Posted: 12/3/2008 9:22:11 PM EDT
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If you do not have a carry permit is there a way to have a handgun with you?
If it were unloaded? I'm curious because my wife is 20 and one of her co-workers(who is also her best friend) was recently kidnapped by an ex bf who also tried to kill her. The freak then tried committing suicide after she got away from him, unfortunately he failed at that as well. |
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I can't answer the legality of your question, but concealed is concealed right? For people who want to be very inconspicuous with their carry, The Wilderness Safepacker Holster is a good choice. |
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Open carry, but she would need to put it in the trunk of her car unloaded if she wants to take it with her in the car. Tell her to go and pay the $55 dollars and get a permit. Then she would be fine and not have to worry. she's not 21... However you can buy her a tazer or a can of mace... it's allowed in a lot more places and people are not as afraid to use it as a gun... you can also get keychain sized OC spray which works wonders. |
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RCW says you can have a pistol with you, on you, in your fixed place of business. Not sure if this includes those under 21 though.
And VR is right, non-lethal options are always good to have. Not every violent type of encounter has to end in shots fired. If an attacker can just be sprayed and kicked a few times, giving the cops time to get there and make an arrest, all the better. |
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RCW says you can have a pistol with you, on you, in your fixed place of business. Not sure if this includes those under 21 though. And VR is right, non-lethal options are always good to have. Not every violent type of encounter has to end in shots fired. If an attacker can just be sprayed and kicked a few times, giving the cops time to get there and make an arrest, all the better. I agree...The only thing that has me worried is that when he kidnapped this girl he had a gun that he held to her head...then when she got away he shot himself in the face unsuccessfully, which tells me that he isn't afraid to use his gun... I just want to make sure that if he decides to get stupid that she isn't "bringing a knife to a gun fight." |
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If you do not have a carry permit is there a way to have a handgun with you?
Under 21? Only within some narrow exceptions. RCW 9.41.240
Possession of pistol by person from eighteen to twenty-one. Unless an exception under RCW 9.41.042, 9.41.050, or 9.41.060 applies, a person at least eighteen years of age, but less than twenty-one years of age, may possess a pistol only: (1) In the person's place of abode; (2) At the person's fixed place of business; or (3) On real property under his or her control. RCW 9.41.042
Children — Permissible firearm possession. RCW 9.41.040(2)(a)(iii) shall not apply to any person under the age of eighteen years who is: (1) In attendance at a hunter's safety course or a firearms safety course; (2) Engaging in practice in the use of a firearm or target shooting at an established range authorized by the governing body of the jurisdiction in which such range is located or any other area where the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited; (3) Engaging in an organized competition involving the use of a firearm, or participating in or practicing for a performance by an organized group that uses firearms as a part of the performance; (4) Hunting or trapping under a valid license issued to the person under Title 77 RCW; (5) In an area where the discharge of a firearm is permitted, is not trespassing, and the person either: (a) Is at least fourteen years of age, has been issued a hunter safety certificate, and is using a lawful firearm other than a pistol; or (b) is under the supervision of a parent, guardian, or other adult approved for the purpose by the parent or guardian; (6) Traveling with any unloaded firearm in the person's possession to or from any activity described in subsection (1), (2), (3), (4), or (5) of this section; (7) On real property under the control of his or her parent, other relative, or legal guardian and who has the permission of the parent or legal guardian to possess a firearm; (8) At his or her residence and who, with the permission of his or her parent or legal guardian, possesses a firearm for the purpose of exercising the rights specified in RCW 9A.16.020(3); or (9) Is a member of the armed forces of the United States, national guard, or organized reserves, when on duty. RCW 9.41.060 Exceptions to restrictions on carrying firearms. The provisions of RCW 9.41.050 shall not apply to: (1) Marshals, sheriffs, prison or jail wardens or their deputies, or other law enforcement officers of this state or another state; (2) Members of the armed forces of the United States or of the national guard or organized reserves, when on duty; (3) Officers or employees of the United States duly authorized to carry a concealed pistol; (4) Any person engaged in the business of manufacturing, repairing, or dealing in firearms, or the agent or representative of the person, if possessing, using, or carrying a pistol in the usual or ordinary course of the business; (5) Regularly enrolled members of any organization duly authorized to purchase or receive pistols from the United States or from this state; (6) Regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for the purpose of target shooting, when those members are at or are going to or from their places of target practice; (7) Regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for the purpose of modern and antique firearm collecting, when those members are at or are going to or from their collector's gun shows and exhibits; (8) Any person engaging in a lawful outdoor recreational activity such as hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, or horseback riding, only if, considering all of the attendant circumstances, including but not limited to whether the person has a valid hunting or fishing license, it is reasonable to conclude that the person is participating in lawful outdoor activities or is traveling to or from a legitimate outdoor recreation area; (9) Any person while carrying a pistol unloaded and in a closed opaque case or secure wrapper; or (10) Law enforcement officers retired for service or physical disabilities, except for those law enforcement officers retired because of mental or stress-related disabilities. This subsection applies only to a retired officer who has: (a) Obtained documentation from a law enforcement agency within Washington state from which he or she retired that is signed by the agency's chief law enforcement officer and that states that the retired officer was retired for service or physical disability; and (b) not been convicted or found not guilty by reason of insanity of a crime making him or her ineligible for a concealed pistol license. RCW 9.41.050
Carrying firearms. (1)(a) Except in the person's place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a concealed pistol. (b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter 7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction. (2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle. (b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor. (3)(a) A person at least eighteen years of age who is in possession of an unloaded pistol shall not leave the unloaded pistol in a vehicle unless the unloaded pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle. (b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor. (4) Nothing in this section permits the possession of firearms illegal to possess under state or federal law. If it were unloaded?
Depending on what part of the law you want to use that may be required. I'm curious because my wife is 20 and one of her co-workers(who is also her best friend) was recently kidnapped by an ex bf who also tried to kill her. The freak then tried committing suicide after she got away from him, unfortunately he failed at that as well. Anyway she has a restraining order on this kid, and he showed up at their work today. I just want to make sure that she can protect herself if this psycho decides to come and try to kill her again.
Is the wifes friend 21? If so go get the CPL; a temporary emergency license can be issued. (10) Notwithstanding the requirements of subsections (1) through (9) of this section, the chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county of the applicant's residence may issue a temporary emergency license for good cause pending review under subsection (1) of this section. However, a temporary emergency license issued under this subsection shall not exempt the holder of the license from any records check requirement. Temporary emergency licenses shall be easily distinguishable from regular licenses.
For your wife she's going to have to assess any weapons policy at her workplace before deciding what to do. Having her friend advise the workplace of the situation would also be smart and having them give the background to the LEOs ahead of time can't hurt any. As many coworkers as possible should know what this guy looks like so that if he comes around the LEOs can be called to respond. PepperSpray, and not some tiny one either. Stun guns/tasers aren't addressed for us peons, but I'm far from convinced about the value of the ones available to us same peons. RCW 9.91.160 Personal protection spray devices. (1) It is unlawful for a person under eighteen years old, unless the person is at least fourteen years old and has the permission of a parent or guardian to do so, to purchase or possess a personal protection spray device. A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor. (2) No town, city, county, special purpose district, quasi-municipal corporation or other unit of government may prohibit a person eighteen years old or older, or a person fourteen years old or older who has the permission of a parent or guardian to do so, from purchasing or possessing a personal protection spray device or from using such a device in a manner consistent with the authorized use of force under RCW 9A.16.020. No town, city, county, special purpose district, quasi-municipal corporation, or other unit of government may prohibit a person eighteen years old or older from delivering a personal protection spray device to a person authorized to possess such a device. (3) For purposes of this section: (a) "Personal protection spray device" means a commercially available dispensing device designed and intended for use in self-defense and containing a nonlethal sternutator or lacrimator agent, including but not limited to: (i) Tear gas, the active ingredient of which is either chloracetophenone (CN) or O-chlorobenzylidene malonotrile (CS); or (ii) Other agent commonly known as mace, pepper mace, or pepper gas. (b) "Delivering" means actual, constructive, or attempted transferring from one person to another. (4) Nothing in this section authorizes the delivery, purchase, possession, or use of any device or chemical agent that is otherwise prohibited by state law. |
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So it does sound like she is covered by the "fixed place of business" thing.
Of course, it's not just about having a pistol within arms reach.....................does she have any kind of training, at all? A weapon in the hands of an untrained person, in a bad situation, can be just as dangerous to them as to the attacker. And hell yes, this coworker, the one with the restraining order, needs to get her CPL and some instruction, for her own sake. |
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I agree...The only thing that has me worried is that when he kidnapped this girl he had a gun that he held to her head...then when she got away he shot himself in the face unsuccessfully, which tells me that he isn't afraid to use his gun... I just want to make sure that if he decides to get stupid that she isn't "bringing a knife to a gun fight." Please please please tell me she or her friend (21?) lives in seattle and would be willing to show up to the public discussion about nickels plan which would mean she is forcibly disarmed because she cares about the law but her ex didn't care about the law and illegally possessing a gun tried to kill her then himself |
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She is comfortable shooting, she just isn't old enough to have her permit...she works in a jewelery store to open carry is out of the question. I just want to make sure she is safe when I can't be there to protect her. No one is *safe*, you can't always protect the ones you love, they can't always protect themselves (thank you, legislators! great job there, you fuckwits!), and her choosing to work in a jewelry store is her decision. If she is concerned about her safety at work, she needs to find another job until she can pack legally, or pack and everyone keep your damn mouth shut about it! Even packing, she may not be able to do anything until it is way too late. http://www.frontsight.info/video/jewelry-assasination.wmv That is not meant to scare you, it is meant to educate you. When someone's got the jump on you, they got the jump on you, period. |
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Her friend isn't 21 either. My wife hasn't had any formal training, but we shoot every weekend, and I'll be damned if she can't shoot better than me (with formal training).
I'm not concerned about her carrying a gun...other than the fact that she isn't old enough. But, when it comes right down to it I would much rather her be alive. |
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Since I have no job, you can hire me to go sit out there... I'll make sure nothing happens to them! In that fruity costume with wings on it, nobody will ever notice you! I'll punch you in your teef! This doesn't looky fruity, does it? Oh wait... It's manly dammit! I have a beer! Oh, and that is not my wife BTW... Just to make that PERFECTLY clear... http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/3/l_f08215a797f0409a99c9afd19c19cd7e.jpg Good God Man ! You are either extremely secure in your manhood or something is seriously wrong.
ETA: On the OP's topic: If I was being stalked by an armed psycho the last thing on my mind would be whether or not I was carrying legally. I do not advocate breaking any laws or advise anyone to do so but: Personally, I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6. |
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Since I have no job, you can hire me to go sit out there... I'll make sure nothing happens to them! In that fruity costume with wings on it, nobody will ever notice you! I'll punch you in your teef! This doesn't looky fruity, does it? Oh wait... It's manly dammit! I have a beer! Oh, and that is not my wife BTW... Just to make that PERFECTLY clear... http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/3/l_f08215a797f0409a99c9afd19c19cd7e.jpg Good God Man ! You are either extremely secure in your manhood or something is seriously wrong.
I'm a man dammit! If I was wearing make-up, that'd be a different story... |
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Since I have no job, you can hire me to go sit out there... I'll make sure nothing happens to them! In that fruity costume with wings on it, nobody will ever notice you! I'll punch you in your teef! This doesn't looky fruity, does it? Oh wait... It's manly dammit! I have a beer! Oh, and that is not my wife BTW... Just to make that PERFECTLY clear... http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/3/l_f08215a797f0409a99c9afd19c19cd7e.jpg Good God Man ! You are either extremely secure in your manhood or something is seriously wrong.
I'm a man dammit! If I was wearing make-up, that'd be a different story... I see rosey cheecks there... looks like blush to me... |
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Since I have no job, you can hire me to go sit out there... I'll make sure nothing happens to them! In that fruity costume with wings on it, nobody will ever notice you! I'll punch you in your teef! This doesn't looky fruity, does it? Oh wait... It's manly dammit! I have a beer! Oh, and that is not my wife BTW... Just to make that PERFECTLY clear... http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/3/l_f08215a797f0409a99c9afd19c19cd7e.jpg Good God Man ! You are either extremely secure in your manhood or something is seriously wrong.
I'm a man dammit! If I was wearing make-up, that'd be a different story... I see rosey cheecks there... looks like blush to me... More than likely the effects of the alcohol... |
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Yes, Neo, your brother was right about you all along. Way ta turn a decent thread ghey! Skunk was soooooooooooooo right............................. He's the one on the right don't let him fool anybody. It's amazing what a push up bra does to man boobs. |
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She needs to contact her work about the problem. They ought to provide their employees with a couple of well-placed shotguns. Added bonus is that they will be better able to defend against the rise in crime we are going to see with this recession.
If they don't give permission, carry concealed or find a new employer. Given the history there isn't a jury that would convict her for carrying concealed. |


This doesn't looky fruity, does it? Oh wait... 
