Posted: 4/16/2010 10:21:46 AM EDT
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Some good news and a request for help.
Wanted to let the forum know that the SDA reform bill (SB2239) passed the house yesterday and will be on its way to the governor. Beginning 1 July, Your CCL process time will be cut to 60 days. My second bill (SB2230), which allows for CCL holders to keep a locked firearm in their locked car on a Career Tech campus parking lot, passed the House Education Committee. But, House Speaker Chris Benge is balking on having it heard. I was informed by senate leadership that Benge sees this as a 'guns on campus' bill. The education lobby first claimed that the bill would violate Federal Law. We pointed out the following from Title 18, section 922q: (2)(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone. (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm - (i) on private property not part of school grounds; (ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;... The Federal law lists locking and loaded provisions that my law would comply with. The purpose of my bill is to allow CCL holders to keep their locked firearms in their cars rather than disarm to go to classes. Rep. John Enns, a CCL holder and the House author of my bill, makes a strong case that his only means of self defense as a paraplegic is his CCL. Others like him, women, and elderly would all have a need to protect themselves as many of their college credit classes are at night. I would appreciate your help on this. I honestly do not understand the push back when we've complied with the Federal law under Enns house amendment and adding an additional locking device measure not required Federally. Please encourage Speaker Benge to let SB2230 be voted on the floor. Thanks, Steve |
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Speaker of the House Chris Benge's phone number at the State Capitol Building is (405) 557-7340.
Like Sen Russell asked, please call that number and tell them the bill SB2230 should be heard on the floor. We have disabled individuals that have no means to protect themselves other than carrying a firearm. Ask Chris Benge if he can guarantee the safety of amputees from assault on school campuses, and if he can't, why would he make them felons if they had a means of protection locked up in their car when they are licensed by the state to carry other places? Use your phones and be heard. Do it now and ask others to do the same ASAP. |
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I just called and his secretary was very receptive and nice to speak to.
BE NICE, BE EMPHATIC!!!! One thing I asked is why does he want to make a felon out of an honest citizen? Many honest law abiding citizens are going to carry their gun in their car anyway if they have an SDA license. All he is accomplishing by not letting it hit the floor is making a felon out of a woman who uses her SDA license to protect herself by shooting a rapist in a school parking lot. Let them know what you think but BE NICE and BE PERSISTENT. |
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Speaker of the House Chris Benge's phone number at the State Capitol Building is (405) 557-7340. Like Sen Russell asked, please call that number and tell them the bill SB2230 should be heard on the floor. We have disabled individuals that have no means to protect themselves other than carrying a firearm. Ask Sen Russell if he can guarantee the safety of amputees from assault on school campuses, and if he can't, why would he make them felons if they had a means of protection locked up in their car when they are licensed by the state to carry other places? Use your phones and be heard. Do it now and ask others to do the same ASAP. See red above. No need to ask me Dan. Please ask Speaker Chris Benge. He is the hold up. Thank him for getting SB2239 passed but respectfully urge him to hear SB2230 allowing CCL holders to lock their firearms in their cars on Career Tech campus parking lots just like a college campus. Spread the word to your friends and lets let him hear from other than the Education lobby. Steve |
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 Oops, I meant Chris Benge, not you Sen Russell. 
Sorry, it was a typo. 
ETA - made the correction in my original post. When I make a mistake, it's usually a good one.  See what happens when you get old and senile? It's easy when you have first-hand experience, Chuck. 
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Need you to keep up the support for SB 2230 to be presented in the House this week. Encourage Tad Jones and Speaker Benge to hear the bill. Sen. Coffee talked with Speaker Benge and he moved it to the calendar––a good sign.
But now the Education lobby has sent pathetic false emails about how this will put guns in the hands of kids in classrooms. Absurd. And False. All this does is allow a CCL holder to keep a firearm locked in his car while he works on campus or attends class at a career tech––just like he can currently do on a college campus. As an added safety measure (not required by Federal law but provided to turn back those saying kids would break into cars and shoot themselves with guns) I added a safety lock measure as well for career tech parking lots only because they have minor children as students. This bill allows women, disabled and elderly who attend class at night to protect themselves without disarming to go to a Career Tech class. Thank Speaker Benge for moving the bill to the calendar and encourage him to let it be heard on the floor this week. Encourage Tad Jones (the floor leader who controls what gets brought up on the floor) to hear the bill on the floor. Tell him you do not want the safety lock measure to be stripped off the bill and you support that added safety measure. Why? Because this was designed to negate those arguing about federal Law and if it gets stripped out, the bill will likely be killed. Better to have your pistol with internal lock or trigger lock in your locked car than no pistol at all. It is easy to unlock and reholster than wish you had the means to defend yourself in a parking lot at night or more likely when you come home late at night after class. Your calls matter. If they don't hear from you, all they get it the education drivel and falsehood about the bill arming students. And if you are a staunch NRA guy and disagree with the safety lock, good luck using your bare hands under current law...because that is the way it will remain. Thanks for any help. Thursday is the deadline. If the bill is not heard Wednesday or Thursday, it is dead. Make the calls and emails please. Steve |
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I do appreciate what your doing.
Personally I don't agree with the provision that it would require a lock. Reason 1. An attacker will attack its victim on their way to the auto. Why, simple, because they know the odds are in the victims favor should they be able to recover their firearm. You are only tipping the balance in the favor of the aggressor. Reason 2. College campus have their own independent security and police force. They are also private venues. Trade schools and tech schools are unsecured. Pretty much completely. Parking is open and the hours for those in attendance are significantly later than regular college. They are primed for sexual assault and robbery. I understand why you did it, but still feel you made a compromise that is not in the favor of the law abiding citizen. Granted its on a much lesser scale but its no more pro gun than the Hughes Amendment was for law abiding gun owners. After all that was for the greater good as well. A locked or unloaded gun will do you as much good as a roll of quarters will in a fight. Only problem is the aggressor will likely have come prepared and and the victim's attention at the time will not be focused on the attack ensuing but on attempting to get their line of defense operational. ETA - I am sorry if I offend Steve, but you should understand that while I was in the service a good and close friend was sexually assaulted in a parking lot as she was leaving from her night classes for lvn school. If I had to put my wife in that situation I would not be comfortable with her being required to lock her firearm to prevent function and secure it in her auto while she is in class. It just doesn't sit right. If she went through all that BS so she could get her card punched and be told its ok for her to protect her self as our original drafters intended only to have someone "in good faith" restrict her from doing just that, then we have done everyone a great disservice. I also understand that the way it is now is of little benefit as well. I just think you were on the right path and got distracted by leftist propaganda. |
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Fister, you get what you can get, then drop the BS stuff later on.
Do you realize that your tax dollars are being used by CareerTech employees to lobby the state legislators to get more money for CareerTech or to push issues like no guns allowed on their campuses, regardless of what the majority of Oklahomans want? Jump down the CareerTech people's throats. They are tax dollar thieves anyway. |
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Guys, I understand as well as any here the lock provision and its concerns. The alternative is unarmed. Think about it. UNARMED.
Better to have it in the door than not at all. Taking a principled stand on the lock and not supporting this effort with your calls and emails will only communicate that the voters do not want this right to defend themselves in a parking lot. The Ed lobby splits no such hairs. I need help to save this bill. If you can help, it is appreciated. The Career Tech Lobby bullied their way around the house already this morning mischaracterizing my bill. With no alternative voice, we're dead on it. Please call and email. Thanks, Steve |
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I completely understand and do support this measure. I never said I didn't. I would however like to not see DC type laws thrust upon us in our great state.
I look at it as a midset thing. Lets look at Daniell's example. Daniell is a CHL holder. She carries for her defense. But she is not legally permitted to carry at her tech school. So she does not. Her mindset while on campus or around campus because of this is "I am on my own here. I must be alert and prepared to defend myself without my fiream." Now lets look at Daniell's example with a bill like this in place. She is legally permitted to lock her carry piece and next secure it in her pov. Her mindset has now been altered. She knows if she can get to her pov and unlock her firearm she may use it to defend herself. Problem is, if she does on campus she will no longer be within the law. She is likely to lose her right to carry and may face jail time if she should brandish and / or use a working fiream at her career tech school premisis is she not. Even if she is in danger that would call for such defense. Unless there are special provisions in place for her protection I am unaware of. Not only has her judgement been clouded and her reaction time slowed but now she must worry about the what ifs even after its all over. Provisions like these do us no service. Its like a hose. Even if you turn the water on after you have kinked it, no water flows out the other end. 
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Guys, I understand as well as any here the lock provision and its concerns. The alternative is unarmed. Think about it. UNARMED. Better to have it in the door than not at all. Taking a principled stand on the lock and not supporting this effort with your calls and emails will only communicate that the voters do not want this right to defend themselves in a parking lot. The Ed lobby splits no such hairs. I need help to save this bill. If you can help, it is appreciated. The Career Tech Lobby bullied their way around the house already this morning mischaracterizing my bill. With no alternative voice, we're dead on it. Please call and email. Thanks, Steve Were they doing it on my dime? How much are those school administrators making a year? How can they use the taxpayer's money to lobby? It should be illegal as hell. |
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Everything is not always all one way or the other. There is always a large area in-between both ends. The libs have fought with this in mind for years. Many were quoted on the health care bill something like "this just gets us in the door. We can always fix it later". Learn from your enemies
With that said I most certainly agree with you. I'd much rather have the GOA position than the NRAs. Which way will get us somewhere though? |
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Call or email this guy and tell him the CareerTech is really agitating many people in this state with their lobbying against the right to protect themselves.
Brady McCullough, Chief Financial and Legislative Affairs Officer for CareerTech (405) 743-5100, [email protected] |
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We need this in our state. Whats the hold up?
http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/2005/09/texas-new-carry-law-what-does-it-mean.html An not with a provision to have them locked either.
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I completely understand and do support this measure. I never said I didn't. I would however like to not see DC type laws thrust upon us in our great state. I look at it as a midset thing. Lets look at Daniell's example. Daniell is a CHL holder. She carries for her defense. But she is not legally permitted to carry at her tech school. So she does not. Her mindset while on campus or around campus because of this is "I am on my own here. I must be alert and prepared to defend myself without my fiream." Now lets look at Daniell's example with a bill like this in place. She is legally permitted to lock her carry piece and next secure it in her pov. Her mindset has now been altered. She knows if she can get to her pov and unlock her firearm she may use it to defend herself. Problem is, if she does on campus she will no longer be within the law. She is likely to lose her right to carry and may face jail time if she should brandish and / or use a working fiream at her career tech school premisis is she not. Even if she is in danger that would call for such defense. Unless there are special provisions in place for her protection I am unaware of. Not only has her judgement been clouded and her reaction time slowed but now she must worry about the what ifs even after its all over. Provisions like these do us no service. Its like a hose. Even if you turn the water on after you have kinked it, no water flows out the other end. Fister, She would be fine in the parking lot under the 'stand your ground' law if threatened or in a perceived threat. THe part of the equation you left out is when she comes home unarmed at night. She is carrying unlocked and ready to go and can defend herself. Under the 'all or nothing' mentality, she is UNARMED if this bill fails. Something to think about. But then I am not the enemy here. The fact that we got bullied by career Tech leaders that drove all the way from Enid today on your dime is the type of challenge we face. And when we plead for some support, we get push back on the finer points. If I thought the provision (which only applies while on the career tech parking lot) curtailed rather than enhanced the right of CCL holders to defend themselves, I would not have allowed it in the first place. Personally, I support no locks. But if given the choice between unarmed or armed & locked only while on a certain parking lot, I'll take the expansion under that specific limitation in the same way I can carry in an eating establishment that serves alcohol as long as I don't go into the bar area. That is a restriction I can live with. Please call or email. Thanks, Steve |
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I completely understand and do support this measure. I never said I didn't. I would however like to not see DC type laws thrust upon us in our great state. I look at it as a midset thing. Lets look at Daniell's example. Daniell is a CHL holder. She carries for her defense. But she is not legally permitted to carry at her tech school. So she does not. Her mindset while on campus or around campus because of this is "I am on my own here. I must be alert and prepared to defend myself without my fiream." Now lets look at Daniell's example with a bill like this in place. She is legally permitted to lock her carry piece and next secure it in her pov. Her mindset has now been altered. She knows if she can get to her pov and unlock her firearm she may use it to defend herself. Problem is, if she does on campus she will no longer be within the law. She is likely to lose her right to carry and may face jail time if she should brandish and / or use a working fiream at her career tech school premisis is she not. Even if she is in danger that would call for such defense. Unless there are special provisions in place for her protection I am unaware of. Not only has her judgement been clouded and her reaction time slowed but now she must worry about the what ifs even after its all over. Provisions like these do us no service. Its like a hose. Even if you turn the water on after you have kinked it, no water flows out the other end. Fister, She would be fine in the parking lot under the 'stand your ground' law if threatened or in a perceived threat. THe part of the equation you left out is when she comes home unarmed at night. She is carrying unlocked and ready to go and can defend herself. Under the 'all or nothing' mentality, she is UNARMED if this bill fails. Something to think about. But then I am not the enemy here. The fact that we got bullied by career Tech leaders that drove all the way from Enid today on your dime is the type of challenge we face. And when we plead for some support, we get push back on the finer points. If I thought the provision (which only applies while on the career tech parking lot) curtailed rather than enhanced the right of CCL holders to defend themselves, I would not have allowed it in the first place. Personally, I support no locks. But if given the choice between unarmed or armed & locked only while on a certain parking lot, I'll take the expansion under that specific limitation in the same way I can carry in an eating establishment that serves alcohol as long as I don't go into the bar area. That is a restriction I can live with. Please call or email. Thanks, Steve Holy crap that burns me up  They will most definately be hearing from me too.
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no.
| Speaker of the House Chris Benge refused to allow the bill to be heard today. Nice to know our Republican House Leader there did what the Dems could not do. It's dead this year. Hope adults trying to defend themselves coming home from class don't die with it. Steve |
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Speaker of the House Chris Benge refused to allow the bill to be heard today. Nice to know our Republican House Leader there did what the Dems could not do. It's dead this year. Hope adults trying to defend themselves coming home from class don't die with it. Steve The law cannot tell us we cannot defend myself with the tools necessary to do so. Our academic administrators are the scourge of this country, causing more problems than just this. CareerTech administrators and many of the educational administrators are blood sucking leaches on Oklahoma tax payers. They give little or nothing for the money they get and cause a great deal of damage to our state and country. This is just one example. |
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Speaker of the House Chris Benge refused to allow the bill to be heard today. Nice to know our Republican House Leader there did what the Dems could not do. It's dead this year. Hope adults trying to defend themselves coming home from class don't die with it. Steve The law cannot tell us we cannot defend myself with the tools necessary to do so. Our academic administrators are the scourge of this country, causing more problems than just this. CareerTech administrators and many of the educational administrators are blood sucking leaches on Oklahoma tax payers. They give little or nothing for the money they get and cause a great deal of damage to our state and country. This is just one example. I'm a IT Director for a public school, am I a blood sucking leech as well, or only academic administrators? |
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Speaker of the House Chris Benge refused to allow the bill to be heard today. Nice to know our Republican House Leader there did what the Dems could not do. It's dead this year. Hope adults trying to defend themselves coming home from class don't die with it. Steve The law cannot tell us we cannot defend myself with the tools necessary to do so. Our academic administrators are the scourge of this country, causing more problems than just this. CareerTech administrators and many of the educational administrators are blood sucking leaches on Oklahoma tax payers. They give little or nothing for the money they get and cause a great deal of damage to our state and country. This is just one example. I'm a IT Director for a public school, am I a blood sucking leech as well, or only academic administrators? I said EDUCATIONAL ADMINISTRATORS. A really fine example is that idiot they fired from Oklahoma City not too long ago. He did things like take his wife on "business trips" and paid her expenses with a credit card issued to him from the OKC Public School System. As the school superintendent he was making $150K a year. Why do we need 531 school system superintendents making a $100K each a year? Some school systems are so small the school superintendent is a bus driver. Why did Francis Tuttle spend $8.5 Million for a "Construction Center" a few years ago, teach Cosmetoloy and GED classes when it was supposed to help end the skilled trades labor shortage for construction in the area? And they are 40% vacant space on their other campuses. Why does Francis Tuttle spend twice as much administrative salaries than they do on instructors salaries? (Last figures available were 2005 before they hid the figures with bull shit descriptions. It was $2.1 Million administrative costs to $1.1 million instructor costs). Let's talk about Reg KXXXXXXy, past president of the NEA. I've personally seen that fat man wearing a $25K Presidential Rolex at an ACE function. The past OEA President, Roy XXXXXX, lives in a huge refurbished mansion in Heritage HIlls in Oklahoma City. His wife had a job at the OEA but she never seemed to be there. I can go on and on. Some of the schools administrators are probably as honest as the day is long and try to earn their money. But having dealt with school administrators from grade schools, to high schools, to seeing the outright theft - ghost employees - that places like OU have, I think a lot of them should be hanged. You need anymore further clarification? ETA This is a sore spot with me. In 2008 4800 kids dropped out of high school in the OKC metro area. The damn administrators have this attitude if a kid isn't college material or an academic all star, he/she is crap. And the kids catch onto that. The damn CareerTech administrators are trying to turn our votechs into junior colleges when they are supposed to VOCATIONAL training for the kids that don't go to college. Francis Tuttle has 55+ pages in their catalog. Only half a page is in the Technical/Industrial Courses. Those are Tile Laying, Bicycle Maintenance, Cabinet Making, etc. Give me friggin' break. Technical Center my ass. The high school nearest me is PC North. They brag about having the highest number of National Merit Scholars in the state. They don't ever mention they have one of the highest drop out rates too. And bunches of their kids go to prison. If I hear one more school administrator talk about it being the parents fault, I'm going to land on them with both feet. I coached PC North in indoor soccer. I knew which kids were the best athletes an players. When it came to the high school playing the best players in outdoor soccer, it didn't happen. Their parent's names determined who played and who didn't. When I coached the kids indoors, EVERYBODY played and we still beat everyone. I coached for the kids, not the damn parents in the PTSA. The priority of the schools are the KIDS, not some game playing, policy dictating asshole school administrator. Like that Enid administrator that sent Enid CareerTech employees to lobby the legislature on one small issue. What the hell do you think they do when it comes to the finances? Throw tons of bullshit at the legislators saying we need more money, more money, more money, etc. And we're paying the salaries of these incompetent blood tax revenue sucking leaches. ETA One more thing - our public school systems are killing us. They can't even teach kids how to balance a friggin' check book. And they never stop crying "education is our salvation". Well, we've wasted billions of dollars on it across the nation and the quality of education keeps getting worse. Educational administrators aren't being held accountable for the shitty job they've been doing on a national and local level. EdDs and PhDs think they can't make a mistake. I've seen EdDs in charge of vocational training that don't even know what a grease zerk is or how to use a grease gun. Incompetence in everything but putting out lots of smoke and bull shit is really rampant in a HUGE percentage of the empty shirts running education in this country. Like OSU-OKC trying to get a lineman's program started for the REAs in the state. They couldn't find anyone to head the program because they wanted a Masters in Ed with 10 years experience climbing poles, have a commercial chauffeur's license, could run a back hoe and bull dozer, etc.  . I don't know who they finally got to run the program, but they had no idea of what the hell they were doing.
OSU-OKC had one hell of a Refrigeration-HVAC program for years. It was a huge success. The guy that started it retired, and they couldn't find a HVAC contractor with his Masters in Education and 5 years of running a similar program, etc. So they dropped it. It's all right with the OSU-OKC administrators though. They want to change the school to a 4 year school anyway. They can't make more money and get more prestige that way.. And then there's the secretary of the past Head Regent of Higher Education that got a $75K year job running the driving school they run for LE, EM, and FDs. You know she had lots of experience in training drivers safety at high speeds. 
I can go on and on and on. Education in this state is a friggin' racket and theft of taxpayers money by a HUGE NUMBER of educational administrators. One more thing - We're all paying the price for this bullshit in more than just our tax dollars. Education in this country is severely lacking and MORE MONEY isn't the cure. Administrators waste it on hiring more administrators so they can claim more responsibility and make more money when in effect they are greatly over paid and way under worked. They throw out so much smoke you can't find substance in almost anything they say. You damn sure can't trust them when they say they aren't responsible and that they need more revenue. |
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Academic/education clarification would've sufficed
BTW I agree, I often get thrown in to the lot while principles that can barley read the policy manual and make 65-90K a year(a super that makes 140K), and with my MIS degree and MCSE, get paid less, and I work year around. But I'm not in it for the $$, my kids get to go to a school that dare I say the majority of teachers are Conservative(as we don't have any private schools in the area, well short of Catholic school). |
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Academic/education clarification would've sufficed
BTW I agree, I often get thrown in to the lot while principles that can barley read the policy manual and make 65-90K a year(a super that makes 140K), and with my MIS degree and MCSE, get paid less, and I work year around. But I'm not in it for the $$, my kids get to go to a school that dare I say the majority of teachers are Conservative(as we don't have any private schools in the area, well short of Catholic school). All I can is I admire you. Because if I worked around any more of those administrative incompetent a**holes, I'd strangle them. Any time I get involved like I did with PC North, or being an instructor at OU, I run into the worst in all situations. So many I think my mission in life is to step in all the hidden shit piles. The one that hurts the worst - I brought GM to OU/NCED for technical training and pissed off CareerTech in a big way. I had a young girl, single mother 26 years old, set up to handle all the paperwork and to get a lot of credit for contract we were bringing in. The day before the contract was to be signed an EdD that couldn't find his ass with either hand had her fired and walked out. He took the paper work over to GM the next day to be signed so he could get the credit for the large contract. The boys at GM didn't sign the contract after I told them what happened. They did later on but that back stabbing incompetent doctorate got fired after they complained about his ineptitude. That poor girl damn near had her life wrecked over that. I didn't stay long after that. And you wouldn't believe OU kept me on the payroll for three months AFTER I QUIT and while I was working at the OMD. They wanted to list my credentials with ACE for some reason. When I kept telling them to stop depositing a paycheck into my account, their payroll supervisor - Percy - told me "We have other people that get paychecks that don't work here and they don't complain.".
Friggin' bunch of thieves. I did pay back the money but they wanted back the gross, not the net pay, and told me it would be taken care of when I got my tax return back. Educational administrators are incredibly assinine in so many situations it is not believable. |