Posted: 4/3/2014 6:47:07 PM EDT
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Today I got lost by Oakbrook Center mall, I don't go to there often. I drove into the parking lot and what do I see....a no CC sign.
I assume the property manager made the mall off limits. But can they make a parking lot off limits also? Did I misinterpret the sign? Is that what the sign say? Opinions? |
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Quoted:
Today I got lost by Oakbrook Center mall, I don't go to there often. I drove into the parking lot and what do I see....a no CC sign. I assume the property manager made the mall off limits. But can they make a parking lot off limits also? Did I misinterpret the sign? Is that what the sign say? Opinions? no they cannot say anything about whats in your car. Yes they can give people heads up that their property does not allow CCarry so people know to leave it in their car. |
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Parking lots in themselves are off-limits in prohibited locations, but the immediate area around your vehicle is exempted in the law in order to allow for storage in your trunk. However, employers can still prohibit firearms in their employee parking areas as a policy. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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In simple terms.
Your vehicle is safe haven...you can leave the gun (loaded or unloaded) in your vehicle anywhere as long as there is a lock between it and the outside world. If you exit the vehicle to place the gun in the trunk, it must be unloaded and enclosed in a case (transport mode) to exit the vehicle to place in the trunk. |
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(b) Notwithstanding subsections (a), (a-5), and (a-10) of this Section except under paragraph (22) or (23) of subsection (a), any licensee prohibited from carrying a concealed firearm into the parking area of a prohibited location specified in subsection (a), (a-5), or (a-10) of this Section shall be permitted to carry a concealed firearm on or about his or her person within a vehicle into the parking area and may store a firearm or ammunition concealed in a case within a locked vehicle or locked container out of plain view within the vehicle in the parking area. A licensee may carry a concealed firearm in the immediate area surrounding his or her vehicle within a prohibited parking lot area only for the limited purpose of storing or retrieving a firearm within the vehicle's trunk, provided the licensee ensures the concealed firearm is unloaded prior to exiting the vehicle. For purposes of this subsection, "case" includes a glove compartment or console that completely encloses the concealed firearm or ammunition, the trunk of the vehicle, or a firearm carrying box, shipping box, or other container.
Source: 430 ILCS 66/65 (b) What this means is that in all prohibited areas, except for nuclear and federal prohibited areas, you can "carry a concealed firearm on or about his or her person within a vehicle into the parking area and may store a firearm or ammunition concealed in a case within a locked vehicle or locked container out of plain view within the vehicle" or "carry a concealed firearm in the immediate area surrounding his or her vehicle within a prohibited parking lot area only for the limited purpose of storing or retrieving a firearm within the vehicle's trunk, provided the licensee ensures the concealed firearm is unloaded prior to exiting the vehicle." Option 1 is to store the loaded or unloaded firearm in the passenger compartment of the vehicle in the "glove compartment or console that completely encloses the concealed firearm or ammunition, the trunk of the vehicle, or a firearm carrying box, shipping box, or other container." Option 2 is to unload the firearm, conceal it, and then exit the vehicle with the concealed unloaded firearm for the purpose of placing the unloaded firearm into the vehicle's trunk. IMHO, Option 2 should only be used if Option 1 is not available to you. |
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Quoted:
Parking lots in themselves are off-limits in prohibited locations, but the immediate area around your vehicle is exempted in the law in order to allow for storage in your trunk. However, employers can still prohibit firearms in their employee parking areas as a policy. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile It is unclear if this is true or not. I have seen an opinion on the IL Bar Association website that suggests the FCCA overrides the employer's right to prohibit concealed firearms in its parking lot. The "shall be permitted" language is pretty strong. It is conceivable that a court might decide that the law can't be enforced that way against private property owners, either in general, or WRT to employees, A court could determine that a private property owner's rights to control his own property override the FCCA in this respect. Or the courts might decide in favor of the FCCA. There is just no way to know with any certainty at present. In any case, an employer can have any policy they want, and can enforce that policy in the way they see fit. Having to go to court after being terminated for having a pistol in your trunk as allowed by the FCCA will be a time consuming and expensive proposition, with no guarantee a court will grant you any relief. Your bills will still be coming in during the 3 months or more it takes for a judge to get to your case while you have no paycheck. The preemption language probably covers someone if they are employed by a public entity. There are potentially some ways a public employer might try to enforce some anti FCCA rules, but I think in the end it is likely they would not pass muster in court. |
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Quoted:
It is unclear if this is true or not. I have seen an opinion on the IL Bar Association website that suggests the FCCA overrides the employer's right to prohibit concealed firearms in its parking lot. The "shall be permitted" language is pretty strong. It is conceivable that a court might decide that the law can't be enforced that way against private property owners, either in general, or WRT to employees, A court could determine that a private property owner's rights to control his own property override the FCCA in this respect. Or the courts might decide in favor of the FCCA. There is just no way to know with any certainty at present. In any case, an employer can have any policy they want, and can enforce that policy in the way they see fit. Having to go to court after being terminated for having a pistol in your trunk as allowed by the FCCA will be a time consuming and expensive proposition, with no guarantee a court will grant you any relief. Your bills will still be coming in during the 3 months or more it takes for a judge to get to your case while you have no paycheck. The preemption language probably covers someone if they are employed by a public entity. There are potentially some ways a public employer might try to enforce some anti FCCA rules, but I think in the end it is likely they would not pass muster in court. Quoted:
Quoted:
Parking lots in themselves are off-limits in prohibited locations, but the immediate area around your vehicle is exempted in the law in order to allow for storage in your trunk. However, employers can still prohibit firearms in their employee parking areas as a policy. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile It is unclear if this is true or not. I have seen an opinion on the IL Bar Association website that suggests the FCCA overrides the employer's right to prohibit concealed firearms in its parking lot. The "shall be permitted" language is pretty strong. It is conceivable that a court might decide that the law can't be enforced that way against private property owners, either in general, or WRT to employees, A court could determine that a private property owner's rights to control his own property override the FCCA in this respect. Or the courts might decide in favor of the FCCA. There is just no way to know with any certainty at present. In any case, an employer can have any policy they want, and can enforce that policy in the way they see fit. Having to go to court after being terminated for having a pistol in your trunk as allowed by the FCCA will be a time consuming and expensive proposition, with no guarantee a court will grant you any relief. Your bills will still be coming in during the 3 months or more it takes for a judge to get to your case while you have no paycheck. The preemption language probably covers someone if they are employed by a public entity. There are potentially some ways a public employer might try to enforce some anti FCCA rules, but I think in the end it is likely they would not pass muster in court. Until a bill is passed and signed into law, or a legal challenge is vetted by a federal court, I would say that the employer's policy will trump employee rights and will teach as such in my courses. Just like there is no free-speech in the workplace, since the Bill of Rights applies to governments, not private entities. An employer's policy infraction won't result in criminal-charges for a handgun in the vehicle, but the employee will still most likely lose their job. The real question is what liability the employer will incur by banning firearms for personal protection on their property, without the presence of a sufficient armed security force on-site in case of violence. |
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Quoted:
Until a bill is passed and signed into law, or a legal challenge is vetted by a federal court, I would say that the employer's policy will trump employee rights and will teach as such in my courses. Just like there is no free-speech in the workplace, since the Bill of Rights applies to governments, not private entities. An employer's policy infraction won't result in criminal-charges for a handgun in the vehicle, but the employee will still most likely lose their job. The real question is what liability the employer will incur by banning firearms for personal protection on their property, without the presence of a sufficient armed security force on-site in case of violence. I think it is wise to exercise caution and let others be the test cases. No doubt there will be some, and it won't take real long. I don't see how there is any liability on a private employer for banning guns on their property. There just is no law in Illinois that would make that the case. |
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I don't see how there is any liability on a private employer for banning guns on their property. There just is no law in Illinois that would make that the case. I don't have a lot of knowledge about this aspect but, I have heard the concerns that the property owners don't have any specific immunities from such actions in the law...I personally don't know the liability issue. |