Posted: 6/5/2008 11:17:59 AM EDT
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I am copying this from another site. It is time to start getting very politically active. I've already been writing my representitives, and suprisingly enough, I have been having a pretty good argument via email with Harry Reid (probably his staffers - the emails are signed his name). Instead of always bitching about the liberals and politics on some gun forum, its time we all actually did something about it. Talk is cheap. I also just upgraded my NRA membership to a lifetime mebership and just sent an interest card to my local Republican party. I want to get out and campaign. Obama disturbs me (ok I'll be honest he downright scares me) on such a deep level I can no longer just sit around and hope. 1.Senator Barack Obama appears at this time to be the Democratic Nominee to the Presidency of The United States of America. 2.It is equally apparent that there will be a safe majority of Democrats in both houses of Congress. 3.It is less likely that President Obama will veto Senator Kennedy's microstamping bill this time around. 4.It is unlikely President Obama will oppose re-introducing the ban on "assault rifles" It is also likely "high capacity" magazine ban legislation written by liberal Democrats will be signed into law. 5.Eventually, a new push by special interest groups such as the Brady Bunch and "Americans for Gun Safety" will provide impetus to create legislation similar to that of gun restrictive states. There will be a ban on all weapons with "auto loading" capability (of course, including shotguns). This legislation will eventually evolve to restrict magazine capacity to two rounds or less (thereby affecting pump actuated shotguns). This legislation is already in place in Massachusettes. The microstamping programme outlined by Senator Kennedy will require voluntarily giving up all ammunition and ammunition components stocked in stores as well as those held by individuals. Since there currently is no reliable microstamping technology, there would be no new civilian ammunition manufactured until the technology was implemented. This would effectively eliminate civilian ammunition use for some time. Not all chamberings would be affected. .45 ACP is one of those affected. Subsequent gun bans would require civilian held weapons be voluntarily submitted to local authorities for disposal. |
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everything about the government and society is getting scary. im just wondering if it matters anyomore...republican, democrat, oprah... it seems like the little guy that actually has what is in my opinion a reasonable stance (i.e. personal responsibility, no welfare state, limited government, etc.) gets swallowed up and spit out by the mainstream political parties. really, does it matter obama, clinton, bush, mccain, etc they are all variations of the same path to failure of society. they all pander and dont confront hard issues or "sensitive" issues because their careers come before what is right. between video games, race this and that, affirmative action, cultural sensitivity, rewarding everyone no matter how poorly they do (that was brought up in the army strong thread), etc. we are all doomed...maybe disarmed with obama, but ultimately doomed. am i bleak, maybe i should be more optimistic. |
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I agree with the ideas in this thread. However, I did have some questions. There is a bill that involves "voluntary" turning in of ammo and ammo components by civilians? I would like to read the exact wording. Two round capacity magazines or revolver cylinders? btw, I did an internet search and found the exact wording of the microstamping bill by Kennedy www.theorator.com/bills110/text/s2605.html still wondering about this proposed ammo legislation... I think the main idea here is that if these guys get away with some legislation, they could build on that and ultimately may attempt to take away the right of civilians to owns firearms, which, obviously, is the main concern... |
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Really my main point is that bitching on a forum does nothing (I'm surely guilty of it) and it is time we as citizens get proactive and make noise. Obama scares me more than Osama - seriously. At least Osama has principles he is willing to stand up and fight for, and you know exactly where you stand with him. Spend some time researching Obama and you will be flabergasted. I actually went and read both of his books - ever heard of Mein Kampf? It is astonishing how similiar Obama's first book and Hitlers book are. We have all heard of Malcom X - read what Obama says about him and it will blow your mind. Look at his positions on abaortion, CCW, crime, etc. 2 seconds on his website revealed this jewel: Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama also favors commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. He supports closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. He also supports making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets. |
who knows..maybe he will waffle his stance on guns...hahahah..yeah right...its amazing the things they waffle on and the things they strictly adhere to. i cant stand any of them....you guys are right...maybe if more of us stood up... for those of us who want to contribute to "our cause" where can we get info on who is the correct entity to address our concerns to? is it just a matter of writing a "to whom it may concern...i feel my rights are being violated...etc" i guess im not real good at that kind of thing...maybe someone can list the reps they corresponded with and what was discussed..not necessarily in detail, but in topic? thanks |
Nothing allegedly about it. www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/05/clinton.obama.wrap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories |
NOw that is a scary combo. im sure barbara boxer will be there too |
How bout writing a letter or two? If anyone doesn't feel like spending 10 minutes writing a letter, let me know. I'll write it and send it to you, just put your name on it and send. All my emails from here on out will also have various Obama facts in the sig line. People need to be educated about his true ways and beliefs. |
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If the situation in this country ever gets to the point outlined in the OP, where people are being forced to give up even the most basic firearms and the associated ammunition by force, there will be a very bloody and very short resistance put up by a tiny group of Americans... and they will be branded domestic terrorists and demonized in the media. The soccer-moms of America will applaud law enforcement while watching these confrontations live on CNN. The government will prevail because the same majority that sweep the Democrats to majority power will support the "crackdown on domestic terrorism". I have very little faith left in the average American. |
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If the government tried to make us go the way of England, Australia, ect... Who would inforce the laws? I don't know of anyone, LEO, Military, or anyone else for that matter! That would only leave the UN, and I don't think that they would want to pick a fight with the "People" of the USA! The only other thing that they could do is to go after ammo, tax the hell out of everything, close down the manufacturers, ect... but we are a resourceful people and would go the way of proabition until they got there asses kicked all the way back to where they came! |
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Well, before going into full bore panic mode, I think we should see what SCOTUS has to say on Heller vs D.C. We should hear a ruling on that this month. If it is a favorable decision, it will go a long way towards thwarting any gun grabbing that might be planned. Also, in case you haven't watched it, may I recommend you spend an hour watching the following documentary? www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=681596 It will strengthen your resolve while also giving you ammo in the fight against gun control... |
I can't help but find this statement to be horribly naive. "Who would enforce the laws?", the same types of people enforcing them in the countries you mentioned! No oppressive regime on the face of the planet has had to make due with a lack of willing and/or coerced enforcers. If you can find people in a population that will kill, imprison, brutalize and torture a selected few because a law got passed, I think you'll be able to find a few to help round up guns to "make the streets safer". Think it can't happen here? I'm sure Germans felt the same way in the 1920s. |
There was probably a time when this was true. I would say it passed when John Wayne passed away and made way for such great westerns as "Brokeback Mountain". If you think there is no one who will enforce these laws, I'd like to remind you of a few small happenstances of the past century. While Germany 1930-something is a good example, you can also look to the USSR and friendly Joe Stalin. Cambodia. Laos. VietNam after the US left. If you want something with a more American flair, how about Waco, Texas and Janet Reno's policy of helping small children through incineration! Adolf Hitler would have been jealous! Ask Lon Horiuchi what he thinks of unconstitutional directives. "I vas only folloving orders!" If you think police will not enforce unconstitutional law, you are wrong. They do it now. |
Hell, gunmonkey, you don't have to go that far to look for an example. Look at New Orleans during Katrina to see multi-jurisdictional forces disarming citizens in their own homes. 
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i dont understand obama supporters.. the guy openly flat out refused to wear a flag lapel pin....when he sees its potentially damaging to his campaign, he begins to wear one. the guy openly defends and wont renounce that hate mongering piece of trash "reverend" wright...when he sees its potentially damaging to his campaign, obama renounces his affiliation with him and the church. the guy straight out talks smack about his white grandmother and says shes "a typical white person"..what kind of shit is that....that would never fly with a white person speaking about blacks.. his wife straight out says she is only now proud of america....since her husband is doing well. and if he wasnt? what is her guage for america's greatness... why wouldnt it be oprah's success...is being elected to a high government office not reason enough to say america is great? do people not understand she will be the first lady? she represents america as well? forget bush, his wife is a teacher, proper and polite...obamas wife represents america by making public points of america being bigoted and repressive towards blacks. yeah, thats what we need in the public world forum...to be labeled as bigots. do obama supporters not see thru the BS? is it not obvious the political nonsense and how he mutates to progress. whats to say he wont waffle on major issues. his constituency should be concerned...if he stands for something now, if he takes heat, he will just back down and pull a 180...doesnt that concern them? i would have 10 times more respect for him if he just stuck to his principles and said this is how i feel, i wont change it cause some choose to criticize me... |
I kind of figured that LEO/Military would have chimed in by now. |
You don't think a little thing like obeying the U.S.C. will muzzle the .gov, do you? The 2A hasn't appeared to work... 
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No offense to you, but I can't believe someone is still taking the stance that the thin blue line is going to refuse to enforce a law across the board. Sure, if it comes down to this, some of you will look the other way. Some of you will see where this is all going and resign. A few will relish in the new authority and bust heads when they can. Most will swallow hard and do their job. Those that don't will be replaced with those loyal to the cause and who won't ask questions. History, including recently from Katrina, tells us what will ultimately happen. In order to believe what you posted, one would also need to believe that pre-WW2 Germany was filled with murderous psychopaths just waiting to be turned loose. Hey, I'm glad you feel as you do, but nobody knows the exact path they're going to take until they arrive at that fork in the road. |
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I think some of you people really need to go on a ride along. You have NO idea what goes on in the mind of the average LEO. Stalin, Hitler, etc... they all lead by fear of death. if you did not comply with his orders, off to the gallows for you. Do you think this is going to happen in the US? Take a second and really think about your thought process. The more time I spend on this website, the LESS faith I have in people because you all talk a big game and nobody does anything to change it. You saw the posts with the contact info for various public officials... USE THEM. get off ARFCOM and start spending your time writing to people who can make a difference, if you refuse to make a difference yourself. The average LEO, including me, would not lay down and enforce a "law" that was unconstitutional. We have this little thing called an "Oath of Office" in which we swore to uphold the Constitution against all enemies, both foreign AND domestic. domestic includes people trying to undermine the Constution from the inside. Hell, we even have policies in place within my department that say that we have a little leeway in enforcing orders that we feel are unconstitutional and immoral. GO ON A RIDE ALONG!!! SEE FIRST HAND WHO IS OUT ON THE STREET PROTECTING YOU, BEFORE YOU START SLINGING BULLSHIT ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK THEY ARE/AREN'T CAPABLE OF. Make INFORMED decisions. |
not sure if this would be appropriate, but im sure at waco there was some form of constitutional violation going on...didnt stop a bunch of atf or fbi from going in...maybe im wrong? i respect LE tremendously, but not all are constitutional lawyers and not all will lay down their badges or arms to protest in event of "conflict of right and wrong" ...it only takes some or most to participate in order to carry out an agenda... |
You also have a career which supports you and your family. Are you willing to throw it all away and destroy your prosperity by making a judgement call as to what is unconstitutional and what is just following orders? I get the feeling most police, in hard economic and social times, would NOT sacrifice their or their family's well being just because some idiot supervisor told you to bust a few heads and confiscate some property. |
There is a little bit of cognitive dissonance among the LEOs posting in this thread. I respect your opinions, but we need to face some facts: In the aftermath of Katrina, firearms were confiscated from New Orleans residents under orders from the brass. I understand that some of these were taken from residents while within their homes. The confiscators were "average LEOs" from a number of jurisdictions across this nation, and possibly National Guardsmen. Given you statement above, I am left with three possible ways to rectify the Cognitive Dissonance:
So please, help us all better understand what happened here. All I'm really getting from you guys is a variation of the "It can't happen here" defense. |
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Ah hell, look where Katrina was! The Cops that didn't walk off the job were looting right along with the other Assholes! You guys are paranoid, but thats OK, if the shit does hit the fan, I'll stick around with the good guys, (LEO and Military) and fight to keep your Constitutional rights in check. The next time your in trouble, don't dial 911... Call a hippy! |
That's not exactly the way to further understanding and meaningful dialogue. 
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