Posted: 5/4/2007 8:31:19 AM EDT
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Spending time on the range, feeling the offhand hold shrink, feeling the target coming to me, that absolute physical calm that tightens a seven ring hold to a nine or ten ring hold, but still, there are the fliers, one miss or low score that ruins an otherwise good string. How do you folks avoid these fliers? Most of the time the fliers seem like they're a case of the trigger's first stage slack being taken up, and a slight muscle contaction that breaks the shot unexpectedly when you know your hold was wandering. Do you: 1. Back off the trigger a bit, then use a faster/alightly harder press to break the shot? 2. Hold the trigger up next to the break and depend on a finer sense of the breakpoint that comes with thousands of rounds downrange? 3. Achieve a deeper zen level that completely eliminates hold wanders outside the nine ring? 4. Use body english after the break to spin the shot back on target as it leaves the barrel? 5. Some other technique I have no concept of yet? Come on, fess up, what's your secret for controlling fliers in offhand? |
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I usually try to accept whatever wobble I have and then squeeze the trigger slowly, as I would in the supported positions, until the shot breaks. When the wind kicks up a little I have found that this can lead to serious fliers, since the shot seems to always break at the worst time. One thing I have done to try and solve this is to adopt a technique that makes the trigger pull seem lighter than it is. A lighter trigger makes it easier to break the shot quickly without jerking it. I choke up on the grip and use my middle finger on the trigger. Because of the short length of pull on the AR I end up with the trigger laying across the trigger in between the first and second joints. The added leverage makes the trigger feel lighter. |
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I can add a couple things, I practice a couple times a week in my back yard at a 100 yards on a 200 reduced to 100 yard target I download off of the palma website. I am notorious at shooting an "almost" clean". I keep some of the targets to just remind we what I did. I have one that I had nine Xs and an 8. The 8 was when I closed my eye as the shot left, a flinch I guess. I fixed that by pretending that its rapid fire, so I keep my eye open for the next shot, even go though the motion of keeping the sights on target and pulling the trigger again even though I single load so its a dry fire. Another problem is the left hand tensing as the shot if fired, I got to consciously think to keep it relaxed. It seems as one problem leaves another pops up, but sooner or later.... edited to fix spelling |
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Thanks for the help. Would have shot an 89 Sunday but for the one filer, a miss, ended up with a 79. I know what happened though. Wind was out of the east at 25 to 30. On my eighth shot for record, I could feel the wind pushing me around, and was tempted to set down the rifle, like I had on several other shots, and wait out the wind. The thing was, the rifle was tracking well, it felt good, stayed on target, and I thought I might be running out of time, so I went ahead and broke the shot. Big gust caught me just as I fired, and sent me high and left just outside the 5 ring. Two lessons learned. 1. Wait out the wind. 2. Use the timer. Next time... |
When that though crosses your mind, you need to have the discipline to follow it. Don't accept a bad shot! Ty |
I know this...now.  Thing is, it didn't feel like a bad shot...the wander was as minimal as it was for previous 7 shots, five 10's and two 8's. I knw the wind was gusting from the sound only, it just wasn't angled right to shift my stance. The only real wander came just as the shot broke. Next time, wait out the wind, no matter how steady the sight picture looks. Check, roger, parked in concrete. Thanks for the reinforcement.
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In the middle of a string, I've unloaded, made safe and set the rifle down before to take a couple good deep breaths and relax. A takedown and reset is the difference between a 7 or 8 and a 10 or X. If you have a good NPA and a good mental picture offhand can be easy. Matches are won standing up and lost lower to the ground. |
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That string went X-10-10-10-8-10-8-M-6-7. On at least three shots prior to the miss I safed the weapon and rested it on the chair to wait for the wind to die down. On at least three others, I let the rifle rest in the chair after the target was scored and raised, waiting for the wind to die down, deep breathing, in through the nose out through the mouth Ishinryu style, and letting my head roll around to loosen neck muscles and generally relax. On the shot that missed, even though the wind was trying to push me around, the hold was solid, staying on the paper, call it an 8 ring hold. Because I had to wait on most of the prior shots, raising questions as to how much time was left, and because the wind was not actually affecting the hold, I broke the shot without taking a break. The specific mistakes seem to be two: 1. Not using a timer, so that fears of running out of time magnified. 2. Trusting a strong gust not to get stronger. With a timer, showing exactly how much time was left, the decision would have been easy. I'd rather risk a miss due to a gust of wind than save a round for a guaranteed ten point loss. I was getting good pit service that day, and could probably get a round off every thirty seconds if I had to. With two minutes or more showing on the timer, I would have rested the rifle on the chair and waited for a break in the wind. With less time than that showing on the timer, I would have broken the shot and hoped the wind wouldn't push me off balance at the critical time. With no timer to look at, I went for the shot, and the gust pushed me off as it broke. A saved round would have cost ten points, the miss cost ten points, it was a break-even with the only chance for improvement being breaking the shot. Luck wasn't with me. I really think the key issues in this one case are two, in order of importance: 1. Always start a timer clipped in plain view. Then you know, and don't have to guess. 2. If there is time, and the wind is gusting towards maximum, but not moving your hold around, don't take the chance, put the rifle down and wait it out. The timer issue is key because not having it cost me not just the ten point miss, it also made me rush the last two shots for another 7 points lost, a total of 17. Put another way, if I'd started the timer, I might have turned a 79-1X into a 94-96-2x. That's worth a few extra seconds necessary to start the timer and clip it where I can see it, and I'll be doing that from now on. |
| I'm little surprised that no here has mention trigger timing - The perfect moment when your movment/figure eight is square on your target and anticipate with your trigger when that coverage happens (which is a very brief moment)- Trigger timing (control) can be practiced dry firing. Again just my .02 |
You're just trying to show off, that's all. You didn't even try to help the guy.  90% - NRA HP Expert, undistinguished, "also ran" My trouble with fliers is caused by trying to get the shot off when the sights are on the target. By then, it's too late - they're on their way back off target before the shot goes. You have to get on it as it's moving in. Don't grab, either. There's no trigger on earth light enough that jerking the trigger doesn't move the sights. |
Yeah well that might be showing off in some circles and maybe not so much in others! I ain't no HM...yet! Those last few points in the percentages for classification are the hard ones!
Fair enough. The recommendation still stands BUT I'll add one book title, The Ways of the Rifle I think Creedmore carries it and its over 50 bones but I think well spent. Its about position shooting--smalbore, but there are many parrallellss. Never could spell that word... Other musings of a novice: If you put in enough quality practice (live or dry) you stand a chance of getting to the point where your trigger squeeze is on auto pilot and the shot breaks in the center as you try to stare a tiny hole in the front sight and your brain is subconsciously doing the correlation between sight alignment, sight picture, and trigger finger pressure. Truly a Zen thing, higher plane, the Force and all that. Works like a champ though. I almost felt it happen once or twice---then I get excited like the rest of us humans and fling one out  Never too early to work on the mental game...Really like the comment about keeping time...dry firing and waiting is free until you run out of time... Now I'll slowly back away from looking like I'm actually offering advice, which would imply that I know what I'm talking about and can execute it. S/F -P |
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Mike & Jeffers, When you dry fire, take the target down so you are just shooting at a blank piece of paper. Turn the focus of the exercise inward. Pay attention to how you control the rifle and the muscle tension that you use (you should have enough to control the rifle - I think a lot of people don't have enough). Pay particular attention to your shoulder and make sure to tell it not to move when you break the shot. It sounds silly but I do that every shot in my head. My current average is not all that hot, but more than a few years ago, I had a couple of cleans in the OH and a fair number of 198s and 199s  B |
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Well, I am probably not the best person to give advice, I have only shot two matches in the last 16 months. Standing is all about shot selection. It doesn't matter how hard the wind is blowing. Your support hand position doesn't matter. Keeping your head erect will help you from feeling like you are falling over. A heavy muzzle will help it feel steadier. TAKE THE FIRST TEN YOU SEE. 200-0 will beat 199-19 every time. If you hold tens, you'll get x's. I only shot a 185 today, but I'll get back to my average. Tomorrow is the standing championship, 4 strings of standing. SRM ETA todays scores 187,192,188 and 195 |