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Posted: 7/5/2017 7:50:13 PM EDT
Okay, so with any of my other pistols I can hit just fine, pretty much where I want with well aimed fire all day. But this Glock 30S, nope. It's all over the damn place! Normally to the left but not always, seems to "pattern" about a 1' circle / 6" anywhere around my point of aim at 20'. That's completely unacceptable! I have tried "giving it more finger" as I normally shoot with the end of my trigger finger, but tried just sticking my whole finger in on this thing and it seemed to help, sometimes... I'll take my time and line up the sighs well, bring the trigger back getting the take up out, and have a pertty good break but one impact will be 6" left, then 6" high, then 7" left, then 3" right WTF!? I swear I can shoot that stupid little LCP better than this! And it's got to have the worst trigger on any pistol...and a shorter sight radius.

My Ruger LCP, MKIV 22/45 Lite, SA 1911 R.O. I can all shoot them many times better. So wtf, is it something I need to change JUST for shooting this damn thing, or did I get a lemon? I'm tempted to sell it and look for something else, but it checks the box's I was looking for in a carry .45 so well, but wtf good is it if I can't hit shit with it!

I did just notice some "mush" after the take up but before the break when dry firing... maybe that's what's screwing me up? (going to go shoot a few more rounds and see, brb)

ETA: Okay, so groups just shrank a lot... still the least accurate hand gun I have, but it's at least acceptable now. What parts can I change to get rid of that mush at the end just before the break and have a cleaner end of take up and break? Yes I could shoot thousands of rounds and get acceptable with the pos factory trigger, but ugh, no. ETE... that mush doesn't always seem to be there... it's weird, somtimes it is, and sometimes it just breaks unexpectedly / surprised by it.
Link Posted: 7/5/2017 7:55:56 PM EDT
[#1]
In for this fun one..

My buddies 17 shoots like shit too. Never been a fan.
Link Posted: 7/5/2017 10:44:16 PM EDT
[#2]
I had a bit of mush before the break on mine as well, did the polish job on internals and it now breaks really crisp and smooth. Makes a big difference on my groups.
Link Posted: 7/5/2017 10:51:45 PM EDT
[#3]
It's a snappy gun. You're probably anticipating the shot.
Link Posted: 7/5/2017 11:35:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
My Ruger LCP, MKIV 22/45 Lite, SA 1911 R.O. I can all shoot them many times better.
View Quote


MkIV and the 1911 are 100 yard pistols, the Glock is MAYBE a 50 Yard Pistol.

The Glock is designed to hit a bad guy running at self defense distances

-Grip tight, this will solve your wandering Zero
-Put a minus connector in, and a reduced saftey plunger spring
-Less effort focusing on sight alignment and more time on grip and smooth trigger pull
Link Posted: 7/6/2017 1:03:23 AM EDT
[#5]
Indian not the arrow.
Link Posted: 7/6/2017 5:52:32 AM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
Indian not the arrow.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Indian not the arrow.
Some arrow's are easier for this Indian to shoot than others.

Quoted:
-Grip tight, this will solve your wandering Zero
-Put a minus connector in, and a reduced saftey plunger spring
-Less effort focusing on sight alignment and more time on grip and smooth trigger pull
I'll give that a try, thank you for your reply.
Link Posted: 7/6/2017 9:43:43 AM EDT
[#7]
The low hanging fruit is generally grip and trigger control.

You are probably not gripping consistently from shot to shot.  You're almost certainly not pressing the trigger consistently.  (From your description)

I'd encourage you to watch the Ron Avery/ Tactical Performance Center videos on grip on Youtube.
Link Posted: 7/9/2017 5:48:50 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Okay, so with any of my other pistols I can hit just fine, pretty much where I want with well aimed fire all day. But this Glock 30S, nope. It's all over the damn place!
View Quote
Unless there is a physical issue with the firearm, it's you, not the pistol.

I have tried "giving it more finger" as I normally shoot with the end of my trigger finger, but tried just sticking my whole finger in on this thing and it seemed to help, sometimes
View Quote
Don't do that. The pad of the finger is fine.


This is troubling.

I did just notice some "mush" after the take up but before the break when dry firing... that mush doesn't always seem to be there... it's weird, somtimes it is, and sometimes it just breaks unexpectedly / surprised by it.
View Quote


It should always be the same trigger press unless a)it's been worked on, b)something is in there rattling around, or c) it's an adjustable trigger not locked down.

Far as 'mush', if it is a new gun, or a lightly used used gun, it may, like others, just need breaking in.

If by 'mush' you mean travel to break, yes, Glocks have a lot of travel RELATIVE to other guns. It is worse than the 1911 platform. It to me isn't as bad as a 3rd Gen DAO S&W semi. You can get trigger kits to shorten this, but be advised: Glocks aren't designed for zero take up or light triggers. Tinkering with that can make them less safe.


Quoted:


MkIV and the 1911 are 100 yard pistols, the Glock is MAYBE a 50 Yard Pistol.

The Glock is designed to hit a bad guy running at self defense distances
View Quote
No.

That's not based in any scientifically, academically tested protocol.


Sir,

If you have no experience operating a striker-fired trigger, it may feel 'off' or different to you, and that will manifest itself in poor grouping and dissatisfaction.

I will tell you that unless something way, way, WAY out of the ordinary is happening, it's never the firearm. Ever. Best way to demonstrate that is get someone who is good on striker fired firearms to try it.

If multiple people can't shoot it, including someone that carries the same pistol, then you can pronounce the pistol.

Otherwise, you have to drop back to the very basics. Are you getting the proper grip on the pistol? Some are more forgiving than others. Are you getting good sight alignment? Is your trigger movement causing the gun to go off-target? There's no magic trigger or grip or stance that will alleviate this, but people will sell you all three.

Start at the three yard line. Make them touch, if not one hole. When that works, push out two yards. Won't feel like any distance, but watch your groups open. Fix that.

Keep moving back until you are as far back as you want to be. If that's 100 yards, ok. The Glock is well capable of it, any Glock. Don't believe me, I'll get someone to take your money all day long (not me, my hands shake and I can't see that dang far!!! lol)

There are few firearms I can't shoot well at the distances I train for. You should be the same; it will just take some self-reflection and burnt powder to get there.
Link Posted: 7/11/2017 9:26:46 PM EDT
[#9]
I bought the gun new, maybe shot 250 rounds through it. I'll try the up close and moving back suggestion. It's just damn frustrating being able to shoot soda cans at 30 yards with the 1911, and no where near it with the Glock. It probably is me and not being used to striker fired pistols.
Link Posted: 7/14/2017 6:29:01 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I bought the gun new, maybe shot 250 rounds through it. I'll try the up close and moving back suggestion. It's just damn frustrating being able to shoot soda cans at 30 yards with the 1911, and no where near it with the Glock. It probably is me and not being used to striker fired pistols.
View Quote
This.  Every new trigger you attempt to master requires relinquishing your preconceptions.  The 1911, G19, J-frame, 92, MkIII, LCP, USP, M&P Shield...each one you commit to mastering will require you to, more or less, start over.

You will build competency faster on subsequent platforms, but you will still start (relatively) in the same place.  It makes little to no difference how well you can shoot your 1911...when there's a Glock in your hand.
Link Posted: 7/17/2017 7:50:08 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


MkIV and the 1911 are 100 yard pistols, the Glock is MAYBE a 50 Yard Pistol.

The Glock is designed to hit a bad guy running at self defense distances

-Grip tight, this will solve your wandering Zero
-Put a minus connector in, and a reduced saftey plunger spring
-Less effort focusing on sight alignment and more time on grip and smooth trigger pull
View Quote
I went to a course with shooters who were dinging steel at 100+ with 17s, 19s, and 22s.
Link Posted: 7/17/2017 7:59:57 PM EDT
[#12]
Do you have the stock plastic sights?  Change them out for a good set of steel sights that allows daylight between the notch and post.  This will let you focus on the front sight much more effectively.  
Link Posted: 7/18/2017 3:07:46 AM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I bought the gun new, maybe shot 250 rounds through it. I'll try the up close and moving back suggestion. It's just damn frustrating being able to shoot soda cans at 30 yards with the 1911, and no where near it with the Glock. It probably is me and not being used to striker fired pistols.
View Quote
I hear ya!  It took me awhile to get on the Glock. I came from revolvers, so I knew what a good trigger was. Glocks aren't bad, just... different.

You sound well grounded. Don't sell yourself (or the pistol) short. Just slow up, get centered, and get back on the basics. It will come.
Link Posted: 7/28/2017 11:47:49 PM EDT
[#14]
I'm sure I will be in the minority in this:  You have too many handguns with different triggers/grips/calibers/etc.

I have always been of the mind that I should only use/train with one type of handgun.  Have I owned, shot and carried multiple types in the past?  Sure, but it was either in my early days trying to figure out what fit me best, or when I was limited to what I was issued.  Can I handle just about any NATO or Warsaw Pact weapon out there?  Yes, enough to hold my own.  In the end, I always gravitated back to the Glock 19, and it has been that one and only handgun for several years now.  Even when I go to the range with friends or family, if they have a handgun I have shot before, I do not shoot it, I just stick with what I have.

"As you train, so shall you fight" is a motto that has stuck with me for a very long time, and I have tried to impart that to the people I have trained.  Owning multiple types of handguns can be fun and cool, but you have to really get down to brass tacks as to the reason why you own/carry multiple systems.  Are they "fun guns"?  Do you have a summer carry, and a winter carry, and a "I'm only running down to the 7-11" carry?  Are they tools or are they accessories?

Whatever you choose, my best advice will always remain the same; find what works for you, stick with it, and train like it is your last day on earth with it.  Your life may just depend on it.
Link Posted: 8/20/2017 10:28:32 AM EDT
[#15]
I dumped my sigs and cz and have been transitioning to 9mm glocks, for a number of different reasons, many of which are irrelevant to your questions. One thing I liked about glock was the consistency and uniformity of the platform, one of the consistent things I did not like, was how I shot it. First took it out and shot great. 2nd range trip was all to the left, 3rd trip.... it goes on. This was standard tacticool thumbs forward shooting. Doing some shooting with a buddy who plays doc on an SRT team, the suggestion of old school thumbs down and tucked (strong hand thumb tight and down against the frame, support thumb wrapping down over strong hand thumb) came up. I felt kind of stupid, but locked the arms out and tucked those thumbs down. Wham bam I'm shooting well again.
Link Posted: 8/23/2017 5:58:33 AM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Do you have the stock plastic sights?  Change them out for a good set of steel sights that allows daylight between the notch and post.  This will let you focus on the front sight much more effectively.  
View Quote
Yeah, still the stock sights. I haven't looked too hard but I have been looking for some metal ones that I think I'll like. Nothing has jumped out at me though.
Link Posted: 11/12/2017 4:08:39 PM EDT
[#17]
Watched a video where Jerry Miculek was explaining some things and tried changing my grip and stance, seems to have helped a good bit.

I was always taught and shot with a weaver stance. Just tried isosceles stance and hooking my left index finger on the front of the trigger guard, lot of changes to incorporate at once and try to keep correct but i rapid fired until slide lock and was much more pleased. Friend of mine has a house in the middle of no where, where I have neighbors on either side of my property so I'm going to head over there this coming weekend I think and zero my new rifle as well as practice this more.
Link Posted: 11/14/2017 2:01:48 PM EDT
[#18]
I would ditch the index finger hooking around the front of the trigger guard.
Link Posted: 11/14/2017 2:34:21 PM EDT
[#19]
Yeah when I do that sometimes I pull the muzzle to the left. I notice it when I am attempting to line up the sights. So I'll probably stop trying that and just do my normal grip with this (new to me) stance.

Another issue I isolated is the Remington UMC plinking ammo inward using has a ridicules crimp on it. (.45ACP) so that may be effecting things as well.
Link to crazy Remington ammo thread w/pictures.

I plan to fire a mag of both the UMC and my reloads out of both the G30s and my 1911 to see how much of a difference the ammo is making.
Link Posted: 11/16/2017 1:50:45 PM EDT
[#20]
Well, I'm sick of trying to figure out how to get decent groups with it,  it's gong on the EE.

G30s

1911


The shot to the left I pulled, i knew it soon as the shot broke, I was firing a hair to fast.
Link Posted: 11/22/2017 3:51:45 AM EDT
[#21]
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Quoted:

Start at the three yard line. Make them touch, if not one hole. When that works, push out two yards. Won't feel like any distance, but watch your groups open. Fix that.
View Quote
Solid advice. I work at a range and often see this issue manifest with Glocks (and some other striker fired pistols as well). When I was first new to Glocks, I had the same issue since I started on 1911's and then on to Hammer fired H&K's. Took a little bit for me to get used to the Glocks in stock form but, once I put the work in, things eventually got better.

Whenever I help out friends and new shooters, I start them on the same drill high_order1 suggested and it definitely helps concentrate more on manipulating the Glock trigger versus trying to chase down smaller groups at longer distances. It allows you to refine all the basics. The old adage "Aim small miss small" comes to mind.

When I shoot my 1911's now, it almost feels like cheating.
Link Posted: 11/26/2017 7:23:09 PM EDT
[#22]
Shot my brothers full size first gen XDm today. Yeah soo going to sell the Glock (listed in the EE right now) and buy one. Shot a group that was several times better, like WAAAY better than the Glock's. The first 5 or so of 13 were touching, and the group was probably around 2.5" First time ever firing it and at a moderate pace. I'm sure with some practice and or slowing down a bit I could have done far better. Stock trigger and sights were both better as well. So that just reaffirmed my dislike for the Glock.
Link Posted: 11/26/2017 8:52:46 PM EDT
[#23]
Was your dislike present before you bought it?
Link Posted: 11/26/2017 9:32:30 PM EDT
[#24]
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Quoted:
Was your dislike present before you bought it?
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Other than thinking they looked like bricks, not really. And the 30S and a few others with the more tapered/chamfered front of the slide look better than most Glocks IMO. It very well may have more to do with the fact that it's a compact *shrug*.
Link Posted: 11/26/2017 11:24:31 PM EDT
[#25]
The first time I ever shot a Glock, I already didn't like them. After that, I liked them even less. After I got over myself, and actually applied what I supposed to with an open mind, I did exponentially better. I'm not saying that's your situation; just giving my experience.
Link Posted: 11/30/2017 3:04:06 PM EDT
[#26]
A modern 1911 is an expensive, high quality, precision fit instrument. You sacrifice capacity, weight and a little bit of reliability (though nowhere near as much as Glock shooters think) to get the best trigger pull ever attained on a handgun, along with excellent ergonomics. I've only shot such pistols a few times (and even then, only custom shop Colts, not something really fancy like a Les Baer or Wilson or something). I personally shoot 1911s poorly because my natural point of aim is way off due to a lifetime of only shooting Glocks.

With the Glock, you get what is arguably the most reliable handgun ever made, which is inexpensive, high capacity, and mildly recoiling. The main cost is a long, creepy trigger pull. A stock Glock is plenty accurate if you can pull the trigger well. I personally have an issue jerking Glocks to the left. It is an ongoing process. I've been shooting a lot more lately, and have largely diagnosed the problem. With a death grip from both hands, using a ton of trigger finger, and consciously trying to pull the trigger to the right, my shots stay centered.

Here is video from my most recent practice session. As you can see, when I do jerk shots which averages one per bill drill, I still jerk them left. I have replaced the trigger with a flat face trigger and lightened it a bit, which helps a bit.

Roland Special Bill drills, 11-27-2017
Link Posted: 11/30/2017 8:12:32 PM EDT
[#27]
Yeah... I'm just going to trade it for an XDm. I shoot them far better, and then I have 13+1. Carrying a full size pistol is not an issue for me now so rather than spend a lot of money on ammo and time shooting just to get to where I am by picking up an XDm...i'm just going to trade for an XDm, gain capacity and then go from there and try to get as good as I am with the 1911 with it.
Link Posted: 2/2/2019 2:45:40 AM EDT
[#28]
Only issue I've ever had was that the grip angle required me to alter my presentation a bit to be on target by the time my arms were extended.

I can say the the XDM is a great gun, aside from the severe lack of grip texture--my hand sweat, so I prefer something more aggressive like the RTF 2 or 3 on Glock (I can't believe they called the original texture "rough"). Anyway, back to the XDM--my brother-in-law had the 4.5" model in .45ACP. The controls were great (he bought it specifically for the ambi mag release, which I believe is a fantastic design in a push button configuration), it shot smooth, low recoil impulse, good trigger, great all around-aside from texture... He left it in my care for a few years when they were in Europe for the service, and I carried it daily for quite a while--ended up returning it to him with several additional mags and holsters.

All that to say my daily carry has been a G19 since a year or two after the gen 4 was released.
Link Posted: 2/16/2019 11:02:38 AM EDT
[#29]
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Quoted:

the Glock is MAYBE a 50 Yard Pistol.
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Well that's just silly.

I'm no Space Force Recon Scout SEAL Ranger sniper, but I can make 100 yard hits on 2/3 silhouettes with a stock 19, and Black Rifle Coffee Company posted a vid on Instagram where the shooter made a one handed shot at a piece of steel 250 yards out while drinking coffee with the other hand.

I get that it's fun to bash on certain manufacturers, but Glocks are plenty mechanically accurate.
Link Posted: 2/16/2019 11:45:18 AM EDT
[#30]
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Quoted:
Well that's just silly.

I'm no Space Force Recon Scout SEAL Ranger sniper, but I can make 100 yard hits on 2/3 silhouettes with a stock 19, and Black Rifle Coffee Company posted a vid on Instagram where the shooter made a one handed shot at a piece of steel 250 yards out while drinking coffee with the other hand.

I get that it's fun to bash on certain manufacturers, but Glocks are plenty mechanically accurate.
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Quoted:
Quoted:

the Glock is MAYBE a 50 Yard Pistol.
Well that's just silly.

I'm no Space Force Recon Scout SEAL Ranger sniper, but I can make 100 yard hits on 2/3 silhouettes with a stock 19, and Black Rifle Coffee Company posted a vid on Instagram where the shooter made a one handed shot at a piece of steel 250 yards out while drinking coffee with the other hand.

I get that it's fun to bash on certain manufacturers, but Glocks are plenty mechanically accurate.
In all seriousness the model 30S I had, there was something wrong with that thing. I shot patterns, not groups. My fathers G22 and my G45 are both good shooters that shoot tight groups. That 30S at 25 feet to the target, you were lucky to keep them in a 18" "pattern". I have no idea what the hell it's issue was, but... yeah, something was wrong with it. The trigger was also odd compared to any other Glock I have shot, it never felt completely consistent, super spungy then didn't seem to break at the same point every time. Nothing keyholed though so I don't have the first clue as to why.
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