Hello all.

This is going to be such a dumb question to many of you...  I apologize in advance.

I have never lived on a concrete slab (Maybe in college in the dorm--no idea about that.)

I'm putting up a building in my back yard. It will be storage/shop (16' X 28'--16' high at the eaves) also a man cave for uxb in the upstairs of that, and on the side is an extension (16' X 18') which will be a (one-story) guest room (when the Murphy bed is pulled down) and most days, a studio for me.

The big part of the building will be polished concrete for the lower floor.  Not worried about that.  Nobody will be walking on that barefooted.

There will be a bathroom, which I will tile.  

I haven't decided what flooring to put on the guest room, but it might be tile too, since  I just purchased a pallet of 8 X 48" gorgeous hardwood-look tile at a great price  (AND BEFORE I GET A GAZILLION COMMENTS ABOUT THE LARGE FORMAT TILE, NO, I AM NOT AFRAID OF LAYING THIS TILE. YES, I KNOW HOW TO DO IT RIGHT, THOUGH INPUT FROM EXPERIENCED TILE PEOPLE IS ALWAYS WELCOME. HAPPY TO HAVE THAT DISCUSSION, BUT NOT HERE. )


Anyway...My fear?

I think the floor in the bathroom and the guest room  is going to be freezing cold 9 months out of the year.

Because I've never lived on a slab (always old houses--built over basements or crawl spaces)  I don't understand slabs.

I don't know how to live comfortably on a slab.

I'm doing research, watching videos, talking to people (some builders I know--mostly they seem to not care, since they hand over the key and leave, so they have nothing of use to offer--maybe I don't know good builders. )

So...Do you live on a slab?  Do you build houses on slabs?  Do you lay tile or other flooring on slabs?

Are your floors cold?  If not, how do you keep them from being cold?

I'm looking at the do-it-yourself, under-tile, applied-with-thinset heating systems that claim it will cost me a dollar per month per ten square feet.  

Yeah, I am not convinced that stuff will last past month three.  

Also not convinced it won't spin the electric meter like crazy, and once it's under the tile, what are you going to do about it?  

Nothing.  That's what.

Can any of you speak to this?  Any homebuilders who can talk about life on a concrete slab?

Anybody have suggestions or thoughts to put my mind at ease?

Should I plan on spending a week with a bang gun putting down plywood to insulate that cold-ass floor?  (this seems stupid).

We poured footers on Friday.  Block goes in on Tuesday.

I'm roughing in the plumbing this week, then we'll pour the slab.     It is Kentucky but a cold floor can be cold year-round even here.

I'm freaking out a little about my floors turning me and my guests into Snow Miser.

Help?

Reassurance?

Tell me to move south, to hurricane country?

Anything?

Thanks in advance,

Kitties

Seriously, I hope that's not the only answer.

I hate carpet.

Rugs are for decoration.

Can you elaborate?

Heating water is out highest cost for energy use here. (It's the biggest part of our electric bill.)

Natural gas is not available here.  Propane heating of water costs too much.

I am interested in this method.

Would love to be able to afford geothermal installation. But that's not in the budget.

I don't know the terminology.

Footer poured.

Guy will lay block, then pour slab involving the block walls.

Guessing that's a stem wall, but maybe not?

Basically it's slab on grade, but has footers and a block perimeter.  Not a monolithic slab.

I think the radiant electric mesh is what I'm looking at now.  Exactly as you describe it is what I want..so it's not miserable on bare feet in a bathroom or bedroom.

Can you explain the thermal break between slab and foundation?

What I don't know is a little overwhelming.

I would love to know what system he has.

Thanks in advance if you can ask and relay it here.

Kitties

You survive the hurricane intact?

Nope, I'm zone 6--(at least I'm Agricultural zone 6.)

You might be looking at a different zone system though.  I default to the ag/plant hardiness zone system.

Do you have any sense of how much it adds to your electric bill?  ( I ask it this way because i f you built a new house and put this in, you never had a "normal" bill without this included.)

Thank you!

I have a deep dislike, bordering on HATRED of Ditra because if you ever need to take it up, it destroys plywood. (I had to deal with it following a bad tile job, and just opted to take up the subfloor rather than spend the excessive amount of time to get it off the ply. (this involved a reciprocating saw with a demo blade and a lot of foul language.  The air was blue.  Because I couldn't find the screw heads holding down the ply  in a lot of spots   ) It basically delaminated the plywood, and I could see no good reason for applying it over plywood.  Concrete is a different matter.)

On concrete, my sense is that there is more potential reason to use it (the uncoupling is one of the big assets, for me--I am considering Ditra on a rehab I'm managing in the nearby town, where there is a small crack in the subfloor that's making me worry.) but there are other uncoupling membranes out there.

Is your experience with Ditra proving it is better than others of its ilk?

I did NOT know about the temperature moderation advantages of Ditra.  That's going to make me take a second look for certain.

So....how did you shoot the board down?  How did you attach it?

ETA:  One of my issues in this structure is wanting a curbless shower.  If I did this as you have it pictured, I'd have damn near enough elevation for the slope to the drain, by the time I consider the durock and the tile.

AND warmer floors.

Hmmm...That looks costly and like a pain in the ass.  But I really, really, REALLY don't want to hate my floors.

You mean mat type heating systems?

If so, how much did they cost to run?

I'm far less concerned with initial cost to install (though that is a consideration) than with ongoing cost of use.

Thank you!  I just might send you an IM.

We are laying block today, then I will be occupied with roughing in plumbing, so it might be a few days before I get back to this.

Thank you!

I will take a close look at this, and at the site you recommend.

Thanks!

Not doing a strict ADA shower because of the opening to the shower proper, and the shower is going to be only 4.5' X 5' or so.  Not a "two shower head" installation. Still, I'm looking at having some body sprays that throw water around in all directions.  Whether I actually go for that or not will depend on budget.

Priority is getting the darn building dried in.

Then we will see what I can actually do. But I'm trying to overbuild on the infrastructure so that I don't have to bust up concrete later to do something I wish I'd done in the first place.

ETA:  "more excavation" is apparently not an issue.  I just called the contractor and said, "could one of your guys come over and bust up this hard-ass dirt so I can actually move it to rough in the drains?"

He did.

Made a mess of his nicely compacted dirt floor but...will save me a bunch of cussing.
(The track hoe was already sitting there.  All he had to do was send over a guy.  He actually said I could use the hoe to do it, and I said, in my most sultry voice because it would make him laugh, "I don't know nuthin' 'bout that kind of hoe."  He did laugh, btw.)

I think he will do anything I need, short of putting up the whole building for me.  (not that I would want that.  Too much of a control freak.)
My main issue with the drains is enough drop to the septic without having to install a lift pump.

Right now we have plenty.  If I go messing with it, that could change.  

I don't plan to mess with it too much.

Thank you.   I had not even considered that.  My foundation contractor did not mention it as an option, which is absolutely not a slam at him.  Just an indication of what he thinks I'm after, and the zone where we live.

I will likely go with the 1" foam above the slab I'm guessing, once I figure that out.  It will significantly reduce the "drop" I need in the concrete in the shower area to get enough slope toward the drain.  I'm not sure how to bridge the "foam to no-foam" junction (my fallback is always thinset ) and I'm a little concerned about the shower itself being so unpleasantly cold (the floor) that nobody wants to shower.

If I do the heat mat system, it might be in the shower itself if nowhere else.

Jeez....I've got a serious learning curve here and not much time to engage the curve. Putting an electrical thingy in a pan that could potentially  become wet...yeah, that tweaks all my twitchies.

Why would I have to "keep it there?"  

Can I not adjust, if nobody will use the building for a few days?

Yes.  That makes complete sense.

Not sure I would keep that floor warm for two weeks for use on a weekend, but depending on frequency of use,  it might make more sense to do exactly that.

This is exactly what I would want to heat.

And assuming there will be a circuit breaker involved, I probably wouldn't even worry too much about that, and I ALWAYS assume a shower pan will eventually get saturated.

Always.

Although I have full faith that I can build one which will not, I still assume...Always.

Hmmm..

Interesting that I trust circuit breakers but not toilets.  

I might need therapy.