Posted: 11/15/2015 1:27:09 AM EDT
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Maybe someone here can help me with these new laws... Only info I can find is bullshit news articles or long winded legal docs...
How does campus carry work now? Will we soon be able to carry on public campuses? I assume all private campuses will 'opt-out'... I read somewhere that carrying into a building posted with a 30.06 or 30.07 sign is now a class c misdemeanor. (used to be class A misdemeanor) Is this correct? For open carry, I read that you can OC anywhere that you can carry concealed except college campuses or property posted with 30.07.. Is this correct? |
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I have money that says someone (not reading or understanding the new laws) will campus carry on 1/1/2016. The news media will have a field day with that! Quoted:
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well it will not be soon Campus carry dont start till 2017 I have money that says someone (not reading or understanding the new laws) will campus carry on 1/1/2016. The news media will have a field day with that! Campus Carry only applies to concealed carry. I'd say that it is too obvious that open carry has nothing to do with campus carry, but I'm afraid that is not a safe assumption. Now another question is: will the opponents of campus carry be confused and open carry dildos on 1/1/16? 
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Universities will be in 2016 Junior colleges etc so on will be in 2017 Concealed only Private universities of course can opt out 30.06 will apply ONLY to concealed carry 30.07 will apply ONLY to open carry So in short, it has to be both to bar carry completely and if only one is posted, the other is legal until told otherwise Violating 30.06 or 30.07 is indeed a class c UNLESS said person refuses and then it's class A. It will work the same as concealed unless posted 30.07. Prohibited places are still prohibited. That's addressing your comments specifically. There is obviously more to it than that. |
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Universities will be in 2016Junior colleges etc so on will be in 2017 Concealed only Private universities of course can opt out 30.06 will apply ONLY to concealed carry 30.07 will apply ONLY to open carry So in short, it has to be both to bar carry completely and if only one is posted, the other is legal until told otherwise Violating 30.06 or 30.07 is indeed a class c UNLESS said person refuses and then it's class A. It will work the same as concealed unless posted 30.07. Prohibited places are still prohibited. That's addressing your comments specifically. There is obviously more to it than that. Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. I'll also throw this chuckle out there. You could see a valid 30.06 and NO 30.07. That means you can unconceal your CC weapon and you will become compliant
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Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. I'll also throw this chuckle out there. You could see a valid 30.06 and NO 30.07. That means you can unconceal your CC weapon and you will become compliant Quoted:
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Universities will be in 2016Junior colleges etc so on will be in 2017 Concealed only Private universities of course can opt out 30.06 will apply ONLY to concealed carry 30.07 will apply ONLY to open carry So in short, it has to be both to bar carry completely and if only one is posted, the other is legal until told otherwise Violating 30.06 or 30.07 is indeed a class c UNLESS said person refuses and then it's class A. It will work the same as concealed unless posted 30.07. Prohibited places are still prohibited. That's addressing your comments specifically. There is obviously more to it than that. Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. I'll also throw this chuckle out there. You could see a valid 30.06 and NO 30.07. That means you can unconceal your CC weapon and you will become compliant What is the change, since there are a lot of places that have these expensive signs up to prohibit concealed carry? |
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What is the change, since there are a lot of places that have these expensive signs up to prohibit concealed carry? Quoted:
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Universities will be in 2016Junior colleges etc so on will be in 2017 Concealed only Private universities of course can opt out 30.06 will apply ONLY to concealed carry 30.07 will apply ONLY to open carry So in short, it has to be both to bar carry completely and if only one is posted, the other is legal until told otherwise Violating 30.06 or 30.07 is indeed a class c UNLESS said person refuses and then it's class A. It will work the same as concealed unless posted 30.07. Prohibited places are still prohibited. That's addressing your comments specifically. There is obviously more to it than that. Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. I'll also throw this chuckle out there. You could see a valid 30.06 and NO 30.07. That means you can unconceal your CC weapon and you will become compliant What is the change, since there are a lot of places that have these expensive signs up to prohibit concealed carry? Changes were due to the handgun license name change: Old 30.06 Sign Wording “Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun” New 30.06 Sign Wording “Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by license holder with a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code ( handgun licensing law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun” |
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This sounds like one of those "you might beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride" things. Quoted:
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Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. This sounds like one of those "you might beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride" things. Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? |
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? Quoted:
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Also remember that 30.06 verbiage changes (ever so slightly). That means current 30.06 will need to be changed to remain valid. This sounds like one of those "you might beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride" things. Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? It should be really bad egg-on-face for any LEO who does something as stupid as arresting for 30.06 and the signs are non-compliant. While it may not be possible to get any meaningful disciplinary action, it should be possible to cause them a great deal of embarrassment by complaints to the appropriate channels. |
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. |
| Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? |
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That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. I get the impression it is very rare. Even though a person could be arrested even if they left after being outed for 30.06, I think that at least some of the time an LEO may decline to arrest if the person who violated 30.06 has already left or to attempt to find someone who has already left. And more than that, I think it would be fairly unlikely for someone who has been outed for violating 30.06 to not attempt to leave on their own accord rather than wait around to be arrested and it would be unusual for the person who owns the premises to try to prevent them from doing so. In other words if people are arrested for violating 30.06, I would guess it is because they were hardheaded enough to stick around and argue about it rather than beat feet. |
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Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? I would think that verbal notice is only good until you leave (although the law does indicate an increased penalty if you are given notice and refuse to leave). I also think that the legal term for "leaving" is the departure past the lease or property line. I would think if you continue to visit (and continually be given proper notice), the remedy for the property owner is to have a Criminal Trespass notice issued to you by LEO. Once that is issued, you WILL be arrested if you violate that CT notice. NOTE: in a past life, I had CT notices issued for individuals that were continually told to leave and continued to return to my location. It had nothing to do with handgun carry. Hopefully TXI will be along to correct me
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Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? Till there is a change in policy I imagine. |
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That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Arrests are not reported to DPS; only convictions. |
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Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? Seriously? It depends on what they tell you. |
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I get the impression it is very rare. Even though a person could be arrested even if they left after being outed for 30.06, I think that at least some of the time an LEO may decline to arrest if the person who violated 30.06 has already left or to attempt to find someone who has already left. And more than that, I think it would be fairly unlikely for someone who has been outed for violating 30.06 to not attempt to leave on their own accord rather than wait around to be arrested and it would be unusual for the person who owns the premises to try to prevent them from doing so. In other words if people are arrested for violating 30.06, I would guess it is because they were hardheaded enough to stick around and argue about it rather than beat feet. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. I get the impression it is very rare. Even though a person could be arrested even if they left after being outed for 30.06, I think that at least some of the time an LEO may decline to arrest if the person who violated 30.06 has already left or to attempt to find someone who has already left. And more than that, I think it would be fairly unlikely for someone who has been outed for violating 30.06 to not attempt to leave on their own accord rather than wait around to be arrested and it would be unusual for the person who owns the premises to try to prevent them from doing so. In other words if people are arrested for violating 30.06, I would guess it is because they were hardheaded enough to stick around and argue about it rather than beat feet. It is a misdemeanor and LEO cannot arrest unless it happens in his presence or view. |
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Arrests are not reported to DPS; only convictions. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Arrests are not reported to DPS; only convictions. DPS doesn't report those (convictions for criminal trespass) either. 
https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/reports/convrates.htm |
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DPS doesn't report those (convictions for criminal trespass) either.
https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/reports/convrates.htm Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Arrests are not reported to DPS; only convictions. DPS doesn't report those (convictions for criminal trespass) either.
https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/reports/convrates.htm Holy Crap. Never noticed that. |
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Quoted: Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? If asked to remove firearm and continue being a patron. Either leave or do as they ask If asked to leave and not come back and no trespass warning. You'd probably be okay to come back eventually. If asked to leave and get issued a trespass warning. Then you'll be arrested if found there again if still there when LE gets there or have a case filed and have to deal with that down the line. I guess if that ever happens and #1 isn't an option and they go with #2 then just ask them. Once upon a time verbally being trespass warned happened, but its changing and actual paper is the norm nowadays. |
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Seriously? It depends on what they tell you. Quoted:
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Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? Seriously? It depends on what they tell you. What do you mean? Do they have to basically quote you the correct verbiage of the law, or can they just say, "Hey you have a gun and you can't have it here." |
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What do you mean? Do they have to basically quote you the correct verbiage of the law, or can they just say, "Hey you have a gun and you can't have it here." Quoted:
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Ok, say you enter a place and they either don't like your open carry, or your carrying concealed. Their signs are either non-existent, or incorrect. Someone with the proper authority comes and tell you, you are not welcome with a firearm. How long is this order to leave, good for? Seriously? It depends on what they tell you. What do you mean? Do they have to basically quote you the correct verbiage of the law, or can they just say, "Hey you have a gun and you can't have it here." The verbiage of the law is irrelevant for verbal notice. If he tells you that since you are a evil gun owner you can never return, then there ya go. If he tells you that they don't want anyone to open carry, then that lasts until he revokes it. If he says hey, for today don't open carry here today, I need to check with the owner tomorrow and see if it is allowed, then the notice lasts until tomorrow. Depends on what the person says to you. ;) |
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That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Some time ago there was a thread about concealed carrying in Grapevine Mills Mall. One (or more) of the anchors was not properly posted, and the question was it would it be OK to cc in the mall if you entered through the not posted anchor's entrance? IIRC, the consensus was no, and the Grapevine PD had (publicly?) stated they indeed would arrest anyone they caught cc-ing. |
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Some time ago there was a thread about concealed carrying in Grapevine Mills Mall. One (or more) of the anchors was not properly posted, and the question was it would it be OK to cc in the mall if you entered through the not posted anchor's entrance? IIRC, the consensus was no, and the Grapevine PD had (publicly?) stated they indeed would arrest anyone they caught cc-ing. Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Some time ago there was a thread about concealed carrying in Grapevine Mills Mall. One (or more) of the anchors was not properly posted, and the question was it would it be OK to cc in the mall if you entered through the not posted anchor's entrance? IIRC, the consensus was no, and the Grapevine PD had (publicly?) stated they indeed would arrest anyone they caught cc-ing. Didn't the law recently change to all entrances must be posted? |
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Didn't the law recently change to all entrances must be posted? I'm not sure. I don't look for loop holes to carry in places where my wallet is not welcomed. I realize the "No Guns" pictures are sometimes put up by clever managers who know they are not proper postings, but were instructed by Corporate to make their establishment a gun free zone. I still avoid these places unless I absolutely have to go there. |
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I'm not sure. I don't look for loop holes to carry in places where my wallet is not welcomed. I realize the "No Guns" pictures are sometimes put up by clever managers who know they are not proper postings, but were instructed by Corporate to make their establishment a gun free zone. I still avoid these places unless I absolutely have to go there. Quoted:
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Didn't the law recently change to all entrances must be posted? I'm not sure. I don't look for loop holes to carry in places where my wallet is not welcomed. I realize the "No Guns" pictures are sometimes put up by clever managers who know they are not proper postings, but were instructed by Corporate to make their establishment a gun free zone. I still avoid these places unless I absolutely have to go there. Same here. I was just curious about the law change. I thought it had to be all entrances now. I just take my money elsewhere. |
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Didn't the law recently change to all entrances must be posted? Quoted:
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Not really. Remember too, that 30.06 penalties are substantially reduced in 2016. 30.06 is also about concealed carry. Even now, how often is someone arrested for 30.06 violation??? That's a great question. It seems DPS doesn't publish those stats on their web site for some reason. Some time ago there was a thread about concealed carrying in Grapevine Mills Mall. One (or more) of the anchors was not properly posted, and the question was it would it be OK to cc in the mall if you entered through the not posted anchor's entrance? IIRC, the consensus was no, and the Grapevine PD had (publicly?) stated they indeed would arrest anyone they caught cc-ing. Didn't the law recently change to all entrances must be posted? No, 30:06 does not change. 30.07 must be posted at every entrance. |