| So to be clear, you are comparing an accidental key stroke to possibly killing or hurting someone or something with a gun? If only the things I say and did carried as much weight as you are apparently giving me credit for, we wouldnt be in this mess in the first place. That makes sense, those who are completely faultless and have never made a mistake please cast the first stone.....I'll be waiting. In the meantime, try talking to those who are trying to pass the bill as opposed to eating your own. |
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http://i.imgur.com/GyfMyzv.jpg Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". |
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF  the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this. The clock is ticking and "silence = guilt" when it comes to social media lynchings. |
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Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. |
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He didn't make the call that started this bullshit - he's probably just covering his ass, following procedure, and hoping to keep his job at the end of the day - can't fault him for that. There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. Quoted:
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Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. |
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He didn't make the call that started this bullshit - he's probably just covering his ass, following procedure, and hoping to keep his job at the end of the day - can't fault him for that. There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. Quoted:
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Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. He said I wasn't the only guy to ask. In the end... I'm gonna call SA HQ later this week and try to get an answer. |
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Waiting for the excuse of "Don’t worry, if it is passed, it be repealed on Jan 1, 2028, per the bill."
Bill text More WTF? 8 (g) A licensee shall make a photo copy of a buyer's or 9transferee's valid photo I.D. card whenever a sale transaction 10takes place. The photo copy shall be attached to the 11documentation detailing the record of sale. |
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I agree. He said I wasn't the only guy to ask. In the end... I'm gonna call SA HQ later this week and try to get an answer. Quoted:
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Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". There are a lot of hard working Springfield employees that had no say in their involvement and they're the ones that are going to get fucked royally by this decision. Hell, most of them were likely blindsided as well. He said I wasn't the only guy to ask. In the end... I'm gonna call SA HQ later this week and try to get an answer. Let us know what SA HQ says. I have multiple XD products and am holding out hope. |
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http://i.imgur.com/GyfMyzv.jpg Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". |
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l So why was a cut out made for Springfield and RRA in the bill if it was just a mistake on a form? Sorry, you got caught, called out on it and now you are scrambling for a plausible excuse. I don't believe you traitor. As for RRA, SA and IFMA, I cant believe they have not responded yet which isnt looking good for them. |
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this. |
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curious minds want to know Quoted:
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Was the bill modified at some point to exempt Illinois manufacturers? And if so, why and who lobbied for it? |
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Waiting for the excuse of "Don’t worry, if it is passed, it be repealed on Jan 1, 2028, per the bill." Bill text More WTF? 8 (g) A licensee shall make a photo copy of a buyer's or 9transferee's valid photo I.D. card whenever a sale transaction 10takes place. The photo copy shall be attached to the 11documentation detailing the record of sale. 
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| Someone lobbied for the manufacturer "cut out". That's where I'm still unclear. The grabbers didn't just put that in for giggles. It was bargained. And the inclusion feels much more like a concession than a CYA. Seems my stance as a manucturer and 2A supporter would be that the bill is shitty as-is and I'm opposed. It either gets shot down wth my push for a no vote, or we get out of Dodge. |
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Inform yourself before you speak, it will help you in the long run. 
But you're right.....earlier I assumed Kellar has switched his position again when, in fact, I was looking at his original position on the unamended bill. I cleared leather and fired from the hip without asking questions first. FWIW, I believe you when you say you screwed up the form. Your organization's name sounding close to Kellar's IFMA doesn't help those of us in the pitchfork and tar crowd who are chomping at the bit for a good ol' fashioned hanging. For the slow ones.....ITFT is *NOT* IFMA! |
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Then they need to come out swinging... HARD. The clock is ticking and "silence = guilt" when it comes to social media lynchings. Quoted:
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this. The clock is ticking and "silence = guilt" when it comes to social media lynchings. The lack of a response looks more like a response as more time goes on. |
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Illinois Tactical Firearms Training Institute, Inc.
We aren't that familiar with these folks but there is no reason not to believe their slip filing was a mistake. Our members have made the same mistake and if you aren't diligent, it can happen. RRA....they are at least complicit in the fact that they are paying someone to lobby on their behalf without giving them guidance or supervision. At some point, I'm sure their lobbyist reported to them what was going on. Someone other than himself had to say that the deal was good enough for them to not oppose. The question is...how do they unring the bell? These are two great manufacturers...we would hate to lose either of them. As far as individuals getting rid of their guns that they already have....Don't blame the child for the sins of the father. Besides, if this bill passes and you live in IL, you may have to drive a long way to find a FFL to replace it!!! 
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I've said it a couple of times in this thread and the other one. It's 2017. You have 48 hours at most before negative social media significantly damages your corporate reputation. A carefully scripted, lawyer approved statement from your CEO issued at the 49th hour is too fucking late. Rock River had better get a smart social media person on to this or they will go down with the ship. If you have a corporate social media account, it has to be monitored 24/7/365 by a smart competent adult. |
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Maybe he knows that if he makes any attempt to comment on it...a job which he was not hired to do....he's not a company spokesman or PR dude... he would get fired. Quoted:
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http://i.imgur.com/GyfMyzv.jpg Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". |
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Disparaging the NRA and it's members isn't going to help you go anywhere. Quoted:
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You mean kinda like the majority of NRA members? They donate and don't check up on what they do. |
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TTAG has a new article up
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/04/john-boch/springfield-rock-river-illinois-sell-picking-pieces/ Springfield and Rock River Illinois Sell-Out: Picking up the Pieces |
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When are you people going to learn...he's not wrong. How many Life members couldn't be bothered to return their forms? How many that did vote voted for the new bullshit change in rules because the NRA said to do it? How many members at the show voted for the NY fudd because the NRA told them to do so? Quoted:
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You mean kinda like the majority of NRA members? They donate and don't check up on what they do. |
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When are you going to learn that your status on AR15 doesn't mean shit to the rest of the world and shit talking isn't going to help?
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http://i.imgur.com/GyfMyzv.jpg Spoke with Justin Pertrick today. I asked and went over in detail what I knew. He was polite and respectful. But basically the official line from him was "No Comment". Large corporations like mine are notoriously slow moving so if we can pull something like that off in less than a day SA has no excuse. At this point in time the benefit of the doubt fund I have for them is empty. |
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So to be clear, you are comparing an accidental key stroke to possibly killing or hurting someone or something with a gun? If only the things I say and did carried as much weight as you are apparently giving me credit for, we wouldnt be in this mess in the first place. That makes sense, those who are completely faultless and have never made a mistake please cast the first stone.....I'll be waiting. In the meantime, try talking to those who are trying to pass the bill as opposed to eating your own. You stated the reason behind your position and I genuinely believe the submission was a mistake. I remember something similar happened when our CCW law was introduced to the house/senate. |
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You failed to address any of my statements though. What is your solution? Sit around and continue to do whatever they say? That just worked out really well. Quoted:
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When are you going to learn that your status on AR15 doesn't mean shit to the rest of the world and shit talking isn't going to help? To think the NRA has the power to turn over laws like the GCA overnight is ridiculous. |
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this.  so the" those arent my pants" card would work on you wouldnt it. I dont believe them and you thinking thats a great reason for it to all be okay makes me dissapointed in you.
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Where's the statement then? They know what happened. They could post a statement but they're keeping quiet. That's not the way to handle this. Quoted:
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this. |
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The NRA is evolving but it takes time and many folks take for granted there has been no renewal of an AWB. I'll give the NRA credit for that. To think the NRA has the power to turn over laws like the GCA overnight is ridiculous. Quoted:
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When are you going to learn that your status on AR15 doesn't mean shit to the rest of the world and shit talking isn't going to help? To think the NRA has the power to turn over laws like the GCA overnight is ridiculous. |
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No, really guys RRA and Springfield had absolutely no idea what the lobby group they fund were up to!  Now, here's what we will have to believe in order to think RRA was hoodwinked: -RRA did not know about major gun legislation in their own state that would significantly affect their business. -They somehow forgot about this lobbying organization, to which they were one of the 2 major contributors. -If the above didn't occur, RRA still didn't raise any public objection to their name being leveraged in antigun legislation. -Their senior leadership, so stunned by the misuse of their name, were rendered incapable of producing at least a token public refutation. Or: -Their senior leadership is ensconced in a faraday cage at NRA and amazingly managed to Captain Hazelwood their company's reputation into the rocks. Alternatively, they got caught in an influence peddling scheme to give RRA and Springfield Armory special handling and lock out future manufacturers. They're hoping the furor will settle and the bill will die, after which they will issue a face-saving non-incriminating public non-apology. |
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MiamiJBT's attitude stems from the NRA's "A" endorsement of a candidate who turned out to be anti-gun. Nothing has been said or done by the NRA, so it's the same situation people are condemning RRA for.
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The NRA is evolving but it takes time and many folks take for granted there has been no renewal of an AWB. I'll give the NRA credit for that. To think the NRA has the power to turn over laws like the GCA overnight is ridiculous. Quoted:
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When are you going to learn that your status on AR15 doesn't mean shit to the rest of the world and shit talking isn't going to help? To think the NRA has the power to turn over laws like the GCA overnight is ridiculous. |
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Disparaging the NRA and it's members isn't going to help you go anywhere. Quoted:
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You mean kinda like the majority of NRA members? They donate and don't check up on what they do. |
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The guys on the floor are just that. Guys on the floor. Gonna have to get word from HQ and that will be this week via phone and email. Quoted:
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RRA was truly in disbelief. When I spoke to them they were pretty much going "WTF the lobbying group did WHAT?!?!?"
I honestly believe the RRA might have been played in this. |