User Panel
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Posted: 7/10/2021 11:51:04 PM EDT
[#1]
Disappointing but not surprising.
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Posted: 7/11/2021 12:28:53 AM EDT
[#2]
Galatians 4:16: "So then, have I become your enemy because I told you the truth?" The Apostle Paul to the Galatian Congregation.
I'm not a Catholic, but it sure seems that PC has taken the place of truth there. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 9:08:23 AM EDT
[#3]
Wow, this is horrific.
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Posted: 7/11/2021 9:34:39 AM EDT
[#4]
The content of Father Altman's preaching was on point, but I think this is a very relevant comment: "The obligation of a bishop is to ensure that all who serve the faithful are able to do so while unifying and building the Body of Christ,"
Just something to ponder... |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:18:05 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The content of Father Altman's preaching was on point, but I think this is a very relevant comment: "The obligation of a bishop is to ensure that all who serve the faithful are able to do so while unifying and building the Body of Christ," Just something to ponder... But who ARE the faithful? It is NOT the entire body of the church. And when the truth bothers some people, that is when they should listen the hardest. The ''Church'' needs to look at the beam in their eye............................ |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:30:56 AM EDT
[#6]
Let the truth be damned in the interest of....?
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:38:06 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wow, this is horrific. It's what big tech is doing. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:48:45 AM EDT
[#8]
Catholic Church leadership is pretty strongly linked with the Democratic Party and their values. Bad mouthing Biden over abortion is not going to lead to a long career.
Sure, rural Catholics are Republicans, but the big city bosses are basically a wing of the Democratic Party |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:58:17 AM EDT
[#9]
yet it is ok to to move pedophile priests around for decades abusing little kids and then be moved to the vatican by the pope just before an indictment for felony crimes against children ( Cardinal Law in Boston ).
That's ok and gets one promoted. if it wasn't so evil it would be funny. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:11:48 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sure, rural FIFY |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:15:21 AM EDT
[#11]
By their fruits
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:27:52 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But who ARE the faithful? It is NOT the entire body of the church. And when the truth bothers some people, that is when they should listen the hardest. The ''Church'' needs to look at the beam in their eye............................ It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:39:15 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: But who ARE the faithful? It is NOT the entire body of the church. And when the truth bothers some people, that is when they should listen the hardest. The ''Church'' needs to look at the beam in their eye............................ It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:48:04 AM EDT
[#14]
When was the last time that bishop, or any bishop for that matter, removed a liberal?
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Posted: 7/11/2021 12:41:55 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. I very much appreciate your opinion on this very interesting subject. I think I agree with your point. I can push and promote conservative ideology and defend gun rights and limited government and human life without being a jerk about it. In fact, making enemies probably does not help our side of the line. "Burn it all down!" "Make enemies!" "Call names!" "Burn bridges!" "Return hate with hate!" has not really helped our pro-life, pro-gun, limited-government side of the line in the big picture. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 12:50:34 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 1:28:42 PM EDT
[#17]
Herod did what, again?
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Posted: 7/11/2021 3:19:32 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Do conservative believers not help the poor? |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 3:33:15 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? What I can promise you is I won't be going after his job, or pleading with the Bishop to talk to him. At the most I would stop attending services for a period. I agree the how is as important as the what in terms of the message goes. The problem with the solution the church adopted that in this case a part of the message is how, and not just what. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 3:33:35 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Jesus didn't give the lazy a pass, while he did say we needed to help the poor it wasn't one sided and if the ''poor'' have work available to them then most would fall under lazy [no workee, no eatee clause] and not poor. And ''widows and orphans'' are entirely different then single women who open their legs to whatever dick is available. You are forgiven of course but the aftermath of your behaviors here on earth are not somehow magically mitigated, you get to live with and deal with the aftermath. and that aftermath can last many years and make your life far harder then it could have been. When the ''poor'' expect help and their life to be paid for, society has been more then generous and now it is detrimental to those same poor people it wanted to help. We have far fewer ''poors'' today and far more ''lazies.'' I can't name one era in history where lazy well fed people could sit on their asses and the rest of society took care of them. Want riots in the streets? Just cut off the food and freebies to all the lazy people and watch them rise up against those who have fed and clothed them for 1/2 century. And both sides knows that which is why the bribes continue. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 3:49:50 PM EDT
[#21]
But Fr. James Martin floats on…
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Posted: 7/11/2021 3:56:15 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I can only speak for myself in regards to the point you make. If he were preaching on areas that I felt I was lacking in it would certainly make me uncomfortable. Perhaps he even makes eye contact with me because I have confessed to him and I feel like it's personal. What I can promise you is I won't be going after his job, or pleading with the Bishop to talk to him. At the most I would stop attending services for a period. I agree the how is as important as the what in terms of the message goes. The problem with the solution the church adopted that in this case a part of the message is how, and not just what. Concur. Don't get me wrong - I concur with Father Altman and some of the videos I've seen are firebrand but it's getting to be about time that someone upsets the apple cart. We've certainly been getting lectured on the "liberal" aspects of doctrine, so it's only fair that someone speak up for the "conservative" side. I don't see Cupich or Gregory ever calling out abortion enablers. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 6:03:55 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We've certainly been getting lectured on the "liberal" aspects of doctrine, so it's only fair that someone speak up for the "conservative" side. I don't see Cupich or Gregory ever calling out abortion enablers. This brings us to one of the major sticking points for non-Catholics. Many non-Catholics, and even some Catholics, have no idea of how the Church's hierarchy works. Indeed, here alone people have equated this bishop's action with that of the Church. Bishops have a TREMENDOUS amount of freedom and independence on how their dioceses are run. Fr. Altman's removal is not necessarily anymore of an indication on how the Vatican views any issue any more than the Liberal Bishops' refusal to excommunicate Biden or Pelosi is. Rather, this is an indication of how those particular Bishops view an issue or circumstance. Still, I don't like it, and I see it as another example of conservative ideals taking a beating while liberals like James Martin keep spewing garbage. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 6:10:36 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: But who ARE the faithful? It is NOT the entire body of the church. And when the truth bothers some people, that is when they should listen the hardest. The ''Church'' needs to look at the beam in their eye............................ It doesn't change the point I was trying to make. I like that Father Altman calls out the fact that some in the clergy have been too quiet in calling out sin. No disputing that. All I'm saying is that the way you spread the message matters too. Sure - it makes you feel good to have someone "lay down the law" and vocalize what many of us are thinking, but there's a more important issue than how the choir receives the message. My main concern is not with speaking the truth, but HOW you speak that truth. Is Father Altman doing it the "right" way? I dunno. Maybe. It's kind of like so many arguments in this forum: You can hit people over the head with your version of the truth, but are you more interested in their well-being or are you only arguing to show that you're the smartest kid in the room, consequences be damned? Bishop Barron, paraphrasing Aquinas, says that loving someone is to will their good. If this is truly the motivation behind your arguments, then so be it. Sometimes you just gotta make a whip and go to the temple. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 6:16:07 PM EDT
[#25]
One of the churches I used to go to has a Communist catholic priest.
He prayed for Trumps ouster and it was granted. Also said anyone supporting Trump should leave the Catholic church. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 6:47:01 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: One of the churches I used to go to has a Communist catholic priest. He prayed for Trumps ouster and it was granted. Also said anyone supporting Trump should leave the Catholic church. That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the bishop? |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:14:05 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Concur. Don't get me wrong - I concur with Father Altman and some of the videos I've seen are firebrand but it's getting to be about time that someone upsets the apple cart. We've certainly been getting lectured on the "liberal" aspects of doctrine, so it's only fair that someone speak up for the "conservative" side. I don't see Cupich or Gregory ever calling out abortion enablers. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I can only speak for myself in regards to the point you make. If he were preaching on areas that I felt I was lacking in it would certainly make me uncomfortable. Perhaps he even makes eye contact with me because I have confessed to him and I feel like it's personal. What I can promise you is I won't be going after his job, or pleading with the Bishop to talk to him. At the most I would stop attending services for a period. I agree the how is as important as the what in terms of the message goes. The problem with the solution the church adopted that in this case a part of the message is how, and not just what. Concur. Don't get me wrong - I concur with Father Altman and some of the videos I've seen are firebrand but it's getting to be about time that someone upsets the apple cart. We've certainly been getting lectured on the "liberal" aspects of doctrine, so it's only fair that someone speak up for the "conservative" side. I don't see Cupich or Gregory ever calling out abortion enablers. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 10:15:37 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the bishop? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: One of the churches I used to go to has a Communist catholic priest. He prayed for Trumps ouster and it was granted. Also said anyone supporting Trump should leave the Catholic church. That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the bishop? |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 12:02:13 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If they did I'm sure the Bishop probably agreed with the sentiment. Not necessarily. What that priest was preaching was his error. Thinking that he IS the Church and assuming the Bishop would agree is where you are erring. |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 8:20:59 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the bishop? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: One of the churches I used to go to has a Communist catholic priest. He prayed for Trumps ouster and it was granted. Also said anyone supporting Trump should leave the Catholic church. That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the bishop? Communism & socialism has been vehemently refuted, as a doctrine that Catholics can follow. It goes against Catholic teaching. But, truth is no longer allowed in the world..... except in whispers. |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 12:17:52 PM EDT
[#31]
Hell must have acquired more real estate and needs more skulls for flooring.
I had a much longer post, but I think Fr. Goring likely has the best short description for Fr. Altman. Goes something like, "Fr. Altman tells the absolute truth. He is a little rough around the edges, but so are most prophets we see in Scripture." I agree with Fr. Goring. Fr. Altman (1) is speaking the truth (2) at a time when it needs to be spoken (3) when most Church leaders are failing to do so. I believe that he will be rewarded richly for his faithfulness. As for his tone, it is well within the parameters we see in Holy Scripture. Contrary to his accusers' allegations, Fr. Altman is one of the nicest people one (bishops notwithstanding) will ever meet, as most priests who are lions in the pulpit tend to be. |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 2:54:50 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Communism & socialism has been vehemently refuted, as a doctrine that Catholics can follow. It goes against Catholic teaching. But, truth is no longer allowed in the world..... except in whispers. Quote HistoryQuoted: Communism & socialism has been vehemently refuted, as a doctrine that Catholics can follow. It goes against Catholic teaching. But, truth is no longer allowed in the world..... except in whispers. It's certainly rare to have a priest who will speak the truth loudly. This is my former pastor, Father Dan Beeman, who in addition to the below was also one of few priests I've seen celebrate an incredibly reverent Novus Ordo Mass. Note that the Bishop of Richmond is our former, late Bishop. The current was previously an auxiliary in DC under Cardinal Wuerl. He (Bishop Knestout) has not said/done anything objectionable, but neither has he said/done anything remarkable. Father Dan Beeman of Holy Trinity parish in Norfolk took action after local KofC leaders announced that Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe would be honored at the parade. “Governor McAuliffe stands contrary to the Catholic Church in not one but many of the most essential teachings of the Church in the political arena,” the pastor said, noting the governor’s strong support for legal abortion and same-sex marriage. Father Beeman said that the parish would not participate in or support the parade, and would sever ties with the local KofC council. |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 3:09:32 PM EDT
[#33]
I am the Grand Knight for our Council and would never support someone like McAuliffe.
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Posted: 7/12/2021 3:32:47 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let the truth be damned in the interest of....? Diabolical Disorientation.  Saul Alinsky and Pope Paul VI: Rules for Radicals, Church and State? Dr. Taylor Marshall Podcast |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 4:56:01 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Let the truth be damned in the interest of....? Diabolical Disorientation.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNiKAJt_Y1o
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Posted: 7/12/2021 5:13:28 PM EDT
[#36]
Here/s what got him in hot water! TRUTH!
 Fr. Altman: You cannot be Catholic & a Democrat. Period. (Part I) |
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Posted: 7/12/2021 5:29:24 PM EDT
[#37]
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Posted: 7/13/2021 12:58:53 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do conservative believers not help the poor? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Do conservative believers not help the poor? This a Marxist talking point first spouted by unbelievers to guilt believers. It's sad that many liberal "believers" are using it as a bludgeon now too. The thing is, what is helping the poor? Is giving people a job helping the poor? Is paying taxes that go to low income parents helping the poor? We're forced to help the poor in this country. Yet the liberals use that as a bludgeon when you speak the truth over their sodomite love or baby killing. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the "judge not" people that don't even use it in context. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 2:39:32 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote History |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 8:18:29 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This a Marxist talking point first spouted by unbelievers to guilt believers. It's sad that many liberal "believers" are using it as a bludgeon now too. The thing is, what is helping the poor? Is giving people a job helping the poor? Is paying taxes that go to low income parents helping the poor? We're forced to help the poor in this country. Yet the liberals use that as a bludgeon when you speak the truth over their sodomite love or baby killing. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the "judge not" people that don't even use it in context. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I understand what you are saying but frankly, ''how you say it'' has been watered down by way too many churches to apologizing for God/the Bible saying certain things are wrong and a sin.'' It's why I usually type ''church'' and not "Church'' any more. I can read or hear about ''global warming is evil and a sin'' all week long. Church is where you go to grow in your faith, not to show off your fake. That is true, of course. At the same time: I think there are some people who like Father Altman's message mainly because it aligns with their "conservative" views, but they are not nearly as passionate about "liberal" things that the Jesus also taught. What if Father Altman just as passionately decried poor people and our unwillingness to help? I'm not talking help as in "use government to pick your pocket and distribute as they see fit" but "YOU, you go out and help someone". There are quite a few other things that Jesus called on us to do, things that make me feel uncomfortable and unworthy because I fall way short in those areas. Would we be as outraged if a bishop removed someone like that, someone that makes us feel uncomfortable about the things that we don't do? Do conservative believers not help the poor? This a Marxist talking point first spouted by unbelievers to guilt believers. It's sad that many liberal "believers" are using it as a bludgeon now too. The thing is, what is helping the poor? Is giving people a job helping the poor? Is paying taxes that go to low income parents helping the poor? We're forced to help the poor in this country. Yet the liberals use that as a bludgeon when you speak the truth over their sodomite love or baby killing. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the "judge not" people that don't even use it in context. Paying taxes is no way to help the poor. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 10:10:55 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This a Marxist talking point first spouted by unbelievers to guilt believers. It's sad that many liberal "believers" are using it as a bludgeon now too. The thing is, what is helping the poor? Is giving people a job helping the poor? Is paying taxes that go to low income parents helping the poor? We're forced to help the poor in this country. Yet the liberals use that as a bludgeon when you speak the truth over their sodomite love or baby killing. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the "judge not" people that don't even use it in context. One of the main purposes of private property/wealth is to allow the development of virtue via charity. Several places in the Gospels, Jesus calls on people to be charitable. Nowhere does he call upon the Jewish or Roman governments to help the poor. While I am not opposed personally to minimalist government "safety nets" in principle, they always outgrow their original scopes and mandates. I also believe that those "nets" should be at the lowest level of government possible to maximize their accountability to the citizens funding them. The outsourcing of charity to the government allows people to feel virtuous without developing any actual virtue. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 11:10:51 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: One of the churches I used to go to has a Communist catholic priest. He prayed for Trumps ouster and it was granted. Also said anyone supporting Trump should leave the Catholic church. That shouldn't be allowed. Did someone report him to the Tax exempt status comes with rules. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 11:41:08 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tax exempt status comes with rules. What a banal trope to drag out. Seriously. Not only does it add nothing to the conversation, it makes no sense from a logical standpoint. This isn't GD. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 12:04:55 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This a Marxist talking point first spouted by unbelievers to guilt believers. It's sad that many liberal "believers" are using it as a bludgeon now too. The thing is, what is helping the poor? Is giving people a job helping the poor? Is paying taxes that go to low income parents helping the poor? We're forced to help the poor in this country. Yet the liberals use that as a bludgeon when you speak the truth over their sodomite love or baby killing. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the "judge not" people that don't even use it in context. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 12:51:28 PM EDT
[#45]
I wish I had a parish priest with have of his strength and courage. They are all cowards, scared of not being liked. It makes me ill listening to their social commentary of a homily. I can't go to Mass anymore without leaving angry.
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Posted: 7/13/2021 1:44:21 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wish I had a parish priest with have of his strength and courage. They are all cowards, scared of not being liked. It makes me ill listening to their social commentary of a homily. I can't go to Mass anymore without leaving angry. https://www.google.com/search?q=Latin+Mass+North+Carolina |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 2:17:26 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What a banal trope to drag out. Seriously. Not only does it add nothing to the conversation, it makes no sense from a logical standpoint. This isn't GD. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Tax exempt status comes with rules. What a banal trope to drag out. Seriously. Not only does it add nothing to the conversation, it makes no sense from a logical standpoint. This isn't GD. Churches enjoy tax free status, subject to certain restrictions. Political campaigning is one of those restrictions. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 2:43:14 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Churches enjoy tax free status, subject to certain restrictions. Political campaigning is one of those restrictions. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Tax exempt status comes with rules. What a banal trope to drag out. Seriously. Not only does it add nothing to the conversation, it makes no sense from a logical standpoint. This isn't GD. Churches enjoy tax free status, subject to certain restrictions. Political campaigning is one of those restrictions. I have listened to many of his sermons and he has never campaigned. Unlike Al Gore who active campaigned in black churches across the US, as did Bill, Hillary and Obama. Please spare us the rhetoric. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 4:04:02 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Churches enjoy tax free status, subject to certain restrictions. Political campaigning is one of those restrictions. You implied that the Bishop's actions were done for monetary reasons, not this blanket statement you are know trying to backpedal with. One Bishop's actions wouldn't be enough to supplant the constitutional history of tax exemption. |
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Posted: 7/13/2021 4:29:11 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Catholic Church leadership is pretty strongly linked with the Democratic Party and their values. Bad mouthing Biden over abortion is not going to lead to a long career. Sure, rural Catholics are Republicans, but the big city bosses are basically a wing of the Democratic Party |
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