User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 9/12/2003 1:15:14 PM EDT
[#1]
10.3 inch is the length for the Crane CQB upper
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2003 1:34:41 PM EDT
[#2]
If your looking to buy and 10" or 10.5" is your choice.......Go with 10.5"
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2003 2:22:20 PM EDT
[#3]
here is a picture
[img]http://www.thermaldynamics.com/pictures/guns/cqbspr.jpg[/img] |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2003 3:01:57 PM EDT
[#4]
SMGLee,
Is that a KAC RIS or RAS? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 12:39:02 AM EDT
[#5]
Mr Pink
I saw that you had a upper on order from MSTN.You should use a RAS with it.They have the same contour as the M4.SJR556. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 1:28:16 AM EDT
[#6]
It is a RIS. the barrel under neath is the skinny profile. The barrel comes standard with the KAC M4QD flash hider.
Upgraded COTS 5 coil extractor spring and rubber bumper and McFarland gas ring. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 2:23:40 AM EDT
[#7]
Upgraded COTS 5 coil extractor spring and rubber bumper and McFarland gas ring. SMGLee, that's a sweet looking upper. What is "rubber bumper"? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 2:34:22 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted: What is "rubber bumper"? He is referencing an improved extractor spring insert. It is a nub of rubber that is placed inside the coils of the extractor spring. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 4:01:32 AM EDT
[#9]
SMGLee is correct, its a RIS.
Crane apparently sticking with what the 10,000 guys they already support already have vs. going to the M4 RAS. For example, since the RIS they already have on their M4A1 Carbine 14.5" upper is numbered 1-13 from front to rear, when the RIS equipped CQB uppers are issued, they will be "addressed" the same, share the same repair parts, manual, etc. This is what life-cycle-cost is all about. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2003 4:31:42 PM EDT
[#10]
Coldblue,
What was the logic behind the front to rear numbering? Seems like this would be confusing with carbine and rifle length systems in use. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 5:52:22 AM EDT
[#11]
Fact is, the USSOCOM front-to-rear/1-13 address numbering predates the ARMY numbering the upper receivers rear-to-front/1-13 by a couple of years; and of course the subsequent RAS numbering 14-forward.
We were perplexed about this as well because the for the Army tests, we initially submitted the USSOCOM RIS. SO they had to know the USSOCOM numbering system. In gact, I doubt they even considered numbering the upper receiver until they saw the numbers on the RIS. Why they reversed it is anybody's guess. I have heard everything from inter-service rivalry (because the "Navy" had done the RIS/USSOCOM thing), to once they were inspired to address rail grooves, that the upper receiver being the "dominant" element, in front of which many generations of rail forends would modify, that #1 would start there. Also consider from the USSOCOM side that their uppers are usually covered by an ACOG, M68, Back-Up Iron Sight, etc. However, this difference has caused some minor confusion problems like with some Ranger units initailly RIS'd by USSOCOM/Navy (Crane); but now get supply support like RAS lower replacements that are numbered differently than their RIS uppers, because the RAS parts are what is illustrated in their M16/M4 TM...2/3&P's. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 11:01:45 AM EDT
[#12]
Coldblue,
Interservice rivalry is certainly believable in light of some other stories I've heard. Are the numbers even worth having, in your opinion? Quick |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 11:21:47 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: 10.3 inch is the length for the Crane CQB upper Would like to talk you into a listing of the details on the various features of the Crane CQB upper, in particular on improvements to the gas system/bolt. Also was wondering if the bayonet still works with this length barrel. Thanks John |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 12:08:16 PM EDT
[#14]
John,
I IM you with the difference, there isn't really that much difference. the extractor spring, McFarland rign, PRI gas buster, 10.3 inch barrel with .070 gas port opening and a KAC QD flash hider. The bayonet will not work, the front sight post is stock inventory item so therefor you see the lug underneath. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 12:11:49 PM EDT
[#15]
Chen- I was wondering if the PRI gas tube is seeing any use in this model?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 12:57:39 PM EDT
[#16]
I don't think so, but I can't be sure.
Out of four guns they tested, I remember several gas tubes failed plus an extractor and an extractor spring. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 4:37:46 PM EDT
[#17]
Are these the same uppers that MSTN sells?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 4:52:48 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: Why they reversed it is anybody's guess. I have heard everything from inter-service rivalry (because the "Navy" had done the RIS/USSOCOM thing), to once they were inspired to address rail grooves, that the upper receiver being the "dominant" element, in front of which many generations of rail forends would modify, that #1 would start there. If you think about it, it makes far more sense to number from the receiver, because the barrel/handguard length can vary, and if you start from the front end of handguards of differing lengths, you'll have different numbers when you reach the upper. If you number from the upper, the rear slot on the rail can be a consistant number regardless of barrel/handguard length. -Troy |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2003 7:03:26 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: Are these the same uppers that MSTN sells? Yes, same config. by LMT for Crane AFAIK! Apparently the newer ones have a slightly heavier bbl. profile. The others are standard M4 I believe. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/15/2003 3:21:19 PM EDT
[#20]
If we're talking about MSTN LMT shorty uppers then they do not use or even like the PRI gas tubes. They run 100% reliably, even full auto with the regular tube. Wes could give you more detailed info on their success and testing. IMHO, even with some good Colt and BM short uppers out there, the LMT 10.5 is the ONLY way to go these days. It requires no tweaking to run PERFECTLY and is SCARY ACCURATE.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/15/2003 5:33:13 PM EDT
[#21]
I could'nt agree more! Scary accurate is a good description. The upper runs as well as anything I own, if not better!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2003 6:28:28 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: If we're talking about MSTN LMT shorty uppers then they do not use or even like the PRI gas tubes. They run 100% reliably, even full auto with the regular tube. Wes could give you more detailed info on their success and testing. IMHO, even with some good Colt and BM short uppers out there, the LMT 10.5 is the ONLY way to go these days. It requires no tweaking to run PERFECTLY and is SCARY ACCURATE. Then why do they sell them....the "PRI fat boy" gas tubes I mean? |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2003 10:55:51 AM EDT
[#23]
For many reasons. They do make M4's run better apparently and can do wonders to franken shorty's where a short bbl. can reek havoc with cycling problems! The LMT does not need one.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2003 11:26:03 AM EDT
[#24]
Thank you for your various replies. I'm going to have to look more into Wes's LMT upper...Wes you can chime in on the details they spoke of at any point bud!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2003 2:16:41 PM EDT
[#25]
No need to look.........just open your wallet[:D]
Believe me you won't be sorry! I love mine and may get another in the future. I got one from the original run with the slimmer bbl. profile standard M4.........The ones he has now are a bit heftier and therefore should be slightly better. Either way they are durable as hell and the accuaracy is amazing for sure! |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2003 11:49:02 PM EDT
[#26]
Good deal. I've used a couple if 11.5" guns and the close quarters handling characteristics are much improved over the base 14.5" carbine.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/17/2003 3:31:09 PM EDT
[#27]
WHY THE NAVY NUMBERED THE KAC M4 RIS FROM THE FRONT SIGHT:
WHEN THE KAC M4 RIS WAS BEING DEVELOPED, THE FIRST COLT M4'S HAD FIXED CARRY HANDLES, NOT FLAT TOP UPPERS. SO IT MAKES SENSE THAT THE M4 RIS WAS NUMBERED FROM THE FRONT SIGHT AFT. BY THE TIME THE BIG ARMY WAS IN THE GAME, THE COLT M4A1 FLAT TOP WAS IN ISSUE. BUT THE M16A4 WAS NOT. AS TO WHY THE ARMY CHOSE TO NUMBER FROM THE REARMOST SLOT FORWARD, ONE CAN MAKE SEVERAL ARGUEMENTS. I FOR ONE REALLY DO NOT CARE. MOST OF MY UPPERS HAVE KAC FREE FLOATING RAS FORENDS OF ONE DESCRIPTION OR ANOTHER. THE REST HAVE PRI CARBON FIBER FORENDS. NEITHER HAVE NUMBERED MOUNTING SLOTS. WES GRANT [URL]MSTN.BIZ[/URL] |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/17/2003 3:38:45 PM EDT
[#28]
THE LMT 10.5" UPPERS ARE MUCH LIKE CRANE'S CHOPPED M4A1 UPPERS. AS HORIK STATED, THE LATE MODEL LMT UPPERS HAVE 2 OUNCES MORE STEEL IN THE BARREL, AS THEY HAVE GONE FROM AN M4 0.625" PROFILE UNDER THE HANDGUARDS TO A SLIGHTLY HEAVIER 0.750".
THE PRI FAT BOY GAS TUBE SEEMS TO HELP COLT 11.5", 14.5", AND 16" UPPERS SHOOT A LITTLE SOFTER AND RUN A BIT SLOWER IN FULL AUTO. BUT THE LMT UPPERS DO NOT NEED THE FAT BOY. INDEED, I HAVE TRIED A COUPLE WITH IT, AND THE LMT UPPER SIMPLY WILL NOT RUN WITH THE FAT BOY. MORALE: LEAVE THE LMT 10.5" UPPER ALONE. RUN GOOD QUALITY HOT AMMO, GOOD MAGS, A STOCK CARBINE RECOIL SPRING, AND A TYPICAL "H" BUFFER. YOU WILL BE PLEASED WITH ETHE RESULTS. WES GRANT [URL]MSTN.BIZ[/URL] |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/18/2003 1:13:40 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: Coldblue, Interservice rivalry is certainly believable in light of some other stories I've heard. Are the numbers even worth having, in your opinion? Quick The numbers are worth having. For example, when an operator needs to mount his M203, but his PAQ-4 is presently mounted and zeroed on the top rail, the laser needs to be moved and re-zeroed to the right rail. If he has done this before, remembers the address he uses on the right rail, and the now reversed elevation & wingage changes that may or may not be required, then he's good to go. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/18/2003 4:46:49 PM EDT
[#30]
I'm sure the guy could also lign the front of the PAQ-4 with the front of the RAS or 2nd slot- or wherever he mounts it... It's what all of us did before numbere pannels.
It worked then it should still work. Or of course he couldjust keep the Paq-4 on the side and the 203 sight on top. and then he wouldn't have to worry about: 1 The location of mounting 2 untieing his dummy cord from the weapon and tieing it to his ruck frame or whatever. (The weight isn't enough for me to want to screw with it personally. (most units require paq-4's and flashlights, optics, etc to be dummy corded. Yep I know odds are 99.9% of the time that item will stay on but because of unit commanders, responsibility, and lost items nearly all of us have to tie off shit anyway. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/18/2003 7:13:36 PM EDT
[#31]
Here is a thread about 10" AR's.
[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=170476&page=1[/url] |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
