Posted: 11/3/2008 12:53:06 AM EDT
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What do i need to do exactly when i fly home to MI for christmas from Sky Harbor in phoenix with my ar15?
All i know is i need a padlockable hardcase but for those of you who have flown with firearms through sky harbor what do I do exactly? who do i declare these rifles too and show and when? Whats sky's rules for flying with firearms? Can I have ammo in the case along with it? |
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It's not really that big of a deal, if you play by the rules. I brought a shotgun back from Oregon, and it was pretty easy.
Go on your airlines website, and check out there page for flying with firearms. It'll tell you exactly what to do, and who to see. Once you get to the airport, just walk right up to the ticket counter, and you'll have to tell 'em you're flying with a rifle. You'll fill out a declarations form, and what ever else the airline requires. From there. you'll head over to the TSA area, and they'll inspect your rifle, make sure it's not loaded, and that it's action is open. (I took the shotgun apart, so it was in two pieces to make it easier) They'll watch you lock it up, and they'll throw it with the luggage. I don't think you can put ammo in the same box, and if you can, it's a very limited amount. Have fun, I'm sure when they see it's an AR your gonna get all sorts of stares, and evil eyes! |
| I've flown with guns many times. Once I had about 6 guns in one case, 2 AR's, an AK, a few pistols, and a 30-06. Just like kevhogAZ said, really not a whole lot to it. Go to the ticket counter, tell them what you have, fill out whatever form they need and watch the TSA rummage through your guns. Nothing loaded and actions open helps. Ammo has to be in orginal packaging. And i'm pretty sure separated from the guns. When you get to your arriving city your guns won't come down with the normal luggage, they'll usually have them where they keep the lost/found bags. |
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Thanks guys.
I still need to buy a case. Id love a storm or pelican but its to much money. What kind of forms do you need to fill out? types of questions? Just don't want to forget anything. An 18 year old, flying home, alone with an ar15...this should be interesting 
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I've never had a problem but that was before the checked bag fees they have now. I take my rifle to the counter, fill out the forms and they've had me sit and wait to see if TSA needs me to unlock the guncase. TSA has never needed to get into the locked case and at the end of the flight my guns have always been right with the regular luggage.
Check with the airline that you will be flying with, thought I heard a report that one has stopped allowing checked firearms on flights but not positive. If it is going to cost you $50.00 to check the guncase you might just ship it to yourself, you can do this legally without an FFL at either end and it cost me $25.00 last time I shipped a rifle. You can have ammunition, but check the airlines website. Get a good hard case. I had one with 3 padlock loops and I put padlocks on each one. Last time I flew I used a cheap hard case as I left the other one up in MI and the case broke from handling though the gun was still secure. If you are flying you need a good case that can't be pried open. The form you fill out is a declaration that the firearm is unloaded I believe. I haven't flown witha firearm for two years. TSA site Firearms
Continental accepts one item of shooting equipment per customer as checked baggage. One item of shooting equipment is defined as one hard-sided shooting equipment case containing up to five firearms, with or without scopes, 11 lbs (five Kgs.) of ammunition and articles used in the firearm sport. Firearms will be accepted only from a customer who is 18 years of age or older. International firearm regulations vary by destination and transiting country. Contact appropriate consulates or embassies to obtain specific entry requirements applicable to destination(s). Firearms are not accepted to/from Israel. Firearms are not accepted to/from Denmark For travel to/from the United Kingdom, pistols, rifles and shotguns must be packed in a hard side rifle case. Customers traveling to/through Amsterdam, Netherlands (AMS) with checked firearms/ammunition must obtain permission from the Netherlands Consulate/Embassy in their country of origin prior to departure. Weapons are subject to confiscation in Amsterdam unless the owner can show all required permits. Customers traveling on military orders with checked firearms may do so without prior consent from Dutch Customs. Checked military ammunition is forbidden. For your convenience, the application for permission is available for download in Adobe PDF format. Curbside check-in of a firearm is not permitted. The firearm must be packaged in a hard-sided container capable of being locked. The container must be locked and the key or combination must remain in the customer's possession. If a hard-sided container is needed, see the container section of this site. Handguns must be packed in hard-side lockable luggage. Baggage containing handguns must be locked at the time of acceptance by Continental Airlines and the key or combination retained in the passenger's custody. The firearm will be transported in a section of the aircraft that is inaccessible to the customer. Proof of registration is not required. Firearms carried in addition to the free baggage allowance will be assessed at the current excess baggage charge. No more than 11 pounds of ammunition may be carried. The ammunition may be packed in the same container as the firearm or in a separate container. Ammunition must be packed in the manufacturer's original package or securely packed in fiber, wood or metal containers. The ammunition inside the container must be protected against shock and secured against movement. The ammunition may be packed in the same container as the firearm or in a separate container. If applicable, the first ($15) or second bag fee ($25) applies to checked firearms. |
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I have flown with guns several times and the procedure is always different for every airport. I've never had them hold the guns off to the side, they come down the ramp with regular luggage.
I prefer to ship to myself whenever possible to avoid hassle, theft, and have the ability to insure for the full retail value. |
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Quoted:
I've never had a problem but that was before the checked bag fees they have now. I take my rifle to the counter, fill out the forms and they've had me sit and wait to see if TSA needs me to unlock the guncase. TSA has never needed to get into the locked case and at the end of the flight my guns have always been right with the regular luggage. Check with the airline that you will be flying with, thought I heard a report that one has stopped allowing checked firearms on flights but not positive. If it is going to cost you $50.00 to check the guncase you might just ship it to yourself, you can do this legally without an FFL at either end and it cost me $25.00 last time I shipped a rifle. You can have ammunition, but check the airlines website. Get a good hard case. I had one with 3 padlock loops and I put padlocks on each one. Last time I flew I used a cheap hard case as I left the other one up in MI and the case broke from handling though the gun was still secure. If you are flying you need a good case that can't be pried open. The form you fill out is a declaration that the firearm is unloaded I believe. I haven't flown witha firearm for two years. TSA site Firearms
Continental accepts one item of shooting equipment per customer as checked baggage. One item of shooting equipment is defined as one hard-sided shooting equipment case containing up to five firearms, with or without scopes, 11 lbs (five Kgs.) of ammunition and articles used in the firearm sport. Firearms will be accepted only from a customer who is 18 years of age or older. International firearm regulations vary by destination and transiting country. Contact appropriate consulates or embassies to obtain specific entry requirements applicable to destination(s). Firearms are not accepted to/from Israel. Firearms are not accepted to/from Denmark For travel to/from the United Kingdom, pistols, rifles and shotguns must be packed in a hard side rifle case. Customers traveling to/through Amsterdam, Netherlands (AMS) with checked firearms/ammunition must obtain permission from the Netherlands Consulate/Embassy in their country of origin prior to departure. Weapons are subject to confiscation in Amsterdam unless the owner can show all required permits. Customers traveling on military orders with checked firearms may do so without prior consent from Dutch Customs. Checked military ammunition is forbidden. For your convenience, the application for permission is available for download in Adobe PDF format. Curbside check-in of a firearm is not permitted. The firearm must be packaged in a hard-sided container capable of being locked. The container must be locked and the key or combination must remain in the customer's possession. If a hard-sided container is needed, see the container section of this site. Handguns must be packed in hard-side lockable luggage. Baggage containing handguns must be locked at the time of acceptance by Continental Airlines and the key or combination retained in the passenger's custody. The firearm will be transported in a section of the aircraft that is inaccessible to the customer. Proof of registration is not required. Firearms carried in addition to the free baggage allowance will be assessed at the current excess baggage charge. No more than 11 pounds of ammunition may be carried. The ammunition may be packed in the same container as the firearm or in a separate container. Ammunition must be packed in the manufacturer's original package or securely packed in fiber, wood or metal containers. The ammunition inside the container must be protected against shock and secured against movement. The ammunition may be packed in the same container as the firearm or in a separate container. If applicable, the first ($15) or second bag fee ($25) applies to checked firearms. When i moved down to AZ, i did ship myself the rifle but UPS did NOT want to ship a firearm. i finally found a UPS and they said ONLY rifles which is obvious but even they were hesitent at first. The other UPSs said it was illegal (this was in MI). So shipping my rifle to my uncles home wouldn't be illegal? |
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It's not illegal to ship a rifle to yourself in care of another person. Go to ATF facts on the gov't site and read it. I printed it off and took it to the UPS hub in Tucson and had no problem. The receiving person is just prohibited from opening the package I believe but who is going to know once it is delivered? Ship it to yourself in care of your uncle if you are going to that residence.
B9) May a nonlicensee ship firearms interstate for his or her use in hunting or other lawful activity? [Back]
Yes. A person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner. Persons other than the owner should not open the package and take possession of the firearm. http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b8 |
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It's not illegal to ship a rifle to yourself in care of another person. Go to ATF facts on the gov't site and read it. I printed it off and took it to the UPS hub in Tucson and had no problem. The receiving person is just prohibited from opening the package I believe but who is going to know once it is delivered? Ship it to yourself in care of your uncle if you are going to that residence. B9) May a nonlicensee ship firearms interstate for his or her use in hunting or other lawful activity? [Back]
Yes. A person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner. Persons other than the owner should not open the package and take possession of the firearm. http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b8 thanks bro, i think it will be less hassel to ship. Last time i shipped to myself UPS banged my rifle up a bit. They also bent the hell out of my brand new pc case. I'll just pack it like 30x better 
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Given Michigan's handgun registration law, and the fact you don't have an AZ CCW that would allow you to carry in Michigan I would recommend against taking your handgun. http://www.michigan.gov/msp/0,1607,7-123-1591_3503_4654-138642––,00.html Link didn't work. I don't need a ccw to buy a handgun from a private sale, and from what i remember i thought it was the same in MI( correct if mistaken ). I would not be carrying it in public, because i don't have a ccw or using it at local ranges, just up north in the 80 acrs of woods that my family owns. But yah, i know in MI all handguns must be registered or something so I'm a bit confused as to that. Please clarify. Thanks. Jesse. |
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In Michigan you need to obtain a purchase permit from the police to buy a handgun from anyone I believe if you don't have the CCW from the state. You being a resident of AZ, you are not eligible to purchase a pistol from a MI resident, unless you have it shipped to an AZ FFL from the MI FFL and do the transaction through the FFL as far as I know, your being 18 would make this not an option. A Michigan resident can not loan you a pistol to use, without a Michigan CPL in your possession. You can take a pistol to MI for your hunting use if you purchase it from a private party in AZ. This you could take with you in checked luggage, placing the locked case in with your luggage and declaring it.
3. How old do I have to be in order to have a pistol registered in my name in Michigan?
MCL 28.422 & 28.429 Eighteen (18) years of age. However, Federal law prohibits a federally licensed firearms dealer from selling a pistol to anyone under the age of twenty-one (21). 5. In Michigan, what is a License to Purchase and is one needed in every case where a pistol is acquired? MCL 28.422 A License to Purchase is a license required prior to acquisition of a pistol by purchase or gift. The important part of the License to Purchase is the affidavit signed by the purchaser swearing to their own qualifications. A License to Purchase is not needed for anyone with a valid Concealed Pistol License, for firearms dealers purchasing from wholesalers, or for relics, curios, antiques, etc., not made for modern ammunition. 10. I have just moved to Michigan from another state. How much time do I have to register my pistols? MCL 28.422 & MCL 28.429 Upon establishing legal residency, you should immediately contact your local law enforcement agency, pass the basic safety questionnaire, and complete both a License to Purchase and Safety Inspection Certificate. |
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In Michigan, a person “shall not purchase, carry, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol,” as prescribed in MCL 28.422. These licenses shall be obtained by the local police agency. If the city, township, or village does not have an organized police agency, the license shall be obtained by the county sheriff department.
Your private sale is occurring here in AZ, correct? If so, both you and the seller need to be AZ residents. You can legally own/possess the pistol here in AZ with no permit. MI, different story. I would believe that having a CCW and being an out of state resident would exempt you from the registration (at least you would have more documentation that you could own/possess it.) AZ CCWs are recognized by MI. I wouldn't want to have to explain to a cop "well it's legal for me to own it in AZ" without some kind of documentation. If you have an MI driver's license and not an AZ one, you would be viewed as an MI resident in possession of an unregistered pistol. It's up to you to assess the legality/risk on your own. If I were you I would not take a pistol with me unless I had an AZ CCW to back it up, it's not worth the potential risk or hassle. |
| I took this up with a local police chief in MI that I grew up with and I didn't have to register my pistols until I was in the state as a permanent resident, but I had a South Dakota CCW at the time and this was back in 1992. No longer have to have a CCW with the ability to carry with my LE credentials in MI. |
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How old do you have to be to get a CCW in AZ?
Obtaining a Permit
CCW Eligibility Applicants must: be a resident of this state or a United States citizen; be twenty-one years of age or older; not be under indictment for a felony offense; not be convicted of a felony offense, unless: the coviction has been expunged, set aside, vacated or pardoned, or the individuals civil rights must be restored AND the individual must not be a prohibited possessor under state or federal law. not suffer from mental illness and been adjudicated mentally incompetent or committed to a mental institution; not be unlawfully present in the United States; satisfactorily complete a firearms safety training program approved by the department of public safety pursuant to ARS §13-3112.O. In Michigan: Concealed Pistol Permit-Requirements to Obtain One
21 years of age or older Citizen of the United States or a Resident Alien Resident of Michigan for at least 6 months Successful completion of Pistol Safety Training Course Cannot be subject to an order or disposition for any of the following: · Mental health order · Legally incapacitated · Involuntarily hospitalized · Been found not guilty by reason of insanity Not subject to a conditional bond release where firearm possession is prohibited Not subject to a Personal Protection Order Not prohibited by MCL 750.224f (felon in possession of a firearm) Has never been convicted of a felony in Michigan or elsewhere A felony charge is not pending against the applicant in Michigan or elsewhere Has not been dishonorably discharged from the US Armed Forces Has not been convicted of one of the following misdemeanors in the 8 years immediately preceding the date of application: You might have to register the pistol in MI to have it there as you aren't going to get a CCW in AZ. http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/publications/firearms.pdf http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-422 Non-Michigan Residents
1. I am an out-of-state resident. Can I legally hunt deer with a pistol in Michigan? MCL 750.231a If you have a license to carry a concealed pistol issued by your state of residence, you may qualify to possess a pistol while hunting depending on the license restrictions from your home state and providing you are also in possession of a valid Michigan non-resident hunting license. You must also carry in compliance with all Michigan's firearms laws. For further questions regarding firearms issues as they relate to hunting see DNR's website. Found it, at your age and being an Arizona resident without an Arizona CCW which you can not obtain, you can not carry or possess a pistol in MI. 2. Can a resident of another state legally possess a pistol in Michigan?
If you are a non-resident of Michigan with a valid concealed pistol permit from your home state, Michigan will recognize your permit (MCL 28.432 & MCL 28.432a). However, you must carry in conformance with any and all restrictions appearing on the permit. You are subject to Michigan's concealed pistol law including but not limited to restrictions on where a concealed pistol may be carried. Without a CPL, a non-resident may not have a pistol in Michigan. 3. Is it okay if I loan my pistol to a friend?
MCL 28.432 An individual can carry, possess, use or transport a pistol belonging to another individual, if the pistol is properly licensed and inspected under the Act, and the individual carrying, possessing, using or transporting the pistol has obtained a license to carry a pistol concealed permit from Michigan. |
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To clarify, I'm 18, I'm an AZ resident, the seller of the g19 is an az resident. I know i can't aquire a ccw unti I'm 21 or carry. I was just wondering if once i obtained the g19 here in az, if it would be legal to bring with me to MI to shoot on my grand parents property but you also said possess so i guess thats a no go. From all this legal stuff, and the fact that it could cause alot of explaining, i may just spend the 450 on a sopmod/sureifire m951 and save the g19 for when I'm 21. Unsure now.
You guys answer quick here in the az forum, thanks! |
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To clarify, I'm 18, I'm an AZ resident, the seller of the g19 is an az resident. I know i can't aquire a ccw unti I'm 21 or carry. I was just wondering if once i obtained the g19 here in az, if it would be legal to bring with me to MI to shoot on my grand parents property but you also said possess so i guess thats a no go. From all this legal stuff, and the fact that it could cause alot of explaining, i may just spend the 450 on a sopmod/sureifire m951 and save the g19 for when I'm 21. Unsure now. You guys answer quick here in the az forum, thanks! Mak did a good job of researching why you can't take it to MI. You can still buy it private sale here at 18, open carry at 18, or carry in your vehicle (in a case or other implement designed to hold a gun). Having a pistol might still be worthwhile for you here, but you can't take it to MI. |
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Been alot of changes in MI recently as I believe the current attorney general made some decisions that overturned prior ones and a decision of the attorney general is considered law.
One deals with machine guns, I believe they were restricted to C&R guns previously, but from what I saw on the MI.gov sites today they are now legal. Still problems with SBR, pistol registration, what the state considers SBR and some NFA firearms. Hopefully they will change those laws before I move back up there but if Obama is elected tonight all bets are off. The OP needs to get out and vote if he hasn't already done so or any pistol he intends to purchase could be banned before he gets a chance to buy one. |