Bud's Exclusive C93 built/rebuilt by PTR - Page 4

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Bud's Exclusive C93 built/rebuilt by PTR (Page 4 of 17)

Posted: 8/6/2018 6:21:10 AM EDT

[#1]

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A G41 clone isn't going to happen at C93 prices or even PTR 91 prices. Hell, it would probably cost more than a PTR 9C/CT. Doesn't make sense to me to pay 3x or more the cost of a C93 to save $60 per magazine as I'm not that autistic that I need 20+ mags for a range rifle.

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It is more than just the mags. Bolt catch and bolt release, forward assists, etc... it is HKs version of a M16A2

Posted: 8/6/2018 6:52:57 AM EDT

[#2]

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It is more than just the mags. Bolt catch and bolt release, forward assists, etc... it is HKs version of a M16A2

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Must not have been very important to have those features included in a HK roller delayed blowback rifle judging by how popular the rifle wasn't.

Posted: 8/6/2018 9:02:29 AM EDT

[#3]

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Must not have been very important to have those features included in a HK roller delayed blowback rifle judging by how popular the rifle wasn't.

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Quoted:
It is more than just the mags. Bolt catch and bolt release, forward assists, etc... it is HKs version of a M16A2

Must not have been very important to have those features included in a HK roller delayed blowback rifle judging by how popular the rifle wasn't.

It was going to be the replacement for the G3 but the Cold War ended. Great rifle introduced at the worst time.

Posted: 8/6/2018 9:19:59 AM EDT

[#4]

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It was going to be the replacement for the G3 but the Cold War ended. Great rifle introduced at the worst time.

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That seems to be HK's curse- they spend so long perfecting and refining their designs, that by the time they're released they're outdated or not needed

Posted: 8/6/2018 10:20:21 AM EDT

[#5]

IIRC Germany/NATO was waiting to see the ACR trial results in the US (and maybe going with the G11). The G41 had already been fully developed as an M16 competitor. Then there were problems with the G11 caseless ammo, and the US decided to just keep the M16 family.

Sometime around here, HK engineers decided it was best to abandon roller-delayed blowback in favor of gas piston (as it would reliably cycle a wider range of ammo without modification, and stayed cleaner). I think German army said, "We'll wait for that," and G41 money became G36 money a few years later.

Someone feel free to correct me. Going from memory of stuff I read.

Posted: 8/6/2018 11:08:47 AM EDT

[#6]

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A G41 clone isn't going to happen at C93 prices or even PTR 91 prices. Hell, it would probably cost more than a PTR 9C/CT. Doesn't make sense to me to pay 3x or more the cost of a C93 to save $60 per magazine as I'm not that autistic that I need 20+ mags for a range rifle.

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For me it’s not necessarily about the cost of the mags it’s having yet another mag/platform to support. When your collection starts getting bigger it’s nice to have commonality on something as simple as a mag. Makes range trips and life a whole lot easier.

Posted: 8/6/2018 11:46:29 AM EDT

[#7]

When your collection gets really big, you learn to keep about 120 rounds worth of mags/links in close proximity to the weapon in question.

Posted: 8/6/2018 11:57:31 AM EDT

[#8]

If I was an actual HK collector I'd find the cash for an HK93 and be done with it. Since we're talking about clones, right now a 93 platform is definitely a curio and is approaching relic status. In other words, a fun range gun, fun to look at, but gets left in the safe if I'm going to actually be doing something with a rifle.

Make it Stanag compatible, maybe put a 1913 top rail on it, and we're getting somewhere towards making it a useful gun with a future.

Posted: 8/6/2018 1:20:24 PM EDT

[#9]

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If I was an actual HK collector I'd find the cash for an HK93 and be done with it. Since we're talking about clones, right now a 93 platform is definitely a curio and is approaching relic status. In other words, a fun range gun, fun to look at, but gets left in the safe if I'm going to actually be doing something with a rifle.

Make it Stanag compatible, maybe put a 1913 top rail on it, and we're getting somewhere towards making it a useful gun with a future.

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Throw in a new barrel too cuz no Operator© would be caught dead with a plain jane 1 in 9 twist 4140 chrome-moly steel barrel that won't last the standard issue thousand round mag dumps. Sourcing the HK 41 specific parts should be a piece of cake and very affordable as the guns were very prolific and parts kits are sold on every HK parts site. And if, god forbid, you can't find those parts you can just have someone draw them up in CAD and CNC/mold and cast them for a couple bucks.

But fuck anyone that wants to enjoy a $550 rifle, that's not a AR-15, at the range. That doesn't fly in the real world where SHTF could happen at any minute.

Posted: 8/6/2018 1:56:23 PM EDT

[#10]

I was thinking more of coyote hunting than social stuff...For fighting even an updated G41 isn't a proper substitute for an AR15.

That's cool that you bought one of these and I'm not shitting on the product. But if the only option with these roller locks is to source surplus parts as opposed to making them...well that's the definition of a dead end product.

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:09:37 PM EDT

[#11]

I don't get the draw here.

Lots of Latin countries a few local yokel swat teams.

Dos anyone else choose the 93 as a platform to rely on?

Mag changes suck, especially with the button .

Heavy as f, maybe worth it in 308 not in 556.

Even at this price, hsld looks will get old quick if you shoot offhand alot.

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:15:28 PM EDT

[#12]

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I was thinking more of coyote hunting than social stuff...For fighting even an updated G41 isn't a proper substitute for an AR15.

That's cool that you bought one of these and I'm not shitting on the product. But if the only option with these roller locks is to source surplus parts as opposed to making them...well that's the definition of a dead end product.

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Uh, yeah of course it's a dead end product. Do you post this sage wisdom in threads about WWII milsurp rifle deals too?

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:31:14 PM EDT

[#13]

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But if the only option with these roller locks is to source surplus parts as opposed to making them...well that's the definition of a dead end product.

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You can source all new-manufacture US-made parts for the entire rifle. Not like once the surplus parts run out, we're fucked.

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:43:06 PM EDT

[#14]

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I don't get the draw here.

Lots of Latin countries a few local yokel swat teams.

Dos anyone else choose the 93 as a platform to rely on?

Mag changes suck, especially with the button .

Heavy as f, maybe worth it in 308 not in 556.

Even at this price, hsld looks will get old quick if you shoot offhand alot.

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Oh FFS. No reason to crap all over the thing, it's not for you I get it. Man, I'm going to toss this in my truck and use it as an all-around trunk/truck gun, I suspect many who bought one are going to do just that. Not going on 100 mile rucks with the doggone thing, nor is it going to be used to take down Neal in the street shootout from HEAT. It's a decent gun at a decent price, if it gets banged up & scratched no big deal. If it (God forbid) happens to be used in a self defense scenario, you aren't going to shed too many tears having the thing languish in an evidence locker being thrown on top of a dozen Hi Points.

Who knows, maybe I'll hate it. But, for $550 I'm not out a ton of cash, and I won't have to treat it like a safe queen.

If it goes "bang" every time I pull that heavy, shitty trigger (as some call it), I'll be happy.

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:54:18 PM EDT

[#15]

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I don't get the draw here.

Lots of Latin countries a few local yokel swat teams.

Dos anyone else choose the 93 as a platform to rely on?

Mag changes suck, especially with the button .

Heavy as f, maybe worth it in 308 not in 556.

Even at this price, hsld looks will get old quick if you shoot offhand alot.

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The draw is it's a 5.56 roller locker for Glock money. I own quite a few guns that aren't practical but just fun to own and shoot. One of my favorite guns to shoot is my PTR91 and it's a beast with the bull barrel. I'm not going to war with them, it's going to be cool to take to the range for fun every now and again. Just a month ago these kits were being sold sans barrel for $600.00 on the forums. If I hate it I bet you that in a year I could sell my PTR 93 for more than I paid for it making my $550.00 investment pretty risk free.

Posted: 8/6/2018 2:59:57 PM EDT

[#16]

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Uh, yeah of course it's a dead end product. Do you post this sage wisdom in threads about WWII milsurp rifle deals too?

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Now you're just picking and choosing statements out of context to which to respond. So is gopherboy. But seriously, enjoy the guns-no need to get defensive about your purchase.

Posted: 8/6/2018 3:03:15 PM EDT

[#17]

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Now you're just picking and choosing statements out of context to which to respond. So is gopherboy. But seriously, enjoy the guns-no need to get defensive about your purchase.

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?? I got no beef with what you said. Not defensive at all. My point is that there are current-production parts available to maintain the platform.

Posted: 8/6/2018 3:07:52 PM EDT

[#18]

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?? I got no beef with what you said. Not defensive at all. My point is that there are current-production parts available to maintain the platform.

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My bad then.

I'm responding to people saying 41s would be prohibitively expensive to make.

Posted: 8/6/2018 3:25:28 PM EDT

[#19]

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My bad then.

I'm responding to people saying 41s would be prohibitively expensive to make.

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?? I got no beef with what you said. Not defensive at all. My point is that there are current-production parts available to maintain the platform.

My bad then.

I'm responding to people saying 41s would be prohibitively expensive to make.

OH! Well, my bad then also

... I was reading your statement that "people buying these Bud's 93 clones are at a dead end because surplus parts are drying up"

Yeah, I can see the G41 being a tough one to start. From my understanding, several attempts at a Hk93 with an AR magwell have been tried but not very successful. I would be interested in an HK33 with AR magwell myself.

Posted: 8/6/2018 3:37:42 PM EDT

[#20]

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Now you're just picking and choosing statements out of context to which to respond. So is gopherboy. But seriously, enjoy the guns-no need to get defensive about your purchase.

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I'm picking and choosing because whole crux of why you don't like this rifle is because its doesn't have AR-15 features, the rest of what you had to say is just white noise beyond this fact. This thread about a deal on a parts kit rifle being built by a reputable company to be a clone of an expensive civilian rifle that hasn't been imported in decades (and only in low numbers). So then we get the whole spiel from multiple people about why they won't buy this rifle because this, that, and the other thing and wish it had features added from a different model that was never cloned in the first place. This isn't an AR-15 and its not a G41 but a $550 rifle that shoots .223/5.56, looks like an HK 93 rifle, has the HK slap, and is being built by PTR off old Century parts kit stock.

I don't need to defend my purchase because there is nothing to defend. I know what this rifle is, what it isn't, and what it will never be. Doesn't mean I like reading the same shit over and over again telling me what I already know.

Posted: 8/6/2018 4:05:09 PM EDT

[#21]

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From my understanding, several attempts at a Hk93 with an AR magwell have been tried but not very successful. I would be interested in an HK33 with AR magwell myself.

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I think some of them worked, but the CA53 AR is the only one I know of which was a regular production item.

Moore Advanced Dynamics may still offer AR magazine conversions. It was a $400 job four years ago.
See old thread here: https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/Converting_C93_to_accept_AR_15_mags/9-437585/?#i4213649

Posted: 8/6/2018 6:06:52 PM EDT

[#22]

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Quoted:
I think some of them worked, but the CA53 AR is the only one I know of which was a regular production item.

Moore Advanced Dynamics may still offer AR magazine conversions. It was a $400 job four years ago.
See old thread here: https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/Converting_C93_to_accept_AR_15_mags/9-437585/?#i4213649

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Jeff just told me he had issues with longevity and the AR magwell conversion, so I trust his opinion. I will probably just leave mine stock and enjoy a $600 93 clone.

Posted: 8/7/2018 4:58:15 AM EDT

[#23]

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For me it’s not necessarily about the cost of the mags it’s having yet another mag/platform to support. When your collection starts getting bigger it’s nice to have commonality on something as simple as a mag. Makes range trips and life a whole lot easier.

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Define "bigger". Because I find that the opposite is true.

Posted: 8/7/2018 12:46:04 PM EDT

[#24]

Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it’s a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn’t exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911’s etc.

Posted: 8/7/2018 1:59:42 PM EDT

[#25]

I got word from PTR this morning. No paddles, but I guess we already knew that. I asked about the PTR-9C pistols being available in the future without a top rail, and with the sling post installed. They said no.

Posted: 8/7/2018 3:07:06 PM EDT

[#26]

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I got word from PTR this morning. No paddles, but I guess we already knew that. I asked about the PTR-9C pistols being available in the future without a top rail, and with the sling post installed. They said no.

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Why no top rail?

Posted: 8/7/2018 3:19:17 PM EDT

[#27]

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Why no top rail?

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I got word from PTR this morning. No paddles, but I guess we already knew that. I asked about the PTR-9C pistols being available in the future without a top rail, and with the sling post installed. They said no.

Why no top rail?

The rail on my PTR 9CT is kind of a nice feature (insert "ermagerd, it's not like the real thing!") but on the smaller K model would be kind of silly IMO.

Posted: 8/7/2018 4:07:08 PM EDT

[#28]

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Why no top rail?

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I got word from PTR this morning. No paddles, but I guess we already knew that. I asked about the PTR-9C pistols being available in the future without a top rail, and with the sling post installed. They said no.

Why no top rail?

I think if PTR had originally offered a clone of the MP5 VS the hybrid model they came out with that completely lacks the sling loop on the triple tree, and without the rail, I would have, among many others on HKPRO, would have jumped. As it stands right now, there are many for sale, but I don't see a lot of them moving. As much as I like the quality of the PTR product line, I decided on the Zenith for the classic MP5 look. H&K will be introducing one also.

I probably could have lived with the top rail, but what a stupid move not to include the sling loop. I guess PTR didn't count on folks SBR'ing them, and adding a sling? I guess one could put a QD mount on the rail, but that takes up space. Again, a stupid move IMHO.

PTR stated that the photo on Buds is the gun that will be delivered.

Posted: 8/7/2018 7:14:36 PM EDT

[#29]

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Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it's a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn't exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911's etc.

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LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

Posted: 8/7/2018 7:25:17 PM EDT

[#30]

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LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

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Quoted:

Quoted:
Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it's a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn't exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911's etc.

LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

Lol. I love when they dip toes into the HK waters and see mag prices for the first time.

Posted: 8/7/2018 9:28:23 PM EDT

[#31]

I got my G-3 mags for a buck a pop!

What are ya'll bitching about???

Posted: 8/7/2018 9:34:51 PM EDT

[#32]

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Lol. I love when they dip toes into the HK waters and see mag prices for the first time.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/259653/20170303-125227-158187.jpg

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Quoted:

Quoted:
Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it's a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn't exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911's etc.

LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

Lol. I love when they dip toes into the HK waters and see mag prices for the first time.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/259653/20170303-125227-158187.jpg

At least your mags are still made and imported.

Posted: 8/7/2018 9:37:49 PM EDT

[#33]

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Quoted:
LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

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Quoted:

Quoted:
Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it's a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn't exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911's etc.

LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

SL-6 and SL-7 mags are pretty expensive as well

Posted: 8/7/2018 9:44:04 PM EDT

[#34]

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SL-6 and SL-7 mags are pretty expensive as well

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Quoted:

Quoted:
Hell if I know. More than 10 more than 50

I have a ton of guns that use AR mags so it's a no brainer to buy them in bulk. I have passed on handguns because it gets annoying and expensive to keep buying multiple mags for them especially when they are expensive like the hk93 mags. 10 mags probably shouldn't exceed the cost of the gun. Like when I am looking at Sigs i will probably end up with one that uses 226 mags. I like platforms that have many options with similar mags like 1911's etc.

LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

SL-6 and SL-7 mags are pretty expensive as well

Yup

Posted: 8/8/2018 12:21:01 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
LOL....

You want to price HK mags?

http://i.imgur.com/wHFx9rM.jpg

On average, a 10rd mag for my SLB2000 is $250

View Quote

Quoted:

Lol. I love when they dip toes into the HK waters and see mag prices for the first time.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/259653/20170303-125227-158187.jpg

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lol at you two. Are you bragging about spending a lot on mags? Can't think why anybody would want a bunch of mags for a obscure hunting rifle. Of course they are expensive. I am very familiar with HK mag prices. Back when I bought my 93 I think I could get mags for $30-$40 but think I only grabbed a couple. Since the gun was NIB I wasn't sure if it would ever turn into a shooter. Almost bought Vector guns a few times but never did so I never picked up more mags. I stacked the 91 mags deep but since I sold my PTR and once again only have a new 91 don't know that I will ever shoot it. Sold my USC rather than converting it. Just didn't seem worth it after shooting one.

Most of the HK guns just never really did it for me. Have a MP5k upper I bought a while back from one of Bailey's companies that I have a stamp for and need to piece together so I will need to suck it up and buy a pile of mags because it will definitely be a shooter.

Posted: 8/8/2018 8:08:20 AM EDT

[#36]

The only thing I'll add here is that I had a hk91 for a while and parts werent an issue. Was so tough as nails, the one repair I did was replace a push pin with a zip tie. Hasn't blinked in the decade since. Just so goddamned heavy in any offhand position. And as such, not in the least bit fun. As a bipod weapon I was stuck asking myself, well if in only shooting supported, why would I use a platform with so much recoil? So I switched to other 308s had more fun and haven't touched the 91 since. It's purely an investment piece now.

Posted: 8/8/2018 10:33:22 AM EDT

[#37]

When did this become a bashing on a good deal? For the guys that bought one, I hope it's all you hoped it would be. For the guys that didn't, well that OK too.

It's alright if you don't like the platform, but can you guys quit complaining? This tread started off great but now is starting to sound like a bunch of old hair dressers that's tit's are starting to sag and they're blaming it on their kids.

Posted: 8/8/2018 8:35:55 PM EDT

[#38]

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When did this become a bashing on a good deal? For the guys that bought one, I hope it's all you hoped it would be. For the guys that didn't, well that OK too.

It's alright if you don't like the platform, but can you guys quit complaining? This tread started off great but now is starting to sound like a bunch of old hair dressers that's tit's are starting to sag and they're blaming it on their kids.

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Ok. New direction.
Are they done yet?
When do they ship?
Huh?
Huh?

Posted: 8/8/2018 10:25:19 PM EDT

[#39]

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Ok. New direction.
Are they done yet?
When do they ship?
Huh?
Huh?

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This is relevant to my interests, as well...

Posted: 8/8/2018 11:51:20 PM EDT

[#40]

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When did this become a bashing on a good deal? For the guys that bought one, I hope it's all you hoped it would be. For the guys that didn't, well that OK too.

It's alright if you don't like the platform, but can you guys quit complaining? This tread started off great but now is starting to sound like a bunch of old hair dressers that's tit's are starting to sag and they're blaming it on their kids.

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This is what happens when we run out of other topics to discuss.

Posted: 8/10/2018 12:34:17 PM EDT

[#41]

SOLD OUT.

Too bad. I would have bought one of these for the Bud's price. (I already have an older C93 that works great, but I have 2 kids so I "need" a second identical gun).

Posted: 8/13/2018 10:50:40 AM EDT

[#42]

Shipping first week of September!

Posted: 8/13/2018 12:49:04 PM EDT

[#43]

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Shipping first week of September!

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Sweet! Where did you hear this?

Posted: 8/13/2018 12:56:07 PM EDT

[#44]

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Sweet! Where did you hear this?

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PTR

Posted: 8/13/2018 2:22:30 PM EDT

[#45]

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Shipping first week of September!

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Nice! Lines up perfectly with some vacation time I took. Now we get to see if Bud's will ship first come, first serve or free for all.

Posted: 8/14/2018 10:45:48 AM EDT

[#46]

We need to get PTR to start showing us some teaser pictures. They most assuredly have more than a few rifles complete!

Posted: 8/14/2018 12:41:15 PM EDT

[#47]

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Nice! Lines up perfectly with some vacation time I took. Now we get to see if Bud's will ship first come, first serve or free for all.

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Team Buds gets first cut

Posted: 8/14/2018 3:53:06 PM EDT

[#48]

I see a lot of people commenting at how pricey HK 93/33 mags are. Why not have it converted to take Stanag mags?

Posted: 8/14/2018 4:50:53 PM EDT

[#49]

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Team Buds gets first cut

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What exactly is Team Buds, just rifles bought from Buds or a special membership thing like ARFCOM team members?

Posted: 8/14/2018 5:02:28 PM EDT

[#50]

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What exactly is Team Buds, just rifles bought from Buds or a special membership thing like ARFCOM team members?

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Quoted:

Team Buds gets first cut

What exactly is Team Buds, just rifles bought from Buds or a special membership thing like ARFCOM team members?

It's a membership thing, if you buy a lot from Buds' its worth it. You get first choice on new stuff, discounts, a hot line on orders, express shipping kind of thing.

The email about the C93 originally went out to Team Buds to start with.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Bud's Exclusive C93 built/rebuilt by PTR (Page 4 of 17)

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