Posted: 4/1/2010 11:27:21 AM EDT
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I am hoping this is the right place for something like this, if not, whoops!
I am looking to take the plunge into reloading. I used to shoot quite often, but with the current prices of 308 and 45, I have started to shoot less and less. I hear reloading does not really save money, it just allows you to shoot more, and that is fine with me. Although I have not bought books on reloading, I have read a lot of resources online and watched a lot of videos on the subject. I would really like to see how it is done first hand before I drop a large amount of money(to me) on the presses and tools. I am in the Lake Jackson/Freeport area(45 minutes south of Pearland, 1 hour south of Houston) and would gladly meet in Pearland or South Houston. To compensate your time, I will buy lunch or bring beer. |
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There is a reloading section here that has a ton of info, get a good manual and read up.
It's not rocket science but you do have to pay attention and follow some simple hard fast rules, you can get started for very little but you can spend alot I chose to drop my cash down and got what I needed and went with a progressive. I don't live in South Houston (North side near Bush Park) but we can go thru some things if you want |
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It saves you half.
I live in Pasadena Deer Park area. Expect to break even with a single stage press inside 1000 rounds with what you are shooting 7mag, 300winmag and match grade .308 is a lot less! This is due to reusing brass. It may be tough to beat surplus, wolf on price. The .45 ACP will throw brass that you then have to find and pickup. That is if he range will let you. A 308 bolt gun will be easy to keep track of the brass. Find a local gun store/reloading shop and buy your kit. |
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Welcome to the wonderful world of reloading.
Go to a shop that carries reloading equipment. Look at the equipment that comes in kit form because it will have basicly all of the important tools you will need. Once you get a kit you can add/upgrade as you gain reloading experence. Most of the savings comes in repition. Reloading the same brass that you buy new. One box of 20 can be reloaded(depending on how hot you load) up to 10 or more times. Just monitor your brass condition. Also by reoading you can get the most performance from your fire arms by tailoring the load to the gun. Most importantly remember 1. reload the rounds following the load books. 2. do not start the load with a max amount of powder for the load you are working on. I like starting in the middle of the range of the minimum and maximum for a powder ie- if the starting point is 10 grains and the max is 20 grains, I start at 15 grains and adjust up or down as to how the gun performs and how the brass looks(pressure signs). 3. be careful and do not allow distractions while loading. Double check all loads twice for safety. Have fun. |
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This was posted on GD in one of ol'painless' posts.
http://www.missouribullet.com/results.php?category=5&secondary=13 I just ordered some 38's and 45's. Supposedly good stuff, but I haven't shot any of it. I'm not picky though. Cheaper than Midway or Midsouth or even my local source. Still trying to find a decent source on once fired brass. New brass is like  .
Oh, and this is an instance where a revolver beats and auto, ... saving your brass. |
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Quoted:
... I just ordered some 38's and 45's. Supposedly good stuff, but I haven't shot any of it. I'm not picky though. Cheaper than Midway or Midsouth or even my local source. Still trying to find a decent source on once fired brass. New brass is like .
... brassworldeshop.com |
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Thank you for your responses!
I have been told I need to stop looking and just jump into it. I have bee researching for the past month trying to figure out what I want to do. I know I am going to want to go progressive, but I have been told(and have read) that starting out with a progressive is a big no-no. So the general consensus is to start with a single stage press. I would go look at different presses and equipment, but I do not have any stores around me that carry anything like that (to my knowledge) so all of what I have seen are pictures and videos. Hence my reasons for wanting to see for myself. |
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The conventional wisdom has been to start on a single stage press since it is simpler and you do every stage one at a time.
Since you do realize the need for a progressive I would start with a progressive. You can still do one stage at a time, or follow a single case through each stage until you get comfortable with what you are doing. Since you want to load rifle and pistol I would recommend a Dillon 550b. It's quick and easy to change calibers- just buy a spare tool head, powder measure, dies and caliber conversion and a stand. You leave each caliber completely setup. No matter what some people here say, blue Koolade tastes best! |
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I have an rcbs rockchucker and a Dillon 650.
If you want to go progressive I would add it at a later date. Right now KISS. I still use my single stage for half my reloading. You have to get the feel down. What does it feel like to resize a case? What if you over, under lube or your primer punch bumps the case and CRUNCH you bend it? How about feeling those primers seat? Get a loose primer pocket and you can feel it on a single stage press. Besides single stage presses are cool in a zen sort of way. Progressives are all about production. |
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You will end up with more than one press, so get what you can afford and get started.
I have a Dillon 550B, a Dillon Square Deal B, an RCBS Rockchucker and an old Lyman turret press. This allows me to keep the calibers I load most setup and gives me options on loading. I use the SDB exclusively for .45acp. If I want to load a different pistol caliber I will just get another SDB. I am planning that for .30 carbine. The 550B is very versatile. I have it setup for .223 and may use it for .308. Right now I use the 'chucker for .308 and am setting up the turret for 6.5x55 and 7.5x55- I can leave the dies for both on the press. You can use a progressive like a single stage. Just resize each case one at a time and don't go to the next step. Or resize a case, then drop powder, then seat a bullet then crimp- all on a single round. When you get used to it run it like it's made to run. The 550B is a progressive but doesn't have auto-indexing. That makes it simpler to check each step. Jim |
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Quoted:
Thank you for your responses! I know I am going to want to go progressive, but I have been told(and have read) that starting out with a progressive is a big no-no. So the general consensus is to start with a single stage press. 1. Do not waste your time or money on a single stage, unless you have the IQ of a turd. Reloading IS NOT rocket science. 2. If you plan to do any type of volume shooting at all, don't buy a single stage. 3. Anyone who tells you to get a single stage hates you. If you hate yourself and want to waste time, energy and money with little volume success, then get yourself a single stage press. 4. Buy a progressive. Buy a Dillon. See here 5. Ignore anyone who says buy a single stage. When I first started reloading I bought a single stage and a Lee Pro 1000 progressive. The single stage was for a .270. I loaded 100 rounds. It took hours. I still have about 5 of those .270 rounds left 20+ years later. I will never use a single stage unless I absolutely have to. I wore out two Lee Pro 1000's on mostly 9mm. Then I bought the Dillons. Have two of them. One for rifle (or large primer) and one for pistol/small primer. My kids can reload and they aren't even 10 years old. That's how simple reloading is. It is not rocket science. Follow simple rules, and your fine. If you can set the clock on your VCR or DVD, you can easily operate a progressive press. A single stage will get you 100 rounds in several hours. A progressive can easily crank out hundreds (500-1000+) rounds per hour. Get a progressive. |
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getting a single stage press vs. a progressive press is the diffrence between buying a Cessna 172 & a King Air 200; how fast do
you want to get somewhere? Which one can you afford? Alot of guys (ok, sure most of us ARE older- but that don't make us TURDS) enjoy reloading as a hobby, not just to crank out ammo; the time [spent reloading] vs. money {buyng equipment to reload} equation must be factored in as to how much you really need. with either system, there is a learning curve & like ANY mechanical device there are more parts to maintain & adjust with a progressive setup. I know alot of guys use diffrent shellplates ect.,,, but the point is (with reloading) if you're just going to shoot 50 rounds of pistol & 20 rounds of rifle a month & don't want to get caught in the ammo shortage again, you can stockpile components for less than 1/2 the price of factory ammo, and with the .308 you can develop a load that shoots best for you're gun. One thing nobody mentioned is that case pre witll be more than 1/2 the work involved in rifle reloading; cases stretch & must be trimmed to work (espically in semi-auto guns)- pistol cases are easier since most aren't bottleneck & don't need trimming. the big question is how much are you really going to shoot? Buying a $500 press to use it only once every few months seems like a bad deal, unless you're time is so tight that you just have to bang out 1000 rounds right now. I'd love to have a progressive press, but I don't have the money; I choose to trade the extra $$$ that press would cost to fed the other calibers I reload for. YMMV |
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I've got a rockchucker. It's nice, but it is slow.
I did buy a Lee handpress. http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000690179 It's pretty cheaply made and it does work. I like to sit on the couch and deprime/resize 357 brass with it, saves some swapping with the big press too. Never used it to do a whole cartridge, but should work ok on small stuff. I wouldn't want to try to load match grade precision anything on it, but it works. I simply point it out as something cheap that works before you drop some $ on something else. But yeah, get with the guys in your area, learn, use their equipment if they'll let you. |
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I've got a rockchucker. It's nice, but it is slow. I did buy a Lee handpress. http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000690179 It's pretty cheaply made and it does work. I like to sit on the couch and deprime/resize 357 brass with it, saves some swapping with the big press too. Never used it to do a whole cartridge, but should work ok on small stuff. I wouldn't want to try to load match grade precision anything on it, but it works. I simply point it out as something cheap that works before you drop some $ on something else. But yeah, get with the guys in your area, learn, use their equipment if they'll let you. yep. The lee handy press is a neat little deal. Like you say it's an infront of the tv press for things like to decap, neck size and bell case mouths. Like most lee products it works well for non-match grade stuff. Great for 357, 44 when you need 50 rounds and don't want to set up a big press. |
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Wow, lots of good information for me. I have noticed when looking through pictures of reloading setups, that a large amount of people have multiple presses, and I can see the reason. I am not sure of I am a bulk shooter. I try to go to the range about twice a month, and when I go, I normally shoot a couple of hundred rounds. Thank for the invitation to the Houston Crew, 1191lotsip. It would greatly depend on what time they are held, and where they are at. My Tuesday nights are normally packed at the later hours. |
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If you want to load for the best accuracy, the progressives are not the best. They dump powder by volume, and for precision loads, you really have no choice but to throw charges one at a time and weigh them to the nearest 0.1 grains of powder. I shoot for tight groups, so my loads take time. If you're a plinker, you don't care as much about groups, so progressives are probably a better choice for volume shooting.
Also, brass prep on rifle loads is 90% of the time. A single stage won't save you any time, but the charging and pressing is a small amount of the time involved in the overall scheme of things if you meticulously prep your brass to achieve ultimate accuracy. For pistols - a progressive is absolutely the way to go. No doubts there. |
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Alot of guys (ok, sure most of us ARE older- but that don't make us TURDS) enjoy reloading as a hobby, not just to crank out ammo; Check your reading comprehension. I didn't say you or any single stage reloader was a turd, only if one had an IQ of a turd then one shouldn't get a progressive. Progressive loaders are not hard to use, by any stretch of the imagination. They are easy. Quoted:
If you want to load for the best accuracy, the progressives are not the best. They dump powder by volume, and for precision loads, you really have no choice but to throw charges one at a time and weigh them to the nearest 0.1 grains of powder. Based on what? Hearsay? Got a definitive article that proves this? This is wrong and an old wives (reloaders) tale. Progressive loaders are just as accurate and consistent in throwing powder as a single stage.....if you buy a good progressive. Even cheap ones like Lee are consistent. When I first got into reloading years ago, I believed this misconception also. On the progressive Lee Pro 1000 that I used, it had disks that tossed a measured load. Never after testing hundreds of loads did it go more than .1 grain in weight difference. The Dillons' that I own now never toss +/- .1 grain of powder per charge. After 20+ years of reloading, the last thing I worry about is if my charge is consistent. Yes, I still check (weigh) a load every now and then, and it never fails. Its always right where it is supposed to be. This same logic is also used as not mixing cartridge head stamps when reloading because you will get poor results in accuracy. Dillon did a huge write up on this years ago. Now if you are a world class or want to be world class shooter, then yes, extreme micro managing your components MAY give you an edge. (At that level, a lot more things to consider than just case brand). For the everyday garage reloader, this will never be the case, will never cause you to miss your trophy animal, or not hit the X in the bulls-eye, if you and your gun do your part. OP, buy a progressive. I guarantee you will regret down the road having WASTED money on a single stage press. Save that wasted single stage press money for more components. For your .45 I'd recommend the Lee Pro 1000 if your on a tight budget. Keep it in one caliber. You will crank out a shit ton of ammo, and huge savings. Less than $160!!! The downside to the Lee Pro 1000 is changing to rifle calibers. It just can't do them very well, and they will wear out. I've worn two out chambered in 9mm. I'd buy a third because the cost vs. volume can't be touched even by the Dillon. The Dillon will last forever. I haven't worn one out.....yet. If you want both rifle and pistol. Get the Dillon, hands down. |
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Progressives are great but be careful because I have had misses with my Hornady where it didn't charge powder. I don't think you'll have this problem with Dillon.
Single stage are great if you are tight on money and don't shoot that much. The single stage is also good if you are building custom loads and/or like mobility. I've taken my single stage to the range, built up a custom load that I like, and then plug it into the progressive. Don't be surprised in spending $1k+ for a good reloading kit (press/tumbler/scale/case prep). |
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I wanted to add that the accuracy of a powder measure depends more on what powder you are using than what you use to measure it.
If you use an extruded powder then you might have some variation. Ball type poewders measure very well. For instance, I use WST for .45acp in my Dillon SDB. It has never varied .1 of a grain. Ever. That is after many thousands of rounds. There are powders for rifle that are as easy to throw a charge. The short extruded and ball powders meter accurately. Also a .1 gr variation in a pistol load- which may only be 4.5gr, is a large percentage variation. On a rifle charge of around 42gr that .1 or .2gr variation won't make enough difference to worry about unless you are shooting at 1000 yards. Jim |
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Thank you for your responses! I know I am going to want to go progressive, but I have been told(and have read) that starting out with a progressive is a big no-no. So the general consensus is to start with a single stage press. 1. Do not waste your time or money on a single stage, unless you have the IQ of a turd. Reloading IS NOT rocket science. 2. If you plan to do any type of volume shooting at all, don't buy a single stage. 3. Anyone who tells you to get a single stage hates you. If you hate yourself and want to waste time, energy and money with little volume success, then get yourself a single stage press. 4. Buy a progressive. Buy a Dillon. See here 5. Ignore anyone who says buy a single stage. When I first started reloading I bought a single stage and a Lee Pro 1000 progressive. The single stage was for a .270. I loaded 100 rounds. It took hours. I still have about 5 of those .270 rounds left 20+ years later. I will never use a single stage unless I absolutely have to. I wore out two Lee Pro 1000's on mostly 9mm. Then I bought the Dillons. Have two of them. One for rifle (or large primer) and one for pistol/small primer. My kids can reload and they aren't even 10 years old. That's how simple reloading is. It is not rocket science. Follow simple rules, and your fine. If you can set the clock on your VCR or DVD, you can easily operate a progressive press. A single stage will get you 100 rounds in several hours. A progressive can easily crank out hundreds (500-1000+) rounds per hour. Get a progressive. +1 If you shoot an average of 400 rounds per month as you stated in a previous post, don't even think about getting a single stage press. A single stage press will take you literally hours and hours to load 400 rounds, you can load the same 400 rounds in about an hour or less on a good Dillon. AND, if anything ever breaks or doesn't work right on the Dillon, they will fix the problem for FREE for the REST OF YOUR LIFE!! Best warranty in the business. Buy once, cry once. |
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Quote: I hear reloading does not really save money, it just allows you to shoot more, If it doesn't cost less, how can you shoot more? Availability? This quote refers to the fact that most guys who reload still spend the same amount of money on components they spent on factory ammo before they started reloading. But this same money goes much further and allows them to make a lot more ammo for the same price. More ammo = more shooting. Hope this helps. |
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Quote: I hear reloading does not really save money, it just allows you to shoot more, If it doesn't cost less, how can you shoot more? Availability? This quote refers to the fact that most guys who reload still spend the same amount of money on components they spent on factory ammo before they started reloading. But this same money goes much further and allows them to make a lot more ammo for the same price. More ammo = more shooting. Hope this helps. Whut? |
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Whut? You can shoot more for the same amount. Example. Factory Loaded Speer Gold Dot 115 9mm cost 24.99 for 20 rounds. You can buy the same Bullets (100 for $17.83) and roll your own. So by the time you buy 100 primers and powder to load 100 cases it will cost you around $20-$25 for 100 rounds vs. $25 for 20 rounds. So you spend the same, you just shoot more. Throw in ball or lead bullets and your savings are even more dramatic. |
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Whut? You can shoot more for the same amount. Example. Factory Loaded Speer Gold Dot 115 9mm cost 24.99 for 20 rounds. You can buy the same Bullets (100 for $17.83) and roll your own. So by the time you buy 100 primers and powder to load 100 cases it will cost you around $20-$25 for 100 rounds vs. $25 for 20 rounds. So you spend the same, you just shoot more. Throw in ball or lead bullets and your savings are even more dramatic. I guess I was too literal concerning the OP. I reload, and know it can save money. I'm guessing it was just the way he phrased his statement. It seemed contradictory to me. |
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I got into reloading for one simple reason. Availability of the load I wanted. I want to shoot stuff other than what is on the market. One Christmas I could not get the one load my Rem 700 BDL .30-06 shoots well, and everything else is all over the paper. It's a finnicky rifle, but it's my Dad's from the late 60's/early 70's so I shoot it with pride. The hunting ammo that I wanted was simply not available. I now can make up the 40 or so rounds I want, and I've tuned them over time to be even better in this picky rifle. I use a Lee Breech Lock single stage press because I can only get time to do a single point or two of the reload process at one time, and I didn't want to reload pistol ammo for volume. The breech lock lets me set the dies, and swap in and out without any/many changes or adjustments. I have a checklist, and several plastic coffee cans of various stages of the process for the brass. Now I'm still using a single stage, and building combinations that are not available in the market. My favorite is a 70 grain Speer soft point in a .223. Yes, a single stage is slow, but I also measure and trickle every charge, measure every case, feel the sizing process and bullet seating and crimp. It all depends on what you want to do. If you want volume, then a progressive is faster. If the purpose is something else, then it's your judge. There is only one wrong answer in reloading...not being careful and attentive. |