Then you might want to do a little research.

In my jurisdiction, for years, a “Private Person” and Peace Officer had the exact same authority to arrest. In recent times, Peace Officers have been given additional authority to arrest for certain misdemeanors involving Domestic Violence.  Based on posts in other threads, many jurisdictions have similar laws.

Here, use of force, up to and including Deadly Force, under certain circumstances, is allowed by law. So if you commit a crime, and Jon Q Public places you under arrest and you resist, he can use force on you, and YOU could be convicted of committing an additional crime of assault on J Q Public.

There are risks to making a Private Person arrest. If you make a false arrest, you could be held civilly liable. The attitude of the Prosecutor in your jurisdiction could affect you too. If he thinks only Cops should enforce the law, and thinks “Citizen’s arrests” amount to vigilante actions, then he may decline to prosecute the criminal, which will open the “Private Person” to an accusation of false arrest and potential civil liability. Also as a private person making an arrest, you might encounter an arfcommer who thinks only Cops can arrest him, and one or both of you get injured in the process.

Another issue some arfcomers may be confused on is Cops and jurisdiction. A Cop out of his jurisdiction will not have the support of his department, prosecutor, etc. In other words he isn't likely to be arresting you as a “Cop”. However, if the law in what ever jurisdiction he and you happen to be in allows Private Persons arrest, he can still damn well arrest you. He may be unwilling to do so without his departments blessing and support though. His department’s policy and procedures may even prohibit him from arresting outside his jurisdiction. In that case, a Private person realisticly has greater authority to arrest you than the Cop.

Every state seems to be a bit different, so perhaps the state you live in doesn’t allow Private Person arrests. Do you KNOW what your law is?

So, if you commit a crime, or if you engage in actions that would make a reasonable person believe you committed a crime, it would be wise to know your laws before resisting ANY arrest.


ETA: The post is NOT advocating making Citizens arrests. In fact it contains some very good reasons not to. The point is to learn your laws before making statements like “if he’s not a cop he can’t arrest you”

Here is my advice to those that miss the entire point and run down to the basement to make a superhero costume so as to venture forth to fight crime - Just because you CAN doesn’t mean you SHOULD. If you WANT to go make arrests, get a job where you get paid to do it and have the support to back you up

YOU WILL NOT ARREST ME!

Son, I have no intention of arresting you.

Rules are very different from state to state. Up there in AK if you ain't in town I'm betting you're gonna' wait a bit for a cop.

Quoted: Son, I have no intention of arresting you.

LOL, that sounds a bit...ominous.

Quoted: Quoted: Son, I have no intention of arresting you. LOL, that sounds a bit...ominous.

and he called us 'internet tough guys'

Quoted: Quoted: Son, I have no intention of arresting you. LOL, that sounds a bit...ominous.

Heh, it sounds a bit.... something for sure.

LOL, what I ment is that not only am I a long ways from TX, I don't go out of my way to get into others business.

I will blade at 45 degrees, while thinking 'disengage', following a massive adrenaline dump, if someone tries to place me under arrest.


No.  I lie.  I'll let a security guard/loss prevention arrest me.  And then, because they've fucked up, I'll end up accepting a settlement, that I'll use to go out and buy some new toys.

It's all good, Dad

Lets just hope the person attempting the arrest makes it very clear they have the authority to do so. I am a bit slow, after all. I can't keep track of all the cops, sheriff deputies, firemen, dog catchers, trash men, etc that have the authority to arrest a person these days.

So, how about dogs?
Can any mall ninja or Wallymart door gunner decimate your dog for no reason other than that they are out of donuts?

BTW, I am not a Security Guard, “Loss Prevention Specialist” or whatnot. I have no dog in that fight. I just had an impulse to start a thread to (hopefully) prompt folks to actually learn their laws.

In fact, I think I’m going to edit the original post to remove terms that might offend the group that would benefit most from learning.

Quoted: Lets just hope the person attempting the arrest makes it very clear they have the authority to do so. I am a bit slow, after all. I can't keep track of all the cops, sheriff deputies, firemen, dog catchers, trash men, etc that have the authority to arrest a person these days.

See, this is what I am encouraging folks to research. Here, the answer is “all of the above” have the “Authority” as you put it, plus everyone else, from the retired State Trooper to the pimple face kid at McD’s.  

I can bet though, that the dogcatcher, trash man, etc., will NOT arrest you. They do legally fit the defination of a Private Person and have the “Authority” under law to arrest you.

Try to separate the idea of a job title or uniform from "authority" to arrest. A criminal gives Jon Q Public the "authority" to arrest by committing the crime.  

Quoted: Quoted: Lets just hope the person attempting the arrest makes it very clear they have the authority to do so. I am a bit slow, after all. I can't keep track of all the cops, sheriff deputies, firemen, dog catchers, trash men, etc that have the authority to arrest a person these days. See, this is what I am encouraging folks to research. Here, the answer is “all of the above” have the “Authority” as you put it, plus everyone else, from the retired State Trooper to the pimple face kid at McD’s.   I can bet though, that the dogcatcher, trash man, etc., will NOT arrest you. They do legally fit the defination of a Private Person and have the “Authority” under law to arrest you. Try to separate the idea of a job title or uniform from "authority" to arrest. A criminal gives Jon Q Public the "authority" to arrest by committing the crime.

That comment was more in reference to the Fire Marshall and the lady swearing in Walmart. I am not worried about John Q arresting me. I don't do anything that would warrant a regular person to attempt to arrest me. Its all the other guys with job titles that would make them want to arrest me for something petty, like cursing in public, disorderly conduct, or whatever the final charges were in that case.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lets just hope the person attempting the arrest makes it very clear they have the authority to do so. I am a bit slow, after all. I can't keep track of all the cops, sheriff deputies, firemen, dog catchers, trash men, etc that have the authority to arrest a person these days. See, this is what I am encouraging folks to research. Here, the answer is “all of the above” have the “Authority” as you put it, plus everyone else, from the retired State Trooper to the pimple face kid at McD’s.   I can bet though, that the dogcatcher, trash man, etc., will NOT arrest you. They do legally fit the defination of a Private Person and have the “Authority” under law to arrest you. Try to separate the idea of a job title or uniform from "authority" to arrest. A criminal gives Jon Q Public the "authority" to arrest by committing the crime.   That comment was more in reference to the Fire Marshall and the lady swearing in Walmart. I am not worried about John Q arresting me. I don't do anything that would warrant a regular person to attempt to arrest me. Its all the other guys with job titles that would make them want to arrest me for something petty, like cursing in public, disorderly conduct, or whatever the final charges were in that case.

I’m with you on that, a large amount of power is wielded by those supported by the .gov to enforce laws. Disgression and responsibility are vital, but sometimes lacking.

edited for spelling

My CCW permit gives me the power of arrest.  But I mostly use it to pull woman over to get their numbers.  

99.9% of the time, this is a very, very bad idea that opens one up to all sorts of personal liability.  

Even if you catch a person committing a felony in your prescence, from a liability mitigation standpoint you are better off 1) making sure you stay alive 2) restrain person by reasonable force or leave if you can safely do so 3) don't talk.

When John Law from the local arrives, they will instruct you what to say, and how to say it, all while witnessing it so that it sticks once in front of the guy with the black dress on.  Otherwise it tends to turn into an expensive episode of he said / she said, especially when attorneys who advertise on TV at 11am get involved.  

Most non-LE retail stop loss / loss prevention personell are trained this way to protect the pockets of their employers.

Alaska is different due to geography of patrol areas, response times, and culture.  Try some shit like that in Detroit and see how far you get.    

This thread has "bad fuckin idea" written all over it.

In Florida, as told to me by a LEO, citizens have the power to arrest just like the police; HOWEVER, they do not have the power to retain someone (that is a police power). So, you can tell them they are under arrest, but you cannot hold them against their will until the police show up.

Does this mean I a free to shoot dogs who "threaten me?"

Quoted: This thread has "bad fuckin idea" written all over it.

All I can picture is Gomer chasing barney yelling "citizens arrest"

Quoted: Then you might want to do a little research. In my jurisdiction, for years, a “Private Person” and Peace Officer had the exact same authority to arrest. In recent times, Peace Officers have been given additional authority to arrest for certain misdemeanors involving Domestic Violence.  Based on posts in other threads, many jurisdictions have similar laws. Here, use of force, up to and including Deadly Force, under certain circumstances, is allowed by law. So if you commit a crime, and Jon Q Public places you under arrest and you resist, he can use force on you, and YOU could be convicted of committing an additional crime of assault on J Q Public. There are risks to making a Private Person arrest. If you make a false arrest, you could be held civilly liable. The attitude of the Prosecutor in your jurisdiction could affect you too. If he thinks only Cops should enforce the law, and thinks “Citizen’s arrests” amount to vigilante actions, then he may decline to prosecute the criminal, which will open the “Private Person” to an accusation of false arrest and potential civil liability. Also as a private person making an arrest, you might encounter an arfcommer who thinks only Cops can arrest him, and one or both of you get injured in the process. Another issue some arfcomers may be confused on is Cops and jurisdiction. A Cop out of his jurisdiction will not have the support of his department, prosecutor, etc. In other words he isn't likely to be arresting you as a “Cop”. However, if the law in what ever jurisdiction he and you happen to be in allows Private Persons arrest, he can still damn well arrest you. He may be unwilling to do so without his departments blessing and support though. His department’s policy and procedures may even prohibit him from arresting outside his jurisdiction. In that case, a Private person realisticly has greater authority to arrest you than the Cop. Every state seems to be a bit different, so perhaps the state you live in doesn’t allow Private Person arrests. Do you KNOW what your law is? So, if you commit a crime, or if you engage in actions that would make a reasonable person believe you committed a crime, it would be wise to know your laws before resisting ANY arrest.

Over 75% of ARFCOM read this in red and only this. They are now venturing out of their Mom's basement to fight injustices everywhere. Its going to be slow for a while until they all get out of the hospital or jail to post about it. I can't wait for that week it will be epic.

Quoted: Quoted: Then you might want to do a little research. In my jurisdiction, for years, a “Private Person” and Peace Officer had the exact same authority to arrest. In recent times, Peace Officers have been given additional authority to arrest for certain misdemeanors involving Domestic Violence.  Based on posts in other threads, many jurisdictions have similar laws. Here, use of force, up to and including Deadly Force, under certain circumstances, is allowed by law. So if you commit a crime, and Jon Q Public places you under arrest and you resist, he can use force on you, and YOU could be convicted of committing an additional crime of assault on J Q Public. There are risks to making a Private Person arrest. If you make a false arrest, you could be held civilly liable. The attitude of the Prosecutor in your jurisdiction could affect you too. If he thinks only Cops should enforce the law, and thinks “Citizen’s arrests” amount to vigilante actions, then he may decline to prosecute the criminal, which will open the “Private Person” to an accusation of false arrest and potential civil liability. Also as a private person making an arrest, you might encounter an arfcommer who thinks only Cops can arrest him, and one or both of you get injured in the process. Another issue some arfcomers may be confused on is Cops and jurisdiction. A Cop out of his jurisdiction will not have the support of his department, prosecutor, etc. In other words he isn't likely to be arresting you as a “Cop”. However, if the law in what ever jurisdiction he and you happen to be in allows Private Persons arrest, he can still damn well arrest you. He may be unwilling to do so without his departments blessing and support though. His department’s policy and procedures may even prohibit him from arresting outside his jurisdiction. In that case, a Private person realisticly has greater authority to arrest you than the Cop. Every state seems to be a bit different, so perhaps the state you live in doesn’t allow Private Person arrests. Do you KNOW what your law is? So, if you commit a crime, or if you engage in actions that would make a reasonable person believe you committed a crime, it would be wise to know your laws before resisting ANY arrest. Over 75% of ARFCOM read this in red and only this. They are now venturing out of their Mom's basement to fight injustices everywhere. Its going to be slow for a while until they all get out of the hospital or jail to post about it. I can't wait for that week it will be epic.

You may be correct. The main point I hoped a certain segment of GD would get, is that they can be arrested for committing a crime, or engaging in behavior that would lead a reasonable person to believe they committed a crime. The person making the arrest doesn’t necessarily have to be a Police Officer. A wise person will learn his laws before assuming that only a Cop can arrest him.

Quoted: This thread has "bad fuckin idea" written all over it.

I don't get it, the thread is about learning the law. How is that a "bad fucking idea"?

The OP did not advocate making Private Persons arrests, in fact, I gave some good reasons NOT to.

September 4th? First day of CJ 101?

This is another thread that will be full of arguments because the law is different in each state.  Personally the only people who would be arresting me (which is a non-issue considering I am a law obiding citizen) are going to be police officers or State Troopers.  Any private citizen, square badge or hoseloader has NO arrest power in my eyes.  I'll just walk away.

I worked as security guard for a summer in college. Most private security guard companies use the citizen arrest principle as their mandate. It's legal in IL.

Oklahoma allows for citizen's arrest for any misdemeanor in your presence or felony on reasonable suspicion.  If the arrest is legitimate, the commision carrying citizens haveto transport your prisoner.  Be ready to do alot of waiting for paperwork.  You can also hold someone pending code citation too if you don't like going downtown for everything.  Like the thread starter said, do your research and KNOW what you are doing.

Quoted: I worked as security guard for a summer in college. Most private security guard companies use the citizen arrest principle as their mandate. It's legal in IL.

Sadly, I have to use citizens arrest as a security officer for a municipal authority and I am an employee.  Ah well.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Then you might want to do a little research. In my jurisdiction, for years, a “Private Person” and Peace Officer had the exact same authority to arrest. In recent times, Peace Officers have been given additional authority to arrest for certain misdemeanors involving Domestic Violence.  Based on posts in other threads, many jurisdictions have similar laws. Here, use of force, up to and including Deadly Force, under certain circumstances, is allowed by law. So if you commit a crime, and Jon Q Public places you under arrest and you resist, he can use force on you, and YOU could be convicted of committing an additional crime of assault on J Q Public. There are risks to making a Private Person arrest. If you make a false arrest, you could be held civilly liable. The attitude of the Prosecutor in your jurisdiction could affect you too. If he thinks only Cops should enforce the law, and thinks “Citizen’s arrests” amount to vigilante actions, then he may decline to prosecute the criminal, which will open the “Private Person” to an accusation of false arrest and potential civil liability. Also as a private person making an arrest, you might encounter an arfcommer who thinks only Cops can arrest him, and one or both of you get injured in the process. Another issue some arfcomers may be confused on is Cops and jurisdiction. A Cop out of his jurisdiction will not have the support of his department, prosecutor, etc. In other words he isn't likely to be arresting you as a “Cop”. However, if the law in what ever jurisdiction he and you happen to be in allows Private Persons arrest, he can still damn well arrest you. He may be unwilling to do so without his departments blessing and support though. His department’s policy and procedures may even prohibit him from arresting outside his jurisdiction. In that case, a Private person realisticly has greater authority to arrest you than the Cop. Every state seems to be a bit different, so perhaps the state you live in doesn’t allow Private Person arrests. Do you KNOW what your law is? So, if you commit a crime, or if you engage in actions that would make a reasonable person believe you committed a crime, it would be wise to know your laws before resisting ANY arrest. Over 75% of ARFCOM read this in red and only this. They are now venturing out of their Mom's basement to fight injustices everywhere. Its going to be slow for a while until they all get out of the hospital or jail to post about it. I can't wait for that week it will be epic. You may be correct. The main point I hoped a certain segment of GD would get, is that they can be arrested for committing a crime, or engaging in behavior that would lead a reasonable person to believe they committed a crime. The person making the arrest doesn’t necessarily have to be a Police Officer. A wise person will learn his laws before assuming that only a Cop can arrest him.

A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass.....

'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.  

Quoted: This thread has "bad fuckin idea" written all over it.

well, couldn't have said it better myself...

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.

What does OH law say about it?

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it?

I have been told that too.  It took just a little more effort to get the cuffs on the individual.  Determination combined with knowledge of the law is all ya need, but then I am fed a steady stream of street people and banger wanna-be's.

Quoted: Son, I have no intention of arresting you.

Boy, you ain't gonna see the inside of a jail.

This edit was added to the OP:

ETA: The post is NOT advocating making Citizens arrests. In fact it contains some very good reasons not to. The point is to learn your laws before making statements like “if he’s not a cop he can’t arrest you”

Here is my advice to those that miss the entire point and run down to the basement to make a superhero costume so as to venture forth to fight crime - Just because you CAN doesn’t mean you SHOULD. If you WANT to go make arrests, get a job where you get paid to do it and have the support to back you up

CO,

Same here any citizen can arrest for a crime presented in his/her presence all force up to and including lethal may be used..




I will chime in unless it's a major felony I wouldn't bother

But yes I have transfered custody of arestee's taken by citizens before and sometimes the DA will accept the charges...

In practice it's easier and more likely to result in conviction if the officer takes a statement from the citizen arestor and then files the paperwork however in some cases due to liability or law the sheriff just accepts custody for purposes of pre trial detention and is not the arresting agency

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it?

How in the hell am I supposed to know that the "Joe Citizen" trying to put cuffs on me isn't a criminal, and doesn't intend me any harm?  Keep in mind, I've got my CCW, and I do not engage in behavior that would cause a uniformed officer to focus his/her attention on me.

Try to put me in handcuffs without some sort of civi LEO / *.mil 31B type ID, you're bound to be eating lead.  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it? I have been told that too.  It took just a little more effort to get the cuffs on the individual.  Determination combined with knowledge of the law is all ya need, but then I am fed a steady stream of street people and banger wanna-be's.

Don't make the assumption that everybody you think ought to be in cuffs, doesn't know a thing or two about the process themselves.  Things aren't always as they appear, and some people might take a really dim view of other, "un-badged" personnel putting their hands on them.  Not trying to act bad-ass, I'm just saying....

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it? I have been told that too.  It took just a little more effort to get the cuffs on the individual.  Determination combined with knowledge of the law is all ya need, but then I am fed a steady stream of street people and banger wanna-be's. Don't make the assumption that everybody you think ought to be in cuffs, doesn't know a thing or two about the process themselves.  Things aren't always as they appear, and some people might take a really dim view of other, "un-badged" personnel putting their hands on them.  Not trying to act bad-ass, I'm just saying....

No worries.  We are badged, just not(yet) a sworn agency.  Even our off duty PD employees have to use citizen's arrest on their part time.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it? How in the hell am I supposed to know that the "Joe Citizen" trying to put cuffs on me isn't a criminal, and doesn't intend me any harm?  Keep in mind, I've got my CCW, and I do not engage in behavior that would cause a uniformed officer to focus his/her attention on me. Try to put me in handcuffs without some sort of civi LEO / *.mil 31B type ID, you're bound to be eating lead.

I suspect your concern is unfounded. If you committed a crime significant enough for some random “Citizen(s)” to arrest you, then you know what you did.  

Professional “security” type dudes are probably going to clearly state why they are arresting you.

Under what circumstances do you think might encounter Joe citizen trying to put cuffs on you, but you don’t know if he is a criminal or good citizen?  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: A wise person would probably tell anybody trying to pull that "Citizen's Arrest" shit, to kiss their ass..... 'Course, I'm just a prick about stuff like that.   What does OH law say about it? How in the hell am I supposed to know that the "Joe Citizen" trying to put cuffs on me isn't a criminal, and doesn't intend me any harm?  Keep in mind, I've got my CCW, and I do not engage in behavior that would cause a uniformed officer to focus his/her attention on me. Try to put me in handcuffs without some sort of civi LEO / *.mil 31B type ID, you're bound to be eating lead.   I suspect your concern is unfounded. If you committed a crime significant enough for some random “Citizen(s)” to arrest you, then you know what you did.   Professional “security” type dudes are probably going to clearly state why they are arresting you. Under what circumstances do you think might encounter Joe citizen trying to put cuffs on you, but you don’t know if he is a criminal or good citizen?

Let's throw in the "whoopsie - wrong address" on the no-knocks, + the home invaders masquerading as cops scenarios, for starters.

Sending IM....

Interesting information so far, it appears that some folks know their laws. According to posters here, NC and OK are vastly different. CO and AK similar. FL is unique from all those.

Good input and it really highlights why we shouldn’t make blanket statements about who can or can’t make arrests.

Know your local laws. Be cautious about assuming laws elsewhere are the same as yours.

'Course, in spite of my "Keep your nose in your own business" attitude, there ain't no way in hell I'd let a drunk driver leave the scene of an accident he caused, if I could physically stop him/her from doing that.

There ARE times when a "restrain and hold until proper authorities arrive" policy is the ONLY right thing to do.  (Well, you've got the other - make, model, description, license plate #, description of driver, etc. option which would probably work just as good as long as the vehicle wasn't stolen, but I digress.)

I've been, by coincidence, first-on-scene in two accidents in the last year.  Luckily, all I had to do was remember how to direct traffic (after a quick health check for the involved) as nobody was injured in a life-threatening manner.
But yes, in certain circumstances I'd be obligated to attempt to hold someone until Mr. Johnny Law arrived on scene.  

(Jeebus - I've been a member here for ten years and I STILL keep getting swatted on the nose with a newspaper.....)

Quoted: In Florida, as told to me by a LEO, citizens have the power to arrest just like the police; HOWEVER, they do not have the power to retain someone (that is a police power). So, you can tell them they are under arrest, but you cannot hold them against their will until the police show up.

In CA you can.  there is another citizens arrest thread floating around that has details also.

Quoted: This is another thread that will be full of arguments because the law is different in each state.  Personally the only people who would be arresting me (which is a non-issue considering I am a law obiding citizen) are going to be police officers or State Troopers.  Any private citizen, square badge or hoseloader has NO arrest power in my eyes.  I'll just walk away.

It’s not clear from your post, are you saying that where you live, Private Person Arrest (or “Citizens arrest”) are not allowed by law? Or are you saying that you would resist a legal arrest?

The point of the thread was to encourage folks to actually know their law before making statements that might mislead some poor dude that gets his legal advice from arfcom.

If private persons arrest is not allowed in CT, then perhaps you could contribute to the thread by saying so, and/or by giving the cliff notes version of the State Statute. That way, someone living in CT or planning to visit could have a general idea. If you really wanted to be helpful, you could post the Statute #, so someone would have an easier time looking it up for themselves.

On the other hand, if Private Persons Arrest is allowed in CT, your post might be construed as promoting illegal behavior.

I put on my Junior G-Man badge, and shouted "You're busted".