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Posted: 1/5/2006 10:10:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:20:59 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 10:51:49 AM EDT
Thank goodness he finally saw the light, and did not force the issue. In the world that we live in today, the single most important thing we can do is ensure the protection of our family. It is a good thing that you have the means to do so. Too many people don't.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:04:55 AM EDT
Wow dude, makes you stop and think. I can usually fend off the street panhandlers with a solid, 'no thanks, man' especially when I look right at them. Just gotta keep awareness up, even in the comforts of home.


ByteTheBullet (-:
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:19:27 AM EDT
I dont have that problem when I answer the door with a 85 pound GSD barking like a wild man at anybody I deem as suspicious. It diesnt hurt that there is a police K-9 car in my driveway either
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:44:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:21:34 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:48:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:22:29 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:56:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/5/2006 12:08:55 PM EDT by Accountant30339]

Originally Posted By JKiser:I drew down on him. He backed off my porch and continued to yell foul things as he moved away. I called 911 and the cops arrived in about 5 to 7 minutes. The first car came with no lights but moving at the speed of sound. The second car was slow moving and looking to see what there was to see... And, that was that.





Forgive me.....but help me understand this:

1. You are inside your home and the door is locked
2. The persistent salesman is outside
3. and you drew down on him because he was looking through the window and trying to talk to you???

What am I missing??

This sounds like a clear case of brandishing a weapon. I am suprised that you are not in jail.

.......did he do anything else? Threaten you or your family?........something?

Accountant

PS: My persistent child will not be selling GS cookies at you house.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 12:03:53 PM EDT
In a similar situation, I was at my parents late one night. About 10pm, there is a knock on the door. I go and look out and this guy is there and I crack the door and he says his car broke down and asked if he could use the phone. My brain flashed back to "A Clockwork Orange", so I said " let me get it, and locked the dead bolt. I retrieved my 1911 with a chambered round, cocked and locked, and the phone.

My ada and I both go back to the door, pistol in my pocket, and I hand the guy the phone. He takes it and pushes "7" and stands there for a few seconds looking at the phone. (I know what this is- a criminal weighing the situation) he says " I don't know how to use this" hands me the phone back and walks off. So I give him a second, tell me dad to call the cops and I follw him outside with pistol drawn, safety off. He's gone just like that. I don't know where he went but he booked. So I headed up to see if there is a car on the road anywhere- nada.

So it was a lessons learned for me. Go to the door armed the first time. Now my dad keeps his beretta 92 within arms reach at the door.

Funny thing about it is the guy was about 5'7", 140 maybe. I'm 6'3" 220 and my dad is 6', 250. My pitbull also came to the door, but she was wagging her stubby little tail.

And to your point, JKiser- Yeah, it isn't simple to read people. you can't go around with butterflies and birds chirping, but you can't go around paranoid either. There's a fine balance of reading people, and if I get bad vibes, I tend to remove myself from the situation. I've been to the shooting range and someone shows up and I get a "feeling" and I pack up and leave, even if I've only been the for a few minutes. Sometimes, I never even got targets set up and I'm already heading for the truck.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 2:14:56 PM EDT
Looking into someone's window is crossing the line. I think you acted prudently given his posturing. It's wise to pay attention to your instincts when they tell you something/someone isn't right.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 2:41:12 PM EDT
Joseph,
I would have done the same thing in your shoes. Maybe he heard you were a gun dealer and was trying to scope out the place for a later "visit"?! Do you keep your inventory at home or at a shop? Might want to re-evaluate storage and security measures. Also would want to discuss matters with the rest of your family as well as your neighbors (you don't have to mention the drawing down, but the other info).

GlockSpeed31
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 2:48:03 PM EDT
Yeah, if he had a cool fake name like us, it would be harder to find him!


ByteTheBullet (-:
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 4:12:18 PM EDT
JKiser I would have done the same thing, you've got to go with that gut feeling. When the hair stands up on the back of your neck you know something a miss.

I don't answer the door anymore after dark unless I'm expecting company. I've got an intercom system and can "verbally" answer the door from anywhere in the house, even while I'm opening the gun safe. Really wish I'd put the optional video camera in so I can see who's at the door, I just hate to run off the girl scouts selling the cookies.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 4:15:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/5/2006 4:16:17 PM EDT by NewGunner]
Deleted - Oops Double Post
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 4:23:56 PM EDT
Joseph-

I would have done the same thing. If I ask you to leave my property and again I ask at which time they do not leave I then have to question their intent. I reserve the right to defend my family and property !
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 4:32:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/5/2006 4:35:56 PM EDT by Suppo]
For all you know, it could've been an Irish Traveler (South Carolina Gypsy) distracting you while his buddy tried to get into your back door. (If he was white.)

Either way, total strangers don't need to be raising hell at someone's front door when they've been asked to leave.

Accountant, I understand where you're coming from. You have to consider the legal ramifications. However, when I say leave, you'd better be leaving.

I would handle things differently at home than I would at the Mall or Wal-Mart. Home is the last place to run to.

Also, I have met MANY people that mistake kindness for weakness. Some of them found out otherwise. I'm a nice guy, not a stupid guy.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 5:20:32 PM EDT
Ok, ok.........I see that I am going to be overruled; but what made me pause, before blindly congratulation him is this:



Originally Posted By JKiser:
The whole encounter lasted less than 60 seconds.




Salesman: The guy walks to the door and rings the door bell. Mr. Kiser would to like to buy some magazines?
Kiser: No, thank you.
Salesman: Mr. Kiser are you sure? I have Newsweek, Time, The Economist, Playboy.
Kiser: No, thank you. Please leave.
Salesman: We do have some really great titles. Are you sure you wouldn't want to see some more? I also have the Shotgun News, SAR, Gun Tests, and Guns & Ammo.
Kiser: Draws down


That conversation is longer than 60 seconds!!!!

If someone, says leave......then you should leave. No, doubt about it, but the length of the exchange is what is bothering me............and the door between them.

Accountant



You should be able to protect your family and your property. I am not arguing that point.......but where was the threat?
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 5:34:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Accountant30339:

If someone, says leave......then you should leave. No, doubt about it, but the length of the exchange is what is bothering me............and the door between them.

Accountant

You should be able to protect your family and your property. I am not arguing that point.......but where was the threat?



And YOU make a good point also. You should be able to articulate everything you do when violence or the threat of it is used.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 6:51:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Accountant30339:
Ok, ok.........I see that I am going to be overruled; but what made me pause, before blindly congratulation him is this:




I think he did the right thing mostly because he listened to his instinct, not because of the way he described the situation. It is hard to describe the intangibles in a paragraph or two. It is very rare for us to get a knock at my door, so when we do, we are prepared to take appropriate action.

My wife has been trying to get me to trust my instinct and not make decisions completely based upon logic and reasoning. In general, women tend to sense things better than us. I try to keep that in mind. When my spider sense starts tingling, I try to act appropriately on it.

Not to derail the thread, but we had a salesperson come knocking one day when my wife was nursing the baby and I was at work. My 3 1/2 yo son opened the curtain to see who it was. When he saw it wasn't anybody he knew, he told the guy to go away. When the guy was trying to convince him to get his Mama, my son said, "go away or my Mama will kill you, you're not gonna take me!!" He repeated this several times. We have talked to him about safety, and they have discussed it at his pre-school. It thought it was good to see him put all that together and recognize a potential threat when he saw it. Apparently it was enough to make the guy move on. When my wife told me about it, I asked my son about killing. He said it was from the movie Madagascar, which is a G animated movie. There's a scene where one of the penguins says, "we killed them and ate their livers." We don't really talk much about killing in the house, so it was weird to hear him say stuff like that. He said it for a couple of weeks and then moved on to something else.
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 7:05:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:24:02 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 7:17:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:24:41 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 7:23:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Accountant30339:
Ok, ok.........I see that I am going to be overruled; but what made me pause, before blindly congratulation him is this:



Originally Posted By JKiser:
The whole encounter lasted less than 60 seconds.




Salesman: The guy walks to the door and rings the door bell. Mr. Kiser would to like to buy some magazines?
Kiser: No, thank you.
Salesman: Mr. Kiser are you sure? I have Newsweek, Time, The Economist, Playboy.
Kiser: No, thank you. Please leave.
Salesman: We do have some really great titles. Are you sure you wouldn't want to see some more? I also have the Shotgun News, SAR, Gun Tests, and Guns & Ammo.
Kiser: Draws down


That conversation is longer than 60 seconds!!!!

If someone, says leave......then you should leave. No, doubt about it, but the length of the exchange is what is bothering me............and the door between them.

Accountant



You should be able to protect your family and your property. I am not arguing that point.......but where was the threat?



If you have ever dealt with many crazy people or criminaly minded types,this would be enough:

"He raised his voice and kept trying to engage me. I turned and said forcefully, "I am not interested, go away." He kept it up so I responded"
"Get the hell off my property!" He kept it up... Wow, what a moron. He is a perfect example of what I am talking about. People like this see kindness as weakness... It is like chumming the waters.

He backed off my porch and continued to yell foul things as he moved away."

He wasn't up to any good in my opinion,and wsa hoping for an open door.
If he was salesman,as much of my time as they waste on the phone at my business,I would have about the same ammount of patience (or less).
How many salespeople think you will buy something from them if they make you angry?

Regards,Robert.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 4:01:17 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 4:36:15 AM EDT
Book- last thing I do before going to sleep is to reach to the nightstand and get a mental picture of the position of my handgun and my surefire so that I know where the grip is in the dark in case my sleep gets disturbed.

Link Posted: 1/6/2006 6:19:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2006 6:23:12 AM EDT by acmech]

Originally Posted By ByteTheBullet:
Yeah, if he had a cool fake name like us, it would be harder to find him!heBullet


That is the very reason I said I would like to see an ID if someone I don't know drops by to bend flats. I have made an open invitation to all here to drop by and bend some AK flats for your builds. I can even help with certain steps like riveting on the trigger guard. I don't mind and I like to help, just ask speedfreak, newgunner and a couple of others. I would like to see everyone here save money on their builds and I can help with that.

I have just learned that you can't always trust some people. I have recently had someone drop by to bend some flats that had given 3 different "real" names to the guys over at gunco, (4 counting the one he gave me). Why did he feel he needed to give 3 different names? Apparently there was a business transaction that didn't go well and he may have been trying to lay low. I don't know what his real name is to this day. I think the person is harmless, but what if he wasn't, by the time he left, he knew what shift I worked, how many kids I had and things you would tell someone about yourself as he told me his story. Lets face it, we are in a hobby that does attract the darker side of the population and the idea of a quick unregistered gun may be tempting. When someone leaves my house they will be very close to putting together a good gun, but besides that, you will know me pretty well as I have no reason to hide anything, and if my wife and kids are home they will know those details to. I however will have no idea if anything I was told is for real but he knows a lot, including where I live. Now I have put a laser sight on my .45 which the wife loves to shoot, and I've shown her the ropes with my AK pistol that I keep with a clip handy in a shtf event (she would rather have the .45).

I just hope I haven't offended anyone by requesting to see an ID if they drop by to bend flats, the invitation is open to anyone here so humor me, and think of it as a way to look out for each other. I don't mind showing mine ID either, for all anyone knows I'm a ATF agent taking names! lol That is funny.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 7:33:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2006 7:34:43 AM EDT by acmech]

Forgive me.....but help me understand this:

1. You are inside your home and the door is locked
2. The persistent salesman is outside
3. and you drew down on him because he was looking through the window and trying to talk to you???

What am I missing??

This sounds like a clear case of brandishing a weapon. I am suprised that you are not in jail.

.......did he do anything else? Threaten you or your family?........something?

Accountant

PS: My persistent child will not be selling GS cookies at you house. hink
Now go over the police interview with the salesman, if thats what he was. LOL I can hear it now.

Cop: Sir, where was the man who pointed his gun at you?
Salesman: In his house.
Cop: Did he ask you to leave?
Salesman: Yes
Cop: How many times?
Salesman: 3 times.
Cop: And you didn't leave?
Salesman: No.
Cop: And your surprised a man in his home, who might be affraid for his families welfare, might point a gun at someone who refuses to leave his door and curses at him?

There is a HUGE difference in arguing with your neighbors in your front yard and showing a gun and getting charged with brandishing a weapon. Completely different circumstances.

You can also wear a gun in your home and not be charged with open display of a firearm, however if your cutting the grass in your front yard wearing your pistol, you'll probably get in trouble. Even if you have a ccw permit you can get charged with open display of a firearm if you are out in public (it must be hidden on your person), however your home is not "in public".
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 8:20:27 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 10:07:22 AM EDT
JKiser,
I was telling your story to my parents, and they told me about a similar situation that happened to my mom. She was at the office alone one afternoon, when a man knocked at the door. He looked very suspicious, and made my mom really nervous. She asked him, through a locked glass door, what he wanted, but he just kept teling her to let him in. She told him to go away, and she called the police. She now carries a 38 Special everywhere she goes. She said that if she had had a gun when this happened she would have drawn it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 10:23:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BookHound:

For the record, my CCW permit doesn't say anything about the firearm must be concealed.



**cough** Firearms License **cough**


ByteTheBullet (-:
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 10:38:16 AM EDT
I was told by a leo that it "must" be concealed, thus the Concealed Carry Weapons permit. I was told you are not allowed to carry it out in the open to prevent you from alarming the public. Perhaps I was told wrong, but when told, I was informed that to carry it openly is consider "public display of a firearm" and I would be subject to revocation of my Concealed Carry Weapon permit. The only place in Ga. I think you can carry it in the open is Kennesaw perhaps I'm wrong.

Sounds like this is something we need to find out for sure.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 10:43:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BookHound:

I know many on this board disagree with open carry in general, but I also open carry sometimes when going to the grocery store or gas station. I've even open carried in a liquor store. No one has ever questioned it.



It really common sense isn't it? If someone is driving an M1A1 Abrams through your 'hood, are you gonna ask him if it's legal for him to do that?

Or maybe it's cause you look like a cop, and nobody questions the cops
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 10:55:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kletzenklueffer:

Originally Posted By BookHound:

I know many on this board disagree with open carry in general, but I also open carry sometimes when going to the grocery store or gas station. I've even open carried in a liquor store. No one has ever questioned it.



It really common sense isn't it? If someone is driving an M1A1 Abrams through your 'hood, are you gonna ask him if it's legal for him to do that?

Or maybe it's cause you look like a cop, and nobody questions the copshr



Thats what I was thinking, they probably think your a cop since no one else would openly carry a gun, but most detectives I've seen also have their badge beside the gun.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:04:54 AM EDT
I've had a legnthy discussion with a Gwinnett County Police Dept. Lieutenant about open carry. He stated that open carry is legal, however people get to be uneasy around non police open carry, and people are free to ask you to remove the firearm as long as they are owner of the place that you are visiting.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:13:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By acmech:
I was told by a leo that it "must" be concealed, thus the Concealed Carry Weapons permit.

Then you were told wrong. It isn't a concealed carry weapons permit, it is a firearms license. And according to the laws of this state, you can legally only open carry in 2 specific circumstances:

1. You are hunting on private land with the landowner's permission

* OR *

2. You possess a valid Georgia firearms license.

It also allows for concealed carry, with exclusions based on arguably arbitrary "public" locations.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:26:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:25:47 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 11:31:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 8:26:38 PM EDT by JKiser]
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:04:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By the_reject:

Originally Posted By acmech:
I was told by a leo that it "must" be concealed, thus the Concealed Carry Weapons permit.

Then you were told wrong. It isn't a concealed carry weapons permit, it is a firearms license. And according to the laws of this state, you can legally only open carry in 2 specific circumstances:

1. You are hunting on private land with the landowner's permission

* OR *

2. You possess a valid Georgia firearms license.

It also allows for concealed carry, with exclusions based on arguably arbitrary "public" locations.



I must have been told wrong if you know for sure, it would suck to be taken to the lockup only for the officer to find out he should let you go. Cops are great, I have the greatest respect for them, but they aren't lawyers, there is just too much for them to know. I do wonder though why he was so sure it was illegal to openly display a gun in public.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 12:52:52 PM EDT
Per packing.org:
A Georgia Firearms License holder (and those from reciprocal states) can conceal or open carry a "pistol, revolver, or concealable firearm." The license does not include knife carry. No carry of any kind is allowed in off limit areas.

Information below is found in Georgia Codes 16-11-126 and 16-11-128
Motor Vehicle carry without a permit is in the Car/Gun Law section.

You can conceal a firearm without a permit:

In the home you own/rent/lease or place of business you own/rent/lease
If you are not listed as one of the ineligible (list of reasons for denial), you can also carry your firearm enclosed in a case, unloaded, and separated from its ammunition

You can open carry a handgun/pistol/revolver without a permit:
(open manner and fully exposed to view means for all to see, you need to have more than just the grip in view)

-In the home you own/rent/lease or place of business you own/rent/lease
-while legally hunting or fishing with a valid hunting or fishing license(license not needed for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses) on their person and with the permission of the owner of the land
-while sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted

Not being an attorney, it appears that carrying openly on public areas would be in violation of the law.

Now what the hell would a guy in TX know about GA carry law? My first LEO position was in GA. and I also had a a hard to get (then) "Pistol Toters License". Yup, that's what they called it back in the 60's (1960's, I ain't that damn old).
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 1:07:03 PM EDT
Excellent info. guys, thats what I like about these forums, but back to the origanal post, if you point a gun at someone or at least flash one to someone you've already asked to leave your porch 3 times, seems reasonable to me.

A older gent I used to work with said he loved to ask for their solicitors permit, they need one to go door to door, and when he found they didn't have one he would say he was going to call the police to have them arrested for not having a permit and they would quickly beat it.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 4:35:16 PM EDT
J kiser good job. My dad taught me one thing before I left for Iraq........Trust your gut! If something feels wierd or wrong it probably is. I feel the same way. If I ask you to leave and you dont I am gonna tell you to. If you still dont then I will use any means I have to to get you to leave. Escillation of force. The guy may have been casing the joint and letting him know that A. You have a weapon and B. You arent afraid to use it to protect your family and friends. Now the chance of him coming back is very unlikely. IF he does he will probably be armed and you can do us all a favor. Remain vigilant, and let him in before you shoot him.


Link Posted: 1/6/2006 4:47:59 PM EDT
Always remember boys and girls ... 2 to the chest 1 to the head... wet your pants and repeat over and over HE'S COMING RIGHT FOR US!!!... Wait too much southpark ... It's I was in fear for my life.. and for God's Sake kill them or they will be on Oprah....
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 8:41:44 PM EDT
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 5:27:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:07:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/7/2006 6:14:04 AM EDT by WooDy_the_infidel]

Originally Posted By acmech:

You can also wear a gun in your home and not be charged with open display of a firearm, however if your cutting the grass in your front yard wearing your pistol, you'll probably get in trouble. Even if you have a ccw permit you can get charged with open display of a firearm if you are out in public (it must be hidden on your person), however your home is not "in public".



Open carry is legal in GA. GA has pre-emption laws too.

ETA: didn't see the second page
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:13:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By acmech:
You can also wear a gun in your home and not be charged with open display of a firearm, however if your cutting the grass in your front yard wearing your pistol, you'll probably get in trouble. Even if you have a ccw permit you can get charged with open display of a firearm if you are out in public (it must be hidden on your person), however your home is not "in public".



Thats what i was thinking. I don't believe its possible to criminally brandish your weapon within your own home. but i'm no expert
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 6:15:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By treedawg:
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD



You are the only one i have ever seen on any gun board that has said something like that.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 7:09:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By treedawg:
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD




paranoia
Main Entry: para·noia
Pronunciation: "par-&-'noi-&
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin, from Greek, madness, from paranous demented, from para- + nous mind
1 : a psychosis characterized by systematized delusions of persecution or grandeur usually without hallucinations
2 : a tendency on the part of an individual or group toward excessive or irrational suspiciousness and distrustfulness of others


Not to gang up on you TD, but I don't consider it irrational at all. Too often we hear about people being attacked or targeted for a multitude of reasons.

A couple of years ago in Gainesville, hispanic gangs were targeting women going to their cars in the walmart parking lot. They would grab the lady as she was opening her car door and force her in the car and rape her.

Another is they would wait until the parent put their kid in the car seat, and when the parent would go around to get in the drivers seat, they would open the kids door and put a gun to it's head and rob the parents at the threat of killing their kid.

We had a company meeintg about gang activity. It even opened my eyes, and I thought I was pretty knowledgeable. North GA has some of the highest gang population percentages per capita in the country. IIRC, there are more than a thousand gangs in Gwinnett Co. alone.

When you see stop signs and such with crap spray painted on them, it make look like stupid kids, but it is much more likely that it is gang territory markings, and while to us it's just silly, to them it's worth killing over.

So it's not unreasonable at all. It's prudent to me to protect what's mine.

I tend to think of it in terms of how our military dealt with Iraq in the first war- "shock and awe." Hit them so brutal and ruthless and fiercely that they are terrified of the idea of messing anywhere around you again.

Link Posted: 1/7/2006 7:30:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:

Originally Posted By treedawg:
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD



You are the only one i have ever seen on any gun board that has said something like that.



But not that it's a bad thing to expect the best out of people, all you have to do is watch the local Atlanta news and nearly everyday you will see a situation where a trusting person is killed, when if they would have had a gun on their person, the outcome might have been different. I just saw a news article this morning on the net, gangs like ms-13 are growing very fast in the US do to its open borders with Mexico and the FBI and CIA are both worried. The article said MS-13 is using expert tactics (swat like training) for robberies and home invasions. Now keeping in mind that 99% of legal and illegal latins are good hardworking people, how big is the latin community here in Atlanta? Now how many other gangs and scumbags rome about? That type of news is why more people should carry a gun.
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 7:54:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:

Originally Posted By treedawg:
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD



You are the only one i have ever seen on any gun board that has said something like that.



Which part???

TD
Link Posted: 1/7/2006 8:25:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By treedawg:

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:

Originally Posted By treedawg:
For some reason people carrying a weapon strike me as bit paranoid.

I know it's better to have and not need than need and not have but come on.....

I will rabidly defend the Second and I have a safe full of neat toys, but I've never felt compelled to carry in public much less in my home. The only place I don't support the Second is on private or so called semi private property where the owner of said property don't welcome your weapon. As far as I'm concerned all property that requires the owner to pay taxes is private.

I've often wondered what good my weapons would be if an intruded was in the house....Answer, good for nothing.

TD



You are the only one i have ever seen on any gun board that has said something like that.



Which part???

TD



That you don't see a need to carry a weapon. Did i misunderstand?
Link Posted: 1/11/2006 6:16:55 AM EDT
You did not over react.
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