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First I have heard of it. Get some 10rd mags and if it's reliable and durable I'm very interested.
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Looks like it takes AR grips which is cool.
Only thing I see that might be an issue is the charging handle. A non reciprocating charging handle farther forward would be preferred but maybe you can use aftermarket AR handles too. |
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Saw it posted on dun.deals but found there is no info on it beyond the seller's site. Are Turkish shotguns gtg?
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Price has been updated. Its not a bad price at all. Added to the list along with
http://www.uzkon.com.tr/Uzkon_Product/details.php?id=808 and this https://www.classicfirearms.com/tristar-25122-bullpup-12g-20-5rd The tristar is actually a KRAL 12 compact. Cool stuff! |
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You know, I was expecting something dumb, but that actually looks pretty neat. If it works well that may end up being a pretty nifty little shotgun.
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Apparently you can use MKA 1919 mags, so there's a pretty robust aftermarket supply.
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definitely like the innovation on shotgun bullpups, i have a ksg and it works fine, but ideally would like a reliable semi-auto!
anyone have experience with mag fed shotguns? i was concerned about shells deforming and causing cycling issues if the gun sat for awhile with loaded mags for HD. |
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Yes, the first (and possibly second) shell usually will deform if the mag is inserted against a closed bolt and left to rest for a week or more. That's due to the shells being soft at the front.
S&B buckshot doesn't deform as much because they roll crimp over a circular plastic disc, so it retains its shape better. I left a 10rd mag loaded in a VEPR-12 for 4 months to see what would happen, and it still fed. |
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Quoted:
definitely like the innovation on shotgun bullpups, i have a ksg and it works fine, but ideally would like a reliable semi-auto! anyone have experience with mag fed shotguns? i was concerned about shells deforming and causing cycling issues if the gun sat for awhile with loaded mags for HD. View Quote |
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If your SG has bolt hold open, that's an option too. I do that for my Saigas with the notch.
Also, using a slug for the top round works. |
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Interesting. Is that a Magpul AFG1 on there, or their knockoff of it? Betting Magpul could have some fun with patent infringement if they wanted to do so.
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Idk if anyone is still interested but I ordered one of these a few days ago. When I get it I can make a mini review of it in this thread if anyone is interested.
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Saw one in person at a local gun shop. Seems pretty decent.
I want one..it's on my short list Would love to see a review here. So tagged. |
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Quoted:
Interesting. Is that a Magpul AFG1 on there, or their knockoff of it? Betting Magpul could have some fun with patent infringement if they wanted to do so. View Quote |
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I'm reposting this from my post over on the BPF...
Brought mine home on Thursday. Overall, I'm pretty impressed with it and if it is reliable, it'll make a good choice for defending the hut. There are some things I wasn't 100% thrilled with, however. 1. Weight. It's a heavy beast and feels heavier than my Benelli M4 and my MDR. However, once shouldered, it seems to just "fit" and lock in. 2. Trigger. The trigger does feel a bit heavy, but in a defensive situation, I'm not sure I'd notice. Still, it is something to consider if you're going to use this for more sporting purposes to put Daffy or Bugs on a dish for dinner. 3. Sling mount points. This one is probably the most annoying nit I have to pick. There are QD points on the forward 1913 rail sections (I really wish they would have carved them off and gone to M-Lok and saved a few ounces), but there aren't any QD mounts on the rear of the shotgun. There is a loop molded into the stock's heel, but I hate those as the firearm never lays right when I sling it and it really destroys a lot of the utility a 2 point adjustable sling like the Ferro Concepts Slingster brings to the table. 4. No choke tubes. This is a "what you get is all you get" barrel, and I hope that either the aftermarket or the manufacturer brings out a replacement barrel that will allow the use of a common pattern choke tube. However, this is a really minor issue and not something that would influence me if I were to buy another, it's more like a "want to have" instead of a "have to have". That said, there are some things that I really like. 1. Two magazines. They could have shipped one, but shipped two which was a nice surprise. 2. BUIS and AFG that are either OEM from Magpul or knockoffs. If they are knockoffs, then they're damned good ones. The AFG really helps lock the shotgun into your shoulder and feels more natural for your support hand given the short foreend. 3. Tools. You get a cleaning kit and a take down wrench that looks like it could be used to remove a receiver extension nut as well. 4. Multiple ways to charge the shotgun. From the factory, the shotgun has a right side charging handle and an AR pattern charging handle. I'm not sure if a normal AR charging handle will fit, if I get bored this weekend I might give it a try. If it doesn't fit, I'd be curious to see if an AR-10 charging handle would fit. Either the side charging handle (which reciprocates, but appears that it doesn't need to be installed for proper function) or the AR handle can be used to load the shotgun. The side charging handle may be repositioned to the left side if the user desires. That's about it until I have a chance to shoot it. To add: Someone asked whether the grip was "AR compatible". I'm not sure, but after looking at the illustrated parts diagram and doing a side by side comparison with an AR, I would have to say that they are either directly compatible or can be "filed to fit" compatible. I guess you could add this to a "wish it was different" list, but I sort of wish that the grip was more vertical than raked in the A2 style because my wrist sometimes hits the overly flared magwell. It isn't a deal breaker, just one of those ergonomic improvements that could be done. That said, I might absolutely hate it with a more vertical grip, so who knows? |
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The AFG on the shotgun is not a magpul, it is a cheaply made knock off. I noticed that right away. I am only referring to the one I saw.
I did snap a quick pic, so I could remember price. It was a bit steep compared to what I am seeing online...but it was there in real life...haha. It has some sort of barrel shroud/fake suppressor on it. The pic doesn't show much...sorry. Attached File |
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I will post a review when I get mine in. I can add more to what has already been said, maybe get some accurate weights, and I will try to test the shotgun with a few different loads to see how it functions, including cheap Walmart bulk box and some Federal LE tru-ball slugs. If anyone has anything specific they would like me to test or try please let me know and I will try to arrange it. I will also try to take more detailed photos, see if the grip is actually compatible with a Magpul and standard A2 grip, and see if the barrel can be drilled for chokes (potential Salvo 12 compatibility?). As I said before if anyone wants to know, see, or for me to shoot anything specific let me know.
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Quoted:
Is this shotgun compatible with left handers? View Quote The Panzer was also next to a MKA 1923 bullpup shotgun and based on looks, weight and feel the Panzer seemed like the better shotgun of the two. It needs real performance reviews though. |
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LOP from the center of the trigger to the center of the buttpad looks like 16.5”
And it weighs 8lb 3.2oz empty and no optic. |
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Would you be able to show a picture of the whole gun with the fake can/barrel shroud removed?
Thanks in advance. |
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Yea I can take one in a few minutes. Please note I made an edit about the fake can in my review. Turns out it locks a plate in place which stabilizes the hand guard and makes it not wobble like mad. Since the optic rail is built into the hand guard, it not wobbling is super important. But you could replace it with a bolt of appropriate size and threading or even cut the factory shroud in half and it will still do the same job. Also the barrel comes to the end of the shroud so you could run chokes and the factory shroud at the same time.
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Oh, OK I didn't see that update.
I like the looks of the shroud anyway, so no bigs. Thanks for the info. |
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We need a range report.
Test it with a box of every 12 guage ammo you can find. That isn't too much to ask, is it |
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I intend to. I went to Scheels and got a variety. I am just waiting for the weather to permit. It has been cold rain here in Rochester the last few days.
So far to test I have: 2.75" Federal Field and Target 8 shot (1200fps) walmart 100rnd bulk box 2.75" Fiocchi Exacta Nickel plated 9 pellet 00 buck (1325fps) 2.75" Federal LE Tru-ball 1oz rifled slugs (1600fps) 2.75" Winchester AA Low Recoil Low Noise target loads #8 shot (980fps) lightest load I could find anywhere 2.75" Winchester AA Super-handicap heavy target loads 7.5 shot (1250fps) 3" Federal Power Shok Magnum 00 buckshot 15 pellet (1210fps) |
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Quoted:
I intend to. I went to Scheels and got a variety. I am just waiting for the weather to permit. It has been cold rain here in Rochester the last few days. So far to test I have: 2.75" Federal Field and Target 8 shot (1200fps) walmart 100rnd bulk box 2.75" Fiocchi Exacta Nickel plated 9 pellet 00 buck (1325fps) 2.75" Federal LE Tru-ball 1oz rifled slugs (1600fps) 2.75" Winchester AA Low Recoil Low Noise target loads #8 shot (980fps) lightest load I could find anywhere 2.75" Winchester AA Super-handicap heavy target loads 7.5 shot (1250fps) 3" Federal Power Shok Magnum 00 buckshot 15 pellet (1210fps) View Quote |
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any other reviews? i think there are a couple other 12ga semi auto bullpups out or coming out soon as well.
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I will have the range report up Thursday. Unfortunately it has been heavy ran the last few days here in Rochester and Thursday is supposed to be the first day of clear weather. Since it is an outdoor range I will have to wait it out.
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The weather cleared today so I managed to make it to the range. Here is what I got:
The good: The only round the gun had issues with is the low recoil and noise. Which isn’t surprising since it is such a abnormally light load. It had no failures with the Walmart bulk or any other load. It patterned the buckshot and slugs fairly well. About what would be expected of a 18.5” cylinder bore. Recoil with the Walmart bulk was pleasantly light. The slugs and magnum 3” buckshot by far recoiled the most. But even they were easily manageable. Very fun gun to shoot. The trigger isn’t an issue once you get used to it. The reset on the trigger is very audible and tactile so that is good. The bad: The right side of the ambi safety cut into my trigger finger under recoil. Not terrible but very irritating. Since the safety is installed with Allen screws I will see if that side can be removed. Some of the rounds, especially the magnum buckshot were very gassy. Being a bullpup that gas cloud came right out of the ejection port and AR charging handle slot right into the shooters face. Manageable but definitely not pleasant. Worth noting the slugs, Walmart bulk, and 2.75” buck didn’t have this problem. It was exclusively the 3” buck and the heavy handicap Winchester. Final thoughts: I think the shotgun is a blast to shoot and could be a great suppressor host. The form factor and balance is excellent. I think it has a few shortcomings but more than makes up for them. The multiple charging options is very nice and the mags and build quality is excellent. Not to mention the price point is excellent for what you are getting. |
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After much thought, as phenomenal as I think this shotgun is, I have decided to post mine in the EE later this evening. This isn't a knock against this shotgun. Honestly today I just realized, while I can shoot a shotgun and hit what I am aiming at, I don't ENJOY shooting shotguns. Not like I enjoy shooting my Tavor or my Garand. I have tried a lot of shotguns. From Benelli M4s, Super Vincis, Husqvarna SxS, H&R OUs, and at least a dozen different flavors of pump action shotguns including SBS. And I just don't enjoy them. I thought maybe this one would be different, but sadly it was not. So it is going up on the block. I will probably replace it with something cheap for hunting that I won't feel bad only pulling out of the safe 1-2 times a year to bird hunt with and nothing else. So if anyone is interested please let me know.
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Quoted:
The weather cleared today so I managed to make it to the range. Here is what I got: The good: The only round the gun had issues with is the low recoil and noise. Which isn’t surprising since it is such a abnormally light load. It had no failures with the Walmart bulk or any other load. It patterned the buckshot and slugs fairly well. About what would be expected of a 18.5” cylinder bore. Recoil with the Walmart bulk was pleasantly light. The slugs and magnum 3” buckshot by far recoiled the most. But even they were easily manageable. Very fun gun to shoot. The trigger isn’t an issue once you get used to it. The reset on the trigger is very audible and tactile so that is good. The bad: The right side of the ambi safety cut into my trigger finger under recoil. Not terrible but very irritating. Since the safety is installed with Allen screws I will see if that side can be removed. Some of the rounds, especially the magnum buckshot were very gassy. Being a bullpup that gas cloud came right out of the ejection port and AR charging handle slot right into the shooters face. Manageable but definitely not pleasant. Worth noting the slugs, Walmart bulk, and 2.75” buck didn’t have this problem. It was exclusively the 3” buck and the heavy handicap Winchester. Final thoughts: I think the shotgun is a blast to shoot and could be a great suppressor host. The form factor and balance is excellent. I think it has a few shortcomings but more than makes up for them. The multiple charging options is very nice and the mags and build quality is excellent. Not to mention the price point is excellent for what you are getting. View Quote |
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Thanks for the review. Post a video review if you have the time as I couldn't find any on Youtube yet.
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Finally was able to get out and take the Panzer Bullpup through its paces. Used Bird shot 8 and jammed or stove pipped every other rd. Went to "00" worked like a champ! Used 5 rd. mags and 10 rd. ProMag (FYI have to take spacer off the ProMag in order to seat properly) The only issue is the safety seems like it is backwards up and down is for fire which leaves it right below your index finger leaving a blister after about 50rds. Also it's a lot easier field stripping than a Vepr-12!
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Quoted:
Finally was able to get out and take the Panzer Bullpup through its paces. Used Bird shot 8 and jammed or stove pipped every other rd. Went to "00" worked like a champ! Used 5 rd. mags and 10 rd. ProMag (FYI have to take spacer off the ProMag in order to seat properly) The only issue is the safety seems like it is backwards up and down is for fire which leaves it right below your index finger leaving a blister after about 50rds. Also it's a lot easier field stripping than a Vepr-12! View Quote |
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