User Panel
Posted: 6/11/2015 4:33:43 PM EDT
|
|
In this thread, you go shoot some of your favorite 5.56 match ammo so I can see the ES.
|
|
I haven't run my handloads through the chrony in a while. But, i can say without a doubt, I've had MUCH better luck with the Hornday Match and Amax 75gr than the SMK 77rgs in my OBR lite. However, the SMKs tend to outshoot the Horndays when I'm playing with the OBR 7.62
I can't speak for the loaded FGMM stuff, but I've also noticed greater variances from one bullet to the next with the Sierras vs. the Hornadys regardless of caliber. |
|
Next time out I was planning on running some 175 FGMM through the Magnetospeed.
ETA: or are you just looking for .223/5.56? |
|
|
|
Here is some info for 7.62... FGMM and handloads...
Federal Gold Medal Match 175gr Series1 Shots:10 Min 2361 Max 2469 Avg2411 S-D31 ES 108 SeriesShotSpeed 1 1 2469 ft/sec 1 2 2433 ft/sec 1 3 2422 ft/sec 1 4 2390 ft/sec 1 5 2361 ft/sec 1 6 2430 ft/sec 1 7 2408 ft/sec 1 8 2415 ft/sec 1 9 2371 ft/sec 1 10 2413 ft/sec ---------------- 43.8gr Varget 175gr SMK Series1 Shots:7 Min 2475 Max 2501 Avg2482 S-D 9 ES 26 SeriesShotSpeed 1 1 2478 ft/sec 1 2 2485 ft/sec 1 3 2501 ft/sec 1 4 2476 ft/sec 1 5 2482 ft/sec 1 6 2477 ft/sec 1 7 2475 ft/sec ---------------- |
|
If you send me a magnetospeed I can go compare some 7.62 and 5.56 for ya!!
|
|
|
Quoted:
Them little Magnetospeeds are handy little devils. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
If you send me a magnetospeed I can go compare some 7.62 and 5.56 for ya!! Them little Magnetospeeds are handy little devils. Sigh.....guess I'll have to add that to my Larue wish list.... |
|
is that nice report in the OP generated through the magneto speed's software?
|
|
Australian Outback 55gr BlitzKing (the most accurate factory ammo I've found to date). Shot from an 18" WOA 1/7 barrel with rifle gas:
3023 3016 2967 3034 2966 Avg. 3001.2 FPS SD: 32.32 ES 68 Black Hills 5.56mm 77gr TMK (same barrel as above): 2712 2747 2728 2720 2740 Avg. 2729.4 FPS SD: 14.27 ES: 35 The BH stuff has flown well for me too, but the ADI stuff is still the most accurate factory ammo I've shot so far. |
|
Quoted:
is that nice report in the OP generated through the magneto speed's software? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes My guy's response ... Sort of. The data for each shot string is just as you see it when you open the data file on a computer, I just typed in the ammo used and organized the shot strings. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
is that nice report in the OP generated through the magneto speed's software? My guy's response ... Sort of. The data for each shot string is just as you see it when you open the data file on a computer, I just typed in the ammo used and organized the shot strings. very nice, i will try to pick up some different match ammo and borrow my buddy's chrono and get some info this weekend |
|
So does this mean that we will be seeing some Larue ammo in the future?
|
|
I will also give some feedback on that new ammo you guys are carrying, picked up some 147gr 300 blackout this week
|
|
Those ES numbers look as good as or better than some of my hand loads. The ES on some of my Varget loads runs as high as 130 iirc. Because I am still seeing pretty good accuracy I mentally attribute some of that to my old beatup chrony.
Interestinly, the ES of my 308 Varget loads runs closer to 30. I suspect the smaller case of the 223 definitely contributes to pressure variances resulting in the larger ES. In actuality it is likely a little of all of the above. Fortunately the LaRues are accurate enough to obscure the problem. The question in my mind is if the ES of an accurate load can be changed from 125 to 25, how much will my accuracy improve at 100 yds? The second part of that line of thought is am I good enough to make use of that improvement? Good luck in your quest... |
|
Interesting. I'll see if I can borrow a chrono from someone and hit the range. I'd like to be able to contribute since I have so many different types of ammo.
|
|
Any reason you're looking for ES, versus SD?
Also, I have some velocity numbers from some other BH loads, I just need to dig them up. |
|
So does this mean, speaking in minutiae, that Hornady > FGMM?
|
|
|
Here's where I find the largest difference between factory ammo and handloads. My result from earlier this week:
Black Hills 77 TMK: Average- 2781 SD- 21.6 fps 77 TMK over 8208: Average- 2693 SD- 6.1 fps |
|
Black hills 5.56mm 77gr OTM (SMK) out of a Colt 14.5" SOCOM barrel: 2645 2655 2679 2659 2662 Avg. 2660FPS SD: 12.40 ES: 34 Black hills 5.56mm 77gr TMK out of a Colt 14.5" SOCOM barrel: 2645 2633 2608 2626 2625 Avg. 2627.4FPS SD: 13.46 ES: 37 |
|
Quoted:
[span style='font-weight: bold;']I'm starting to get why any bloke off the street can Outshoot The Shootist. View Quote the problem must have started after I received mine , I am not even thinking about beating him sent me a pattern almost touching, no way I could duplicate just my luck!!! should have waited |
|
Ok got 3 different brands to test for ya mark results coming sunday
Hornady Remington federal Can't remember weights off hand |
|
For anyone looking for ammo, SSA is having a pretty good sale. Another option to run with.
SSA 5.56mm 77 Grain SSA OTM (MK 262 Clone) - 20ct |
|
Quoted:
For anyone looking for ammo, SSA is having a pretty good sale. Another option to run with. SSA 5.56mm 77 Grain SSA OTM (MK 262 Clone) - 20ct View Quote Not a bad deal at all |
|
Quoted:
For anyone looking for ammo, SSA is having a pretty good sale. Another option to run with. SSA 5.56mm 77 Grain SSA OTM (MK 262 Clone) - 20ct View Quote Thanks for the link, just order 20 boxes. |
|
Quoted:
Thanks for the link, just order 20 boxes. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
For anyone looking for ammo, SSA is having a pretty good sale. Another option to run with. SSA 5.56mm 77 Grain SSA OTM (MK 262 Clone) - 20ct Thanks for the link, just order 20 boxes. I did the same! 20 boxes!!! |
|
I think mark and a few others would take interest in this link from precisionrifleblog.com
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/04/18/how-much-does-sd-matter/ There is also one on muzzle velocity, actually they are all worth reading. What I got out of them was ALL things matter at distance but when considered in total some are worth more effort to control. The whole squeeze/juice argument. The whole series is broken down and easy to understand especially when provided with the software computations are illustrated. Monk |
|
As ML pointed out "Them little Magnetospeeds are handy little devils."
168g Federal SMKBT 18" TOBR YHM Suppressor---- Series2 Shots:5 Min2546 Max2566 Avg 2555 S-D7.9 ES 20 Series Shot Speed 2 1 2559 ft/s 2 2 2549 ft/s 2 3 2566 ft/s 2 4 2555 ft/s 2 5 2546 ft/s ************************************************************* 168g SSA 18" TOBR YHM Suppressor---- Series 3 Shots:5 Min 2526 Max2562 Avg 2547 S-D18 ES 36 Series ShotSpeed 3 1 2526 ft/s 3 2 2556 ft/s 3 3 2562 ft/s 3 4 2562 ft/s 3 5 2529 ft/s *********************************************************** 77g Federal SMKBT 16" TOBR YHM Suppressor---- Series 4 Shots:5 Min 2588 Max 2630 Avg 2613 S-D17.4 ES 42 Series Shot Speed 4 1 2588 ft/s 4 2 2619 ft/s 4 3 2626 ft/s 4 4 2630 ft/s 4 5 2603 ft/s ********************************************** 77g SSA 16" TOBR YHM Suppressor---- Series 5 Shots:5 Min 2443 Max 2491 Avg 2468 S-D20.4 ES 48 Series Shot Speed 5 1 2488 ft/s 5 2 2459 ft/s 5 3 2462 ft/s 5 4 2491 ft/s 5 5 2443 ft/s |
|
^^^^^ That 42 as 48 extreme spread is surprising but not as bad as 96 and 114.
|
|
Quoted:
I think mark and a few others would take interest in this link from precisionrifleblog.com http://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/04/18/how-much-does-sd-matter/ There is also one on muzzle velocity, actually they are all worth reading. What I got out of them was ALL things matter at distance but when considered in total some are worth more effort to control. The whole squeeze/juice argument. The whole series is broken down and easy to understand especially when provided with the software computations are illustrated. Monk View Quote |
|
Major take-away in bold, in case you don't want to read my diatribe.
I may be cross-contaminating a *few threads, so my apologies if this is an inappropriate location. (*Those threads are: this one, my MagnetoSpeed Use on a 16" thread, and the LaRue Hand Loading Thread.) Also, I'm a bit of a 'Data Whore'. I take it most folks are using a MagnetoSpeed.... I think it goes without saying that if you're NOT using a MagnetoSpeed, then it should be stated which chrony you are using. That can skew the numbers a bit. Here's the example I have experienced: I used to use a Shooting Chrony F1 to get the data for my PredatAR 7.62. It was showing that my handloads had decent SD/ES numbers (10-15fps and 25-30 fps, respectively). When I translated that data into the ballistic computer (confuser), the numbers would never match up. I would ALWAYS have to adjust the MV in the computer to what the bullet was telling me... specifically that my bullets were going slower than what the Chrony F1 was showing me. I didn't expect much out of that little F1, so I wasn't really surprised that it wasn't giving me accurate data. I primarily used the F1 as an indicator of whether or not my handloading processes were actually producing tangible results. I was pleasantly surprised, however, that it was giving me precise data; the SD/ES numbers were nearly identical when I started using the Magnetospeed. The accuracy was spot on with the MagnetoSpeed; the bullet drops seen were extremely close to what the ballistic computer was showing me, within 0.1 mils at 1k yards. The reason I bring this up is that some folks might see the data in this thread as a benchmark for what should be happening with similar ammo from THEIR gun. Specifically, if I were to see another rifle like mine that was shooting similar ammo, then I might be thinking that there's something right/wrong with MY gun/ammo combination when the data that I see isn't matching up with what others are experiencing. To be honest, I haven't seen too much craziness happening from load to load as it relates in the way of the 100 yard zero (my 41.5-43.0 grain loads all had a 100 yard zero that was within about .0.2 mils from each other) . However, since my normal target range with my LaRue is from the 250-800 yard range, the high SD/ES utterly cripples the long range accuracy capability from shot to shot. I (sort of) apologize for the long winded response to this, but it's been eating at my brain for a while. |
|
Quoted:
Major take-away in bold, in case you don't want to read my diatribe. I may be cross-contaminating a *few threads, so my apologies if this is an inappropriate location. (*Those threads are: this one, my MagnetoSpeed Use on a 16" thread, and the LaRue Hand Loading Thread.) Also, I'm a bit of a 'Data Whore'. I take it most folks are using a MagnetoSpeed.... I think it goes without saying that if you're NOT using a MagnetoSpeed, then it should be stated which chrony you are using. That can skew the numbers a bit. Here's the example I have experienced: I used to use a Shooting Chrony F1 to get the data for my PredatAR 7.62. It was showing that my handloads had decent SD/ES numbers (10-15fps and 25-30 fps, respectively). When I translated that data into the ballistic computer (confuser), the numbers would never match up. I would ALWAYS have to adjust the MV in the computer to what the bullet was telling me... specifically that my bullets were going slower than what the Chrony F1 was showing me. I didn't expect much out of that little F1, so I wasn't really surprised that it wasn't giving me accurate data. I primarily used the F1 as an indicator of whether or not my handloading processes were actually producing tangible results. I was pleasantly surprised, however, that it was giving me precise data; the SD/ES numbers were nearly identical when I started using the Magnetospeed. The accuracy was spot on with the MagnetoSpeed; the bullet drops seen were extremely close to what the ballistic computer was showing me, within 0.1 mils at 1k yards. The reason I bring this up is that some folks might see the data in this thread as a benchmark for what should be happening with similar ammo from THEIR gun. Specifically, if I were to see another rifle like mine that was shooting similar ammo, then I might be thinking that there's something right/wrong with MY gun/ammo combination when the data that I see isn't matching up with what others are experiencing. To be honest, I haven't seen too much craziness happening from load to load as it relates in the way of the 100 yard zero (my 41.5-43.0 grain loads all had a 100 yard zero that was within about .0.2 mils from each other) . However, since my normal target range with my LaRue is from the 250-800 yard range, the high SD/ES utterly cripples the long range accuracy capability from shot to shot. I (sort of) apologize for the long winded response to this, but it's been eating at my brain for a while. View Quote Salient points. I updated my chart with additional data for clarity. |
|
In the "OFFICIAL HAND LOADING THREAD" I've updated which Chrono was used for my testing. Sadly, a lot of the earlier stuff was with a Shooting Chrony F1. I just MAY need to repeat those tests with the MagnetoSpeed V3.
Here's my official contribution to this thread, which is cross-posted over at the handloading thread. Rifle: 16" PredatAR 7.62 w/ SureFire Pro Comp MB Scope: Vortex 2.5-10x42 w/ LaRue mount Ammo: FGMM 175, 2.226" Base-to-Ogive (average) mv: 2414 avg sd: 41 es: 150... ugh! 2310 to 2460, see explanation below. Take out the high and the low, and it becomes 45. **The Chronograph used was a Shooting Chrony F1. It has since been proven to have inaccurate results** |
|
ok finally got a chance to head out to the range and test some speeds for you Mark
I shot this out of a home build SPR, 18in barrel with a 1:8 twist I used a Chrony Alpha Chronograph just like this one link sitting about 1.5 feet in front of the muzzle i should note that accuracy wise the Hornady and Remington grouped much much better than the Federal GMM |
|
|
Quoted:
I went out and shot the 03-A4 today and at the same time shot some Hornady SuperPerformance out of the tOBR; results added to the chart. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v501/defender3va/Chrono7_zpsoqxzbepm.jpg View Quote Looks like we are getting same results, hornady super performance is more consistent than the FGMM |
|
Quoted:
Looks like we are getting same results, hornady super performance is more consistent than the FGMM View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I went out and shot the 03-A4 today and at the same time shot some Hornady SuperPerformance out of the tOBR; results added to the chart. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v501/defender3va/Chrono7_zpsoqxzbepm.jpg Looks like we are getting same results, hornady super performance is more consistent than the FGMM For sure. I also just picked up some Remington Match that I'll try one of these days and I have some of the CBC 77gr OTMs on the way.. |
|
Quoted:
For sure. I also just picked up some Remington Match that I'll try one of these days and I have some of the CBC 77gr OTMs on the way.. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I went out and shot the 03-A4 today and at the same time shot some Hornady SuperPerformance out of the tOBR; results added to the chart. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v501/defender3va/Chrono7_zpsoqxzbepm.jpg Looks like we are getting same results, hornady super performance is more consistent than the FGMM For sure. I also just picked up some Remington Match that I'll try one of these days and I have some of the CBC 77gr OTMs on the way.. Rem.match was in between hornady and federal for me |
|
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.