Never have I encountered so much concentrated incompetence in a single company.

I love their rifles (wonderful quality and options) and they are extremely marketable. The only single factor that hinders my sale of them is the company itself.

10-13-03

I call to order a Entry Tactical Carbine and the customer has specifically requested a A2 rather than a Hogue pistol grip. The 'upgrade' from a A2 to a Hogue is $20 ($10 dealer) but they only credit me $7.00 to downgrade from the same. I charge the customer accordingly.

I also order a front sight light mount since I'm paying shipping anyway.

I place the order. I verbally give it to a rep over the phone and then fax in a hard copy that I advised them will be showing up.

10-14-03

I call to confirm reciept of the order. I've been down this road before where they kept telling me "2 weeks" only to discover they don't even have the order a month later. As before, they do NOT have my order.

I refax the order and recall to confirm receipt. They finally have it.

I inquire about delivery time based upon the order for a single rifle I just faxed over. They 'estimate' 3 weeks. RRA being the ONLY manufacturer I'm aware of that doesn't have a single model rifle ready to ship nor all the components required to make one 'to order.'

I advise customer of 'estimated delivery.'

10-31-03

Customer calls to inquire about rifle, I call RRA. They tell me 2 weeks. I call customer, customer is pissed and blames me. I attempt to reassure customer as best I can.

11-07-03

I call RRA and they tell me they still don't have the light mount which 'apparantly' has been holding up the order the last week. I tell them ship it (knowing I will now have to pay extra shipping on just the damn light mount which will cost almost as much as the freaking mount) without the mount.

They advise it is scheduled to ship out Monday 10-10-03. I later obtain a teck number and find it actually went out Tues 10-11-03.

10-07-03

It arrives complete with Hogue grip that I have been charged for despite a verbal / faxed order that specifically requested a A2 grip.

I have been calling RRA for the last hour without success. Everyone has gone to 'voice mail' and I can't get ahold of anyone.

My prediction:

They will advise me to return the Hogue grip in exchange for a A2 and that will only take "2 weeks." Also in order to get that $7.00 credit I will spend about three times that amount in shipping to return the Hogue grip and the costs to ship the A2 grip to me. I further guarantee that the front sight mount will be unavailable to ship with a replacement A2 grip so no possible chance of them shipping together.

And finally the actual customer will kill me because I advised him his rifle is scheduled to arrive today and WILL ship to him tommarow. He is not gonna wanna hear about a SNAFU with the grips, he will NOT pay extra for the Hogue and he will actually be pissed that it doesn't have the SPECIFICALLY REQUESTED A2 grip.

And he will be right.

So thank you Rock River Arms for once again doing your level best to undermine the reputation of my business. It must be difficult to completely staff a entire office with people who cannot read or comprehend orders in printed text.

The gun business is damn compettive and my profits are minimal. Overcharging me for incorrect orders and expecting me to pay additional shipping costs to correct your errors negates those profits.

You guys are killing me.

Well wonder never cease.

They are actually gonna credit me the $7.00 on the remaining order of the front sight mount. Hope it actually gets done.

Thanks Nancy.

Customer is still gonna be pissed and I'm gonna offer him a free A2 grip and just ship his rifle.

Ok spoke to the customer and advised him of the situation. I already ordered a A2 grip (not from RRA) and am just gonna send it to him when I get it.

He was pretty cool about it considering.

I'm only out $12 now. Coulda been worse.

Sad cause they are really great rifles.



And I can't order from the RRA "parts guys" because they charge me the same price you guys pay. Who in their right mind is gonna pay more?

Quoted: Couldn't you have just switched out the Hogue for an A2, ship the rifle, and sell the Hogue on the EE ? A little more work, but a little more profit.

Yes, If I happened to have a A2.

I seem to have everything except what I need at the moment.

Didn't you have these same problems back with that 9mm upper set you were selling? Why do you keep dealing with them? There must be Ar manufacturers that have stuff in stock they can ship you.

Quoted: Quoted: Sad cause they are really great rifles. groups.msn.com/_Secure/0RgDPAssT!aORVNTrgwZKM!OfZ8oX4eClRtoviFOXBah8r!h0xRN6UES26AX820TI04xebwotUDrnlYR6aYgZD!XCZX6HATV!tCkFojpBUE4/Dcp_2085.JPG And I can't order from the RRA "parts guys" because they charge me the same price you guys pay. Who in their right mind is gonna pay more? Time to switch to DPMS. They only mess up the order 1/3 of the time. But, hey they have the best prices on parts for dealers.

I have observed better quality with RRA than with DPMS products. Only reason.

Quoted: Didn't you have these same problems back with that 9mm upper set you were selling? Why do you keep dealing with them? There must be Ar manufacturers that have stuff in stock they can ship you.

Yup sure did.

Basicaly they offer things that Armalite, Bushy, etc. don't make and they are better quality than the others who offer similar configs.

I wish I had a alternative.

Bottom line: People see them, people want them.

This kind of thing is typical in the "gun world."  I sold a nice "deer rifle" to a Doctor friend of a friend.  He wanted one identical to my wife's--Rem. 700, Leupold scope, Butler Creek scope caps.  I call a big name distributor.  They have everything in stock, and right before hunting season, so I'm happy.  The Doctor is ecstatic.  THEY have the application chart for the Butler Creeks.  **I** do not.  They pick the pair I need.  The rear one is way too big.  I call them, expecting a quick resolution.  Luckily I had another guy wanting a rifle, so it's no biggee to throw it in the box and no one eats shipping costs on a $5.50 item.  They don't have the rifle.  They won't ship the item--saying "I'll lose my ass if I do that"--his exact words.  I tell him it's their mistake, so not my problem--send the item.  He refuses.  I demand to talk to someone else.  He refuses, says he'll call me tomorrow.  He calls back and says they will waive the normal $100 minimum order if I will just order $25 worth of stuff.  Fine, I order some broadhead blades for myself.  Total order now--$26.76.  Shipping, $8.69, unearned cash discount (used a CC) $.86--total now is $35.35--for a $5.50 item and some broadhead blades I don't need.  The package arrives the day before opening day, AND THE FRIGGING NEW ONE IS ALSO TOO BIG!!  At least this piece does not keep the Doc from hunting--he killed a nice buck with it yesterday--but he STILL does not have what he paid for, I have two that I may use someday (maybe!), and I am rapidly reaching the sum of a big fat ZERO profit on a $1303 rifle/scope.  

Everyone, please be nice to your friendly FFL--his day sucked.  (Doesn't matter which day!)  

Quoted: Can't you take one off YOUR guns? Just a thought...

Off of one of my preban original Colts?

No and for several reasons:

1. They are orginal preban Colts, ya nuts or something? I'd rather be out $12 bucks.

2. Putting used parts on "new guns" ain't cool.

3. The customer is ok and it only costs me $12 bucks.

Quoted: Next time, try Bushmaster just to see what happens. I'll bet you a dozen donuts that you'll get the sort of service you WANT and EXPECT from them.   No company is perfect, but Bushmaster seems to screw up less often than most of their competitors.  You'll get your rifles on time and as ordered. CJ

I sell a LOT of Bushies, problem is they don't offer features like the "flash hider" style brakes and that Y Comp looks like shit.

If either Bushie or Armalite figured out to offer the better looking features they would own the market.

Quoted: Establishing an inventory might prevent such problems.

Yes, but inventory also drives costs up significantly.  You have to pay for all of the materials and labor to make the rifles and parts that make up your inventory, but then they just sit there, not making any money for you, while you have to now spend MORE money on rifles to ship.  Let's not forget storage space for those guns and parts, and the extra labor force you have to hire to make them, given that you are currently at capacity.

One of the ways RRA keeps their costs down is by NOT having inventory.  However, you have to deal with the fact that fulfillment sucks.

Bushmasters are more expensive, but they have a pretty decent inventory, despite moving FAR more rifles, so they can provide much faster fulfillment on MOST orders.  There will, of course, always be configurations that they are out of stock for, given that they have dozens of barrel configurations alone.

-Troy

Quoted: Quoted: Establishing an inventory might prevent such problems. Ouch!!!

Or not. I started out trying that. Everyone wanted something I didn't have yet. Always something that just came out, and by the time I got them in inventory something more new came out that everyone wanted.

Didn't take long to figure that shit out. And had to sell the inventory at damn near cost just to move it after taking up space for almost a year.

I've got my business fine tuned and specialized focusing on the stuff other guys are unwilling to deal in or don't have the patience to deal with. The only downside is that includes companies that others no longer bother with like RRA.