Posted: 6/24/2010 5:15:31 AM EDT
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You're the WHTF expert on duracoat... is Tru-strip degreaser safe to use on polymer? Specifically a Blackhawk Axiom 10-22 stock, and Kel-Tec pistol frames? I bought some Duracoat from Midway, and I bought a bottle of Tru-strip. I plan on starting on an old 870 that I've had for 40+ yrs that has most of the bluing worn off. If all goes well, I'll move on to finishing a 10-22 that I built, in two differant colors (receiver & barrel in one color, Axiom stock in another), and then possibly my P3AT and P-11. And then who knows??? I've got almost 50 firearms to "play" with.
None of the included instructions give any preperation instructions for "plastic". All I can find on LWC's website is a recommendation to "blast" polymer with aluminum oxide or sand with 600 grit sandpaper. The nooks & crannies on the Axiom make thorough hand sanding impossible. I've got an airbrush, automotive grade spray-gun and compressor (I've painted a car or two in my day) , but no sand blaster. One thing I've learned is that the prep is 90% of the key to a good job. I plan on "scrubbing" the metal parts with a new toothbrush and the Tru-Strip. Will doing the same on the polymers do any harm? |
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I'm not Flame but I have painted with duracoat many many times. And yes, I have ALUMINUM OXIDE blasted polymers. Never ever sand blast them, they turn hairy because of the makeup of the polymer. But aluminum oxide blasting at lower pressures works wonders. I personally would not use a chemical to do the same job. I don't know how it would affect it., good luck. Where are you at? |
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Quoted:
You're the WHTF expert on duracoat... is Tru-strip degreaser safe to use on polymer? Specifically a Blackhawk Axiom 10-22 stock, and Kel-Tec pistol frames? I bought some Duracoat from Midway, and I bought a bottle of Tru-strip. I plan on starting on an old 870 that I've had for 40+ yrs that has most of the bluing worn off. If all goes well, I'll move on to finishing a 10-22 that I built, in two differant colors (receiver & barrel in one color, Axiom stock in another), and then possibly my P3AT and P-11. And then who knows??? I've got almost 50 firearms to "play" with. None of the included instructions give any preperation instructions for "plastic". All I can find on LWC's website is a recommendation to "blast" polymer with aluminum oxide or sand with 600 grit sandpaper. The nooks & crannies on the Axiom make thorough hand sanding impossible. I've got an airbrush, automotive grade spray-gun and compressor (I've painted a car or two in my day) , but no sand blaster. One thing I've learned is that the prep is 90% of the key to a good job. I plan on "scrubbing" the metal parts with a new toothbrush and the Tru-Strip. Will doing the same on the polymers do any harm? Sorry for late response. U1 is correct. I will check on the tru strip tomorrow. |
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Quoted:
I'm not Flame but I have painted with duracoat many many times. And yes, I have ALUMINUM OXIDE blasted polymers. Never ever sand blast them, they turn hairy because of the makeup of the polymer. But aluminum oxide blasting at lower pressures works wonders. I personally would not use a chemical to do the same job. I don't know how it would affect it., good luck. Where are you at? Thanks for the reply. I picked up a cheap sand blaster today at Home Depot.... but they did not have any alum oxide. The blaster I bought hooks up to an air compressor, and has a "pick-up" hose that you stick into a bucket full of whatever you're using to blast with. A buddy has one just like it that I borrowed a few years ago, when I sand-blasted, then repainted, a steel framed snowmobile trailer (it only cost $14). When I had a new well drilled a few years back, they drilled through 65' of sand. About the bottom 20' was as fine-grained sand as I've ever seen, and I saved it in three 5 gallon buckets... used one to sandblast the trailer and it worked great. But I was afraid of what it would do to the polymer, after seeing how quickly it knocked the rust off that trailer. If the Tru-Strip will harm the polymer, I know that rubbing alcohol will not, and it's a very good cleaning agent for use on plastics. If I can find alum oxide, I'll try blasting. BTW... I'm way up north, between Eagle River and Phelps. |
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I'm not Flame but I have painted with duracoat many many times. And yes, I have ALUMINUM OXIDE blasted polymers. Never ever sand blast them, they turn hairy because of the makeup of the polymer. But aluminum oxide blasting at lower pressures works wonders. I personally would not use a chemical to do the same job. I don't know how it would affect it., good luck. Where are you at? Thanks for the reply. I picked up a cheap sand blaster today at Home Depot.... but they did not have any alum oxide. The blaster I bought hooks up to an air compressor, and has a "pick-up" hose that you stick into a bucket full of whatever you're using to blast with. A buddy has one just like it that I borrowed a few years ago, when I sand-blasted, then repainted, a steel framed snowmobile trailer (it only cost $14). When I had a new well drilled a few years back, they drilled through 65' of sand. About the bottom 20' was as fine-grained sand as I've ever seen, and I saved it in three 5 gallon buckets... used one to sandblast the trailer and it worked great. But I was afraid of what it would do to the polymer, after seeing how quickly it knocked the rust off that trailer. If the Tru-Strip will harm the polymer, I know that rubbing alcohol will not, and it's a very good cleaning agent for use on plastics. If I can find alum oxide, I'll try blasting. BTW... I'm way up north, between Eagle River and Phelps. Hoestly I don't use Tru strip. As far as I am concerned it is over priced brake cleaner. Non-chlorinated brake cleaner is polymer safe. My prep is remove large carbon, clean with brake cleaner, blast with 120 grit aluminum oxide, blow off with air and coat. |
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I'm not Flame but I have painted with duracoat many many times. And yes, I have ALUMINUM OXIDE blasted polymers. Never ever sand blast them, they turn hairy because of the makeup of the polymer. But aluminum oxide blasting at lower pressures works wonders. I personally would not use a chemical to do the same job. I don't know how it would affect it., good luck. Where are you at? Thanks for the reply. I picked up a cheap sand blaster today at Home Depot.... but they did not have any alum oxide. The blaster I bought hooks up to an air compressor, and has a "pick-up" hose that you stick into a bucket full of whatever you're using to blast with. A buddy has one just like it that I borrowed a few years ago, when I sand-blasted, then repainted, a steel framed snowmobile trailer (it only cost $14). When I had a new well drilled a few years back, they drilled through 65' of sand. About the bottom 20' was as fine-grained sand as I've ever seen, and I saved it in three 5 gallon buckets... used one to sandblast the trailer and it worked great. But I was afraid of what it would do to the polymer, after seeing how quickly it knocked the rust off that trailer. If the Tru-Strip will harm the polymer, I know that rubbing alcohol will not, and it's a very good cleaning agent for use on plastics. If I can find alum oxide, I'll try blasting. BTW... I'm way up north, between Eagle River and Phelps. Hoestly I don't use Tru strip. As far as I am concerned it is over priced brake cleaner. Non-chlorinated brake cleaner is polymer safe. My prep is remove large carbon, clean with brake cleaner, blast with 120 grit aluminum oxide, blow off with air and coat. Thanks for the advice. I've got a couple of cans of brake cleaner in the pole barn. I'll have to read the label and see if it's non-chlorinated. If not, I'm sure the local NAPA store will have some. As long as I've got the Tru-Strip, I'll use it on the metal parts. Who sells the 120 grit aluminum oxide? Is it normally sold at home-improvement centers, or maybe body shop suppliers? Home Depot, where I bought the sand-blaster, didn't have any. The only other home-improvent center in the area is Menards.... and Fleet-Farm, but that's 65 miles away in Antigo. I've got a friend that owns a body shop that specializes in restorations, and I'm going there today to do some work on a 1960 Corvette. I'll see if they've got any (or know of a local source). |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm not Flame but I have painted with duracoat many many times. And yes, I have ALUMINUM OXIDE blasted polymers. Never ever sand blast them, they turn hairy because of the makeup of the polymer. But aluminum oxide blasting at lower pressures works wonders. I personally would not use a chemical to do the same job. I don't know how it would affect it., good luck. Where are you at? Thanks for the reply. I picked up a cheap sand blaster today at Home Depot.... but they did not have any alum oxide. The blaster I bought hooks up to an air compressor, and has a "pick-up" hose that you stick into a bucket full of whatever you're using to blast with. A buddy has one just like it that I borrowed a few years ago, when I sand-blasted, then repainted, a steel framed snowmobile trailer (it only cost $14). When I had a new well drilled a few years back, they drilled through 65' of sand. About the bottom 20' was as fine-grained sand as I've ever seen, and I saved it in three 5 gallon buckets... used one to sandblast the trailer and it worked great. But I was afraid of what it would do to the polymer, after seeing how quickly it knocked the rust off that trailer. If the Tru-Strip will harm the polymer, I know that rubbing alcohol will not, and it's a very good cleaning agent for use on plastics. If I can find alum oxide, I'll try blasting. BTW... I'm way up north, between Eagle River and Phelps. Hoestly I don't use Tru strip. As far as I am concerned it is over priced brake cleaner. Non-chlorinated brake cleaner is polymer safe. My prep is remove large carbon, clean with brake cleaner, blast with 120 grit aluminum oxide, blow off with air and coat. Thanks for the advice. I've got a couple of cans of brake cleaner in the pole barn. I'll have to read the label and see if it's non-chlorinated. If not, I'm sure the local NAPA store will have some. As long as I've got the Tru-Strip, I'll use it on the metal parts. Who sells the 120 grit aluminum oxide? Is it normally sold at home-improvement centers, or maybe body shop suppliers? Home Depot, where I bought the sand-blaster, didn't have any. The only other home-improvent center in the area is Menards.... and Fleet-Farm, but that's 65 miles away in Antigo. I've got a friend that owns a body shop that specializes in restorations, and I'm going there today to do some work on a 1960 Corvette. I'll see if they've got any (or know of a local source). This is what I use for cleaning parts after I blast them. And it works great. I just don't do it commercially for anyone any more. Need an FFL to do it. FT is da man when it comes to Duracoat. I would hit up an auto parts sourcs for your alum oxide. I got mine from Harbor Freight. It won't "rough" the finish as bad as sand. If you use sand you will want to lightly sand with 120 grit (max) sand paper to smooth down the "hair" sand will leave behind. And FT knows what I mean by hair. Sand really raises hell with any kind of polymers. When doing black polymers all you have to do is slightly rough the finish. Aluminum Oxide will turn a black stock slightly gray when it's "done enough" to paint. It's not rocket science, just take your time, and trust me you can't degrease enough. I'd easily go through a whole can and sometimes two on a long firearm. And my finishes never ever peeled. Good luck!!!  And they way I used to do it is: Remove all parts. Alum-Oxide blast. Blow off excess. Clean with Degreaser. Clean with Degreaser. Clean with Degreaser. (yes, three times) Blow off with air. Paint. If you use a stripper make sure and degrease at least three times. Strippers can leave a film that paint won't like. (you CAN'T degrease enough!) You have a buddy with a body shop? He should have one of these (like mine) around somewhere.  |
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I checked out every possible source in my area for aluminum oxide this morning.... only available by ordering a 50lb bucket, for over $100, plus freight. In my "research" on alum oxide, I discovered that this stuff is re-usable, so I certainly don't need 50lbs of it!! At most, I'll be cleaning a rifle stock or two and a couple of handgun frames. When I returned home a little while ago, and saw Unique's post above, I checked out Harbor Freight tools. They have it, in a finer 220 grit, so I ordered 5 lbs. ($18.99). I also ordered their "air eraser" kit for $20, which is a mini sand-blaster type tool that looks like my airbrush. I've already got 3 cans of ( non-chlorinated ) brake cleaner (I use that stuff a lot for cleaning lock & safe parts, so I've always got plenty on hand).
Thanks guys for the help. I'll let you know how things turn out. |
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I checked out every possible source in my area for aluminum oxide this morning.... only available by ordering a 50lb bucket, for over $100, plus freight. In my "research" on alum oxide, I discovered that this stuff is re-usable, so I certainly don't need 50lbs of it!! At most, I'll be cleaning a rifle stock or two and a couple of handgun frames. When I returned home a little while ago, and saw Unique's post above, I checked out Harbor Freight tools. They have it, in a finer 220 grit, so I ordered 5 lbs. ($18.99). I also ordered their "air eraser" kit for $20, which is a mini sand-blaster type tool that looks like my airbrush. I've already got 3 cans of ( non-chlorinated ) brake cleaner (I use that stuff a lot for cleaning lock & safe parts, so I've always got plenty on hand). Thanks guys for the help. I'll let you know how things turn out. What area are you in? I buy my AO at Midwest Finishing in Hartland |
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I finished my first duracoat project, and it was easy. It turned out great, too. The "subject" was an old 870 that I've owned for 40+ years. I used to pheasant hunt with it, and it was pretty beat up. I'm making a "home defense" gun out of it (I don't like the word "tactical"). The bluing was mostly gone on the receiver & barrel. The wood stock was all scratched up, and the forearm was glued back together after it got broken on a goose hunting trip to southern ILL.
I replaced the stock & forearm with a new black synthetic from Remington. I duracoated the receiver & magazine tube, bottom section of trigger group, bolt carrier, 8-shot magazine extension, and the 19" barrel.... all in ACU grey/green. The barrel was originally a 26" non-vent rib, with fixed IC choke. I cut it back to 19", and drilled & tapped the bead sight back on. I left the new stock black. I did not do the chrome bolt.... that's getting done in another color, and I figured I'd wait and do the bolt when I do my next project, the receiver of an old Rem 1100 3" mag that I use for duck hunting, and do both bolts together while I've got the duracoat mixed and in my airbrush. The 1100 already has a new camo stock and the barrel is covered in matching camo-clad. I put the camo-clad material on the barrel & receiver a few years ago. It has held up remarkably well on the barrel, but it keeps peeling loose on the edges of the receiver, so just the receiver needs to be covered in a dull, camo-like color (I'm using "woodland tan", which blends in well with the "Advantage Wetlands" stock & barrel). As for those bolts, they're both chrome plated. How well does duracoat hold up over chrome? I also have some of the Wheeler's Ceramacoat bake-on gun finish.... would baking the black Ceramacoat on the chrome bolts be a better option? |
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Finished my second duracoat project today. Ruger 10-22, Blackhawk Axiom stock, Shooters Ridge heavy barrel, Leapers 6X mil-dot scope. Duracoat OD green for a base, covered with balsam branches and sprayed "through" them with desert brown, then rearranged the balsam and sprayed with some woodland tan.
http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0013.jpg http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0017-1.jpg BTW... I found out that brake cleaner and Ramline 10-22 mags do not mix. |
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Finished my second duracoat project today. Ruger 10-22, Blackhawk Axiom stock, Shooters Ridge heavy barrel, Leapers 6X mil-dot scope. Duracoat OD green for a base, covered with balsam branches and sprayed "through" them with desert brown, then rearranged the balsam and sprayed with some woodland tan. http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0013.jpg http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0017-1.jpg BTW... I found out that brake cleaner and Ramline 10-22 mags do not mix. Gun looks great, nice work. Yeah you have to watch out for brake cleaner and certain types of plascitcs. |
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Quoted: awesome! I am very impressed!!!Quoted: Finished my second duracoat project today. Ruger 10-22, Blackhawk Axiom stock, Shooters Ridge heavy barrel, Leapers 6X mil-dot scope. Duracoat OD green for a base, covered with balsam branches and sprayed "through" them with desert brown, then rearranged the balsam and sprayed with some woodland tan. http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0013.jpg http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac102/safcrkr/SUNP0017-1.jpg BTW... I found out that brake cleaner and Ramline 10-22 mags do not mix. Gun looks great, nice work. Yeah you have to watch out for brake cleaner and certain types of plascitcs. |
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Thanks guys. I'm somewhat surprised at how well it did turn out. It actually looks much better than the pictures show, as I used my cheap camera because my good one needed a battery re-charge. But I took my time, and degreased, then degreased, then degreased again. Friday night, I broke it down to 5 parts... stock, trigger group, bolt, bolt handle/return spring, and the barrelled receiver. The stock got blasted twice, with 220 grit alum oxide that I got from Harbor Freight, then cleaned with Simple Green, rinsed, blown dry, then hung up to dry overnight. The metal parts got cleaned first with Tru-strip and a new toothbrush, then twice more with brake clean. I then masked off the top of trigger group, most of the bolt (only the side that shows through the ejection port got coated), covered the recoil spring, plugged the muzzle end of the barrel with a rubber plug, and filled the empty receiver with crumpled up newspaper.
Saturday morning, everything including stock, got one more blast of brake clean, then the stock, trigger group, bolt handle, and barrelled action (complete with scope) got 4 coats of OD green, applied about 30 minutes apart. The side of the bolt got 2 coats of woodland tan. They hung from hooks fashioned out of metal coat hangers overnight in my garage. Sunday, I put the barreled action back in the stock (I didn't insert the bolt or trigger group). I then layed it on its side on a cardboard box, and covered everything with balsam boughs cut from a tree behind my garage. I then cranked up the air pressure on my compressor from 30-45 lbs, and sprayed the whole works from end to end with desert brown, then quickly removed the balsam. I let it dry about 10 minutes (the light overspray dries REALLY fast) then turned it over and did the other side. Then the top, then the bottom, in a 4 step process. I then repeated the whole balsam process, this time with woodland tan. It took about 3 hours on friday night, 3 hours on saturday, and another 3 on Sunday... including final re-assembly and test firing a few shots. I did make one mistake... I had a Shooters Ridge bi-pod on the rifle that I Intended to duracoat also, but I had taken it off to use on my Savage .17HMR last weekend, and I totally forgot about it. Now I've got to repeat all the mixing and airbrush cleaning just for the bi-pod. |