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Posted: 10/27/2021 8:27:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: The_Beer_Slayer]
This is now the active "shit News links, thanks to BerettaGuy: Originally Posted By BerettaGuy: LINKS TO UKRAINIAN NEWS SOURCES IN ENGLISH Kyiv Post Ukrainian News UKRInform EUROMAIDEN PRESS New Voice of Ukraine Kyiv Independent Ukraine World InterFax Ukraine UATV Ukrainian Journal Official Website of the President of Ukraine Ukrainian Ministry of Defense Save these links. I can't post all the headlines like I've done in the past - too much news and too often. Please @ me with additional stuff to be added here. I don't currently have time to properly curate this thread otherwise. New news link c/o berettaguy: Ukrainian Pravda https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/ Stop fake, anti - disinformation site: https://www.stopfake.org/en/main/ |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:23:31 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DreadPirateMoyer: In what world is that list reasonable? I guess in a world where Russia doesnt totally collapse and Ukraine doesnt want to fight for another 2-3 years. From the point of view of a neutral observer, that list seems "reasonable". I doubt either party will agree to it and by the time either IS ready to agree, the other will want more. It's just a "reasonable" way to achieve piece in the next few months rather than fighting this to the end, which is probably what needs to happen. But neither one of us are in Ukraine to risk our blood or honor. I hope and pray that the RU Army totally collapses, the UA gets ALL of their pre-2014 land back, and Putin gets hanged as a war criminal. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:24:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: HIPPO]
[#2]
A thread worth a click and read-thru. Unrolled thread here - non-Twitter link. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:24:41 PM EDT
[#3]
The latest joke in russia.
Two men are talking - I told my wife that men with two wives are exempt from mobilization - And what did she say? - She said go and die with dignity. |
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CHN
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:25:46 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: About a thousand pages ago, I made the argument that even an M1 Carbine is "good enough" in a combined arms war on an industrial scale like this. Shit, I'd settle for an old Makarov and a reliable radio I could use to call for fire. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Originally Posted By Alex9661: Some sources claim that 97% of casualties in this war were caused by artillery and only 3% by small arms. If true, caliber doesn't really matter. About a thousand pages ago, I made the argument that even an M1 Carbine is "good enough" in a combined arms war on an industrial scale like this. Shit, I'd settle for an old Makarov and a reliable radio I could use to call for fire. I also suspect failure to defeat body armor with rifles is nearly irrelevant all considered. Would Ukraine be better off with SIG 6.8s or with the AKs and ARs they are using? Their biggest rifle related issue is probably the mix of 7.62x39, 5.56 and 5.45 in the front units. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:28:29 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TheAvatar9265ft: It's a deal that would make both sides very unhappy. It is more than fair to Russia and quite unfair to Ukraine, but it secures Ukraine and Ukraine doesn't have to lose a ton more people and fight for years more to get marginally better terms. That would be more just for Ukraine, but it will cost a lot of blood and treasure. At least in this hypothetical. I mean in an ideal hypothetical, Russia crumbles into internal conflict, Putin and pals get hung from lampposts like Mussolini, all the Rus invaders go home, Kalinigrad is reclaimed by Poland, the Russia Federation is split up into a dozen smaller states, and their nukes are placed under NATO control to deter China from colonizing across the border. Oh yea, and Georgia gets its occupied lands back too. Also, I win the lottery without buying a ticket. This is my belief in calling this hypothetical deal "reasonable". I want to see Russia punished but NOT until the last Ukrainian. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:28:49 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RunnngCircles: LOL I wanted to say staged but i know it is real Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RunnngCircles: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
LOL I wanted to say staged but i know it is real Yeah, the grenade going off at the end confirms it is real. The one standing probably took most of the blast; the one on his knees got lucky is some ways. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:30:01 PM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:30:23 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By elcope:
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:30:26 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Musk just shit in his own punch bowl. Damn Elon. That’s some dumbass shit. I’m a huge fan of yours too. Way to do nothing but get a bunch of enemies. |
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CHN
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:32:57 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: i would think the ukranians want the dem votes based on the republican voting records and past rhetoric You mean like Obama not providing weapons while Trump provided javelins? |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:33:00 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dillydilly: Idiots. Did they really think Ukraine is a blank slate with no deep ties to Orthodoxy? On the contrary, they are winning BECAUSE of God. This is why it pisses me off that libs just hijack whatever is popular. Take for instance the Ukrainian flag. They slap it next to their gay pride emoji on their Twitter profile. And then you have GD all up in arms hating Ukraine cause libs virtue signal in support of Ukraine. It’s all so tiresome. 😩 I think they assumed, just like some idiots on the right, that Ukraine was a totally corrupted playground for leftist progressives and that is why Putin attacked them. It did surprise me that leftist progressives were cheering for people fighting to the death to protect their borders, language, and culture. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:35:52 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeJ3y5cWQAA0QQT?format=jpg&name=small So, which side were the Russians on when they blew it? |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:37:17 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
May also point to more extensive use of tanks as ersatz artillery than we understand. There are even a few videos around purporting to be UA tanks killing RA tanks with indirect fire, which HEAT could do but AP couldn’t. One video said they fired 20 rounds, but killed the RA tank.from kilometers away using drone spot. |
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CHN
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:37:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: I think they assumed, just like some idiots on the right, that Ukraine was a totally corrupted playground for leftist progressives and that is why Putin attacked them. It did surprise me that leftist progressives were cheering for people fighting to the death to protect their borders, language, and culture. If Ukraine was at peace and refusing Syrian refugees how would they handle that? |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:38:38 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Musk just shit in his own punch bowl. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:40:35 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vahog: So, which side were the Russians on when they blew it? Probably both. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:42:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GTLandser: @Rumsonv2 A few months back, there was a Russian propaganda video, interviewing students at one of the state schools for international relations (basically, a feeder school for Muscovites hoping to get a government job with the Russian MFA or similar ministry). It was exactly what you would expect, everyone "supports the special military operation", "for sure Ukraine was going to attack us if we didn't attack first", blah blah blah.  A few of the lady students were cute, and user outofbattery replied to the clip and said something to the effect of "Well well, we can all look forward to the day soon when a degree from [school] is as worthless as the ruble, and lady student can earn herself some money to eat by whoring herself out. I wouldn't want her to starve, so I'd toss her a few rubles to stick a carrot up her ass, and ride her around like a pony". That's not an exact quote but the original had us all  .  Thus did outofbattery pass into ARF myth and legend.  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GTLandser: Originally Posted By Rumsonv2: Can somebody educate me on the bag of carrots? I've seen it a few times. @Rumsonv2 A few months back, there was a Russian propaganda video, interviewing students at one of the state schools for international relations (basically, a feeder school for Muscovites hoping to get a government job with the Russian MFA or similar ministry). It was exactly what you would expect, everyone "supports the special military operation", "for sure Ukraine was going to attack us if we didn't attack first", blah blah blah. A few of the lady students were cute, and user outofbattery replied to the clip and said something to the effect of "Well well, we can all look forward to the day soon when a degree from [school] is as worthless as the ruble, and lady student can earn herself some money to eat by whoring herself out. I wouldn't want her to starve, so I'd toss her a few rubles to stick a carrot up her ass, and ride her around like a pony". That's not an exact quote but the original had us all . Thus did outofbattery pass into ARF myth and legend. It was glorious! And glad to hear the carrot-up-the-girls-butt never goes out of style. 
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:43:42 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Musk just shit in his own punch bowl. Way out of touch on the situation. He needs to worry about his own problems rather than proposing wholly untenable peace deals on twitter. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:43:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: stgdz]
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: You mean like Obama not providing weapons while Trump provided javelins? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DonS: Originally Posted By stgdz: i would think the ukranians want the dem votes based on the republican voting records and past rhetoric You mean like Obama not providing weapons while Trump provided javelins? Durrrrrrer that's it. Like all the R's that have voted against the bills in the last year. When it fucking counted even more and the ukranians needed them. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:44:48 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Which makes this all the more insane. Here's Turkey's MoD, joining Ukraine's' first lady, launching a warship yesterday. powerful statement; Turkey knows where the butter is coming from, and is turning away from the stuffing. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/556465/corvette_jpg-2549084.JPG Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Originally Posted By Featureless: And then through Turkey. They still don't have control of their maritime destiny. Which makes this all the more insane. Here's Turkey's MoD, joining Ukraine's' first lady, launching a warship yesterday. powerful statement; Turkey knows where the butter is coming from, and is turning away from the stuffing. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/556465/corvette_jpg-2549084.JPG With Russia weakened, Turkey becomes master of the Black Sea with Ukrainian ally? |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:45:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: HIPPO]
[#21]
— Faytuks News ? (@Faytuks) October 3, 2022 This story is starting to get some traction.Link to news story |
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CHN
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:47:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: DonS]
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Durrrrrrer that's it. Like all the R's that have voted against the bills in the last year. When it fucking counted even more and the ukranians needed them. The Javelins Trump sent saved Ukraine. And recall, Biden not wanting to send Javelins just prior to the invasion. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:47:53 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
— Faytuks News ? (@Faytuks) October 3, 2022 This story is starting to get some traction.Link to news story If true, I'd have zero problems with us destroying that train the minute it crosses the border. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:49:31 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Better idea: Russia goes back to Russia and loses Crimea, Donetsk, and Luhansk. Ukraine deports all Russians and russian passported folks back to Russia. Russia is still sanctioned and Ukraine joins nato. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: Originally Posted By TheAvatar9265ft: Take Kherson. Take Severdonetsk. Take Svatove. Then push south from Zaporitza to Melitopol and cut the Russians in half. Blow the Kerch Bridge and Crimiea is cut off. Putin will probably be fragged at that point. Then negotiate: Peace Terms: 1. Russia gest a 99 year lease on Sevastapol. 2. Crimea, Luhansk and Donesk recognized as Ukraine, but can vote for semi-autonomous administration. 3. All other Ukraine territory reverts to Ukraine. 4. Russia must demilitarize all mech/armor/arty/mlrs basing to >200km from UKR border while Ukraine reconfirms their adherence to the NNPT. 5. UKR agrees not to join NATO, but can engage in any other military or economic alliance. (Let's Russia claim victory while UKR can have alliances that offer equivalent mutual defense to being NATO, including US extended nuclear deterrence). 6. Russia to pay debts to UKR in gas and from seized assets. 7. Prisoner exchange including civilian deportees that Russia kidnapped. 8. UN Peacekeeping force in Donbass. 9. Sanctions against Russia dropped. 10. Russia hands war criminals to ICC, not Ukraine. Better idea: Russia goes back to Russia and loses Crimea, Donetsk, and Luhansk. Ukraine deports all Russians and russian passported folks back to Russia. Russia is still sanctioned and Ukraine joins nato. "give them nothing , take from them everything" some war fighting bloke, maybe |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:50:49 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zam18th: 
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zam18th: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Maybe the rest of NATO needs to put Hungarys revocation on the agenda instead. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:52:11 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Yobro512: Damn Elon. That’s some dumbass shit. I’m a huge fan of yours too. Way to do nothing but get a bunch of enemies. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Yobro512: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Musk just shit in his own punch bowl. Damn Elon. That’s some dumbass shit. I’m a huge fan of yours too. Way to do nothing but get a bunch of enemies. That is an insanely poor position that Elon has carved out for himself. I bet Putin would love to take this deal. Sounds like Elon is a puffer. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:52:45 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: i would think the ukranians want the dem votes based on the republican voting records and past rhetoric I visit Ukrainian forums occasionally. For a lot of them, Trump is Putin's agent and/or best friend and biden is a smart powerful leader of the free world. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:55:43 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jozsi: Fuck that Aspies motherfucker I care about his opinion as much as about opinion of my neighbor across the street. Why do people generally give a shit what some rich person thinks about a subject totally outside of her area of expertise? |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 1:58:15 PM EDT
[#29]
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:01:46 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alex9661: I visit Ukrainian forums occasionally. For a lot of them, Trump is Putin's agent and/or best friend and biden is a smart powerful leader of the free world. I expect this makes some sense with them trying hard to be european. It actually sounds like Ukranians have a political divide similar to how the US does. Maybe it's just a human thing. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:01:59 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: That would be saying "The quiet part out loud," our leaders likely know this but like the boiling the Russian frog I pointed out long ago if we frame it as "they are taking their land back" it will probably go over a lot better than destroying the Russian state. Which is what the west is doing. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Originally Posted By Jack67: Originally Posted By ad_nauseam: Possibly but Russia didn't have Crimea from 1991-2014 and did just fine. That's because Ukraine was not actively hostile. That's over. I need to make a long post on this, but until then, ponder this and realize hostile possession of Crimea takes Novorossiysk as a port off the table. It's a BIGGER threat to Russia than SRBM's in Cuba was to the US. (data is paywalled and on my ipad, wait a few minutes for me to switch) *added. Ust-Luga is in the Baltic, Vostochny is in RFE. Take those out as year-round warm water ports, or serving European Russia, and you see the dimensions of the disaster. I keep meaning to massage this data and a map of the Baltic/Black/North ports in order to explain this strategic vulnerability but didn't have time these last few days. Hurricane and family moving was part of that. Everything about this war is about control of Crimea, and control and security of Novorossiysk. It is what the Kremlin sees, but none of the west public gets it/is talking about it. The key strategists in power get it, I'm not claiming "we" are stupid. It's just not in the public dialogue. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/556465/2C630259-6C5B-4543-AA48-9DEFDBC6FCF2_png-2548902.JPG That would be saying "The quiet part out loud," our leaders likely know this but like the boiling the Russian frog I pointed out long ago if we frame it as "they are taking their land back" it will probably go over a lot better than destroying the Russian state. Which is what the west is doing. Despite the idea that the West if frogboiling Russia (which I have advocated this whole thread) the fact remains that this war is in Russia’s power to stop and save themselves. And ONLY Russia’s power. From a strategic perspective, the West/Ukraine has probably done enough damage to Russia to suit their aims. Russia’s conventional power is in shambles and their economy will follow. If sanity prevailed in Russia, we would probably call it a day. Or let me put it this way - if someone shot Putin, mumbled an apology, and withdrew to the actual borders, we would accept that and might even lift sanctions quickly. However, sanity is very definitely not prevailing in Russia as the Nordstream pipeline shows. Direct action against Europe’s energy infrastructure is insane and instead of cowing Europe they are moving to a war footing. They have to. We’re seeing the slow-motion collapse of the Russian government and rational decision-making from a combination of (IMO) their warped historical views, mass hysteria, incompetence pushed past the breaking point, abject desperation, and total corruption from top to bottom. The people aren’t going to revolt. The FSB could take out Putin but are probably too tied into his crimes against his own people and Ukraine for them to be able to take that step. The only thing that can save Russia now is revolution in the Army. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:02:19 PM EDT
[#32]
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:06:54 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
— Faytuks News ? (@Faytuks) October 3, 2022 This story is starting to get some traction.Link to news story |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:13:10 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fisterkev: Uh, no thanks. Then we'll be responsible - and culpable - for every target hit... I'd give them ATACMS on the condition that if they fire them into *actual* Russia (excluding the "annexed" areas) then we cut the supply of all MLRS/HIMARS ammo. So don't shoot them there. But as for us having "oversight" of UA targeting, no. That just puts every target on us and gets us directly involved. That does away with plausible deniability. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fisterkev: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeJ4IhoXoAAN8os?format=png&name=900x900 Uh, no thanks. Then we'll be responsible - and culpable - for every target hit... I'd give them ATACMS on the condition that if they fire them into *actual* Russia (excluding the "annexed" areas) then we cut the supply of all MLRS/HIMARS ammo. So don't shoot them there. But as for us having "oversight" of UA targeting, no. That just puts every target on us and gets us directly involved. That does away with plausible deniability. I disagree. Russia says the “annexed” parts of Ukraine are now part of Russia, this means Putin is already going to say Ukraine is attacking Russian territory. So what’s it matter if Ukraine actually attacks Russian territory? Putin will already use whatever excuse he wants to escalate things. Russia attacked Ukraine, the US is already providing weapons to Ukraine, let’s stop worrying about how things appear to try and not upset Putin. I think the strategic benefit of being able to attack inside Russia is greater than the worry of upsetting Putin. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:14:27 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Not at all. Bio/chem weapons require an extremely competent and prepared military to use them effectively. Russia doesn’t have that by any stretch. Nukes are a stronger likelihood and in keeping with Soviet doctrine. Blow holes in the enemy lines with nukes and roll through in buttoned-up BMPs. The Russians can worry about their increased thyroid cancer rate in 10 years. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By griffin86: Anyone else surprised Putin hasn’t used biological or chemical weapons yet? Not at all. Bio/chem weapons require an extremely competent and prepared military to use them effectively. Russia doesn’t have that by any stretch. Nukes are a stronger likelihood and in keeping with Soviet doctrine. Blow holes in the enemy lines with nukes and roll through in buttoned-up BMPs. The Russians can worry about their increased thyroid cancer rate in 10 years. The “cornered Putin resorts to NBC attack” is a big issue in my house, since wife & kids are German dual citizens, and all the in-laws live in Germany. The last nuclear explosion in Ukraine ( ie- Chernobyl ) was a big deal to Europe; there are still effects felt today. I doubt Putin will risk the fallout from using a nuke. That leaves chemical or bio weapons. I don’t know about Russian bio-weapons. But Putin and or the Soviets have used chem weapons several times, and denied it. Putin used them in Syria. They were certainly used in Afghanistan. Probably used in Chenya. Not sure where else the Russians used them. As for the safety of Russian soldiers deploying the weapons, does anyone believe Putin gives a crap about the safety of his soldiers?? My bet would be on chemical weapons in Ukraine before any nuke goes off. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:16:54 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
— Faytuks News ? (@Faytuks) October 3, 2022 This story is starting to get some traction.Link to news story Even as the russian govt kidnaps russian citizens to be bullet sponges in this war, roughly 70% of russians still want Ukraine conquered for the sake of russian pride. The russian people want to win more than they want their children to live. They will definitely support the kremlin using nukes to win. (After all, Ukraine was just about to attack russia.  ) Freakin idiots.
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:18:21 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I was waiting for them to drop a grenade on them. I was not disappointed! 
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:19:02 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeIitGEXEAAg8cv?format=png&name=large This sounds like a more mechanized version of the Japanese infiltration/blockage tactics they used in early WWII. Infiltrate allied lines then set up on GLOC and wait for the main line to panic and withdraw, then repeat. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:19:17 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: It did surprise me that leftist progressives were cheering for people fighting to the death to protect their borders, language, and culture. That is not why the Left is supporting Ukraine. They are supporting it because the RussiaRussiaRussia! hoax conditioned them to hate Russia. Now, don't get me wrong - there's always a good and worthwhile reason to hate Russians. That just doesn't happen to be one of the particularly good ones. The Left doesn't give a fuck about Ukraine's borders, language, culture etc except to the extent that doing so hurts Russia - and by extension in their little minds, Trump. The Left still wants the abolition of national borders, that hasn't changed. It's just convenient to pretend that they care about Ukraine's. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:21:45 PM EDT
[#40]
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:22:25 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Musk just shit in his own punch bowl. Oh shit…. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:27:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Zam18th]
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zam18th: I'm going to be F5ing for the next week for news of them breaching the Svatove - Kreminna and Troitske - Svatove lines and getting into the rear. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Zam18th: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeJlx0TWYAQqDtc?format=jpg&name=medium I'm going to be F5ing for the next week for news of them breaching the Svatove - Kreminna and Troitske - Svatove lines and getting into the rear. ETA: As I said yesterday, Krasnorichenske is more than cutting the supply line. It accesses the road system that leads to Starobilsk and the rears of Rubizhne and Sievierodonetsk.
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:28:49 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By anonimovaca: I disagree. Russia says the “annexed” parts of Ukraine are now part of Russia, this means Putin is already going to say Ukraine is attacking Russian territory. So what’s it matter if Ukraine actually attacks Russian territory? Putin will already use whatever excuse he wants to escalate things. Russia attacked Ukraine, the US is already providing weapons to Ukraine, let’s stop worrying about how things appear to try and not upset Putin. I think the strategic benefit of being able to attack inside Russia is greater than the worry of upsetting Putin. No one outside of Russia recognizes their annexation of Ukraine's territory. It has no legal or international legitimacy anywhere outside of Russia. And because of that, supporting Ukraine in trying to take back what is their occupied territory is still view as legitimate. But the second that we start reviewing and OK'ing every target that HIMARS/M270 shoots at, then we take ownership of those strikes. And if they start shooting them deep into Russia, then we also own that. At that point, we are literally at war with Russia, and it's a short path from that to nuclear exchange. If Russia *truly* viewed the annexed areas as any other part of Russia, then the nukes would already be popping off. Even they don't buy their own bullshit. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:42:03 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fisterkev: That is not why the Left is supporting Ukraine. They are supporting it because the RussiaRussiaRussia! hoax conditioned them to hate Russia. Now, don't get me wrong - there's always a good and worthwhile reason to hate Russians. That just doesn't happen to be one of the particularly good ones. The Left doesn't give a fuck about Ukraine's borders, language, culture etc except to the extent that doing so hurts Russia - and by extension in their little minds, Trump. The Left still wants the abolition of national borders, that hasn't changed. It's just convenient to pretend that they care about Ukraine's. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fisterkev: Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: It did surprise me that leftist progressives were cheering for people fighting to the death to protect their borders, language, and culture. That is not why the Left is supporting Ukraine. They are supporting it because the RussiaRussiaRussia! hoax conditioned them to hate Russia. Now, don't get me wrong - there's always a good and worthwhile reason to hate Russians. That just doesn't happen to be one of the particularly good ones. The Left doesn't give a fuck about Ukraine's borders, language, culture etc except to the extent that doing so hurts Russia - and by extension in their little minds, Trump. The Left still wants the abolition of national borders, that hasn't changed. It's just convenient to pretend that they care about Ukraine's. This really isn't a correct representation of many democrat's position on Ukraine. |
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USA
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:47:19 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: Russian Orthodox alreadybis a separate religion from Christianity/Catholicism and split long ago. The theology has historically been rejected……on top of Kirill being a historic KGB asset placed in the church to keep and eye on them. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: Originally Posted By Francisco_dAnconia: Originally Posted By Napoleon451: Originally Posted By elcope:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeErQ9dXEAERNpY?format=jpg&name=large https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FeErQ9dWIAcGKlk?format=jpg&name=large Russian Orthodox alreadybis a separate religion from Christianity/Catholicism and split long ago. The theology has historically been rejected……on top of Kirill being a historic KGB asset placed in the church to keep and eye on them. Kiril is the primate of the Russian Orthodox Church; he’s also known as the Patriarch; essentially the eastern equivalent of a pope. He is an FSB asset. He answers directly to Putin, not to his church nor to God. His predecessor was Primate Aley II of Moscow, who was a KGB asset. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarch_Alexy_II_of_Moscow “There have been reports, beginning in the 1990s, that Patriarch Alexy II had been a KGB agent. These reports originate with Gleb Yakunin, a member of the committee created for the investigation of the Soviet coup attempt of 1991 and chaired by Lev Ponomaryov, who thereby gained the access to secret KGB archives.[18] In March 1992 he published materials alleging cooperation between the Moscow Patriarchate and the KGB. He published code names of several KGB agents who held high-rank positions in the Russian Orthodox Church including Patriarch Alexius II. The Russian church defrocked Yakunin in 1993.[19] “ “The Patriarch was also named as a "KGB collaborator" in a 2015 interview with defected former KGB general and suspected double agent Oleg Kalugin.[26] It is alleged that the Estonian branch of the KGB recruited Alexy as an agent on 28 February 1958, just days after his 29th birthday, assigning him the codename "Drozdov" (he had completed his dissertation on Metropolitan Filaret Drozdov). The report detailing his recruitment makes clear that the KGB contacted Alexy, then still a simple priest, because they expected him to succeed John (Alekseev) as Bishop of the Russian Orthodox diocese of Tallinn and Estonia (and he was in fact appointed to this post less than three years later).[27] Among his KGB assignments was one in 1983, when he was sent to the Pskov-Caves Monastery to "pacify" rebellious monks.[28] The reports further allege that Alexander Grigoryev, a KGB officer in Leningrad under cover as Orthodox priest Fr Alexander was his case officer for a while.[29] According to Oleg Gordievsky, Alexy II worked for the KGB for forty years, and his case officer was Nikolai Patrushev.[citation needed] In February 1988, exactly 30 years after his recruitment, the KGB chairman awarded him the Certificate of Honour.[20] Patriarch Alexy II acknowledged that compromises were made with the Soviet government by bishops of the Moscow Patriarchate, himself included, and publicly repented of these compromises.” Read the rest at the link. Kiril is not a real priest nor even a Christian. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:47:39 PM EDT
[#46]
Check that map in the second tweet! |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:48:46 PM EDT
[#47]
Looks like the Kupiyansk bridge head is about to be linked with the Lyman push. Good good.
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:48:59 PM EDT
[#48]
More to come from the Kherson front. |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:51:00 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Check that map in the second tweet!  Attached File |
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Posted: 10/3/2022 2:51:40 PM EDT
[#50]
Elon is getting fucking roasted. LOL |
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