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Posted: 10/27/2021 8:27:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: The_Beer_Slayer]
This is now the active "shit News links, thanks to BerettaGuy: Originally Posted By BerettaGuy: LINKS TO UKRAINIAN NEWS SOURCES IN ENGLISH Kyiv Post Ukrainian News UKRInform EUROMAIDEN PRESS New Voice of Ukraine Kyiv Independent Ukraine World InterFax Ukraine UATV Ukrainian Journal Official Website of the President of Ukraine Ukrainian Ministry of Defense Save these links. I can't post all the headlines like I've done in the past - too much news and too often. Please @ me with additional stuff to be added here. I don't currently have time to properly curate this thread otherwise. New news link c/o berettaguy: Ukrainian Pravda https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/ Stop fake, anti - disinformation site: https://www.stopfake.org/en/main/ |
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CHN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:34:09 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Former11BRAVO: Just because it's "our side" doesn't mean we're wearing white hats all the time. We meddled for nefarious purposes and fostered a color revolution in Ukraine. We continued to add nations to NATO after promising we wouldn't - nations nowhere near the fucking Atlantic, I might add. We continued to poke the RU bear and then cried "Foul!" when he finally lashed out (after warning us repeatedly). The color revolution in Ukraine brought democracy not dominated by Russia. It overthrew a Russian puppet. And the people of the Ukraine were the driving force in that revolution, as they are the driving force fighting Putin now. And I don't give a shit that Russia is butthurt about NATO. Former Warsaw Pact states and even former parts of the USSR have been happy to join NATO, since they grasped the real threat--the bear in their backyard. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:35:10 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Looks like the market maybe predicting this. Based on the upcoming speech today about the referendum and "mobilization". Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Is this based on fears of mobilization? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdGuf54XgAAExWB?format=jpg&name=medium Looks like the market maybe predicting this. Based on the upcoming speech today about the referendum and "mobilization". |
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CHN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:37:52 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: You’re forgetting one MAJOR timeline point that “conservatives” love to ignore Volodymyr Zelenskyy Assumed office 20 May 2019 Not president during Biden/Hunter/Burisma scandal And Hunter's boss at Burisma was pro-Russian. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:38:16 AM EDT
[#4]
Would M1128 Strykers be a good option for Ukraine? They're going to be retired by the Army anyway, they have a 105mm gun, they run on diesel (IIRC), etc. I think those could be useful for assaults like we saw in Kharkiv. That being said, my knowledge about armored vehicles is rudimentary at best and comes solely from the internet, so someone will likely explain to me that this is a horrible idea, lol.
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:40:47 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bikedamon: Fostering a color revolution in Ukraine was not "nefarious". Russia and the West both play the influence game, and Russia's overplayed their influence hand in Ukraine and it blew up in their face. NATO is about to fracture? Debatable. Membership is expanding. Turkey was never a good NATO partner or ally in general, but they are an ally of convenience due to proximity of Russia. Russia's fear of an expanding NATO became a self-fulfilling prophecy through their own actions. Beyond that, most of the rest of your comments "The West caused this! - The WEF is leading this! - If Biden is for it I'm against it!" seem to confirm prior stated opinions about you that you have a problem with. Turkey used to be a better ally. Really becoming shit now. And Germany has always been lukewarm. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:42:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: ITCHY-FINGER]
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: The color revolution in Ukraine brought democracy not dominated by Russia. It overthrew a Russian puppet. And the people of the Ukraine were the driving force in that revolution, as they are the driving force fighting Putin now. And I don't give a shit that Russia is butthurt about NATO. Former Warsaw Pact states and even former parts of the USSR have been happy to join NATO, since they grasped the real threat--the bear in their backyard. I think what may be confusing some conservatives is that there was outside influence before, during Maidan. Our buddy John McCain was heavily involved as well as others. So some folks just assume the revolution was afro-turfed. But it was grassroots from the Ukrainian people with overwhelming popular support. It was a revolution against corruption and against Russian influence. No amount of nefarious Western influence could get the people out in the streets for months, taking bullets from snipers, without being real and of/by the people. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:42:34 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: You’re forgetting one MAJOR timeline point that “conservatives” love to ignore Volodymyr Zelenskyy Assumed office 20 May 2019 Not president during Biden/Hunter/Burisma scandal Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KELBEAST: Originally Posted By 1969iggy:
That's the best short way for me to sum it up. You’re forgetting one MAJOR timeline point that “conservatives” love to ignore Volodymyr Zelenskyy Assumed office 20 May 2019 Not president during Biden/Hunter/Burisma scandal Often left out of this conversation: 
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:43:23 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MelGibsonEnthusiast: Would M1128 Strykers be a good option for Ukraine? They're going to be retired by the Army anyway, they have a 105mm gun, they run on diesel (IIRC), etc. I think those could be useful for assaults like we saw in Kharkiv. That being said, my knowledge about armored vehicles is rudimentary at best and comes solely from the internet, so someone will likely explain to me that this is a horrible idea, lol. Would probably be excellent, although limited in the mud season. Ukraine seems to benefit from any vehicles, M113s and those Aussie armored trucks. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:45:40 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Former11BRAVO: I'll not be cutting off my friend - because he is, indeed, a friend. Friends can be mistaken (or, led astray) and still be friends. Apparently, you are omnipotent and probably have very few real friends who don't think you're a judgmental prick. ETA: Likely true for a lot of posters in this thread. Dude.. just stop being your own worst enemy. People were right to call you out for pushing that excusenic drivel. You are wrong to waste so much thread on your ego and poor judgement. Stop being someone elses fool and listen to what people are telling you. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:48:14 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tiberius: What I’d like to know is why US Divisional Insignia and a inset map of CONUS were on that map. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tiberius: Originally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Originally Posted By Gunslinger808: A question I’ve had is if Russia had rolled up the Ukraine like they thought they could, would they have stopped there, or consolidated then moved on to try and take another country? They did have designs on other countries. Very early on someone (the Belarusian President?) leaked a map showing them moving on to Moldova after Ukraine ostensibly fell. They ran their mouth about "de-Nazifying" the Baltic states as well. What I’d like to know is why US Divisional Insignia and a inset map of CONUS were on that map. Belarus was supposed to close the Suwalki gap between Belarus and Kaliningrad. It would have involved invading Poland and Lithuania. Guaranteeing US involvement and that map (I think) was intended to show their intel on what was in Poland. About a day after he had his little presentation. Poland and US troops moved to the border and there was about five times more shit than Vladdy had told him he would be facing.  (Record scratch sound) |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:48:44 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Would probably be excellent, although limited in the mud season. Ukraine seems to benefit from any vehicles, M113s and those Aussie armored trucks. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Originally Posted By MelGibsonEnthusiast: Would M1128 Strykers be a good option for Ukraine? They're going to be retired by the Army anyway, they have a 105mm gun, they run on diesel (IIRC), etc. I think those could be useful for assaults like we saw in Kharkiv. That being said, my knowledge about armored vehicles is rudimentary at best and comes solely from the internet, so someone will likely explain to me that this is a horrible idea, lol. Would probably be excellent, although limited in the mud season. Ukraine seems to benefit from any vehicles, M113s and those Aussie armored trucks. Yeah, I've been thinking that since we're hesitant to send Abrams due to issues with logistics and maintenance, M1128 Strykers would be a halfway decent alternative. They're not a tank, but they've got a 105mm gun and would likely work great for the sort of offensive operations Ukraine is going to need to conduct to retake ground in the south. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:52:34 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sq40: Video of the firebombing of Ozerne; https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/xj2ry1/russians_continue_to_burn_ukrainian_villages_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf  What kind of ammunition is used for that? That almost looks fake since I've never seen air-dropped munitions that are on fire as they rain down. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:54:03 AM EDT
[#13]
The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me.
When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:55:33 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:56:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CenterMass762: Excuse me but wtf even is the Comoro islands? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CenterMass762: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Well, that makes me feel safer that Comoro islands won't deploy space based weapons. 
Excuse me but wtf even is the Comoro islands? lol, islands off the coast of Africa. Russia doesn't have to worry about their space weaponry at least if they ever decide to have a space program. 
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:57:42 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: The oldest of them maybe. Could be useful for training, maybe to issue to reservists to hold near a questionable border. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Originally Posted By ludder093: Are those viable against Russian tanks? The oldest of them maybe. Could be useful for training, maybe to issue to reservists to hold near a questionable border. Adding yet another animal to the zoo doesn't sound like a good idea, but used for training or reserve might free up better equipment for the front. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 11:57:49 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. We won’t do anything in retaliation for a Russian Nuke going off in Ukraine (or several). That’s what Russia believes and is banking on. Butt what about Poland? Would they allow that? Would they instantly move on Moscow with everything in a decapitation strike knowing they are next to be attacked? If they are nuked would we (NATO) still be restrained, |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:00:17 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By frankiebagadonuts: China isn't going to risk sanctions over Ukraine. They have seen what not only the official sanctions, but the voluntary company pull-outs have done to Russia. China is much more dependent on trade than Russia. They would be absolutely crushed by sanctions. Came out last week that the administration is writing a list of sanctions it would hit China with if Taiwan is invaded, and the Taiwan Policy Act is moving through committee with, for the first time, a loan package to Taiwan to buy US weapons and probably some of its own sanctions. Point is the sanctions have been piling up quick, the more that go into effect now the less the deterrent effect of additional sanctions can be relied upon. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:01:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: OBird]
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
These muthafuckers Crazy how I just watched that recent Peter Zeihan video where he says Russia would be more inclined to nuke Berlin than Ukraine, and now this… |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:02:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. The theory is that a full mobilization and conscription of Russians from "favored locations" like Moscow would be political suicide for Putin. It's true they dont care about the lives of conscripts from far away republics, prisoners, etc but what about their own sons? I'm not sure but it seems valid. Maybe we will find out how the elites of Moscow, St. Pete etc feel about this war. And probably most importantly, they will need equipment. This is not WWII where mass waves against a tired and understaffed army worked. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:02:36 PM EDT
[#21]
11 minutes ago.
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:04:42 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Former11BRAVO: When I get time to give you guys a recent history lesson, I will. And I never said they were 100% responsible. I put more blame on NATO/the West, in general. Just because it's "our side" doesn't mean we're wearing white hats all the time. We meddled for nefarious purposes and fostered a color revolution in Ukraine. We continued to add nations to NATO after promising we wouldn't - nations nowhere near the fucking Atlantic, I might add. We continued to poke the RU bear and then cried "Foul!" when he finally lashed out (after warning us repeatedly). That's no defense of Russia/Putin. It's just the truth - and it's only the tip of the iceberg. And look at the result: the whole world is about to either explode or go tits up, financially. Oh, but we get to puff out our chests and say how righteous we are, as the Earth and our way of life/civilization become a smoking ruin. That's great! NATO, in particular, is about to fracture, too. Some of our historic "partners" can't stand the pain and are about the jump ship. Hell, look at what Turkey just announced yesterday and what Germany is doing (or, not doing). Look at the other regional conflicts about to kick off. What's not to love, right? Yet, I'm the asshole for pointing out that we are/have been playing with fire. Fucking Biden & Co. (and the EU, NATO, WEF, et al) are the last people on this planet I would choose to lead us into any conflict, much less, a possible WWIII. They're also the last people I'd believe about anything - and with good reason. How long have they been lying to us about most everything? It's almost enough to make one nostalgic for the Cold War, I swear! Personally, I hope UA kicks the snot out of RU. My whole reason for being from 1983-89 was to kill Russians, so I have no love for them. But, I'm not foolish enough to think there might not be major, long-lasting consequences to us, for our part in this shit-show - catastrophic consequences, actually. And Heaven help us if we actually end up in a shooting war with Russia and/or China. Our munitions are depleted, our SPR is near dry and our forces are all waiting for their transition surgery, our .mil leadership is undergoing another political purge and we have unreliable allies! Again, what's not to love, right? Not to mention, our own southern border is being invaded. Last number I saw was something like 2.4 MILLION illegals interdicted just this year alone. How many came in undetected? But, we're worried about borders on the other side of the globe and investing irreplaceable resources and treasure into making it as painful and drawn out as possible for all involved. It's pathetic. But, keep cheering it on and attacking me, guys! You're the SMEs after all. What the fuck do I know about anything? This post is pretty reasonable and I don't really find anything at fault here, except to point out one thing: You don't get to choose war or peace if the other guy has already made that decision for you. Russia is a direct threat to world stability, and sitting on the sidelines - while more expeditious and "cheaper" today - will cost MUCH more than getting involved now. Biden, unfortunately, is who we have but I have to say that he's done "OK" (that's about as nice as I'm willing to go). Insofar as we're discussing who's right and who is wrong: Nobody is totally clean, but it really doesn't matter a whole lot. Ukraine was attacked by Russia and has been subjected to barbaric brutality. END OF STORY. That's all I need to know that we should support them. It really is that black and white, and I don't care if Ukraine has done some shady things in the past. Is there pain because of this? Yes, no doubt. I would like it much better if my retirement portfolio looked like it did before the Russians invaded, but I also know that it's cheaper to do it now than when they were ready to do the same thing to Poland and a bunch of other countries. The US was always going to get involved to some level, and I see this as the cheapest of the options. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:04:49 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:05:44 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Former11BRAVO: Like the trench warfare and artillery bombardments in/around the breakaway Donbas Region? It was in the news for years, but I'm being told it never happened. You mean the war that the Russians started by infiltrating their regular military into the Donbass and making it seem like it was a local uprising? |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:06:35 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
itshappening.gif |
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NY, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:06:53 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: And Hunter's boss at Burisma was pro-Russian. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Originally Posted By KELBEAST: You’re forgetting one MAJOR timeline point that “conservatives” love to ignore Volodymyr Zelenskyy Assumed office 20 May 2019 Not president during Biden/Hunter/Burisma scandal And Hunter's boss at Burisma was pro-Russian. I didn't forget that... it's not relevant to the way of thinking that leads to "conservatives" not supporting Ukraine. The conversation with him was central to the second impeachment for trying to interfere with the election, or whatever Dem horseshit was tossed around. The people you are arguing with don't care... Biden is corrupt, he got money from Ukraine, Ukraine Bad. It's the same idiocy that has people who blame the war on Trump because he "withheld aid".... I was just answering the question of why some people thought that way. If you ignore all the other facts, and focus on just those... it's "logical". |
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CHN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:08:11 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: I think what may be confusing some conservatives is that there was outside influence before, during Maidan. Our buddy John McCain was heavily involved as well as others. So some folks just assume the revolution was afro-turfed. But it was grassroots from the Ukrainian people with overwhelming popular support. It was a revolution against corruption and against Russian influence. No amount of nefarious Western influence could get the people out in the streets for months, taking bullets from snipers, without being real and of/by the people. There was support, maybe just verbal, from the Soros/WEF/EU types, but they are not always wrong. Soros opposed the USSR. EU is better then any Russian economic system. I can think Brexit is good while thinking Ukraine would benefit from EU membership. It isn't all black and white. The grassroots Ukrainian support was clear, as you say. Getting rid of a Putin puppet is always good. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:08:19 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Lol. Why would Russia govt care about law? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:09:02 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. Russia does not have the equipment to push a major new force in theater. Manpower or no. So what? Ten thousand happy ass reservists and prisoners march their way into a modern battlefield with 1950's and 60's arms. A week later 5k will need more ammo and food. A week after that, they are toast too. Is Putin that stupid? Yes. Is it worth handwringing over? Nah. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:09:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hking: itshappening.gif Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hking: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
itshappening.gif If any Russian Citizens had any thoughts of getting out of Dodge now would be the optimal time to do so. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:09:42 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: We won’t do anything in retaliation for a Russian Nuke going off in Ukraine (or several). That’s what Russia believes and is banking on. Butt what about Poland? Would they allow that? Would they instantly move on Moscow with everything in a decapitation strike knowing they are next to be attacked? If they are nuked would we (NATO) still be restrained, Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: Originally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. We won’t do anything in retaliation for a Russian Nuke going off in Ukraine (or several). That’s what Russia believes and is banking on. Butt what about Poland? Would they allow that? Would they instantly move on Moscow with everything in a decapitation strike knowing they are next to be attacked? If they are nuked would we (NATO) still be restrained, My speculation is that if Russia pops a nuke in Ukraine, that will force NATO's hand. A bluff is only used when you don't have a winning hand. NATO would be forced to respond. As to what that response looks like, that's a lot harder to say. It's possible there would be a conventional "response" where everything Russian military within range of NATO arty and missiles gets blown to tiny bits. The less likely outcome would be somebody like Britain nuking something of equivalent size to wherever Russia attacked. It's also possible that the gloves would come off in Ukraine and NATO utterly destroys Russia's military there and in the border areas, including their Black Sea fleet. Nobody can really say for sure other than it would be bad. |
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CHN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:11:10 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1969iggy: I didn't forget that... it's not relevant to the way of thinking that leads to "conservatives" not supporting Ukraine. The conversation with him was central to the second impeachment for trying to interfere with the election, or whatever Dem horseshit was tossed around. The people you are arguing with don't care... Biden is corrupt, he got money from Ukraine, Ukraine Bad. It's the same idiocy that has people who blame the war on Trump because he "withheld aid".... I was just answering the question of why some people thought that way. If you ignore all the other facts, and focus on just those... it's "logical". Oh, I don't disagree. I just like pointing out that Hunter's boss was pro-Russian. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:13:13 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By THOT_Vaccine: Belarus was supposed to close the Suwalki gap between Belarus and Kaliningrad. It would have involved invading Poland and Lithuania. Guaranteeing US involvement and that map (I think) was intended to show their intel on what was in Poland. About a day after he had his little presentation. Poland and US troops moved to the border and there was about five times more shit than Vladdy had told him he would be facing. (Record scratch sound) Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By THOT_Vaccine: Originally Posted By Tiberius: Originally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Originally Posted By Gunslinger808: A question I’ve had is if Russia had rolled up the Ukraine like they thought they could, would they have stopped there, or consolidated then moved on to try and take another country? They did have designs on other countries. Very early on someone (the Belarusian President?) leaked a map showing them moving on to Moldova after Ukraine ostensibly fell. They ran their mouth about "de-Nazifying" the Baltic states as well. What I’d like to know is why US Divisional Insignia and a inset map of CONUS were on that map. Belarus was supposed to close the Suwalki gap between Belarus and Kaliningrad. It would have involved invading Poland and Lithuania. Guaranteeing US involvement and that map (I think) was intended to show their intel on what was in Poland. About a day after he had his little presentation. Poland and US troops moved to the border and there was about five times more shit than Vladdy had told him he would be facing. (Record scratch sound) Which probably saved eastern Poland a lot of destruction and saved the Belarusian military from complete annihilation. The Poles would have made their displeasure felt and their counteroffensive would have made Sherman's March look like a church picnic; as the counteroffensive would likely have culminated somewhere east of Smolensk, with Minsk either captured or under siege and the airspace dominated by some sort of Polish/NATO air campaign. Either Belarus is governed by a complete clown or a seriously Machiavellian SOB who threw Putin's grand strategy out the window by aborting the "Northern Front" in order to check Belarus out of major combat operations. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:17:49 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I think we've written off the Moscow Times for credibility reasons, but notes about already being in a state of mobilization, here in regard to jail time for surrendering or refusing to serve. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/09/20/russian-lawmakers-approve-long-jail-terms-for-military-surrender-refusal-to-serve-a78843 These could be bills for theater purposes that never go anywhere for all I know. |
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CHN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:18:18 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zhukov: This post is pretty reasonable and I don't really find anything at fault here, except. . . Really? You think it's reasonable to claim the Orange Revolution was instigated by a "nefarious" west? They were overthrowing a Putin puppet. It clearly had popular Ukrainian support, just as their current war against Russia does. And you think NATO expansion is reasonably seen as provocation? Why were Poland and Estonia happy to join NATO? Russia's issue with NATO expansion is that it complicates gobbling up countries in the future. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:18:27 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: lol, islands off the coast of Africa. Russia doesn't have to worry about their space weaponry at least if they ever decide to have a space program. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fb/Comoros_rel91.jpg/800px-Comoros_rel91.jpg Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By CenterMass762: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Well, that makes me feel safer that Comoro islands won't deploy space based weapons.
Excuse me but wtf even is the Comoro islands? lol, islands off the coast of Africa. Russia doesn't have to worry about their space weaponry at least if they ever decide to have a space program. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fb/Comoros_rel91.jpg/800px-Comoros_rel91.jpg Wow.  Did Russia also sign a trade agreement with Antarctica for their tropical fruit? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:19:37 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Either Belarus is governed by a complete clown or a seriously Machiavellian SOB who threw Putin's grand strategy out the window by aborting the "Northern Front" in order to check Belarus out of major combat operations. He's the type of buffoon that loves for you to take him at face value. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:23:14 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Well, that makes me feel safer that Comoro islands won't deploy space based weapons.
Today, I learned about the previously unknown-to-me Comoro Islands and where they are located. This thread has proved useful for learning about our world in unexpected ways. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:24:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RolandofGilead]
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: The idea the Russia won't roll out conscription, or it won't have any effect until everyone is trained seems like wishful thinking to me. When has Russia ever given a damn about their soldiers? I suspect Putin would be willing to send a million or more untrained soldiers to the front lines and have them learn on the job. We should ready and willing to nuke him if he sets off even one atomic weapon. Really nuke him, not selective targeting. Every city of 30,000+ and be done with him. They might roll out conscription here's why IMO it won't make any difference: -How long will it take to actually get those new boots on the ground? They have to notify them, get them to show up, then ship them over. Probably train for a week or two...maybe...or maybe not. -How many will actually show up? Popular support in Moscow and SPB isn't super high already. This will bring it down further. -Ukrainians are motivated, fairly well trained, and well equipped for the most part. Russians are NONE of those already. Throwing meat into the grinder doesn't help. Ukraine will just kill the ones that don't surrender. These guys will probably never even see a UKR soldier close up, they'll be smoked by HIMARS or Excalibur rounds on their way to the front. -As far as nukes, the minute we eschew precision guided weapons, of which we have MANY in favor of wiping out civilians we lose popular support inside and outside of our country. We should do the exact opposite of what you say. Selectively target every single military base, warship, and nuke site in Russia and call it good. Nuking babushka isn't a good look. All just IMO. Maybe he'll throw a few 100k untrained civvies in uniforms with Mosins at Ukraine and it'll win the war for them. I'm doubtful though. |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:25:37 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By burnka871: Lol do it faggot Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By burnka871: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Pepper the angus. Lol do it faggot Going to war with FJB and Miley calling the shots is...not my preferred option. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:27:07 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zhukov: What kind of ammunition is used for that? That almost looks fake since I've never seen air-dropped munitions that are on fire as they rain down. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zhukov: Originally Posted By sq40: Video of the firebombing of Ozerne; https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/xj2ry1/russians_continue_to_burn_ukrainian_villages_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf What kind of ammunition is used for that? That almost looks fake since I've never seen air-dropped munitions that are on fire as they rain down. Magnesium or maybe thermite. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:27:35 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zhukov: What kind of ammunition is used for that? That almost looks fake since I've never seen air-dropped munitions that are on fire as they rain down. White phosphorus. Designed to start fires. RA has used them since the beginning. Basically a Dresden kind of weapon. |
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ON, CAN
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:27:50 PM EDT
[#43]
So am I off base here...
RUS uses the "referendum" to absorb annexed regions into Russia proper saying the "people voted for it" line. RUS then can accuse UKR/NATO/NAFO of direct attacks on RUS sovereign territory. RUS then uses that excuse as an excuse to begin a pathway to full mobilization, further rhetoric about use of nuclear options. All of this happening now due to desperate situation in UKR. Is RUS about to go full retard? |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:28:01 PM EDT
[#44]
What does the draft bill
Say? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:28:13 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote History These cables and how they "fixed" are making me mad.
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:30:50 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RolandofGilead: They might roll out conscription here's why IMO it won't make any difference: -How long will it take to actually get those new boots on the ground? They have to notify them, get them to show up, then ship them over. Probably train for a week or two...maybe...or maybe not. (snip) |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:31:52 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Really? You think it's reasonable to claim the Orange Revolution was instigated by a "nefarious" west? They were overthrowing a Putin puppet. It clearly had popular Ukrainian support, just as their current war against Russia does. And you think NATO expansion is reasonably seen as provocation? Why were Poland and Estonia happy to join NATO? Russia's issue with NATO expansion is that it complicates gobbling up countries in the future. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Originally Posted By Zhukov: This post is pretty reasonable and I don't really find anything at fault here, except. . . Really? You think it's reasonable to claim the Orange Revolution was instigated by a "nefarious" west? They were overthrowing a Putin puppet. It clearly had popular Ukrainian support, just as their current war against Russia does. And you think NATO expansion is reasonably seen as provocation? Why were Poland and Estonia happy to join NATO? Russia's issue with NATO expansion is that it complicates gobbling up countries in the future. 1) "Western Inspired"? Of course it was! Re-read our Declaration of Independence; it is one of the most Revolutionary documents in human history and has inspired hundreds of uprisings and revolutions over the years, some successful, some partially successful, and some not. It is so Revolutionary it could be easily applied against our current Federal Government by changing a few words. Add in the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and the US Constitution, and you'll find the "West" has "Inspired" a lot of revolution over two centuries. When done right, we call this "Freedom".  2) Agreements only work if both sides are willing to follow them. I think the Russian treatment of International agreements (as Bismarck's "Scraps of Paper) has driven NATO expansion more than anything else. After all, in what other historical timeline would the Baltic States, Poland, Germany, France, Sweden, and Finland WANT to be on the same side in a military alliance?
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:32:39 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m: These cables and how they "fixed" are making me mad. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4xGM300m: These cables and how they "fixed" are making me mad. "If it ain't beautiful, it ain't repairable kids" |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:33:15 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mal_means_bad: Last month the Ukrainians showed off papers they found on a guy who went 5 days between being snatched off the street by a press gang to KIA. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mal_means_bad: Originally Posted By RolandofGilead: They might roll out conscription here's why IMO it won't make any difference: -How long will it take to actually get those new boots on the ground? They have to notify them, get them to show up, then ship them over. Probably train for a week or two...maybe...or maybe not. (snip) True, but he was an LNR guy right? If we're talking mass mob how long would it take for someone from Moscow who is better educated, and already unlikely to even show up to the rally point? Do they even have the man power to snatch and pressgang 100k from Moscow unwillingly? I don't really know, but again, I have doubts. |
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Posted: 9/20/2022 12:36:40 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CenterMass762: Excuse me but wtf even is the Comoro islands? |
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