Posted: 5/20/2012 5:54:04 PM EDT
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If a person from Illinois obtains a Utah permit and carries a weapon in Iowa, are they bound by both Utah's laws, or just Iowa's?
Iowa's permit to carry weapons is less restrictive than Utah's permit to carry concealed firearms. |
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Insert standard "I am not a lawyer" disclaimer here.
Two things I thought of... First, maybe I am remembering things out of the blue, but for your out of state permit to be valid in Iowa, don't you have to be a resident of the state in which it was issued? Ie., an Illinois resident would have to have the mythical "Illinois Permit to Carry Weapons" and would not be covered with a Utah permit. Again, maybe I am remembering things that aren't there. Second, assuming the permit would be valid, although something you do may be legal in Iowa, I would still make sure I didn't violate any sort of restriction that the Utah permit may have. For instance, and I DO NOT know the specifics of the Utah permits, but in Iowa if you are carrying and have a beer and do not go over the 0.08% level, you are within the law. But, if the Utah permits are not valid while consuming alcohol, you might set yourself up to lose the permit if somehow Utah officials found out. Not that they ever would, but since they are trying to help people out by issuing their permits pretty easily, I would damn sure try to make sure I didn't take advantage of that. Just something to think about. Now, go forth and bare arms! |
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Insert standard "I am not a lawyer" disclaimer here. Two things I thought of... First, maybe I am remembering things out of the blue, but for your out of state permit to be valid in Iowa, don't you have to be a resident of the state in which it was issued? Ie., an Illinois resident would have to have the mythical "Illinois Permit to Carry Weapons" and would not be covered with a Utah permit. Again, maybe I am remembering things that aren't there. Second, assuming the permit would be valid, although something you do may be legal in Iowa, I would still make sure I didn't violate any sort of restriction that the Utah permit may have. For instance, and I DO NOT know the specifics of the Utah permits, but in Iowa if you are carrying and have a beer and do not go over the 0.08% level, you are within the law. But, if the Utah permits are not valid while consuming alcohol, you might set yourself up to lose the permit if somehow Utah officials found out. Not that they ever would, but since they are trying to help people out by issuing their permits pretty easily, I would damn sure try to make sure I didn't take advantage of that. Just something to think about. Now, go forth and bare arms! Utah and Florida both issue permits to non-residents. So my parents who live in Illinois can obtain a Utah permit. (they just sent in their permit application today) While this permit currently does them no good in Illinois, it makes them legal to carry in several states, including Iowa. Local talk radio show on the IA/IL border was discussing this. It seems there are a ton of people in Illinois who have Utah and/or Florida permits. They were taking a poke at IL for the loss of revenue of all the people buying their permits out-of-state. Your comment regarding differences between IA and UT and alcohol while carrying is a great example of my line of thought. My dad asked me the question: if he is carrying in Iowa with a Utah permit, and inadvertently exposes the handgun (not illegal by itself in Iowa), is he breaking any law since that is not allowed in Utah? The more I thought about it, I wasn't sure of the answer. I'm trying to think of examples both ways. I assume Septic knows what he is talking about. |
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Iowa honors ALL permits, nothing about being a resident. My Utah permit doesn't have any restrictions on it and I don't see a space for any either. Restrictions would likely be written into their state's laws. There are plenty of restrictions on Iowa's permits, but they aren't spelled out on the permit itself. |
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iowa honors all permits in all circumstances, with one exception... you can't be an iowa resident and not obtain an iowa non professional permit and still be legal... so enjoy your FL or UT permit if you like but if you plan on packing in iowa, you'd better have an iowa permit as an iowa resident.
some illinois dude using a FL non resident permit is good to go in iowa. he has a legal permit from another state. done. |
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Insert standard "I am not a lawyer" disclaimer here. Two things I thought of... First, maybe I am remembering things out of the blue, but for your out of state permit to be valid in Iowa, don't you have to be a resident of the state in which it was issued? Ie., an Illinois resident would have to have the mythical "Illinois Permit to Carry Weapons" and would not be covered with a Utah permit. Again, maybe I am remembering things that aren't there. Second, assuming the permit would be valid, although something you do may be legal in Iowa, I would still make sure I didn't violate any sort of restriction that the Utah permit may have. For instance, and I DO NOT know the specifics of the Utah permits, but in Iowa if you are carrying and have a beer and do not go over the 0.08% level, you are within the law. But, if the Utah permits are not valid while consuming alcohol, you might set yourself up to lose the permit if somehow Utah officials found out. Not that they ever would, but since they are trying to help people out by issuing their permits pretty easily, I would damn sure try to make sure I didn't take advantage of that. Just something to think about. Now, go forth and bare arms! greg, you're making this too hard. take all the shit you just typed and forget you typed it. you're welcome. |
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Iowa Code says this:
724.11A Recognition. A valid permit or license issued by another state to any nonresident of this state shall be considered to be a valid permit or license to carry weapons issued pursuant to this chapter, except that such permit or license shall not be considered to be a substitute for an annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers issued pursuant to section 724.15. 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §10, 19 Section 724.15 goes on to say: 724.15 Annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers. 1. Any person who desires to acquire ownership of any pistol or revolver shall first obtain an annual permit. An annual permit shall be issued upon request to any resident of this state unless the person is subject to any of the following: a. Is less than twenty-one years of age. b. Is subject to the provisions of section 724.26. c. Is prohibited by federal law from shipping, transporting, possessing, or receiving a firearm. 2. Any person who acquires ownership of a pistol or revolver shall not be required to obtain an annual permit if any of the following apply: a. The person transferring the pistol or revolver and the person acquiring the pistol or revolver are licensed firearms dealers under federal law. b. The pistol or revolver acquired is an antique firearm, a collector's item, a device which is not designed or redesigned for use as a weapon, a device which is designed solely for use as a signaling, pyrotechnic, line-throwing, safety, or similar device, or a firearm which is unserviceable by reason of being unable to discharge a shot by means of an explosive and is incapable of being readily restored to a firing condition. c. The person acquiring the pistol or revolver is authorized to do so on behalf of a law enforcement agency. d. The person has obtained a valid permit to carry weapons, as provided in section 724.11. e. The person transferring the pistol or revolver and the person acquiring the pistol or revolver are related to one another within the second degree of consanguinity or affinity unless the person transferring the pistol or revolver knows that the person acquiring the pistol or revolver would be disqualified from obtaining a permit. 3. The annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers shall authorize the permit holder to acquire one or more pistols or revolvers during the period that the permit remains valid. If the issuing officer determines that the applicant has become disqualified under the provisions of subsection 1, the issuing officer may immediately revoke the permit and shall provide a written statement of the reasons for revocation, and the applicant shall have the right to appeal the revocation as provided in section 724.21A. 4. An issuing officer who finds that a person issued a permit to acquire pistols or revolvers under this chapter has been arrested for a disqualifying offense or who is the subject of proceedings that could lead to the person's ineligibility for such permit may immediately suspend such permit. An issuing officer proceeding under this subsection shall immediately notify the permit holder of the suspension by personal service or certified mail on a form prescribed and published by the commissioner of public safety and the suspension shall become effective upon the permit holder's receipt of such notice. If the suspension is based on an arrest or a proceeding that does not result in a disqualifying conviction or finding against the permit holder, the issuing officer shall immediately reinstate the permit upon receipt of proof of the matter's final disposition. If the arrest leads to a disqualifying conviction or the proceedings to a disqualifying finding, the issuing officer shall revoke the permit. The issuing officer may also revoke the permit of a person whom the issuing officer later finds was not qualified for such a permit at the time of issuance or who the officer finds provided materially false information on the permit application. A person aggrieved by a suspension or revocation under this subsection may seek review of the decision pursuant to section 724.21A. [C79, 81, §724.15] 90 Acts, ch 1147, §2, 3; 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §12, 19 For transition provisions relating to permits issued under this chapter prior to January 1, 2011, see 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §18 there you go |
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Insert standard "I am not a lawyer" disclaimer here. Two things I thought of... First, maybe I am remembering things out of the blue, but for your out of state permit to be valid in Iowa, don't you have to be a resident of the state in which it was issued? Ie., an Illinois resident would have to have the mythical "Illinois Permit to Carry Weapons" and would not be covered with a Utah permit. Again, maybe I am remembering things that aren't there. Second, assuming the permit would be valid, although something you do may be legal in Iowa, I would still make sure I didn't violate any sort of restriction that the Utah permit may have. For instance, and I DO NOT know the specifics of the Utah permits, but in Iowa if you are carrying and have a beer and do not go over the 0.08% level, you are within the law. But, if the Utah permits are not valid while consuming alcohol, you might set yourself up to lose the permit if somehow Utah officials found out. Not that they ever would, but since they are trying to help people out by issuing their permits pretty easily, I would damn sure try to make sure I didn't take advantage of that. Just something to think about. Now, go forth and bare arms! greg, you're making this too hard. take all the shit you just typed and forget you typed it. you're welcome. Don't make me make BobRoberts and Crew kick your ass there, Mr Hayden. 
He says he's just waiting for someone to run the video camera and he's gonna do it as it is. |
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Iowa Code says this: 724.11A Recognition. A valid permit or license issued by another state to any nonresident of this state shall be considered to be a valid permit or license to carry weapons issued pursuant to this chapter, except that such permit or license shall not be considered to be a substitute for an annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers issued pursuant to section 724.15. 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §10, 19 Section 724.15 goes on to say: 724.15 Annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers. 1. Any person who desires to acquire ownership of any pistol or revolver shall first obtain an annual permit. An annual permit shall be issued upon request to any resident of this state unless the person is subject to any of the following: a. Is less than twenty-one years of age. b. Is subject to the provisions of section 724.26. c. Is prohibited by federal law from shipping, transporting, possessing, or receiving a firearm. 2. Any person who acquires ownership of a pistol or revolver shall not be required to obtain an annual permit if any of the following apply: a. The person transferring the pistol or revolver and the person acquiring the pistol or revolver are licensed firearms dealers under federal law. b. The pistol or revolver acquired is an antique firearm, a collector's item, a device which is not designed or redesigned for use as a weapon, a device which is designed solely for use as a signaling, pyrotechnic, line-throwing, safety, or similar device, or a firearm which is unserviceable by reason of being unable to discharge a shot by means of an explosive and is incapable of being readily restored to a firing condition. c. The person acquiring the pistol or revolver is authorized to do so on behalf of a law enforcement agency. d. The person has obtained a valid permit to carry weapons, as provided in section 724.11. e. The person transferring the pistol or revolver and the person acquiring the pistol or revolver are related to one another within the second degree of consanguinity or affinity unless the person transferring the pistol or revolver knows that the person acquiring the pistol or revolver would be disqualified from obtaining a permit. 3. The annual permit to acquire pistols or revolvers shall authorize the permit holder to acquire one or more pistols or revolvers during the period that the permit remains valid. If the issuing officer determines that the applicant has become disqualified under the provisions of subsection 1, the issuing officer may immediately revoke the permit and shall provide a written statement of the reasons for revocation, and the applicant shall have the right to appeal the revocation as provided in section 724.21A. 4. An issuing officer who finds that a person issued a permit to acquire pistols or revolvers under this chapter has been arrested for a disqualifying offense or who is the subject of proceedings that could lead to the person's ineligibility for such permit may immediately suspend such permit. An issuing officer proceeding under this subsection shall immediately notify the permit holder of the suspension by personal service or certified mail on a form prescribed and published by the commissioner of public safety and the suspension shall become effective upon the permit holder's receipt of such notice. If the suspension is based on an arrest or a proceeding that does not result in a disqualifying conviction or finding against the permit holder, the issuing officer shall immediately reinstate the permit upon receipt of proof of the matter's final disposition. If the arrest leads to a disqualifying conviction or the proceedings to a disqualifying finding, the issuing officer shall revoke the permit. The issuing officer may also revoke the permit of a person whom the issuing officer later finds was not qualified for such a permit at the time of issuance or who the officer finds provided materially false information on the permit application. A person aggrieved by a suspension or revocation under this subsection may seek review of the decision pursuant to section 724.21A. [C79, 81, §724.15] 90 Acts, ch 1147, §2, 3; 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §12, 19 For transition provisions relating to permits issued under this chapter prior to January 1, 2011, see 2010 Acts, ch 1178, §18 there you go "there you go" is right. Thanks! I thought I was fairly well versed in 724. Apparently I need to read it again. |
| The point I was trying to make that still hasn't been addressed that the OP asked is some of the laws apply from the host state. It's my understanding that if the out of state permit dictates you can not consume alcohol for your permit to be valid it applies where ever you travel possibly invalidating the out of state permit. |
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The point I was trying to make that still hasn't been addressed that the OP asked is some of the laws apply from the host state. it has been addressed directly and 100%. you obey the laws the occupy your jurisdication, not both. how can an iowa state patrolman know what new jersey has to say about their permit and their restrictions? he knows iowa code, not all 50 states code. in the case of restrictions on a driver lic. things would be different as 'corrective lenses required' or whatever may apply. not so with this. if i go to colorado with my iowa permit, fine. but i can't conceal my weapon if they don't allow it. then it is open carry only as a non resident. while i can carry either way here in iowa, i have to obey the laws in colorado since i'm in their state. |
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The point I was trying to make that still hasn't been addressed that the OP asked is some of the laws apply from the host state. it has been addressed directly and 100%. you obey the laws the occupy your jurisdication, not both. how can an iowa state patrolman know what new jersey has to say about their permit and their restrictions? he knows iowa code, not all 50 states code. in the case of restrictions on a driver lic. things would be different as 'corrective lenses required' or whatever may apply. not so with this. if i go to colorado with my iowa permit, fine. but i can't conceal my weapon if they don't allow it. then it is open carry only as a non resident. while i can carry either way here in iowa, i have to obey the laws in colorado since i'm in their state. I think we are on the same page. I guess I was thinking about a printed restriction like we use to have on our permits like "valid while hunting only, invalid when consuming alcohol, etc." otherwise you are right that an officer wouldn't know otherwise. |
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The point I was trying to make that still hasn't been addressed that the OP asked is some of the laws apply from the host state. it has been addressed directly and 100%. you obey the laws the occupy your jurisdication, not both. how can an iowa state patrolman know what new jersey has to say about their permit and their restrictions? he knows iowa code, not all 50 states code. in the case of restrictions on a driver lic. things would be different as 'corrective lenses required' or whatever may apply. not so with this. if i go to colorado with my iowa permit, fine. but i can't conceal my weapon if they don't allow it. then it is open carry only as a non resident. while i can carry either way here in iowa, i have to obey the laws in colorado since i'm in their state. I think we are on the same page. I guess I was thinking about a printed restriction like we use to have on our permits like "valid while hunting only, invalid when consuming alcohol, etc." otherwise you are right that an officer wouldn't know otherwise. "valid while hunting only"???????? I wonder what the DNR would have to say about that. |
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how can an iowa state patrolman know what new jersey has to say about their permit and their restrictions? he knows iowa code, not all 50 states code. Correct. Also, even if the Iowa State Patrolman knew the laws of New Jersey (maybe he's from there!) how could he/she enforce another state's laws in Iowa? It doesn't work that way unless there are federal rules in place, which there aren't. Think of it like this: My Toyota is titled in Iowa. It has 20% tint on the front side windows. This is illegal in Iowa. Driving in Missouri, if I get pulled over by the Missouri State Patrol (and I have in the Toyota, for no reason, like five times) they can't enforce Iowa's tint law, because I can't break an Iowa law in another state and be ticketed for it. If I'm not doing anything wrong by Missouri state law or federal law, I'm not breaking the law, period. (Caveat: 20% tint is also illegal in MO, but that law is only applicable to vehicles titled in MO. Firearm carry laws don't make that exemption.) Now if Missouri is a "no right on red" state and I make a right on red in Missouri, I can't get out of a ticket by telling the police officer who tickets me that I do it all the time in Iowa. It's the law in Missouri, and it applies to all drivers regardless of residency. |
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It is where you are at as Septic has said. Utah state restrictions are for when someone is in Utah. Utah has no restrictions listed on the permit as Iowa does not now. Another state can't hold you to their laws if you are not in that state.
I have done a few classes on the IL border and there are a lot of IL residents that are getting UT or FL permits. No problem. In response to the OP Utah's permit is probably less restrictive than Iowa's. It is a little harder to get (a few more disqualifiers, a standard course, fingerprints) but they have better/less restrictive laws than we do for the most part. |