Okay, I know there are a dozen threads talking about comms, but need updated advice on a GMRS radio.  I don't need/want Ham.  Don't really have the time.  I want something "plug and play" and really want to just communicate with my family, who (unfortunately) live about two miles away.  Too cluttered for FRS, so want to go GMRS.  And yes I understand they require a $70 license.

I want a mobile device, not something fixed in my vehicle, so leaning towards a BTECH GMRS-V1.  Seems robust enough for what I want, and definitely wont break the bank coming in at around $65.  

Anyone have any experience with the BTECH?  Pros / Cons?  

Thanks everyone.

Interested... For the same reasons you asked.

In the radio world "mobile" means "fixed in the vehicle". So it sounds like you are looking for handheld radios. Most people want a handheld device for convenience, that magically works everywhere, but since this is the survival forum, they want it to work without the infrastructure that does the magic.

2 miles is at the fringe of usable distance for handheld-to-handheld communications, and that's rural, flat, open terrain. If one user is in a vehicle and the other in a house, it will probably be intermittent at best. That's just the physics of ~400MHz RF and it makes no difference if you're talking about GMRS, land mobile, or amateur. There is no magic brand or model of radio or magic antenna for a handheld radio that will appreciably extend that range. For sure there are some crappy radios and antennas that perform poorly vs some that do better, but there is a strong factor of diminishing returns where you run into the practical physics. If you're trying to talk hilltop to hilltop though your 2 miles is probably easy.

Where specific models of radios can vary a lot though is in other aspects of radio performance. If you happen to be in an area that would have a high level of other radio signals, some radios are much more susceptible to some kinds of interference (like intermodulation distortion and front-end overload). If you have a TV transmitter site nearby or something like that you may have to get really picky about what model radios you get.

Even a very modest outside antenna on a pole or tower and a base station radio at one end would make 2 miles trivial though. If you want high reliability you may need to expand your thinking beyond handheld radios.

As far as the Btech radios, they are an inexpensive chinese made radio just like millions that are sold, just with firmware that restricts them to the pre-programmed GMRS channels. If you are cost-conscious, and can follow directions you could just get plain-jane programmable radios and program them with the GMRS frequencies and then lock them into channel-only mode and save a few dollars. The chances of anyone ever caring that you are using a Part 90 radio on Part 95 frequencies is as close to zero as is possible. If you are less cost-conscious you could get a little nicer radio that would be more rugged and might perform just a touch better (but probably not a lot).

Thanks Gamma.  yeah, it's the whole legality issue between part 90 and 95 that has me just wanting to go the "CB" route and be done with it.  I figure GMRS will have a better reach than FRS.  As the crow flies, it's only 2 miles to my family's house, but there are trees, houses, and a high school in the way.

So you have tried FRS and other than the clutter they work over that distance?  Or are you saying you believe FRS is too cluttered?

If you were able to get FRS to work over that distance and your local terrain-- that's a starting point and we can work from there.

People get wound around the axle about it, and for someone advertising and selling radios it would be different, but from an individual user perspective nobody is going to care that you're using a Part 90 radio on licensed GMRS, as long as you get it programmed correctly. There are tons of GMRS repeaters on the air and AFAIK there has never been a Part 95 type approved repeater. Almost no Part 95 approved radios allow you to program repeater splits. The fact that you actually have a GMRS license puts you in a minuscule percentage of GMRS users.

GMRS is no different than FRS other than you're allowed to use more power and better antennas. A good radio with 4~5 watts will certainly do better than the typical consumer FRS radio which is probably transmitting something like 150 milliwatts, but 2 miles with intervening buildings and such is still going to be a stretch with just handhelds.

This.  I also have my GMRS license simply because I also have my General amateur, and work in the Communications profession so I want to set a good example.  The truth of the matter is I don't think I have ever met anyone else (in person) who actually has a GMRS license who wasn't also a licensed ham.

MURS?

The 2W limit on MURS is going to make terrain a very tricky thing to overcome with OPs desired distance. It's certainly capable of 2 miles but it will be spotty unless using antennas on towers to get over trees & buildings.

Did he say FRS radios worked earlier? If so MURS should work better.

I was just commenting elsewhere that I recently got my GMRS license with the intent to build a mobile package for my son and my myself (maybe my wife...she's picky about crap in her car) and ultimately a decent base station that I can eventually use as a repeater.  I was reading about a guy who used GMRS for emergency work and set a van up as a mobile base station and with 50W and a 20 foot antenna, it provided the HTs almost a 10-15 mile range (terrain was relatively flat/rural).  

I can't speak to those specific radios, but my 8W radios get pretty decent distance with a quality antenna...my son has been testing and getting close to five miles outside of his college town, about 2-3 miles in (or across town)...but he had to get some good LOS locations.  We're still working with them, but the extra power with the license makes a significant difference.  

ROCK6

Went ahead and got my GMRS license, and bought a couple BTECH's and it works great.  Bought some beefier antennas to see if I can make it to my office, which is about 5 miles away.  So far I'm loving GMRS.  Greta emergency comms.  Thanks team.

Any gmrs repeaters in your area?  There’s a really good one here thanks to the guys connections with the tower owner.  Covers a ton of area and the channels are rarely busy as it’s not that popular here overall.

https://mygmrs.com/ check here for repeaters

For my area, there are three.  I just got permission to use one, one hasn't responded, and the third is paid-access.  I may or may not pay for the third repeater, but the other two are far more useful in my immediate area.

So, GMRS question for long-time users.  The license allows use of family members, however I only have the one callsign, did any of you created a subordinate designator?  At one point my callsign in the military was ROCK6, but my driver used ROCK6-Delta.  Not sure if it's that important nor do I want to violate any hidden FCC rule about callsign designators, but it would just seem odd to have the same callsign talking over a repeater...

ROCK6

Most use mobile or base or -1 -2 and such from what I’ve seen.  A lot don’t care and use nothing.

Thanks.  For now, it's really just my son and I, but figured some structure to delineate "actual" from family members is just a good idea in my CEOI/SOI book

ROCK6

Lol true

I have never heard any one using a call sign on gmrs.  I’ve never heard a repeater though and perhaps folks that use gmrs repeaters actually use call signs.

I don’t think a lot of people honestly know they should have a call sign to be on GMRS honestly.  

On the repeater I do hear it more often though than simplex channels.

I think it's just a prudent practice to at least have all your radios marked with your call sign.  If my son is using it, he'll have it and is covered if someone challenges him.  Again, I don't think it's a major concern, but I just prefer to have call-signs (associated with my GMRS license) established for family members that will be using them.

Having a usable CEOI/SOI with common brevity codes and possibly an authentication chart isn't a bad idea either.

ROCK6

Agree.  Just labeled all my radios this morning.

How do you know they were not FRS? Since they share the same freqs and all.

Stupid question time:  
How do I utilize a repeater?  I just charged up my old Cobra GMRS radios and heard one repeater broadcasting.  
I have never done more than talk deer stand to stand with them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repeater

Came here with a similar question as OP.

I would like something relatively simple to use for family communication. I'm thinking GMRS w/ license because I know my wife isn't willing to go for the ham ticket, but I may personally get into ham in the future... I'm just not ready yet. And for starters I'm thinking 2x HTs. Adding a home or vehicle base station is a possibility in the future, but not something I'm interested in on day 1.

I've seen all the Baofengs and whatnot for sale at good price points and am looking at lots of reviews, but all of this had let me to two questions that I think I need answered before I pick some HTs:

1) I know that the GMRS HT will suffer the from same range/clutter/LOS issues as FRS HTs, but they provide access to repeaters. I've looked on a map and there are three repeaters that are less than ten miles from my house, and my office (where I am most of the time when I'm not home) is basically the midpoint between the repeaters and my house. I don't think where I live is considered particularly hilly (Cincinnati suburbs).

Will the repeaters help me extend the typical "no more than 2 miles at best in an urban environment" that I have read about in all of these threads, or am I seriously oversimplifying it in my head and missing some key factor?

2) In the likely event that I enjoy operating the radio and in the future want to get my ham ticket, I know that I'll require a different radio. If I get something NOW like a Baofeng BF-F8HP that is a ham radio, could/should I use that as my GMRS radio before I get my ham ticket?

I do understand that strictly by the book it isn't legal, but I am willing to be a responsible user that will have a GMRS license/callsign, and ensure that I properly program frequencies/power outputs so as to not overpower the FRS/GMRS channels. I'm basically just asking that in the future if I get my ham ticket and don't want to have more than one radio, is this juice worth the squeeze, or is it more trouble than it's worth as a new radio/GMRS user?

Thanks for your time. This is an entirely me world to me, and GMRS seems like a good middle ground to get into it for fun but also in emergencies... but I want to make sure I do it right. I used radios in the military and I know how frustrating it can be when you are trying to operate the right way and some asshat comes in out of nowhere and screws it all up for everyone... I don't want to be that guy! And more importantly, I want to practice with the tools that I plan on using in an emergency so that I know what they can/cannot do.

Repeaters greatly extend range because they tend to be mounted higher up on buildings or towers with better antennas.  They receive the signal then repeat it at the same time on a different frequency.  In order to communicate both sides have to be able to talk to the repeater.  The main ham repeater I use in town is about three miles away and I can use it with a handheld as long as I'm not in the basement.  Ten miles without an elevated antenna is definitely a stretch though.

As Gamma mentioned the risk of getting in trouble using a Baofeng radio is as close to zero as you can get.  Even if you get caught the FCC is generally in the "stop that you" until you become a repeat offender (not a lawyer, not legal advice).

Yes, most likely.  Depends on where the repeater is from you, the height of the repeater, and your ability of your HT to reach the repeater.  

Like here there is a really nice repeater parked way up.  The reach of that GMRS repeater is crazy.  Oddly enough its way underutilized.

I looked at the Chinese crap radios and passed. I picked up a few used Motorola HT1250 radios and had them programmed. Not much more than the Chinese radios for much better quality.

I don't know what your terrain is in your AO. I get between 3/4 and a full mile up and down the canyon. We live in a heavily wooded canyon. Once you're over the ridge, forget about having any range back to home.

My son and I did some testing.  I did get some taller HT antennas.  The nice thing about the GMRS-rated radios is replaceable antennas.  Power is nice, but your antenna gain is more important as is height.  My son was able to get me at three miles away with his antenna sticking through his sun roof and it wasn't a very good LOS.  I was using a similar whip antenna at home.  Again, these aren't long-range communication devices (although repeaters can help).  I see them as in/around the area comms for the family.  Once I get a base station set up at the house and with a good 40-50 foot antenna, I can easily see this reaching 20-30 miles in most directions.  

As with most amateur radio bands, you can listen, scan, and learn all day; you just can't transmit.  With the GMRS channels, once you get over the FRS-power limits, you need a license.  I know there are some other restrictions (such as removable antennas), but for the price, just get the GMRS license.  I had mine in less than 24 hours.

I've been scanning on the GMRS frequencies and very rarely get a small break in squelch.  There's very little (to almost no) use in my area.  Of course, it could just be more FRS radios used with very low power and range, but there's almost no use in my area.

ROCK6

My wife and I just tried out a pair of Midland MXT115's yesterday afternoon. We put them on one of the frequencies that you can transmit up to 50 watts on, used the stock antenna (little as hell), and put the radio in high transmit power level. She was in her car in the driveway, I was driving around town in mine. At 2.9 miles (as the crow flies) and without repeater help (there is one nearby) we could hear each other but there was static on the line. At times the transmission crackled but but enough where you couldn't understand each other. This was in the urban sprawl mind you. I think if we both had the MXTA26 antenna our range might increase another couple miles. Transmitting from home with a tower 40 get in the air would increase distance more.

Midland makes a mobile radio that can push out nearly 40 watts. I was originally going to set up a to of those but the furthest distance wasn't interested so my only current need is 3 miles. Easily doable, I think, with the MXT115 and MXTA26 antenna.

Attached File
Also to add. My off road / bugout setup is going to include this:

https://www.portableuniversalpower.com/our-products/operator-115/

In addition to that is a NOS foldable solar panel rated for 42 watts. Due to its age it'll probably get half that which is fine with me. I also have some other flexible antenna I can stow in the Operator 115 that I can put up in a tree via paracord and a branch.

From the Electronic Code of Federal Regulations website:

You may be right but the FCC loves them some enforcement. You can read about it here.

https://www.fcc.gov/enforcement/orders/1823

I've thumbed through quite a few of them and have yet to see anyone getting fined for using a Baofeng or other non-part 95 radios for GMRS.  If you care to share any examples of that rather than the typical "guy really being an asshole" that most of them are I'd love to read it.

I would too. Still wouldn't put it pass big brother making an example out of a person. I posted the link just as an FYI FCC does enforcement.

Given that it's the federal government I wouldn't be really shocked, but the truth is that it would be nearly impossible to tell remotely and they don't just go around looking for trouble.  All of the actions that I've read the targets were flaming assholes purposely preventing the normal use of a frequency.