User Panel
Posted: 1/2/2006 1:09:58 PM EDT
From the discussion at subguns.com, it appears that the Attourney General has issued an opinion that all MGs are legal for residents to own, and not just C&R guns.
Opinion # 7183 has not yet been uploaded on the state website, but when it is, you can read it here. Type in 7183 in the opinon number box. I have not yet read the text of the opinion, only relaying what I have read elsewhere. I'm interested because I may be moving to MI in the near future for a year or so. I was looking into getting a deposit box in Indianna somewhere to keep my toys in, but this would be much better. |
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Man! I hope this is true!
I could see a few MG's in My future if it is!!!!! I Hope!, I Hope!, I Hope! Tall Shadow |
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From what i heard it is true, I'll have to sell my harley now and buy a real Krinkov and a few suppressors and SBR a few of my guns , now i'm broke. lol I posted this topic over on gunboards yesterday. heres the link McM
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Looks like the cat is out of the bag.
As I understand it, this has not been forewarded to ATF yet nor has it been uploaded to the State web site. Sounds like just a few more chips need to fall into place. I have read the 10 page opinion folks, this looks rock solid. Pray that there is not a knee jerk reaction now to pass newer restrictive laws. Anybody want to loan me about 12K for a registered reciever? |
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Oh man ,oh man now i just need to get a couple more jobs and sell my a few organs..
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I read it as well, and agree that its everything we could hope for. It should be on the AG's website soon. You need to sell that AR18 Lumpy :) |
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Ooohhh I can't wait!!! I see at least a M-11 in my near future and some other goodies!!
BTW, if anyone has a copy of the 10 page opinion could you email it to gundecals (at) sbcglobal.net ? I'd appreciate it. Kris |
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Should I insert a shamelss plug for my transfer services here?
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I know you'll be my new crack dealer Dave :) |
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All hail the Candy Man! |
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This is the one thing I am concerned about. We shall see in time I suppose. But, as they say....can't make an omlet without breaking a few eggs.... |
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Locate Opinion No.: 7183
1963 - to date Opinion Not Found Opinion No. Date Headnote [ /opinion/findsngl.asp ] Quoted: Should I insert a shamelss plug for my transfer services here? Can you be my new silenced crack dealer? |
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Get your paperwork started NOW. The ATF has been known to move slower than plate techtonics with approvals lately, you want to get your transfers approved and take posession before Granhole gets the opportunity to railroad a piece of counter legislation through.
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It hasn't been uploaded yet. Be patient. |
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For those that have read the letter, Does it apply to all nfa and aow firearms?
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Actually this is not the case. This fall they completed their move to West Virgina and have a whole new crew. Transfers are moving at record speeds lately. My form 3's which were running 60 -90 days have been getting done in 3, 4 and 5 weeks. Pretty impressive change. Everyone I have spoken with can speek English too...that is a nice plus. Oh, and they are actually personable, they don't act like you are bothering them. All in all a great change. The counter legislation I am concerned about. |
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Seems to just address the issue of the word "License" and how that is interpreted. The provisions prohibiting SBS and SBR may still stand and that was not mentioned in the opinion as I read it.
I believe AOW's were OK before. |
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Only need $9500, Sendra and Olys have been running that for the last few months. SP1 conversions I have seen as low as $8900. Of course.....the demand will now drive the price up....our little situation and the Shrike actually shipping a few units. |
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Yeah, what prevented regular transferable MGs up until this opinion, was a previous opinion referencing MCL 750.224. This opinion basically says that a signed form 4 from the BATFE satisfies the licensing requirement in MI Law. However, only MGs and suppressors are defined/discussed in MCL 750.224 so SBRs and SBS are still not legal (although you can put a short barrel on a legal MG) because they are expressly forbidden in other pats of the MCL. AOWs were previously legal and remain so. |
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I just hope you misread that. I really really want my sbr Krink!!!!!! I don't want to build it as a dumb pistol!!! As for AOW's, they've been OK all along. I beleive DD's are too. BTW, I need a silencer just like you have for my piece-o-crap P22. That way no one at the pit will know when it misfired. Kris |
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I wonder if there's someone we should write? Should we lay low and wait?
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This better NOT be a joke. As I sit here in utter disbelief. Pinch me please! |
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+1 I'll believe it when I see it |
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I think I've shot that Krink over in Wyoming Michigan. Do you know if that is the same one that Sherridan Arms brought with them? I' assuming a transferrable Krink isn't too cheap though. Kris |
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That ain't going to happen. Short Barreled Rifles will still be a no no. |
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Lumpy, is this an opinion or did the legislature pass something? Some of the things that I have read so far say opinion but others say something was passed. Is this a new AG opinion? |
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New AG opinion. |
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I'm still waiting to see the official letter. But I'm thinking in the mean time:
When does this go into effect? I understand that it may take some time before ATF has updated their files and start approving paperwork. That means there would be a wait on Form 1 & 4 registrations. The same would be true of people that own NFA stuff in other states. They have to wait for ATF to approve a 5320 before they can bring stuff in. However, silencers do not require any approval prior to crossing state lines. If the "opinion" has force of law right now, someone could bring in a silencer from out of state today. I just don't feel like being the unlucky test subject. |
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We need this to happen in Californistan.
According to the letter of the law, MGs ARE legal for the general public to own. But they've made it impossible through red tape. |
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Any updates on this? I would be really curious to know if this in in fact the gospel truth or a less than nice internet rumor sent out by the ATF in the hopes of ensnaring some unlucky Michiganders.
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What does this mean for me, as a civilian non-01 FFL holder / non-dealer?
Are we allowed to make our firearms FA after the Form 1 is approved? What about silencers? |
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No individual can make a FA firearm. That ability was taken away May 19, 1986 in the FOPA act which is federal legislation. You can file all the form 1s you want, but they will not be approved if you are asking to build a MG for individual use. Silencers should now be allowed in MI and you are still allowed to form 1 a suppressor and make it yourself. |
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So how do we get a FA firearm now (or should be able to get)? Does it have to be made before 1986 or does it have to come from the factory FA (made after 1986)? Seeing the lack of full-auto 3rd Gen Glocks in many of the states leads me to believe the former (made pre-86)? So for suppressors, I'd have to fill out the Form 1, pay $200 tax per silencer after it is approved? Then I could buy, say, a Gemtech for the AR-15 from an online dealer and show them the paperwork? |
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Getting off-topic, but I'm sure there are lots of people with questions like yours. The only MGs available to individuals in the US are those weapons registerd in the National Firearms Transfer Record (NFTR) prior to May 19, 1986. These are called 'transferrable' machine guns. Anything made after this date is considered a 'post may sample' and are for FFLs who have paid their SOT, law enforcement agencies, military, etc. You cannot order new MGs from the factory, unless that manufacturer still has inventory that was registered before the 1986 cutoff. For suppressors. If you want to BUILD your own, then you would send in a form 1 with a $200 check, wait for approval, and ONLY then could you start to build it. If you wanted to buy a gemtech for instance, you would pay your dealer the price of the can. You or your dealer fill out the paperwork (form 4), you get CLEO signoff, attach a check for $200 and send it off to the BATF. The approved for comes back to your dealer and then you can go pick up the suppressor. There are many other scenarios that can take place depending on if you are buying a MG or suppressor from an individual out of state, a dealer out of state, etc. but I'm not gonna get into them now. |
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Forgive my ignorance, but do you have to be 21+yrs old to (legally) purchase/register a suppressor, or do you just have to be 18 or older? I'm hoping for the latter, assuming that this AG decision really does exist. I might have to make room in my college budget for a gemtech if so.
ETA: Got my answer in the General Discussion thread. |
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OK
I am confused here... I have always been told we can't own an AOW here in Michigan. From what I am hearing we can? If so, what do I have to do to get a 1) Pen gun 2) a shotgun with a very short barrel? Also, if I get a shotgun with a very short barrel can I carry this in my trunk or inside my car? I do have a CPL if that matters. |
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Well, there's something up on the website now, but when I click the link I get a 404 object not found error message.
The headnote states: A person in Michigan may only possess a machine gun if it was lawfully possessed before May 19, 1986, and is properly registered under federal law. A person in Michigan may only transfer possession of a machine gun if authorized to do so by the federal Director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. |
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Yeah, Its been posted on the AG's website.
here is the .pdf version with signature, etc. AG Opinion
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That is excellent. However, the opinion letter does not address the issue of silencers. Without going back and looking at the text of the existing law, I assume that they were outlawed in a similar manner as MGs were (must be "licensed", but no state licensing mechanism). If that is the case, this opinion should set precedence to cover silencers as well. But until I see something official, I would be somewhat leery of simply sauntering into the state with them.
Anyone know anything more concrete? |
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