[ARCHIVED THREAD] - LBR calibre (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 10/31/2007 5:12:34 AM EDT
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Any advice on whether a .38/.357 or .45ACP Taurus is preferable to the other? I'm attracted to the .45ACP as it's one of my favourite cartridges and it seems to me that reloading should be v quick using the full-moon clips, but the .357 appears to be much more popular and I'm wondering why... Cheers 
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Caliber choice isnt that critical with LBR's IMO Are the frame sizes the same for both ? The .44 mag version is definately large frame .38 is probably more popular purely based on previous familiarity with this caliber in the old pistol days. There weren't that many .45acp revolvers around way back when. I remember when S&W brought out a ltd edition revolver in .45acp for bowling pin comps. I've got an LBR in .38. The .38 is a 7 shot, whilst the .45acp is a 6 shot. I've got a couple of 7 shot speedloaders for it, although I imagine moon clips may be quicker ? (The .30 carbine version is a 10 shot IIRC and gets hot real quick ?) |
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Mines a .357 but I mostly use .38's Ammunition is cheaper and more easily available in .38 or .357 if you don't reload and components are easier to get if you do. I suppose .357 would have more legs if you wanted to scope it and shoot at distance. I'd certainly choose that calibre again and certainly over .45ACP, jetloaders are quicker than moon clips  I would look at .44 Mag though that offers similar benefits Richard |
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Good point on the frame size, it may well be larger. I note that on one website advertising them it is only the 45ACP and 44 Mag revolvers that are at a higher price, which would perhaps indicate they are bigger. Probably makes the 38 favourite, as I've hefted one of those and it definitely felt nice, whereas a larger frame would mean a step into the unknown :) |
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I have both a 357/38 and a 45ACP LBR. They both work realy well it all depends on what disciplines you are going to be shooting. I.E. the 357 when loaded with 38spl (158g rn over 3.7g vit n320 with a federal 100 small pistol primer)is a very accurate revolver and if you can remember back to the good old days if you were shooting PPC competitions you needed a PPC built on a S&W K frame. The Taurus is built on what would be classed as a K frame. You can buy competition holsters for it I.E. the safariland 002 which is clamshell holster, so you will not be hindered when you draw. The Taurus 45ACP is built on an N frame equivalent I.E. the same frame size as a S&W mod 29 44 magnum or the S&W mod 25 45ACP. There are no dedicated competition holsters for the 45 taurus they can be made to fit into the safariland but the draw becomes very hard to perform quickly. The 45ACP is a good chioce if you are doing a lot of pin shooing (I used to have a S&W mod 25 just for this type of competition) IMHO the best gun to go with is the 357/38 but stick to 38spl in it. Remember if you shoot a lot of 38 lead rounds through it to clean it before hooting 357 as you may damage the forcing cone. These guns are not made out of the best metal and we have seen 2 of them let go due to bad homeloading. They can be rebarrelled but its a costly and time consuming task due to USA state dept laws. The triggers on the most recent guns can be adjusted for weight but they are no way as near as good as a S&W. I have modified the triggers on my earlier model guns using a wolf spring kit. I am in the process of adding a plunger style trigger stop to get the best from the revolver. Dave |
The .30 carbine is an 8 shot, which gives it the advantage on field courses. Although it is a very pokey load for a revolver. I went for a .357 Taurus simply because i likes the size and weight of it. Go to a local shop, and have a feel of them, and get the one which you like best is my advice, because there is quite a big size/weight difference between the medium frame (.357) and the large frame (.44/.45/.30). The moon clips are supposedly quicker than a speedloader, but not by much. And if you really want to use moon clips, the cylinders on the .357's can be machined to take them. There is a price difference (~£600 for the medium and ~£635 for the large) but its only small, so shouldn't be an important factor. If you want a .45ACP, we have a few in stock. |
Mine came with two jet loaders which have to be quicker than moon clips? Is this still the case? Rich |
If you're gonna tout for business, the least you can do is pony up for a team membership. This whole advertising in the HTF's is under review, and we in the UK get a certain amount of slack, but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves. OK? Bollocking over |
If I'm thinking of the same chap he put a round up the barrel behind a light loaded round already jammed.... Barrel blew under the top rib...  ETA: Hey Dave.... Didn't you get the full moon clips surface planed to avoid chamber alterations on the .45? |
Fingers intact then 
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M e touting for buisness!!! Look whos talking! |
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I have the .45acp version. It has been machined to take the more popular thickness moonclips instead of the thin ones you get with the gun. I also use a Safariland 002 holster with CCW SS moon clip holders, this set up works well. If you intend to shoot practical pistol with it, don't forget that .38sp is classed as minor and scores lower points for C & D hits on the target. I also think that you have to reload after 6 rounds even though the gun (.38/.357) holds 7. If you want to use the full 7, I think this will bump you into 'open' div. I am running a UKPSA sanctioned practical pistol match for LBRs and LBfs on Sunday Feb 10th 2008 at Leicester Shooting Centre. 12 stages/154 rnds minimum. You will need to be a member of the UKPSA and hold a competition license to enter. |
No we are just making sure no one else dies on their arse.his Jim |
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Back to the original question 38 or 45. If 38, for steel plate matches additional round useful. Must be moon clipped if you plan on doing practical,so much faster than speed loaders. The moon clipped 45 is quicker to reload than the 38, getting 6 big ones in six big holes is eaasier than 7 into seven , plus the thicker 45 clips hold the rounds without any wobble which you tend to get with the 38. Just my 2p jim |
You may think so Jim, but from the outside looking in it appears very different. Why all of a sudden is the UKPSA holding LBR practical pistol comps? I remember when they first tried to introduce them and the old guard weren't interested because they weren't semi-auto's. Is it because they've shot themselves in the foot?? There are 2 main UKPSA guidlines 1) Make it as difficult as possible for the outsider to join and partake. These are 2 day safety courses and "competition licenses" 2) If the applicant has circumnavigated the above and get's to shoot competitively, attempt to disqualify him, and everyone else if possible at every conceiveable opportunity. But they will never change, so never mind ETA: you can't even enter their website because it's so secretive |
+1 The UKPSA are a complete waste of time, they have a set of rules which they reckon are the best safety rules going, what a crock of shit. Its just a money spinning execise. We attended a PSG shoot run by them and they DQ'd someone as he was seen to muzzle sweep someone with his gun while in its gunbag, and this was after his gun was cleared, unloaded twice and the action fired off the requsite number of times and all that bollox that goes with the UKPSA daft practices. I ask you muzzle swept with a gun bag. Oh how dangerous. Or like "opening gun bag" "removing gun" "action open" "safety on" and thats just to take a piss UKPSA = TOSSERS 
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The UKPSA isn't holding the LBR comp, Leicester Shooting Centre is. The UKPSA is just a governing body and part of IPSC. I don't think it is difficult to join, just fill out an application form, and pay the membership fee and you're in. The safety course and comp license are all done in the name of safety and are a good thing in my opinion. We have a very good safety record in the sport and wish to keep it. I was the first to run a UKPSA LBR sanctioned match and this is the 3rd one we've run at LSC. The LBR/LBF is the closest we can get to the 'old days' and stay on the legal side so until we get handguns back into section 1, lets encourage the use of what we have got. |
You might think so Chambo mate, but that's because you've been indoctrinated
So do all the clubs and association that I know of or belong to and none of these require the said Comp license to take part. It's totally unnecessary |
Then why are people not allowed to enter 'Off the Street'? Even the NRA has wised up to that one with the SG events! You are employing restrictive methods even the gov would be proud of. It's not as if you need them to be 'internationally licensed' in this case, is it? We as shooters and organisations should be finding ways of getting as many people shooting as possible, not taking extra money of them for 'courses' and restricting entry to events and competitions. |
Thats twice I agree with you
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I would have to agree that the competition license is a very important part of practical shooting. The UKPSA may seem secretive from the outside, but they are merely doing what is necessary to ensure safety of our sport. Any shooters are always welcome to compete, and the required safety course is something that will be useful to all shooters. Such a strict set of rules makes practical shooting one of the safest forms of shooting there is, due to the elimination of all the unsafe gun handling and bad habits. Yes, you may be pissed of if you get DQ'd from a competition, but it is always your own fault! (I have been shooting the national circuit for about 4 years now, and i have managed to go without a DQ (touch wood) yet)If you follow the rules, you will have a nice day out shooting. There are so many do-gooders out there who would like to ban shooting, and if there is any more restrictive legislation imposed upon us, then the first thing to go would be practical shooting, so we cannot afford to give them any ammunition to use against us. Jim |
You've been brain-washed as well. I've seen it all before. I was a UKPSA member and have passed the safety courses for pistol and PSG so I feel I am in a position to criticise where necessary. I've also seen so many walk away from them for the exact same reasons. All this "we're safer than the others" bollox was to protect themselves at the expense of other disciplines. All shooting sports are safe when properly regulated. I've never seen an unsafe one. I've never known anyone to get hurt in SR, PR, Highpower, F-Class or whatever. It's nothing more than self-important, self-righteous crap. And I fail to understand why you all can't see it
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Isn't that like plastic toy pistols with plastic toy bullets? I'm sure you have a lovely time but its not for me Richard |
The problem I have with this is that say someone in authority (or health and saftey, god forbid) sees this and thinks 'if they are happy just shooting little plastic balls why do they need to use real guns'! Then they start looking at other forms of shooting and thinking why can't they use airsoft, it'll make things alot safer! Maybe I'm being a little bit pesamistic but there are enough people out there trying to remove our guns without this sort of thing. |
Don't let me get started on that one  I know people that shoot all that airsoft bollocks that might as well burn their FAC's |
No, they see it as by continuing shooting practical pistol, albeit with realistic toys, it appears to IPSC that al te criteria can be fulfilled with the added benefit that some of the luckier ones who have pistols lodged abroad can go and shoot overseas matches, which is OK, but also some of the hierarchy can go on a good old jolly up at the same time. But.....as I'm not a UKPSA member anymore, it's none of my business. Getting back to your original question, the UKPSA have always looked out for themselves first and foremost |
Yes, you're right. An element of UKPSA members who were sick and tired of the enforced implementation of safety courses etc decided they'd has enough and broke away. Splitters  You see, when the interested and enthusiastic prospective member is confronted with the fact that although it looks like fun but they can't take part until they have undergone 14 hours over 2 days to be deemed safe enough, it seems like too much effort, and therefore they lose prospective newcomers. They don't get it |
I agree. My club had a shoot last weekend down at Lydd. We had a guy turn up who was interested in joining. He had a go on one of the club guns and I gave him 20 rounds of RG which he used in my AR. The whole time he was monitored by the RCO and also by me when using the AR. At no time was our saftey compromised and if anyone had felt him unsafe he'd have been removed from the firing line. He really enjoyed himself and will be coming back. That's what it's all about. |
Surely not? That made me and then
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I am reassured of the good spirit between shooting sports by the balanced argument "UKPSA are tossers". We will probably have to agree to differ. |
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Quoted: The course is necessary to ensure that safety skills can be proven before a competition, and monitored at events. For the reasons outlined above.Competition licences also allow shooters to participate in IPSC competitions abroad, if you do not want to shoot IPSC style matches you do not have to. Shooters who prefer these type of matches do not slag off other shooting disciplines and in fact participate in both. [/quote Would they participate in both if they had to do the "basic safety courses" for the other disciplines? Me thinks not. At Rio Salado in Phoenix, where they shoot the IPSC Desert Classic, amongst others, they have practical steel move & shoot matches every tuesday night. Anyone can turn up and shoot. If they haven't been before, they are required to take a 30 minute class. That's all. None of this 2 day assessment nonsense |