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Posted: 8/17/2018 11:39:27 PM EDT
Tragically killed in 1994 while attempting to land on an aircraft carrier. RIO ejected and lived. Video of crash: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIS1WNXCgq8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Hultgreen Elaine Donnelly of the Center for Military Readiness, a group that seeks to limit the roles of women in the military, suggested that Hultgreen "may have been the victim of a flawed policy," a policy that overlooked her mistakes in training, two of which were similar to those that caused her death. The other pilot named by the center subsequently brought a suit for defamation against the CMR but lost because the court determined that, by virtue of her status as one of the first women to attempt to qualify as a carrier combat pilot, she was a “public figure” and had to prove malice on the part of those who published the charge of favoritism. She appealed but her appeal was denied with a statement that “Our conclusion about Lt. Lohrenz’s public figure status does not suggest that she was not a good Naval aviator trying to do her job, and it does not penalize her for acting with ‘professionalism.’”
An Accuracy in Media reports others quoting CDR Tom Sobiek, commanding officer of Fighter Squadron VF-124, as saying of the four female pilots in his squadron, "The women are going to graduate regardless of how they performed" and that "the Navy was in a race with the Air Force to get the first female fighter pilot". It quotes Sobiek denying making any such statement. "That is a flat **** lie," he said. "And whoever told you that, if they were under oath, should be taken to task." |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 11:41:57 PM EDT
[#1]
Holly Graf comes to mind.
Too female to fail. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 11:44:53 PM EDT
[#2]
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through.
She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. She got into a reverse power scheme on the approach and wasn't able to save the aircraft. There are fine female pilots and NFOs in the fleet. She was mediocre, and died for it. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 11:57:04 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. She got into a reverse power scheme on the approach and wasn't able to save the aircraft. There are fine female pilots and NFOs in the fleet. She was mediocre, and died for it. First You get the life or death Test. Then, If you survive, you have learned a valuable lesson |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:02:56 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Life & Flying are both Cruel Teachers... First You get the life or death Test. Then, If you survive, you have learned a valuable lesson In particular Naval Aviation Is not necessarily more dangerous than other endeavors, But it is scathingly unforgving of mistakes. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:13:24 AM EDT
[#5]
Read title and clicked to make joke. Joke not funny now
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:18:45 AM EDT
[#6]
Feminists don't care how many females are hurt or killed in the name of their agenda. They certainly don't care how many men are killed and the ill effects their policies have on our military capabilities.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:32:27 AM EDT
[#7]
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:34:34 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. She got into a reverse power scheme on the approach and wasn't able to save the aircraft. There are fine female pilots and NFOs in the fleet. She was mediocre, and died for it. (from Battlestar Galactica) |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:38:53 AM EDT
[#9]
On 25 October 1994, Hultgreen died when her F-14A-95-GR, BuNo 160390,[4] coded "NH 103," crashed on approach to USS Abraham Lincoln. The incident occurred off the coast of San Diego after a routine training mission.[5] Finding herself overshooting the landing area centerline, Hultgreen attempted to correct her approach by applying left rudder pedal, which caused the nose to disrupt the airflow over the left (inside) wing, as well as the airflow to the left engine intake. (The approach turn stall, aerodynamic effect, and the appropriate recovery technique were taught throughout the period that Hultgreen completed primary (undergraduate) flight training.)
The port engine suffered a compressor stall and lost power—a well-known deficiency characteristic of the F-14A's TF30-P-414A engine when inlet air was no longer flowing straight into it. For this reason, the F-14 NATOPS flight manual warned against excess yaw. Loss of an F-14 engine results in asymmetric thrust, which can exceed rudder authority, especially at low speeds. After aborting the approach, Hultgreen selected full afterburner on the remaining engine, causing an even greater asymmetry. This, combined with a high angle of attack, caused an unrecoverable approach turn stall and rapid wing drop to the left. The radar intercept officer in the rear seat, Lt. Matthew Klemish, initiated ejection for himself and Hultgreen as soon as it was apparent the aircraft was becoming uncontrollable. First in the automated ejection sequence, the RIO survived. However, by the time Hultgreen's seat fired 0.4 seconds later, the plane had exceeded 90 degrees of roll, and she was ejected downward into the water. She was killed instantly. The entire event unfolded in less than 20 seconds. On 12 November, 19 days after the crash, the Navy salvaged the plane and recovered her body, still strapped into the ejection seat. The wreckage was in 3,700 feet (1,100 m) of water |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:42:04 AM EDT
[#10]
It's a very well known story in aviation circles.
I first saw the video when I was about 25. As a Father, I now see it from a different perspective. She was somebody's daughter. Murdered by White Knights, affirmative action, political correctness, and her own hubris. Can you imagine the guts it took for the RIO to strap into that plane? He knew exactly how incompetent she was. Everybody knew what was going on. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:52:49 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote History |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 12:53:59 AM EDT
[#12]
 60 Minutes Double Standard |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:13:53 AM EDT
[#13]
Giggles when they take off.
  Here's What it Takes to Become a Certified C2-A Pilot |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:15:15 AM EDT
[#14]
Lefties often kill by proxy to get their way in the ole US of A
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:17:17 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Holly Graf comes to mind. Too female to fail. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:19:09 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lefties often kill by proxy to get their way in the ole US of A |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:27:44 AM EDT
[#17]
Feminism is cancer.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:28:30 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote History"Hold on to the yoke" 
Talk about someone who has no business behind the wheel. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:29:50 AM EDT
[#19]
Question: Would she have made it had the aircraft had F110's and not the sucky TF30's?
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:31:21 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Hold on to the yoke"
Talk about someone who has no business behind the wheel. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:43:38 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. Saw it first hand. Training issues or behavior/incidents outside the training command, that would have sent any white male packing was overlooked or swept under the rug in order get them thru. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:48:59 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This^^^ Saw it first hand. Training issues or behavior/incidents outside the training command, that would have sent any white male packing was overlooked or swept under the rug in order get them thru. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. Saw it first hand. Training issues or behavior/incidents outside the training command, that would have sent any white male packing was overlooked or swept under the rug in order get them thru. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 1:49:17 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Question: Would she have made it had the aircraft had F110's and not the sucky TF30's? No discredit to her but she was going in either way once the compressor failed. Her biggest mistake was punching up the other engine, enhancing the roll. If she'd brought it back, might have remained level enough for ejection to have been more viable |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 2:18:10 AM EDT
[#24]
Just wait until some female Ranger or other Special Operations "qualified" officer leads her men to their deaths. there will be all kinds of cover up's, medals, etc... It's happened in situations where male leaders screwed the pooch. Remember the Pat Tillman shitshow? They tried to cover that one up, but only failed because good men spoke up. Hell, there's dozens if not hundreds of incidents that have successfully been covered up, and only a several that were unsuccessfully swept under the rug.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 2:59:11 AM EDT
[#25]
More proof most women can't park for shit
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Posted: 8/18/2018 3:17:25 AM EDT
[#26]
She screwed the pooch.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 3:26:41 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryAs a none pilot why didn’t she abort landing and power out for another try? Any pilot like to do a quick run down of what went wrong Edit never mind read above thanks. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 3:42:19 AM EDT
[#28]
Not my best photographs, but .....
On display outside Arnold Engineering Development Center (formerly Arnold AFB) in Tullahoma, TN: 
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Posted: 8/18/2018 3:48:37 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just wait until some female Ranger or other Special Operations "qualified" officer leads her men to their deaths. there will be all kinds of cover up's, medals, etc... It's happened in situations where male leaders screwed the pooch. Remember the Pat Tillman shitshow? They tried to cover that one up, but only failed because good men spoke up. Hell, there's dozens if not hundreds of incidents that have successfully been covered up, and only a several that were unsuccessfully swept under the rug. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 3:52:09 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not my best photographs, but ..... On display outside Arnold Engineering Development Center (formerly Arnold AFB) in Tullahoma, TN: http://sc-photo-tn.com/wp-content/gallery/2013/aircraft/2009-04-05-08.jpg http://sc-photo-tn.com/wp-content/gallery/2013/aircraft/aedc19.jpg |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 4:02:54 AM EDT
[#31]
Just shut the fuck up about your dick or twat, and deliver the CAS.
You're a goddamned Squid, and support. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 4:04:30 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The engine failure didnt come out of nowhere... |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 4:04:32 AM EDT
[#33]
That's a sad story.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 5:00:56 AM EDT
[#34]
So basically because the pilot had a vagina, she gets her own standing display/monument to her failure but gets immortalized because of her gender. Sounds about right in the military.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 5:38:31 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a very well known story in aviation circles. I first saw the video when I was about 25. As a Father, I now see it from a different perspective. She was somebody's daughter. Murdered by White Knights, affirmative action, political correctness, and her own hubris. Can you imagine the guts it took for the RIO to strap into that plane? He knew exactly how incompetent she was. Everybody knew what was going on. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 6:02:23 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lefties often kill by proxy to get their way in the ole US of A |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 7:23:13 AM EDT
[#37]
My dad and her dad were friends
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Posted: 8/18/2018 7:26:38 AM EDT
[#38]
Scotty Miller personally walking the last graded patrol in Ranger school for the 2 split tails comes to mind.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 7:41:14 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. She got into a reverse power scheme on the approach and wasn't able to save the aircraft. There are fine female pilots and NFOs in the fleet. She was mediocre, and died for it. My best friend was a USAF F-16 pilot, and everyone was speaking pretty freely. The navy guys just plainly stated that she had no business flying an F-14 off of a carrier, and blamed the Clinton admin for pushing To get any woman, right now, in that role. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 7:46:03 AM EDT
[#40]
How many men have served as combat pilots how many aircraft did they shoot down, how many tanks destroyed, how many infantry lives saved
you'd think that would be some kind of braggable bench mark to celebrate... You'd think the highest greatest goal for anything military would be a bit more pragmatic utilitarian. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 7:58:29 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No way, I've been assured on this site, that the .mil wouldn't drop training or promotion standards based on gender/race. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
She had problems in flight school, but was given extra chances and tutoring to get her through. She was in over her head, and politics kept her in the seat. Saw it first hand. Training issues or behavior/incidents outside the training command, that would have sent any white male packing was overlooked or swept under the rug in order get them thru. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:00:59 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not my best photographs, but ..... On display outside Arnold Engineering Development Center (formerly Arnold AFB) in Tullahoma, TN: http://sc-photo-tn.com/wp-content/gallery/2013/aircraft/2009-04-05-08.jpg http://sc-photo-tn.com/wp-content/gallery/2013/aircraft/aedc19.jpg "Dead, because competence or merit were less important than First Vagina To Fly F14." |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:01:12 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Read title and clicked to make joke. Joke not funny now 
Kharn |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:04:05 AM EDT
[#44]
Get the politics out. If a person is qualified, they're qualified. If not, wash 'em out.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:10:32 AM EDT
[#45]
Part of the problem that is often overlooked in this mishap is the fact that the F-14A with the TF30 engine was a fucking pile of shit.
The TF30 was a fucking pile of shit. It was a well known weak link with the plane back in the beginning. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:12:10 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryYou can hear the frustration with her shitty flying in that landing dudes voice. Glad someone lived through that clusterfuck. |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:16:58 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Scotty Miller personally walking the last graded patrol in Ranger school for the 2 split tails comes to mind.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:29:28 AM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/K_hultgreen_F14.jpg Tragically killed in 1994 while attempting to land on an aircraft carrier. RIO ejected and lived. Video of crash: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIS1WNXCgq8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Hultgreen Elaine Donnelly of the Center for Military Readiness, a group that seeks to limit the roles of women in the military, suggested that Hultgreen "may have been the victim of a flawed policy," a policy that overlooked her mistakes in training, two of which were similar to those that caused her death. The other pilot named by the center subsequently brought a suit for defamation against the CMR but lost because the court determined that, by virtue of her status as one of the first women to attempt to qualify as a carrier combat pilot, she was a “public figure” and had to prove malice on the part of those who published the charge of favoritism. She appealed but her appeal was denied with a statement that “Our conclusion about Lt. Lohrenz’s public figure status does not suggest that she was not a good Naval aviator trying to do her job, and it does not penalize her for acting with ‘professionalism.’”
An Accuracy in Media reports others quoting CDR Tom Sobiek, commanding officer of Fighter Squadron VF-124, as saying of the four female pilots in his squadron, "The women are going to graduate regardless of how they performed" and that "the Navy was in a race with the Air Force to get the first female fighter pilot". It quotes Sobiek denying making any such statement. "That is a flat **** lie," he said. "And whoever told you that, if they were under oath, should be taken to task." |
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:34:22 AM EDT
[#49]
BuNo 160390 was one of the two jets from VF 41 which shot down the Libyan SU 22s in August 1981.
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Posted: 8/18/2018 8:34:33 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Part of the problem that is often overlooked in this mishap is the fact that the F-14A with the TF30 engine was a fucking pile of shit. The TF30 was a fucking pile of shit. It was a well known weak link with the plane back in the beginning. |
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