150 rounds down the barrel. Mine sped up and tightened up significantly after 100 rds.
I'm starting to think Hornady hit it out of the park with their 130 gr match load. I know that they perform great for me. |
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Give the laziest man the hardest job and he will find the easiest way to do it.
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I see the Alpha and Lapua are very close in weight and I'm sure they are of the same quality. I got 3 more boxes of Lapua last week and now I find out that Alpha has 10% off with code memorial10. The one thing I like about Alpha is the packaging, dinged case mouths are not an issue the way they do it. Lapua needs to take some notes in that area!
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Originally Posted By Aby001:
I see the Alpha and Lapua are very close in weight and I'm sure they are of the same quality. I got 3 more boxes of Lapua last week and now I find out that Alpha has 10% off with code memorial10. The one thing I like about Alpha is the packaging, dinged case mouths are not an issue the way they do it. Lapua needs to take some notes in that area! View Quote |
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Originally Posted By mettee:
Were all these numbers from the same 18" barrel or some of it your 22", I am assuming all the same 18" View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By mettee:
Originally Posted By Defender3:
That 18" .260 barrel hasn't sped up yet. The FGMM was averaging 2557, but the ES was 72FPS and SD was 36.6FPS. The Gorilla was 2665fps with an ES of 26FPS and SD of 10.4FPS. I had 2669FPS average in the bolt with the Gorilla, ES was 44 and SD was 17.5. |
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As an owner of three Gen I Razors, I thought I’d throw up some impressions of the Gen II. The obvious is the objective is larger (56mm vs 50mm) and the tube is smaller (34mm vs 35mm), but it retains the sort of sand / dark earth color of the HD scopes. From there the scope diverts from the Gen I in that the turrets are shorter, but wider, and they use a pop-up feature for locking, as well as a pretty cool side indicator that tells you how may rotations past zero you’ve made. The turrets are zero-stop and illumination is built into the side parallax turret, accessed by pulling the turret out and turning the knob to gain illumination. The knob also has an off function between each brightness setting, a nice touch. My Gen II is the 4.5-27x and my old eyes appreciated the extra power. I opted for the EBR-2C reticle which is in MOA, akin to every other optic I own so there’s no introduced errors as I struggle on the line with math.
The scope is heavy, 48ozs of beefiness, which (according to the interweb) is a good 6ozs more than some of the others such as S&B, USO, etc., and it’s about 10ozs heavier than my Gen I 5-20. Considering it’s in a Spuhr mount and on a beast of a rifle, I can live with the 6ozs. The EBR-2C reticle is nice for me, it’s not cluttered but it still offers the subtentions you need for hold-overs. The crosshairs are a bit wider than a S&B, I suspect it could be for the illumination function but don’t quote me on that one, but they are thinner than on my Gen I. According to the web, the Gen I is 0.05 thick whereas the Gen II is 0.03 and I believe the S&B is 0.02 thick. The main crosshairs have ½ MOA subtentions (0.5, 1.0, 1.5 etc.) versus others that may have four subdivisions per MOA (0.25, 0.5, 0.75, 1.0). At first I thought that could be an issue, but the center of the crosshair is a 0.06 open circle and the subtentions are similar as my Gen I. I really don’t think the lack of divisions will present an issue for the shooting I do, which is static, I won’t be running around the countryside shooting anytime soon. The subtentions extend down for holdovers with the 1 and 2 MOA holdover extending to 2MOA and the 3&4 extending to 3MOA and the 5&6 extending out to 4MOA. Each of these subtentions are in 1/4MOA divisions and they are numbered 1 – 6 so you know how much you’re holding over. I did not do a ladder test, I’ll let someone else shoot up $20 of ammo if they want. The glass is very clear and I can tell the difference from my Gen I. There is no shadow / glare / distortion or color mitigation on the edges and there was plenty of light through the tube, again, great for my old eyes. My uncalibrated eyeballs liked the glass, it was clear, showed contrast and there was a sharpness to the targets that made it easy to get on target. I did not get any tunneling through the range of magnification and again, the clarity of the image was superior. This is not a S&B, but it’s close and for the money (military discount) I think it was a great value. One issue I had was the eye box, not because of the scope, but because of the 1.5” Spuhr mount I selected. I used the scope height calculator that recommended 1.5” over bore due to the 56mm objective but what I failed to account for was the Mausingfield has a 20MOA rail. After raising my cheekpiece really high to compensate I was able to shoot pretty well, but I did order a 1.18” Spuhr mount. I measured, remeasured and measured again and with the 1.18” I should have plenty of clearance for the bolt and still have 2-3mm for the objective over the barrel. Once it arrives I remount and rezero and see if it settles me a bit, but no matter, it will be easier to maintain the correct eyebox. Overall I’m very happy with the Gen II and for what I paid, I think I have a premier piece of glass, full lifetime warranty also. |
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Gorilla ammo is on sale this weekend - go to their site and order direct.
Gorilla 260 Ammo ETA - Free shipping on 10 or more boxes, saves you $12. |
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Originally Posted By Freakinout:
I don't think its ever humid enough in NM to pickup a vapor trail View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Freakinout:
Originally Posted By dHUTCH:
He may not have had enough humidity in WI to get a good vapor trail. Shooting in and around Houston we always had a solid vapor trail from my 6.5x47 Lapua. Shooting 300win mag in New Mexico was tough to pick up on one. |
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"Peace has cost you your strength and victory has defeated you!"
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Originally Posted By ziarifleman:
Oh yes it is. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By ziarifleman:
Originally Posted By Freakinout:
Originally Posted By dHUTCH:
He may not have had enough humidity in WI to get a good vapor trail. Shooting in and around Houston we always had a solid vapor trail from my 6.5x47 Lapua. Shooting 300win mag in New Mexico was tough to pick up on one. |
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Carry it, shoot it. (repeat forever)
Hard Livin' Clean Given' Cool Driven. - WWIIWMD God Bless Texas "... it's the socialism, stupid." - RL |
Shameless plug - If you're thinking of ordering anything this weekend, consider Quantico Tactical. They have 20% off storewide /website (code MEMORIAL17) and 100% of their proceeds are supporting the Duskin and Stephens Foundation.
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Originally Posted By mettee:
I like to ask questions I try and crunch all the details in my mind View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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