Posted: 11/19/2004 12:14:43 PM EDT
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I moved out of MN a few years ago, but go back to visit the family every summer. I heard there was a big stink over the issuance of concealed carry permits. Does anyone know how difficult it is to get an non-resident permit? Thanks in advance. |
| I asked my Police Officer brother your question and he was pretty certain that you must be a resident of the State of MN for 6 months and have taken the CCW class to qualify. You may just want to contact the local Sherrifs dept and ask the question though since it is possible that the rules may be "viewed" differently from County to County. Good luck! |
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There is a court case outstanding in which several churches & synagoges sued for the new law to be overturned. Their contention is that it was passed illegally in that it was "snuck" in to a bill meant for other purposes. It was upheld by a Ramsey County judge & now it is up to be reviewed by the MN Supreme Court. Of course, their hidden agenda is that they just don't want CCW in their buildings, but the real reason is simply that they are liberals who are irrationally afraid of firearms. Anyway, the net effect is that there is a lot of confusion in the issuance of permits. The concensus seems to be the if you got your permit under the new law then you can keep it. Same if you got it under the old law, but if you want a new one now, you will be governed under the old law. That law was "may issue." It was mostly a matter of who you know. What little enforcement there is, apparently is following the old law. Try this website. It might have a better explanation. It used to be the website of the Concealed Carry Reform Now website, but it looks like the owner turned it into an advertising website. Try looking at all of the buttons. |
Thanks for the info guys. I don't know why I didn't think of this but my cousin is a Minneapolis LEO, I'll see if he knows what the deal is. I wish they would just make a federal card for all states. The only states that accept my MA card are states that let anyone carry. 
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i know a few WI residents that have MN permits. i took the class and then all the BS happened. |
I do not think they will issue to out of state at all at this point. Here is the url for CCRN, we usually meet the 2nd Tuesday of the month at Hamline Law School if you are interested. I called my local police department for information about the validity of permits issued under the new law and was told that of course they are legal, it is just some troublemakers trying to spread disinformation that they were not. BTW the folks at the Appeals court say they beleive the case will hit the first part of December. www.mnccrn.org/ |
I don't see how that is possible unless they have some VERY special circumstances which qualified them. Minnesota and Wisconsin really don't even enter into the equation since it is a "County" level decision that qualifies or disqualifies the request. But if you say so.. It must be so. Sure would like to hear how that got done though! |
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I still don't see how that would have been possible. I went back and pulled my copy of my CCW and it clearly asks about residency and lenth of 3 months or more. I really can't understand how one County in another State or a citizen residing in a County in another State could be generated a CCW for another County for another State. The logic just doesn't follow but I guess their again may have been "Special" circumstances involded. I would be interested in specifics Inferno715. |
Gunbum, You don't think you should be allowed to carry in other states? |
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The conversation has nothing to do with what I or Inferno "want" or believe. We were discussing the legalities of the origanl question posted at the beginning of the thread which was dealing with the posibilities of someone from the East coast obtaining a CCW for his travels to MN while still residing in (I believe it was Maine). Personally, I believe that for a private citizen to be allowed to carry and conceal a legal firearm in multiple States of the union, that citizen should and must be educated and fully understand the local customs and laws of the land in which they are traveling too. This (I believe) would be a logistical nightmare for the law enforcement community and therefore would never be allowed. Also, I always enjoyed the laws of Arizona for the several years that I spent their earlier in my life. The law required you to go through a single Federal backround check once, after that, you could walk into any gunshop, provide drivers license and purchase any handgun you chose. The single most important point to their law was that the gun MUST be worn UNCONCEALED if you were in public. It was simple and seemed to work very well! |
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From the MN DPS Permit to Carry a Pistol in Minnesota -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Permit to Carry/Personal Protection Act of 2003 Ruled Unconstitutional On Tuesday, July 13, 2004, Minnesota’s Personal Protection Act of 2003 was declared unconstitutional by a district court judge. The district court permanently enjoined the State of Minnesota and its agents (which includes the Minnesota Department of Public Safety from taking any action to enforce the provisions of the Personal Protection Act which were contained in Senate File 842. On behalf of the State of Minnesota, the Minnesota Attorney General’s Office has filed a notice of appeal and requested a stay of the district court‘s decision. Link to the Ramsey County court decision: Unity v. State of MN Order (7/14/2004) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No Permit Reciprocity Before the enactment of the Personal Protection Act of 2003, Minnesota law did not provide for reciprocity for permits to carry firearms for those persons with permits from other states. Therefore, effective immediately and until further notice on this website, the Minnesota Department of Public Safety will not recognize permits to carry firearms issued by any other state. |
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There needs to be some sort of national standard for CCW, w/ nation-wide reciprocity for anyone who meets the terms. My state doesn't require any sort of class for CCW, but I'd gladly do it if I could get recognizance to conceal carry in other states. There might be some sort of mutual reciprocaty between states, but I tend to think that the closest chance of that would require approval from the AG in that state. It'd also be nice to piss off liberals in CA, MA, IL, NY, etc. by being out of state & being able to carry, even as they don't |
It's my thread. I grew up in MN, moved out to MA = Massachusetts 6 years ago. I currently have a CCW for MA and wanted to know what needs to be done for me to carry when I go home to see my family. If it is a County Decision there must be one person who makes the decision for the county. Obviously if there are out of state residents taking the required classes to carry in MN there must be a way for a out of stater to get the permit. I started this thread to hopefully find out. Hopefully when all this crap gets out of court there will be some reciprocity or they will allow non-residents. I also will take any class that is needed. |
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I don't believe that there are any "outstater's" with Minnesota CCW's unless they have "special circumstances" that allowed them to be waivered somehow. As for anyone taking classes from "outstate" now, I don't believe they would stand a chance in hell of ever getting anything other than a polite smile when applying for the CCW. Not that I agree with it, but I understand it! We've already got enough "untrained" and undiciplined "Ya-Who's" out there running around acting like idiots during hunting season. This would be the FIRST place I would start is to mandate classroom training and backround checks on the people that will be carrying weapons that will easily kill a human in the wrong hands. The people that are already certified in one state at least "should" have gone through "some" training and backround check so I would allow them to carry long before billy-bob-bubba or vietnam tommy (No offense intended to any racial group) out in the woods or anywhere for that matter! |
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Hardcase amd AlreadyThere have the correct information regarding issuance of permits. FWIW, I am a WI resident, took the required training and received a permit under the MPPA (before the court case happend). And "yes", its still good. For those of you that aren't MN residents and want to get a MN permit, I'd suggest waiting until the court case gets cleared up, then take the required training course. Part of the MPPA requires that your training be within 1 year of your application. |
He agrees with non-residents having MN CCW permits. He justs wants them to do it legally. Thats all. |
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Instead of wasting money on beer and such support the CCRN! They are doing the leg work! Either support them with cash or labor. Do not piss in each other's Wheaties we are all on the same side here! There are some people that I know both young and old that lack the wherewithall to make critical choices. As evidenced here and everyother BBS on the internet! And, just cause a person has a pulse and piece of paper does not assure they are not some nincompoop! Just cause you take a class does not make you competent. I can assure you all of that! A test is just that! It shows on a given day you could do the required pyschomotor skills! And, last I checked the ND CHL test was a complete joke, IMHO, open book and 10 shots? That is not competency based training! Sully has proved his assertion that you need to train and train and train! How many of you can say that you have had live fire practice in the last month? |
Master Blaster, you are right. The only thing that I would add would be "reasonable" i.e., "There needs to be some sort of reasonable national standard for CCW, w/ nation-wide reciprocity for anyone who meets the terms." sgthoskins, how in the world did you ever get a CCW from MA? I just assumed that, MA being so ultraliberal, they didn't even have CCW. So much for assumptions, huh? |
I completely disagree. The goal should not be further government. Any "standard", whether "reasonable" or not is an infringment. Any "fee" associated with obtaing such a "permit" is a tax. Rights are not supposed to be taxed! Now, if you're talking about that as a stepping stone to the ultimate goal of the true meaning of the 2nd Amend, then I might go along with you... heck, I already paid for a MN permit. That's my .02. Now back to the regularly scheduled topic: MN out-of-state carry permits. |
I've practiced in the past month on family land... I don't know if you could call it practice though, as it was only ~100rds fired...  Practiced: ~21rds of marksmanship (accuracy) -28rds of movement shooting -28rds of various strange DE positions -23rds of Meltdown/transitions/reloads with .22 rifle & my colt .45 It's all I had for Ammo at the time, and was short on time...  I guess it's better than nothing. Might be helping my friend sight in his newly built AR-15 this friday or saturday, and I may get to briefly use my .45 a little as well...  I need more time, ammo components, and $$ at present. Will just be scraping by for rent this month though.
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GREAT COMMENTS AND IDEAS on many versions of this thread I'd say... I believe what we were discussing the ability to "allow" people from "other" states, other than their current CCW and (Residence) was issued, to be able to obtain a reciproccal CCW here in Minnesota. I brought up the issue of (Untrained and unfamiliar hunters in our and any other states "and Countries" for that matter) simply because of the fact that it is an issue that I really rarely hear of anymore and have seemingly hit a "Discussion Point of interest" I understand and completly support the 2nd ammedment to obtain and bear arms to protect ourselves and our homes and families. Good lord, we wouldn't be free without the support of these words and the peolpe who have given their lives to support these words! However, when you are "imposing" your will upon others to secure your second ammendment rights, I feel that you must: 1) Understand the local laws of the land and yield to them without question. 2) Have full and complete authorization to move through and stay at any point on any "Private Property" that you may run across or suspect to be "Private Property". I can tell all (first hand) that I have requested many "unknown" hunters to remove themselves from my personal property during, before and after the hunting season. Usually, I did not really concern myself with being armed, after this hunting season, I don't know that I will enter my own land without being "fully armed" and "fully aware" of any possibilities. I feel terrible for having to "patrol" my personal property! We used to "enjoy" it without the thought of somethong like what happened in NW Wisconsin (Which we also know very well) That is the primary reason I left the larger cities of MN in the first place and went back "home". I guess home really never, ever, can be found again! Sorry for the Stomp of the original thread! but it seemed a natural progression with the different views from all that joined the thread. |
A couple of points: * In spite of all of the handwringing on these boards, the incident near Rice Lake was an aberattion. * Did you see the article on trespassing in yesterday's Red Star? Piss poor job of writing up the differences between the MN & WI trespass laws. * If you have private land in MN, with a few exceptions, you, as landowner, must post it to keep people off. * If you don't post it, EXPECT people to use the land, especially if you are next to public land. * Agricultural/forest landowners get many tax breaks & full time farmer get many price supports. Who do you think pays for that? I suppose that it's about time to start a thread about "All landowners/farmers are pigs." |
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By copying part of my post are you proposing that I am not informed or intelligent enough to "post" my land? The fact is that most of the "Ass-holes" that we end-up chasing off will often even make comments that I don't have a right to remove them and some have even challenged me for "ruining their hunt" even though they admitted to seeing the "posted" signs. Others, have denied seeing the signs that were posted every 30 yards along the posted "Private Property-No Trespassing" road to the property. Once you arrive to my property, there are also signed, dated and with my name and local phone number signs every 30 yards along the truck trail to the deer stands (built by my brother and me) where these people choose to leave all there litter for the weekend; and every other possible thing you can imagine. So please don't suggest that "weak" kind of an excuse! Before you hunt anywhere! YOU have the responsibility to find out if it is public or private property and act accordingly! I did it when I was younger and had to search for land to hunt and I expect nothing less than a telephone call simply "asking" first since I have always felt that the land owners also have a responsibily to "share" the wildlife which we do NOT own when we purchase land and MUST share with others as long as they respect our ownership and simply clean-up after themselves and act responsibly while on others land. When you try this Bullshit of saying that because my land may or may not be located next to or even near public land that I must allow others to "have their way" on my land and I should just accept it, I tell you that you should more fully understand the type of taxes I pay on MY land every year just to own it and if you think that because a farmer receives a subsidy has ANYTHING to do with my personal property, you are just not thinking clearly. Using your same logic, if you find yourself owning property besides a meth-lab, they should just feel free to store their poison on your property without asking, Right? I and my children spend time on this land and I don't feel that I should have to run a "sweep" every time we enter the land before I allow my children to play with the dog in the woods. Granted, during the hunting season it is out of the question, but when it starts getting a month before and two or three months after hunting season, then MY rights are being pissed-on. Am I asking too much? I don't think so! |