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Posted: 9/19/2009 9:57:06 AM EDT
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Posted: 9/19/2009 9:59:43 AM EDT
[#1]
IBD_A
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:02:47 AM EDT
[#2]
Ron Paul P0wnz all ze pollz!!!!! Stupid paulbots... Scripts are for Kiddies.... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:04:10 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
IBD_A That was going to be my responce as well, guess I need to be quicker 
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:05:08 AM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
Quoted:
IBD_A That was going to be my responce as well, guess I need to be quicker Looks like I was accurate too... 
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:06:37 AM EDT
[#5]
Hell, I think .gov should be abolished.
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:07:57 AM EDT
[#6]
No just audited.
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:12:44 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
No just audited. This |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:15:09 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IBD_A That was going to be my responce as well, guess I need to be quicker Looks like I was accurate too... think he freaks when google goes down? 
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:16:42 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: Quoted: No just audited. This Yeah, put that crew that did Madoff's audits in charge. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:24:37 AM EDT
[#10]
If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing.
(Actually, the constitution says the congress has to do that kind of thing). It is not as simple as every one thinks. What is the replacement going to be? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:30:00 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
Ron Paul P0wnz all ze pollz!!!!! Stupid paulbots... Scripts are for Kiddies.... Everybody is a dumbass until they agree with you 
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:31:11 AM EDT
[#12]
"If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing."
Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:35:10 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: Quoted: Ron Paul P0wnz all ze pollz!!!!! Stupid paulbots... Scripts are for Kiddies.... Everybody is a dumbass until they agree with you No, Paulbots have a long and distinguished history of tampering with web polls... And then claiming that Ron was being conspired against, because he never won any states, but won so many web polls.... The 'real' voting results turned out to be more in line with the traditional polling, of course... This is nothing but the same crew playing the same game... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:42:11 AM EDT
[#14]
Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.
So, apparently you favor a silver standard over a gold standard? It is still congress' choice. The constitution does give them that power. Free banking would make for an interesting world. We may end up with a negative carbon standard. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:46:18 AM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.
So, apparently you favor a silver standard over a gold standard? It is still congress' choice. The constitution does give them that power. Free banking would make for an interesting world. We may end up with a negative carbon standard. Given Congress has the authority to coin money where does an unaudited Fed come from? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:55:42 AM EDT
[#16]
Given Congress has the authority to coin money where does an unaudited Fed come from?
Congress. I am not a big time supporter of the Federal Reserve system. However, if the fed is abolished, some thing must replace it. Under our constitution, the congress chooses what that replacement will be. Which, is kind of silly, because the people actually vote on what the currency will be. The gov't, can force you to pay taxes in the currency of its choice, and can make a currency legal tender for debt, but all other transactions are free to personal choice. Most people in the US choose dollars, as a matter of convenience, but they chould choose cigarettes, wampum, or any number of things to serve as currency. Czarist paper rubles held their value better after the Russian revolution, even though they were worthless, simply because the people chose to accept them in preference to the Soviet ruble. I kind of like the idea of competing private currencies, especially in our wonderful digital age. I seriously doubt that this, or any future congress will experiment in that area, however. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:56:42 AM EDT
[#17]
Abolish the Fed! Restore the power to the Treasury Department where it belongs.
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Posted: 9/19/2009 10:59:33 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Given Congress has the authority to coin money where does an unaudited Fed come from?
Congress. I am not a big time supporter of the Federal Reserve system. However, if the fed is abolished, some thing must replace it. Under our constitution, the congress chooses what that replacement will be. Which, is kind of silly, because the people actually vote on what the currency will be. The gov't, can force you to pay taxes in the currency of its choice, and can make a currency legal tender for debt, but all other transactions are free to personal choice. Most people in the US choose dollars, as a matter of convenience, but they chould choose cigarettes, wampum, or any number of things to serve as currency. Czarist paper rubles held their value better after the Russian revolution, even though they were worthless, simply because the people chose to accept them in preference to the Soviet ruble. I kind of like the idea of competing private currencies, especially in our wonderful digital age. I seriously doubt that this, or any future congress will experiment in that area, however. I did not say abolish;I said audit. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:13:07 AM EDT
[#19]
I certainly don't mind if the congress wants to order an audit of the fed. They could even make the results of that audit public, and not bother me.
Not too sure what that would actually accomplish, though. Now, if we had competing currencies, (which we actually do, though not in a practical sense), we wouldn't need an audit, would we? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:16:33 AM EDT
[#20]
The Problem is lack of Accountability and Corruption.
Banks leveraging Money and giving Questionable Loans has maxed OUT the World Economy. Nothing Backed the Money that was given out. Doesn't matter if its Printed Money or Gold. It doesn't matter if WE had the Gold Standard the same thing would of happened because of the ALLOWED Corruption and Unaccountability. Gold would just trade at $100, $1000, $5000 or whatever Price determined by Interest Rates by that Governing Body. Representatives calling to end the FED are doing so for the Power. Every Branch wants more POWER....Smoke & Mirrors 
Bankruptcy Laws are in place for this reason, but OUR Government has Guaranteed those that can' t be; In order to Cover Up THEIR Screw Ups. 
Inflation is caused to make Government Debt seem Less over time. Just in the past 30 years No ONE stopped the Insanity. WE need a 'Governing' Body separate from the 3 Branches, that handles a much simpler system. Every Dollar handed out has to be Backed by another Physical Dollar. WE will return to real 'Values' by cutting out all the Middle Men. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:19:44 AM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
The Problem is lack of Accountability and Corruption. Banks leveraging Money and giving Questionable Loans has maxed OUT the World Economy. Nothing Backed the Money that was given out. Doesn't matter if its Printed Money or Gold. It doesn't matter if WE had the Gold Standard the same thing would of happened because of the ALLOWED Corruption and Unaccountability. Gold would just trade at $100, $1000, $5000 or whatever Price determined by Interest Rates by that Governing Body. Representatives calling to end the FED are doing so for the Power. Every Branch wants more POWER....Smoke & Mirrors
Bankruptcy Laws are in place for this reason, but OUR Government has Guaranteed those that can' t be; In order to Cover Up THEIR Screw Ups.
Inflation is caused to make Government Debt seem Less over time. Just in the past 30 years No ONE stopped the Insanity. WE need a 'Governing' Body separate from the 3 Branches, that handles a much simpler system. Every Dollar handed out has to be Backed by another Physical Dollar. WE will return to real 'Values' by cutting out all the Middle Men. We just need to hold Congress accountable;this is Pelosi's worst fear. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:41:58 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The Problem is lack of Accountability and Corruption. Banks leveraging Money and giving Questionable Loans has maxed OUT the World Economy. Nothing Backed the Money that was given out. Doesn't matter if its Printed Money or Gold. It doesn't matter if WE had the Gold Standard the same thing would of happened because of the ALLOWED Corruption and Unaccountability. Gold would just trade at $100, $1000, $5000 or whatever Price determined by Interest Rates by that Governing Body. Representatives calling to end the FED are doing so for the Power. Every Branch wants more POWER....Smoke & Mirrors
Bankruptcy Laws are in place for this reason, but OUR Government has Guaranteed those that can' t be; In order to Cover Up THEIR Screw Ups.
Inflation is caused to make Government Debt seem Less over time. Just in the past 30 years No ONE stopped the Insanity. WE need a 'Governing' Body separate from the 3 Branches, that handles a much simpler system. Every Dollar handed out has to be Backed by another Physical Dollar. WE will return to real 'Values' by cutting out all the Middle Men. We just need to hold Congress accountable;this is Pelosi's worst fear. Let it Collapse and see how many Prosecutions occur. 
Only when 'WE' really feel the pain from all of this Corruption, will those 'Representative, Past & Present, be held Accountable. The Inevitable will occur when the Governments of the World stop bailing out the 'Players'. 
Unless some Other 'System' is created by the same Pimps & Whores; WE can't allow that to occur 
You can't 'Print' or Borrow for Profits, EVER, so why are these 'Geniuses' doing it?
Buying time 
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:48:51 AM EDT
[#23]
WE need a 'Governing' Body separate from the 3 Branches, that handles a much simpler system.
And who would set that up-Congress? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 11:58:24 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ron Paul P0wnz all ze pollz!!!!! Stupid paulbots... Scripts are for Kiddies.... Everybody is a dumbass until they agree with you No, Paulbots have a long and distinguished history of tampering with web polls... And then claiming that Ron was being conspired against, because he never won any states, but won so many web polls.... The 'real' voting results turned out to be more in line with the traditional polling, of course... This is nothing but the same crew playing the same game... ARFCOM does the same thing  
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Posted: 9/19/2009 12:13:29 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
WE need a 'Governing' Body separate from the 3 Branches, that handles a much simpler system. And who would set that up-Congress? Congress has to follow the Constitution. You could still call it the FED, doesn't really matter, my point is that things are made complicated for a reason; Confusion. The Treasury, the FED, Congress, Executive all should 'Hate' each other not 'Work together'? Why no Checks & Balances? They all played a Major role in this Implosion and are trying to cover their tracks. The cost of goods is a constant; The Dollar has less value so it takes more to buy those Goods & Services. All in the name of Government Debt that has made OUR Economy more 'Stable'; Right?
Simplify things so OUR dollar holds a real value, not an inflated one. OUR Current system has proven to be easily Corrupted, Manipulated and Abused; WE need Accountability, NOT Secrecy; Checks & Balances
'Complex Problems' have simple solutions, it just involves Real Accountability. Just my opinion
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Posted: 9/19/2009 12:22:19 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ron Paul P0wnz all ze pollz!!!!! Stupid paulbots... Scripts are for Kiddies.... Everybody is a dumbass until they agree with you No, Paulbots have a long and distinguished history of tampering with web polls... And then claiming that Ron was being conspired against, because he never won any states, but won so many web polls.... The 'real' voting results turned out to be more in line with the traditional polling, of course... This is nothing but the same crew playing the same game... Agreed. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 12:23:49 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Hell, I think .gov should be abolished. there is no government like no government |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:20:04 PM EDT
[#28]
The vast major of financial people would like to see the Fed abolish. All you have to look is in the blogs.
There were times when the USA has no central bank and the USA did fine in those era. I believe the Fed itself is illegal under the US Constitution because it take a part of the responsibility out the US government and into their private hands. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:22:30 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: "If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States... The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:23:29 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: I certainly don't mind if the congress wants to order an audit of the fed. They could even make the results of that audit public, and not bother me. Not too sure what that would actually accomplish, though. Now, if we had competing currencies, (which we actually do, though not in a practical sense), we wouldn't need an audit, would we? Competing currencies are unworkable for the average consumer. Too much information, constantly changing, to make it work... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:24:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Why would we abolish the Federal Reserve? What's the point?
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:27:52 PM EDT
[#32]
Whoops, yes, should be audited.
It's unConstitutional for them to have Congressional powers to make law concerning the ability to coin money, also. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:39:43 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted: Quoted: At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States..."If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself... We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:41:52 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States..."If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself... We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. Yeah... Except then ACORN would get to form banks & have all our tax revenue deposited with them, they'd lose it all 'investing' in inner city housing projects, and the recession would get worse (given the present President swapped for AJ).... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 2:58:21 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted: Quoted: Yeah... Except then ACORN would get to form banks & have all our tax revenue deposited with them, they'd lose it all 'investing' in inner city housing projects, and the recession would get worse (given the present President swapped for AJ)....Quoted: We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. Quoted: At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States..."If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself...  |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:01:22 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Yeah... Except then ACORN would get to form banks & have all our tax revenue deposited with them, they'd lose it all 'investing' in inner city housing projects, and the recession would get worse (given the present President swapped for AJ)....Quoted: We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. Quoted: At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States..."If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself... Exactly.... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:05:45 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Yeah... Except then ACORN would get to form banks & have all our tax revenue deposited with them, they'd lose it all 'investing' in inner city housing projects, and the recession would get worse (given the present President swapped for AJ)....
Quoted:
We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. Quoted:
At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States...
"If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself...
Exactly.... Isn't that what people like Janet Reno and Barney Frank did?
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:24:44 PM EDT
[#38]
Yes, it should be. However, I don't want it done now. Look who would choose the replacement (and there would be SOME form of replacement), a whacked out Liberal as hell Congress. If things improve in 2010, MAYBE we can consider abolishing the Fed, but probably not until Obama is gone as well. Think about how it would turn out if done tomorrow...Obama would appoint some Czar to be in charge of everything, Congress would approve it, and we'd have some whack job in control of our banking system complete with former acorn drones to enforce their will. The Republicans in Congress would do a half-assed job of opposing it, and we'd end up worse off than we are now.
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:26:32 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Yeah... Except then ACORN would get to form banks & have all our tax revenue deposited with them, they'd lose it all 'investing' in inner city housing projects, and the recession would get worse (given the present President swapped for AJ)....Quoted: We could always just pull an Andrew Jackson. Quoted: At the time of the Founding, we created the Bank of the United States..."If you do away with the Fed, you have to replace it with some thing." Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913.Seriously audit it! The modern Federal Reserve is almost identical in design, other than being distributed across the country... So 'replacing it' with the original, would be 'replacing it' with itself... Exactly.... Isn't that what people like Janet Reno and Barney Frank did? That's an 'update' of what Andrew Jackson did with the US dollar, when he was President... ACORN = Presidential cronies inner city housing projects = land out west But otherwise, it was the same.... All over a personal beef with bankers & others who did not work with their hands... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:32:54 PM EDT
[#40]
"SHOULD THE FED BE ABOLISHED????"
Yes. The Fed is a part of the International Banking Cartel. If the public ever finds out how much of the taxpayers bailout money went out of the country, the Fed would be done for. American tax dollars bailing out the world. Do you think the world will return the favor when we go bust? TT |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:35:55 PM EDT
[#41]
Yes.
Time for something new..........in a lot of places. Hit the reset soon .
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:40:18 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: "SHOULD THE FED BE ABOLISHED????" Yes. The Fed is a part of the International Banking Cartel. If the public ever finds out how much of the taxpayers bailout money went out of the country, the Fed would be done for. American tax dollars bailing out the world. Do you think the world will return the favor when we go bust? TT That's what I've been thinking from the first bailout. The money is gone. Doubling the money supply from 800B to 1.7T..........where is it? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:42:37 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted: Quoted: "SHOULD THE FED BE ABOLISHED????" Yes. The Fed is a part of the International Banking Cartel. If the public ever finds out how much of the taxpayers bailout money went out of the country, the Fed would be done for. American tax dollars bailing out the world. Do you think the world will return the favor when we go bust? TT That's what I've been thinking from the first bailout. The money is gone. Doubling the money supply from 800B to 1.7T..........where is it? The functional money supply is 13T. 800B is paper... None of the TARP money was 'new paper'... There is still only 800B or so in paper... Most of the TARP money has been paid back, due to Obama trying to use it as a 'leash' to kick the banks around... Further, TARP was not the FED, TARP was the Treasury..... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 3:51:11 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
No just audited. This. We can abolish them after the audit. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 4:03:49 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted: Quoted: Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913. So, apparently you favor a silver standard over a gold standard? It is still congress' choice. The constitution does give them that power. Free banking would make for an interesting world. We may end up with a negative carbon standard. Given Congress has the authority to coin money Give the same fools who fucked up the credit system direct control over monetary policy? Pfft... Anything's better than that –– excpet gold where does an unaudited Fed come from? Congress had the foresight to make the FED independent in the beginning. This independence includes not being subject to congressional audit. It is a very, very good thing too - Congress only audits things they want to manipulate, and we do not need them manipulating the money supply |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 4:07:04 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted: The vast major of financial people would like to see the Fed abolish. All you have to look is in the blogs. There were times when the USA has no central bank and the USA did fine in those era. I believe the Fed itself is illegal under the US Constitution because it take a part of the responsibility out the US government and into their private hands. And you would be 100% wrong... 1) Anyone can set up a blog... The 'financial people' to listen to are the ones at Goldman, & similar... 2) The time that the US had no central bank, by and large, had far worse economic turmoil - more frequent and more severe panics - than we did under the original Hamiltonian banking system, or the time since under the FED... Jackson was a fool... |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 4:12:00 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Replace it with what was in place at the time of the Constitution,not 1913. So, apparently you favor a silver standard over a gold standard? It is still congress' choice. The constitution does give them that power. Free banking would make for an interesting world. We may end up with a negative carbon standard. Given Congress has the authority to coin money Give the same fools who fucked up the credit system direct control over monetary policy? Pfft... Anything's better than that –– excpet gold where does an unaudited Fed come from? Congress had the foresight to make the FED independent in the beginning. This independence includes not being subject to congressional audit. It is a very, very good thing too - Congress only audits things they want to manipulate, and we do not need them manipulating the money supply I have to agree with Dave_A on this. (I'm spitting the bad taste of that thought out of my head) Since this has been in the news, I've been talking to an attorney at the law firm where I work. He explained that congress not having the power to audit the Fed prevents them from manipulating it for political gain. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 4:20:31 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted: Abolish the Fed! Restore the power to the Treasury Department where it belongs. I could get behind this. There's no perfect solution. The complete absence of some sort of financial body was difficult in the first days of our fledgling nation. I can only imagine how much harder it would be today, what with our "global economy" and such. But there has to be a limited scope and specific agenda, something that I don't think our current version has. Hamilton seemed to do a good enough job. There will always be factors outside the control of the governing body, but history says, and common sense agrees, that the less government intrusion into the affairs of men, the better. |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 4:28:34 PM EDT
[#49]
Yeah, let's have the govt. create money out of thin air and charge us interest on it to borrow it. On the surface, sounds totally legit.
Nah, there would never be a massive debt no one could ever repay and would not shackle future generations with high taxation. Great plan! Yeah, and it would end up being a massive control mechanism either. Cause the congress has ALWAYS proved themselves prudent stuwarts of the public funds. Let alone Obama, nah, he'll just spend til your drunk. Hell, yes, this sounds GREAT! Giving a bunch of damn lawyers a blank check book, sounds like a totally reasonable thing to do if your a socialist whore. Now, if your a freedom loving american who wants to keep more than a small percentage of your income, it's a total shit plan. Really, who here is paying upwards of 50% taxation. Really, and your ok with that?!?! Lick the polsihed wingtips if you want, but these fedres goons and their fag buddies in the IRS can take a hike. If I ain't speaking de troof, then I'm tim foiled out. But I emplore you to go look at what the fed does and does not do. Look for yourself. Fuck the haters, GO LOOK. Your getting skinned. Look at the official charter of the FED Reserve. Look at the law. They create money at the request of congress. Where does that money come from? |
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Posted: 9/19/2009 6:28:23 PM EDT
[#50]
Quoted: The functional money supply is 13T. 800B is paper... None of the TARP money was 'new paper'... There is still only 800B or so in paper... Most of the TARP money has been paid back, due to Obama trying to use it as a 'leash' to kick the banks around... Further, TARP was not the FED, TARP was the Treasury..... Latest Observations:
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