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Posted: 2/6/2006 3:52:36 PM EDT
The next CCRN meeting will be this Tuesday, February 7, at 7:30 p.m.. There will probably be some changes to the carry bill this year. If you want to have some input or want to know what is going on stop by. Here is a link to directions for those who have not been there before. Joel Rosenberg will be giving his proposals.

www.mnccrn.org/ccrn_old/images/ham_map.gif
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 6:19:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AlreadyThere:
There will probably be some changes to the carry bill this year.



Changes for the better

Or for the worse

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 4:13:47 AM EDT
I don't want to put words in Joel's mouth, but if you're interested in reading his words and judging for yourself, head over to his blog at

www.joel-rosenberg.com

or head to the local carry discussion forum at

www.twincitiescarry.com/forum/

and read his (usually entertaining and thought provoking) comments.

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 4:48:01 AM EDT
Thanks for the links. Found this informstion on his site:




1. Change the "must accept" language so that the sheriffs must accept certificates from instructors who are certified by any one or more of the following organizations: AACFI, MADFI, Society for the Advancement of Firearms Education (SAFE), and NRA, removing the discretion of the DPS with regard to instructors certified by any of those organizations.

Modify the present language so that the Commissioner Public Safety may certify additional organizations, and that certificates issued by instructors from those additional organizations, too, must be accepted by all Minnesota sheriffs. (See below for both my disclosure of my relationships with all of those organizations, and for my reasoning as to why they should be included in the statutory language.)

2. Lower the minimum age for permit holders from 21 back to 18, as was the case pre-2003.

3. Remove the ban on carry in schools, and put schools in the same category as other businesses and governmental entities -- governmental entities not being allowed to restrict carry; private businesses allowed to post, or not, as they choose.

4. Mandate the acceptance of all carry permits issued by any state.

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:34:04 AM EDT
tag for later
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:45:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TruePunisher:
Thanks for the links. Found this informstion on his site:




1. Change the "must accept" language so that the sheriffs must accept certificates from instructors who are certified by any one or more of the following organizations: AACFI, MADFI, Society for the Advancement of Firearms Education (SAFE), and NRA, removing the discretion of the DPS with regard to instructors certified by any of those organizations.

Modify the present language so that the Commissioner Public Safety may certify additional organizations, and that certificates issued by instructors from those additional organizations, too, must be accepted by all Minnesota sheriffs. (See below for both my disclosure of my relationships with all of those organizations, and for my reasoning as to why they should be included in the statutory language.)

2. Lower the minimum age for permit holders from 21 back to 18, as was the case pre-2003.

3. Remove the ban on carry in schools, and put schools in the same category as other businesses and governmental entities -- governmental entities not being allowed to restrict carry; private businesses allowed to post, or not, as they choose.

4. Mandate the acceptance of all carry permits issued by any state.




#1 looks like he is looking out for himself IMO. To each there own I agree with #2,3,4,
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:37:26 AM EDT
I agree with the proposed changes, but frankly I would think the #3 proposed change is just going to get the anti's riled up.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:44:57 AM EDT
Change #1 basically protects against a back door ban on carry permits. I'll explain:

1) a democratic anti-CCW governor comes into office like, say, Wes Skoglund, who has a hardon for getting rid of CCW despite the lack of any proof that CCW is a problem.
2) he instructs the BCA to eliminate all certified training organizations
3) he instructs the BCA to no longer certify ANY training organization
4) effective immediately, people who haven't taken their certified training are screwed
5) within 5 years, every issued permit expires and cannot be renewed because of lack of training

It's a small hole, but a hole nonetheless. I'd just as soon see it gone.

#2. Not sure how I feel about this. While I don't begrudge any 18+ person getting their permit, it would make our law dissimilar from other states, and hurts changes for reciprocity.

#3. This is a losing battle. While I like the idea, there is NO WAY that it will pass. It's just too hot of a subject to pass. It would cost republican congress members their seats, and they know this. I think it's dead before it hits the floor.

#4. Good idea. Will help reciprocity across the board and eliminates discretionary method for approving out of state permits by the BCA.

Just my view.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 11:43:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Fast351:
Change #1 basically protects against a back door ban on carry permits. I'll explain:

1) a democratic anti-CCW governor comes into office like, say, Wes Skoglund, who has a hardon for getting rid of CCW despite the lack of any proof that CCW is a problem.
2) he instructs the BCA to eliminate all certified training organizations
3) he instructs the BCA to no longer certify ANY training organization
4) effective immediately, people who haven't taken their certified training are screwed
5) within 5 years, every issued permit expires and cannot be renewed because of lack of training

It's a small hole, but a hole nonetheless. I'd just as soon see it gone.

#2. Not sure how I feel about this. While I don't begrudge any 18+ person getting their permit, it would make our law dissimilar from other states, and hurts changes for reciprocity.

#3. This is a losing battle. While I like the idea, there is NO WAY that it will pass. It's just too hot of a subject to pass. It would cost republican congress members their seats, and they know this. I think it's dead before it hits the floor.

#4. Good idea. Will help reciprocity across the board and eliminates discretionary method for approving out of state permits by the BCA.

Just my view.



I agree with this post 100%.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 4:59:48 PM EDT
Well it looks like we will not be opening the bill this year. The timing would be bad so it is not going to happen. The big down side on this is that the DPS can regulate the permits out of existance any time they want, and if we loose our current Governer they just might do it. Not enough people care enough to do anything about it so I guess we will just have to wait and see.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 1:50:17 PM EDT

2. Lower the minimum age for permit holders from 21 back to 18, as was the case pre-2003.



Not real excited about this. I wouldn't let any of the 18 year-olds I know drive my car, much less carry a gun.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 2:44:50 PM EDT
After reading some of the stuff here & on twincitiescarry.com, maybe we should sit back and relax a bit for the time being. Being too forceful can generate ill-feelings. I won't disagree that the current Permit to Carry law need to be tweaked. But, hell, we just got it back. One step at a time & little by little.
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