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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:17:43 PM EDT
www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_121205WABgunshowsJK.3592120.html
They showed footage of the WAC show, who let the lying bastards in, i did not see them there sat. dirty lying bastards. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:21:26 PM EDT
[#1]
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. " Jefferson quoting criminologist Cesare Beccaria
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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:37:47 PM EDT
[#2]
Looks like old footage in the old building. The roof is too low. Given the media's history of slanting everything they report, it's not a good thing to see in the news.
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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:41:34 PM EDT
[#3]
What about firearms that are stolen out of cars, like the one you left unsecure Gil......? |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:44:33 PM EDT
[#4]
I just watched the report and thought the same thing. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 5:52:56 PM EDT
[#5]
Thats not a gun show in any building that I've been in. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 6:32:57 PM EDT
[#6]
I guess they forgot to mention that only members can buy firearms at the WAC shows and that members must pass the records check.
Asshats! |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 6:53:55 PM EDT
[#7]
Thats what so enraged me, they out right lied and most of the footage was from Wade's or some other gun-store, the gun table footage looked like it was taken from just above waist level, but one thing is for sure the media lied with malace of forethought and should be brought to justice for doing so.
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Posted: 12/12/2005 6:58:46 PM EDT
[#8]
Exactly...I heard this on the radio tonight and thought exactly that...only WAC members can buy/sell guns. It looks like the head LE guy in Olympia must be out of the loop b/c he was the one yapping for the news guy about how the loop hole is so dangerous. I think he should read reports by the FBI/ATF that indicate few bad guys get their guns from shows.
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Posted: 12/12/2005 7:03:39 PM EDT
[#9]
I also saw an article today espousing the "Newspaper Loophole"...i.e. trying to get newspapers to stop taking classified ads for firearms
LEAVE LINK COLD http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14&Itemid=33 At least they have a quote from Joe Waldron in the article.. Between this and Strats article and the Ceasefire poll yesterday, I believe the antis are starting an offensive this week. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 8:38:04 PM EDT
[#10]
+1 |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 9:09:55 PM EDT
[#11]
Yet we never start any... |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 9:12:25 PM EDT
[#12]
This is what happens when the gun control crowd gets their way. Of course, the bastards do not show up when this happens. Just made a big noise when the Brazilian population rejected more gun control in a recen referendum.
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:04:08 PM EDT
[#13]
Don't confuse this guy with the real cops. He has his own agenda and his BS line of thinking does not represent the rank and file LEO's in WA. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:16:28 PM EDT
[#14]
No shit!
Your best homie sets you up with a gat, you just tell the cops you got it at a gunshow. I hate Seattle!  |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:20:23 PM EDT
[#15]
I can't stand the use of the word "police" in this context, as if ALL offficers are in agreement on gun control issues, "police believe" or "police are trying to" I know a fair amount of cops, not one of which supports more restrictions for law abiding citizens. And hearing the chief talk about accountability is such bullshit coming from a man who LOST his sidearm.
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:33:02 PM EDT
[#16]
Don't forget when Tommy the Whale got whacked. 
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:36:31 PM EDT
[#17]
You masturbating over there?  Or are you talking about your eyebrow? |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 10:47:51 PM EDT
[#18]
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Posted: 12/12/2005 11:02:45 PM EDT
[#19]
Right or Wrong,that was Murder, no matter how you justify it... |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 11:04:17 PM EDT
[#20]
Self defence is not murder, it is justifiable homocide. |
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Posted: 12/12/2005 11:14:40 PM EDT
[#21]
Whether you consider right or wrong doesn't matter--it was a counteroffensive, provided that was the reason he was killed and it wasn't revenge by one of the people he acted against as a prosecutor. Ideally, Whaley would've faced trial for his crimes. As it is, I hope he is joined in Hell by the criminals his gun control efforts helped.
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Posted: 12/13/2005 12:24:13 AM EDT
[#22]
Agree'd... |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 5:58:35 AM EDT
[#23]
Shooting someone through the window of their house while they are working at a computer is not self defense.
What kind of BS is it to say "Whether you consider right or wrong doesn't matter--it was a counteroffensive"? We gote enough grief from the antigun nuts initially crying that the progun people killed him without you dancing with glee in his blood. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 6:19:00 AM EDT
[#24]
I have to agree with SARS on this one. I'm glad the SOB is dead and I hope his soul is rotting in hell. Who knows for sure why Mr. Wales was popped. It could have been something totally unrelated to gun control but just the same I'm glad the SOB is dead and I hope the FUDS never find the shooter! Phil, I'm trying to flame you but I have to ask the rhetorical question: Where is your line in the sand? How much more incremental tyranny are you willing to endure before you take sides in the fight for what is left of our freedom? As for the right of self defense, I personally beleive that the demise of Tom Wales was justified self defense because that guy was out to kill all of us with his abuse of power and his personal agenda. If the government takes away your god given right to defend your self then you might as well be dead. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 7:55:43 AM EDT
[#25]
If abuse of power and an unattractive personal agenda is reason enough for you to claim that killing someone in cold blood is self defense then buddy you must have an awfully long list of people who you think are trying to kill you. Your questions were rhetorical, but I will address them anyway. If you don't know that I have a side in this fight then you haven't been paying any attention at all. I just happen to believe that whacking people on the other side of the gun rights fight was not appropriate in 2001 when wales was murdered neither would it be appropriate as I write this today. My line in the sand is my line in the sand, I'd think one would want to know when the first line is crossed, the line that through the words of some would seem to result in overt actions unless they are merely full of rhetoric, not the line you are implying is so much further back that you find it not to your liking. The only assett that wales brought to his side of the table was his position as a prosecutor, as a debate opponent he was laughable as he'd often lapse into emotional outbursts and come off as a loon. He's been more worth to ceasefire since his murder as a fund raising tool and a martyr then he was when he was with them. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 8:36:07 AM EDT
[#26]
Anti gunners who think any such law will keep guns out of a criminals hands are nuts.
Last time I checked it was illegal for the criminals & bad guys to have / do drugs and they seem to have no problem getting their hands on dope everywhere in town. Banning / restricing firearms sales @ gun shows will do no more to curb a felons access to guns anymore than thinking the cure for obesity is to stop selling spoons. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 8:50:01 AM EDT
[#27]
<<TWITCH>>
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Posted: 12/13/2005 8:52:22 AM EDT
[#28]
+1
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Posted: 12/13/2005 10:00:53 AM EDT
[#29]
Phil, I suggest you read the thread. R-32 asserted that folks that oppose usurpations of our rights never counterattack, I pointed out a case where a counterattack was made. Your view or mine does not affect whether or not an event occurred.
Killing anyone that campaigns to enslave others is justified, though it may not always be prudent. Wales was effectively soliciting a hit-man to dictate that you must abide by his wishes or be killed. Was he effective at it? Not really, he did not get a hit-man to agree to kill us. He did attempt to, however, justifying the defensive use of force. It is very analogous to the justification for the war in Iraq (minus the shoddy intelligence work). Saddam reportedly threatened the US, attempted to get terrorists to attack, and stockpiled WMD. Whaley was a terrorist who campaigned to have people imprisoned or killed merely for exercising their natural right to self defense. Killing Wales is not murder any more than dropping bombs on caves in Afghanistan is. There is certainly a compelling argument that Whaley had it coming. The key question is whether doing it was beneficial or not. Did it accomplish anything? It doesn't appear to have. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 10:37:00 AM EDT
[#30]
This is what I said, In the context it was written.
I wonder why we never start our own offensive's?, Im tired of just being defensive. Whaley did have it coming in my mind, but "justice" was not served in this case. It is still murder. I would much rather have seen him used as a example in the flesh, or at the end of a rope if need be. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 11:02:56 AM EDT
[#31]
No, there is not a compelling arguement that tom wales had a cold blooded murder coming to him. Your holding his murder up as an example of a counter attack from the progun side is BS, and the mere fact that you would consider what should be treated as a henious act as a "counter attack in the name of freedom and liberty" should leave a bad taste in the mouths of moral people, plain and simple. That and your guess that he was killed as a counter attack as opposed to any other reason is just that; a guess, no facts have been found to show what the motive may be. Running around murdering our opponents is not the way things should be done, not in 2001 and not today. This is not the night of the long knives. If anything it hurt the progun side as it provided a martyr to the antis. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 11:05:16 AM EDT
[#32]
That you know about ! look for a after action report next tuesday.
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Posted: 12/13/2005 1:28:27 PM EDT
[#33]
Gil is a politician now. If he was any kind of real cop, he'd know that the gun he had stashed in his car was gonna be stolen eventually. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 1:41:29 PM EDT
[#34]
MILITIA!! |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 1:41:56 PM EDT
[#35]
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Posted: 12/13/2005 1:53:28 PM EDT
[#36]
I don't know when Kerlikowski was last a real cop. It would be nice of the rank and file LEOs were able to make their real views heard so that the public would see something other than Kerlikowski and his flunkies pushing his "guns are bad Mmmmmmkay?" panderings. |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 3:45:39 PM EDT
[#37]
Who knows for sure whether he was killed by someone who was pisside off at him because of his anti-2A stance or if someone killed him because of some other abuse of power that he inflicted on someone as a federal prosecutor. He obviously pissed someone off. Personally all I have to say is good riddance! |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 5:24:46 PM EDT
[#38]
I bet the antis would get a hard on for this post.
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Posted: 12/13/2005 5:32:50 PM EDT
[#39]
Let them.... |
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Posted: 12/13/2005 5:36:00 PM EDT
[#40]
Exactly. There's enough ammo for both sides to do whatever they want or need to. I say, get busy! |
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Posted: 12/14/2005 12:39:17 PM EDT
[#41]
It is time then to agree on the strategic goal. as well as a primary secondary and tertiary. Then the mission planning begins.
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Posted: 12/14/2005 10:11:43 PM EDT
[#42]
I thought there is a background check at the gunshow? When I bought my lower at the WAC, I remember the guy calling in my NIC.
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Posted: 12/14/2005 10:24:51 PM EDT
[#43]
You have to be a member of WAC to trade arms there, and a member requires a background check, if new a NIC will be run as well at time of sale. |
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Posted: 12/15/2005 3:20:18 AM EDT
[#44]
They aren't complaining about the FFLs selling at shows, they're claiming to be complaining about "unlicensed dealers". Which we all know is acting as an "unlicensed dealer" is already illegal under existing federal law. Anytime you hear them spout off a number of vendors selling as "unlicensed dealers" at gunshows you know they are including people selling beef jerky, beanie babies, etc., in that number. They are after person to person sales. |
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Posted: 12/15/2005 4:18:31 AM EDT
[#45]
Let's hear a proposal. Grassroots efforts are often clumsy, spendy, and fruitless. I can't even recall all of the different pro-2nd Amendment groups I've thrown money at over the years, for advertising campaigns and such. Many of which were sane and intelligent groups, that I could respect wholeheartedly, unlike my love-hate feelings for the NRA. But, like I said, I can't even recall them.... where are they now? So, the question is, what kind of group effort can be taken seriously in todays political climate? Black rifles and handguns are clearly the antis primary target, which is this forums primary interest. Is AR15.com the best springboard to launch from, for our best interests? Black rifle rallies at the states capitol would earn an automatic black mark in the scope of intelligent political warfare, IMHO. Weaponry in general endorses violence, and violence is all the ammo the antis need to defeat us.....etc. My thought is that diplomacy is the only credible tactic to make a real and lasting change. But I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed either... What say you? |
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Posted: 12/15/2005 6:20:35 AM EDT
[#46]
It's hard to reason with fanantics. These people are masters of manipulation and they have the liberal media on their side. If there is any rational debate they won't allow our message to be heard by the voting public. I think it's time to take the gloves off! |
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Posted: 12/15/2005 7:37:16 AM EDT
[#47]
You're right, it is hard. We've all been there to some extent. But you speak as though we've already been defeated. Our side has every bit of vigor and intelligence as those who manipulate from behind the enemy line, (more than, in my own opinion). A rational debate is always heard by those who want to listen. We still have more freedoms than not, and a damned far stretch above the rest of the world. All is NOT lost, and gloves come off when we're left with no other choice. That day will come I believe, sadly, but it's not here yet.
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Posted: 12/15/2005 11:32:37 AM EDT
[#48]
I posted this in annother thread.... I'm pretty sure you need a background check at the WAC show...pretty sure..... Pretty damned sure..... washingtonarmscollectors.org/members.asp Yup....pretty sure
Pretty sure you need a membership to buy a firearm.....pretty sure....yup...I'm sure: washingtonarmscollectors.org/shows.asp
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Posted: 12/15/2005 11:41:07 AM EDT
[#49]
I really don't think we should base our argument against new state legislation on two gun shows out of the whole state. We need a "new" angle, such as FREEDOM.
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Posted: 12/15/2005 11:44:57 AM EDT
[#50]
Exactly!! |
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