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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:06:54 AM EDT
[#1]
Why not use 12 gauge reduced recoil slugs?
No help here on the 20. Sorry. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:06:58 AM EDT
[#2]
2 3/4" rem buckhammers. End of story. With most slug guns, slower is better. I saw more guns shoot buckhammers well than anything else.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:17:01 AM EDT
[#3]
I had really good results (on paper) with the Hornady SSTs out of my NEF 20 ga single shot. The Rem Accupoints shot well also. They both print at almost the same POI without any scope adjustment.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:21:10 AM EDT
[#4]
You could try fire lapping or just regular lapping the barrel and see if that helps. Also make sure there aren't any burrs in the barrel from the ports and that the muzzle is in good shape. Even if the muzzle looks good it may be worth having a gunsmith face it just to be sure.
To fire lap the barrel you would do it sort of the same way as with a rifle. Roll the slugs in progressively finer lapping compounds then shoot them. Use cheap foster slugs though, the softer the lead the better. I'd just use a razor blade to cut off the edge of the roll crimp and pull the slugs. Then roll the slugs in lapping compound, put the slugs back in the shells and shoot them. Without the crimp the velocity will be all over the place but that doesn't matter when all you are trying to do is send lapping compound coated lead down the barrel. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:21:45 AM EDT
[#5]
I would be happy with those groups in my son's youth rifled 870 at 100yrd.
I'd be happy with it at 60! |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:23:37 AM EDT
[#6]
Fully rifled barrels can be really, really picky about what you feed them.
The best course of action I've found is to spend $150 buying 2 boxes of every type of slug you can find and then hit the range with a Lead Sled. Once you find the one that groups acceptably, go buy a boatload of them and surely your favorite slug will be discontinued or improved in two years requiring you to start the process all over again. Also, since it is for hunting, remember that you are looking for 1st shot from a cold bore accuracy. If it prints the first and second slugs within reason and close to POA, it really doesn't matter what a 10 shot group from a hot barrel looks like. I have a preference for Brenneke slugs. They always seem to shoot reasonably well and with less recoil than comparable loadings. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:36:52 AM EDT
[#7]
Ditch the fucking Mossberg. They're cheap for a reason. Then guy buy your son an 870. I still hunt with my 20ga 870. Like you said...the cheap green and yellow goobox Remington Sluggers shoot good and they've always killed deer for me. It's a slug gun...no need to get fancy. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:38:37 AM EDT
[#8]
Have you had the Nikon on any other guns and did you purchase it from Natchez?
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:51:06 AM EDT
[#9]
I have a 20 gauge Mossberg 500 that I used for years. Shot Brenneke Rotweils in it for years. One particular year I couldn't hit shit. I'm talking 8+ inch group at 50 yards.
Fed up with the accuracy, I started looking into other slug options. I decided to clean the bore...and duh, the use of the Brenneke slugs leaded the hell out of the barrel. I bought some lead fouling remover and REALLY cleaned the bore. I got the results I was looking for. 3-4 inches at 100 yards with Lightfield Hybrid EXP. Try really cleaning the bore OP, make sure the barrel is cranked into the receiver, and try again. Best advise I can give. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:54:03 AM EDT
[#10]
Could it be the scope, or the scope rings? I had a slug gun a few years ago that started to give me problems. it used o be an extremely accurate, but all of a sudden started shooting all over the place. Afer many boxes of slugs, I finnaly discovered that the screws on the scope base had broke after many years of shooting. Replaced that, and it was back to normal.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:04:04 AM EDT
[#11]
Unless you get lucky, it takes a lot of time, money and hair pulling to find the combo that works the best.
Try to stick with the heavier, slower moving slugs, unless you have a fast twist rate in the barrel (I know it's opposite of AR-15s) but slower twist rates group heavier, slower slugs better. After lots of time, money and hair pulling, my Benelli M2 with 24" fully rifled barrel will shoot 3" groups at 100 yards with 1 oz. Federal Power Shock Sabots (these are only $7 a box too –– yippee!) My Remington 870 with 20" fully rifled barrel likes 1 oz. Remington Copper Solids the best. It will shoot them within 2" group at 100 yards. It's got a Timney 870 sear/spring and a pinned bbl with drilled/tapped receiver. Likewise, other slugs I tried would be around 4- 6" group with the occasionally flyer (that I know wasn't flinch induced). It also takes nerves of steel to shoot small groups with a shotgun. You really have to be on your game. Wind also deflects the rounds like a mother. It will also test how good your scope and mounting skills are. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:07:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
I need a little help with a 20-gauge youth shotgun I just bought new for my son to hunt deer with this fall. The slug barrel is a fully rifled 24-inch canteliver barrel that is ported. The rings are Warne as I recall and the scope I mounted on this is a 3-9 Nikon. To try this shotgun out I went shopping and bought five different 20gauge sabot slugs. I didn't make a list but I know some of these included the Remington Acupoint, Winchester Super X, Federal Power-Shok, Lightfield Hybrid Exp, and a fifth that is escaping me. I was extremely dissapointed in all of these! The best 3-shot group I got at 100-yards was 6-inches and that was with the Lightfield Hybrid Exp slugs. The others were all about the same but always seemed to have a flyer that opened up the groups to 8 or so inches. I am sure the scope is mounted well and it was loc-tited in place so no loose screws. I had my remington 870 with it's 20-inch smooth bore and Remington Green Box 1oz faster slugs with a 2-7 Bushnell Elite and that gun shot a ragged 1-hole 2-inch group. I really expected the rifled 20-gauge to do somewhat close to this as opposed to minute of pie plate. I am going to try shooting some foster style slugs through the gun to see if that helps. Anybody have any other advice? Do I need to break the barrel in before the darned thing would be expected to shoot better? I figure I will try to limit my son's shooting to about 50-yards anyways and that gets us down to say 3-4-inch groups which is acceptable but I have to be honest this is teh worst shooting slug gun I have ever owned and those darned sabots are expensive to shoot so shitty! My son is too small for my 12-gauge 870 as I also have a 12-gauge Ithica 37 Deerslayer I would use (that really kicks like a mule). I don't want to make him shoot those as the 20gauge slugs alone are pretty stiff for him. In a year or two I may move him to the 12 gauge but then I have a daughter that will be ready to start hunting so I would like to figure this problem out... Are my expectations too high? That canteliver barrel set up is pure fucking trash. I finally took mine to the smith and had him take that horrible thing off the top of the barrel. Then, I bought a new base and rings and mounted them to the reciever and got a Nikon Slug Hunter scope with the BDC setup. Used Hornady SST slugs, and everything was MUCH btter. This is on a 12 gauge Mossberg 500. That cantilever shit needs to go, though. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:08:32 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
I have a 20 gauge Mossberg 500 that I used for years. Shot Brenneke Rotweils in it for years. One particular year I couldn't hit shit. I'm talking 8+ inch group at 50 yards. Fed up with the accuracy, I started looking into other slug options. I decided to clean the bore...and duh, the use of the Brenneke slugs leaded the hell out of the barrel. I bought some lead fouling remover and REALLY cleaned the bore. I got the results I was looking for. 3-4 inches at 100 yards with Lightfield Hybrid EXP. Try really cleaning the bore OP, make sure the barrel is cranked into the receiver, and try again. Best advise I can give. Some people also shim the barrel so it fits tighter in the receiver. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:09:54 AM EDT
[#14]
Lightfield Hybrids are what I recommend.The results were amasing in both my Mossberg 12 and 20 gauge 500s.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:14:59 AM EDT
[#15]
If it has irons, the first thing I would do is shoot a 50 yard group with irons and see what was happening with that.
6 inches seems like a lot to me at 100 if every thing looks good on the barrel. My old 500 20 gauge smooth barrel would do a 2 " hole at 100. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:21:49 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted: I have that same gun for my son, we went through the same "shoot them all, see what groups" Lightfields were OK at long range but cheapo Remington Foster slugs grouped well to 50yds. I limited shot to that range, deer came in at 20yds, happy ending. Sight in with Regular Fosters, limit the range, it will work fine.. I am going to try shooting some foster style slugs through the gun to see if that helps. Anybody have any other advice? Do I need to break the barrel in before the darned thing would be expected to shoot better? I figure I will try to limit my son's shooting to about 50-yards anyways and that gets us down to say 3-4-inch groups which is acceptable but I have to be honest this is teh worst shooting slug gun I have ever owned and those darned sabots are expensive to shoot so shitty! ... Are my expectations too high? |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:26:56 AM EDT
[#17]
I had a buddy buy a slug barrel for his 500 12 gauge and try several versions of slugs through it, nothing would group.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:30:38 AM EDT
[#18]
I'd start with a thorough cleaning as the plastic sabots tend to foul. You MUST use a solvent which will clean the plastic.
After that, one flyer is not a problem if it's the third/fifth shot. If it shoots the first one to point of aim (with a cold barrel), then you are golden. 
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Posted: 10/22/2012 6:35:21 AM EDT
[#19]
I have read a school of thought that the occasional flyer is caused from the sabot not releasing cleanly from the slug.
Personally, I have found that the jacketted, fast moving slugs to suffer from the occasional flyers. The non-jacketed sabot slugs, like the Lightfeld Hybrids and Federal Power Shocks seem to be very consistent. Possibly because the non-jacketed slugs will swage to the barrel. They just don't have the long range trajectory of the jacketed fast slugs. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 8:37:29 AM EDT
[#20]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have a 20 gauge Mossberg 500 that I used for years. Shot Brenneke Rotweils in it for years. One particular year I couldn't hit shit. I'm talking 8+ inch group at 50 yards. Fed up with the accuracy, I started looking into other slug options. I decided to clean the bore...and duh, the use of the Brenneke slugs leaded the hell out of the barrel. I bought some lead fouling remover and REALLY cleaned the bore. I got the results I was looking for. 3-4 inches at 100 yards with Lightfield Hybrid EXP. Try really cleaning the bore OP, make sure the barrel is cranked into the receiver, and try again. Best advise I can give. Some people also shim the barrel so it fits tighter in the receiver. Yeah, I forgot to mention that. I had a friend make a brass shim for where the barrel screws in to the mag extension. Snugged it right up, but it wasn't until I really cleaned that barrel did I realize any kind of accuracy. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 8:44:27 AM EDT
[#21]
Forget the sabot slugs and go Brenneke
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Posted: 10/22/2012 8:51:11 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Forget the sabot slugs and go Brenneke Brennekes through a fully rifled barrel? 
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Posted: 10/22/2012 9:05:40 AM EDT
[#23]
I had similar luck putting a slug barrel made by mosberg on my 870. Poor groups with expensive slugs. The smoothbore barrel wasnt any better with cheap slugs either. The 870 finally pissed me off jamming on 3" goose loads and I bought a beretta.
Problem solved. My al391 smoothbore shoots slugs to POA and will touch holes at 75yds. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 11:46:56 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Forget the sabot slugs and go Brenneke Brennekes through a fully rifled barrel? Black Magic, K.O., and SuperSabot are all GTG in rifled barrels. They claim the others are too, but I've never tried them through anything but a smooth pipe. http://www.brennekeusa.com/cms/h_products.html |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 11:50:40 AM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Forget the sabot slugs and go Brenneke Brennekes through a fully rifled barrel? Black Magic, K.O., and SuperSabot are all GTG in rifled barrels. They claim the others are too, but I've never tried them through anything but a smooth pipe. http://www.brennekeusa.com/cms/h_products.html I didn't know that, but after watching the video it would have made more sense to reference the special Brennekes designed for rifled barrels, no? To just say "go Brenneke" means the traditional slugs to me.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 3:12:11 PM EDT
[#26]
My sons used the same guns for years. Buckhammers shot the best out of it, hands down.
You'll need to clean every 8-10 shots or accuracy suffers. For my smoothbores I like Federal Truballs. Quoted:
Why not use 12 gauge reduced recoil slugs? No help here on the 20. Sorry. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 3:15:13 PM EDT
[#27]
Minute of paper plate at 100 is good with me lol
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Posted: 10/22/2012 3:25:41 PM EDT
[#28]
My wife has one. I wasted a bunch of money on hornady SSTs thinking I was the problem. Plain old remington sluggers seem to shoot as well as anything. Wish I would have bought a H&R single shot.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 4:35:41 PM EDT
[#29]
How old is jr?
Even though the laws reduced the starting age for kids, kids have to be physically and mentally ready. Some kids just aren't physically strong enough even though they may have the age and heart for it. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 4:45:36 PM EDT
[#30]
I shot my 20ga for several years (870), limited to 50yds are less. Did just fine.
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:54:21 PM EDT
[#31]
Questions? First, look to make sure the cantilever is not touching the reciever, seems pretty straightforward, but I just had that problem with my 870 (mossberg made barrel) and it would not let me shoot anything smaller than 5" at 50 yards. Second, make sure that you are not pulling back on the foregrip when firing. I found my best pattern was Federal's loaded with Barnes. My brother gets great groups out of his 20ga 870 and even better out of his H&R. Something tells me its your barrel or something you are not seeing.
100yds 2/3/4 federal loads The three touching were the last three shot group of the day. |
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Posted: 10/22/2012 5:58:11 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted: Questions? First, look to make sure the cantilever is not touching the reciever, seems pretty straightforward, but I just had that problem with my 870 (mossberg made barrel) and it would not let me shoot anything smaller than 5" at 50 yards. Second, make sure that you are not pulling back on the foregrip when firing. I found my best pattern was Federal's loaded with Barnes. My brother gets great groups out of his 20ga 870 and even better out of his H&R. Something tells me its your barrel or something you are not seeing. These things suck for real. My wife shoots the exact same gun and it won't pattern for shit with good sabots. I'm lucky to get 6" groups with slower slugs. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 5:31:19 PM EDT
[#33]
2 3/4 Remmington copper solids and light fields shot great in my daughters mossberg 20 ga . I think the slower slugs work better with mossbergs barrels
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Posted: 11/19/2012 5:48:16 PM EDT
[#34]
I had a Mossberg Trophy Slugster and a Ithaca Deer Slayer in 12 gauge and they both sucked balls with sabots,Finally just went with Brenneke shells and moved in a little closer. Shotgun only in my old county in NY ,moved to FL and the two shotguns got sold lickety split.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 5:54:52 PM EDT
[#35]
I have a 535 that loves SSTs. As a shotgun hunter that's hunted with all types I've never seen Brennekes work in anything but a smooth bore. My 535 has a Nikon on it with the bdc and I can hit a paper plate at 200 yards with every shot in still wind. I'd say go with SSTs.
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Posted: 11/19/2012 5:55:11 PM EDT
[#36]
This probably isn't what you want to hear, but if I lived in a shotgun-only state, I'd see if it was legal to hunt with a muzzleloader.
Modern inlines are insanely accurate. |
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Posted: 11/19/2012 6:43:53 PM EDT
[#37]
Tag
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Posted: 11/20/2012 5:47:46 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
This probably isn't what you want to hear, but if I lived in a shotgun-only state, I'd see if it was legal to hunt with a muzzleloader. Modern inlines are insanely accurate. The thought has crossed my mind! inline muzzle loaders are legal but I am not sure my son can handle the weight so well. My 12-gauge 870 shoots fine (2.5-inch groups at 100 yards or less). I just need get him bulked up for the 12 gauge and drop this 20 
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Posted: 11/20/2012 6:01:57 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Forget the sabot slugs and go Brenneke Brennekes through a fully rifled barrel? Black Magic, K.O., and SuperSabot are all GTG in rifled barrels. They claim the others are too, but I've never tried them through anything but a smooth pipe. http://www.brennekeusa.com/cms/h_products.html I didn't know that, but after watching the video it would have made more sense to reference the special Brennekes designed for rifled barrels, no? To just say "go Brenneke" means the traditional slugs to me. Surprisingly, regular slugs do just fine through some rifled shotgun barrels.
Shotgun Slugs and Sabots |
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